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OT: Lakers Player Mutiny Against D'AnToni
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holfresh
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1/26/2013  12:14 PM
I defended Isiah for many years...It came to the point where the results were the results and I had no choice to examine them..I had to man up and accept the errors of my analysis...Isiah knew talent but couldn't assemble a team to play team basketball...I manned up...

MDA is not a good coach.. He is a guy with a system that works with the perfect PG to run it...Not every PG can run it..He needs a coach on the floor to run it...Nash is old..

He goes from place to place putting up the same results and his defenders blame the players and the organization..At some point you have to look at the man...At some point reality should set in...Other coaches have won with Kobe, Gasol and Medda..Add Nash and DHow who is not the same player but is still the best center in the league, the results are still bad...What gives???..

Bill Parcells once said your are what your record says you are...
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IronWillGiroud
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1/26/2013  12:18 PM
What other coach has Kobe won with? When Harris was winning in LA Kobe was playing 15 and 26 minutes per game,

In Kobe's first full season as a starter he went 6-6 with Harris and 24-13 with Rambis, every other year sans 2004-05 Kobe was coached by Phil Jackson, and he even had two very mediocre seasons with Phil, both first round exits,

We can't apply one logic to MDA and then throw it out the window for Kobe.

The Will, check out the Official Home of Will's GameDay Art: http://tinyurl.com/thewillgameday
holfresh
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1/26/2013  12:27 PM    LAST EDITED: 1/26/2013  12:43 PM
IronWillGiroud wrote:What other coach has Kobe won with? When Harris was winning in LA Kobe was playing 15 and 26 minutes per game,

In Kobe's first full season as a starter he went 6-6 with Harris and 24-13 with Rambis, every other year sans 2004-05 Kobe was coached by Phil Jackson, and he even had two very mediocre seasons with Phil, both first round exits,

We can't apply one logic to MDA and then throw it out the window for Kobe.

That's like saying what other coach has Jordan, Magic, Bird, and Duncan won with..Kobe has 5 rings..MDA 0...This is the second stop where MDA looks absolutely lost ...

ramtour420
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1/26/2013  12:43 PM
smackeddog wrote:D'Antoni is the only coach in nba history, who when given a front line of pau Gasol and Dwight Howard, could reach the conclusion "we gotta go small".

According to nixluva, him being inflexible is a load if craps. You see, he is being flexible. He sees the roster and he makes the necessary adjustment, going small. Because you see, this Lakers team is just not a title team, as per nixluva. So MDA is in the clear again. He just doesn't have a title team over there to work with

"You may say I'm a dreamer, but I'm not the only one. I hope someday you'll join us and the world will be as one." -J.Lennon
gunsnewing
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1/26/2013  1:51 PM
Dantoni would break up the Spurs Twin Towers of Robinson and Duncan
Nalod
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1/26/2013  2:10 PM
holfresh wrote:
IronWillGiroud wrote:What other coach has Kobe won with? When Harris was winning in LA Kobe was playing 15 and 26 minutes per game,

In Kobe's first full season as a starter he went 6-6 with Harris and 24-13 with Rambis, every other year sans 2004-05 Kobe was coached by Phil Jackson, and he even had two very mediocre seasons with Phil, both first round exits,

We can't apply one logic to MDA and then throw it out the window for Kobe.

That's like saying what other coach has Jordan, Magic, Bird, and Duncan won with..Kobe has 5 rings..MDA 0...This is the second stop where MDA looks absolutely lost ...

Kobe has burned thru a few coaches. PhiJax after his first stint fried him in his book. The dude is uncoachable. Phil does his jedi mind tricks on hiim.

Kobe signed off on MDA. So did Dwight. I think the problem is a bit more complicated than "MDA is inflexible". MDA is the coach and ultimately its his responsibility. This team had problems when he came on board.

So far, he can't fix it. He did not create this problem. It appears he is not the immediate solution.

Anger sells, don't buy!
nixluva
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1/26/2013  2:30 PM
I know it's easy to just assume that MDA is not capable of "fixing" the Lakers issues, but I would caution against being too hasty about what will happen in LA. For one thing that team had issues before he got there and one of the things that needed to be done was for THE PLAYERS to adjust to what the new coach wanted, but some of those STAR players resisted. That goes for Kobe, Pau and Dwight. What should've happened was that they didn't immediately resist and only play halfheartedly as they did. This was the true cause of the problem. Much like Melo those guys just didn't want to fully buy in and give it a chance.

Now last night they actually really tried to play as a team. Kobe handles the ball the MOST on the team and it was crucial that he be the one to lead and he did. He looked to set the example for sharing the ball and that's why he had so many assists. 14 assists was the 2nd most he's ever had. It's not like MDA is asking players to do something bad. His system is about ball and player movement and teamwork. So when his team's best players actually buy in then they usually find some success. No the Lakers aren't fixed. They have real issues in the roster, but they can and should play better if they just trust what he wants them to do.

Nalod
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1/26/2013  3:03 PM
Nash has to handle the ball and Kobe has to play off it.

Why bring in nash if you don't want this?

Why bring in MDA if you don't want this?

Dwight can't explode to the rim cause he had back surgery.

there are no lock down defenders on the team. Metta can't play like he used to.

Kobe is great for his age but can he really do it all? If Kobe don't trust his mates or the system it won't work. He never trusted anyone but Phil and even then fought him at times.

They can "Mutiny" against MDA but they already did it to Mike Brown this season. Anyone think removing MDA and bringing in a THIRD coach before the all star game is reasonable?

Has Kupchak lost it or is Jimmy Buss steering the ship now? This is a roster construction problem. Im sure we all think collecting names is usually a good idea. Knick fans understand this by now. Its a starphuch gentleman. Sometimes they work, often not.

Anger sells, don't buy!
loweyecue
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1/26/2013  3:22 PM
holfresh wrote:I defended Isiah for many years...It came to the point where the results were the results and I had no choice to examine them..I had to man up and accept the errors of my analysis...Isiah knew talent but couldn't assemble a team to play team basketball...I manned up...

MDA is not a good coach.. He is a guy with a system that works with the perfect PG to run it...Not every PG can run it..He needs a coach on the floor to run it...Nash is old..

He goes from place to place putting up the same results and his defenders blame the players and the organization..At some point you have to look at the man...At some point reality should set in...Other coaches have won with Kobe, Gasol and Medda..Add Nash and DHow who is not the same player but is still the best center in the league, the results are still bad...What gives???..

Bill Parcells once said your are what your record says you are...

And does Armelo I took the "C" out of Closer Anthony's record say what he is? Riiiiight!

TKF on Melo ::....he is a punk, a jerk, a self absorbed out of shape, self aggrandizing, unprofessional, volume chucking coach killing playoff loser!!
holfresh
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1/26/2013  3:22 PM
MDA always need a scapegoat..First, with us, it was Marbury, then it was Nate...Melo was the problem after "the trade"...It was Gasol as soon as he got to LA...When asked why he benched Gasol in the 4th qt after a loss, he said because he wanted to win...So now it's Kobe and DHow...Can't wait to see who we dig up next week...
nixluva
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1/26/2013  3:26 PM
Nalod wrote:Nash has to handle the ball and Kobe has to play off it.

Why bring in nash if you don't want this?

Why bring in MDA if you don't want this?

Dwight can't explode to the rim cause he had back surgery.

there are no lock down defenders on the team. Metta can't play like he used to.

Kobe is great for his age but can he really do it all? If Kobe don't trust his mates or the system it won't work. He never trusted anyone but Phil and even then fought him at times.

They can "Mutiny" against MDA but they already did it to Mike Brown this season. Anyone think removing MDA and bringing in a THIRD coach before the all star game is reasonable?

Has Kupchak lost it or is Jimmy Buss steering the ship now? This is a roster construction problem. Im sure we all think collecting names is usually a good idea. Knick fans understand this by now. Its a starphuch gentleman. Sometimes they work, often not.

Well it's real simple. Move the ball and keep moving and the ball will find you. MDA says it all the time but few players get it right away. To trust that the ball will move it takes the Star players to not hog the ball and over dribble looking for their own shot 1st. This is what happens to the Knicks when JR and Melo get solo happy. It almost never works out for us. However, when they keep the ball moving and find open teammates all of a sudden we have the top offense in terms of efficiency as we did to start the year. That's historically what MDA's offense is all about. We started the year doing that and the Lakers never really gave it a try, but last night they actually did and it looked much better. Now they have to keep doing that.

Kobe has to view himself as a decoy to open up easy buckets for D12 and Pau and 3pt shooters. That's really what can extend his career. He tried shooting his way out of it and that doesn't work. Melo tried that too and it doesn't work. A stars shots come easier when his teammates are a legit threat and that only happens when you share the ball.

Vmart
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1/26/2013  3:27 PM
Look the players wanted Jackson to coach them and when the players didn't get what they want they knew that Management wasn't committed to winning a chip.
nixluva
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1/26/2013  3:31 PM
holfresh wrote:MDA always need a scapegoat..First, with us, it was Marbury, then it was Nate...Melo was the problem after "the trade"...It was Gasol as soon as he got to LA...When asked why he benched Gasol in the 4th qt after a loss, he said because he wanted to win...So now it's Kobe and DHow...Can't wait to see who we dig up next week...

You clearly don't know what you're talking about. Did you watch those games? Do you know what it looks like when a player is not giving his all and it hurts the team? When star players act like little girls and stop playing hard it effects the entire team and that's what happened. Rather than actually give the new system a 110% effort and try to see how it works. The Laker stars all acted like children and stopped giving max effort. It's the same crap Melo did and sooner or later you're going to see that fact.

That's why even without Melo and STAT the teams role players played better. They actually trusted in what MDA was coaching and they found some success. It's also why the team played better when MDA left cuz all of a sudden Melo played hard and his teammates followed. It's always that way. The players have to give a damn and play hard. If they act like spoiled brats it's not gonna work.

holfresh
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1/26/2013  3:35 PM    LAST EDITED: 1/26/2013  3:46 PM
loweyecue wrote:
holfresh wrote:I defended Isiah for many years...It came to the point where the results were the results and I had no choice to examine them..I had to man up and accept the errors of my analysis...Isiah knew talent but couldn't assemble a team to play team basketball...I manned up...

MDA is not a good coach.. He is a guy with a system that works with the perfect PG to run it...Not every PG can run it..He needs a coach on the floor to run it...Nash is old..

He goes from place to place putting up the same results and his defenders blame the players and the organization..At some point you have to look at the man...At some point reality should set in...Other coaches have won with Kobe, Gasol and Medda..Add Nash and DHow who is not the same player but is still the best center in the league, the results are still bad...What gives???..

Bill Parcells once said your are what your record says you are...

And does Armelo I took the "C" out of Closer Anthony's record say what he is? Riiiiight!

It certainly does...His scoring averages tells you he is one of the better scorers in the league...Not sure about this, but, I think he led his team(Denver) to seven 50 win seasons in the West with notable scoring sidekicks like Earl Boykins and Vershon? Leonard...When he got a decent PG, he got to the ECF...So, Do we have a decent PG??..Check!!!..Are we on the road to 50 wins?? Double Check!!!...ECF??,The big dance???, a possible ring???..Check back later!!!

gunsnewing
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1/26/2013  3:42 PM    LAST EDITED: 1/26/2013  3:43 PM
We will see where the Lakers go from here. Kobe 14pts 9rebs 14assists last night. If he plays like that and gets howard, nash and gasol involved they can actually win if not then Dantoni will be the goat.

Maybe with Durant blowing past him Kobe will finally give up on the chase for the scoring title

knickscity
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1/26/2013  3:50 PM
gunsnewing wrote:We will see where the Lakers go from here. Kobe 14pts 9rebs 14assists last night. If he plays like that and gets howard, nash and gasol involved they can actually win if not then Dantoni will be the goat.

Maybe with Durant blowing past him Kobe will finally give up on the chase for the scoring title

Kobe wants the all-time one, but i believe he wants to win first.

The Lakers situation isn't because of D'antoni, but he'll take the fall for it.

loweyecue
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1/26/2013  4:02 PM
holfresh wrote:
loweyecue wrote:
holfresh wrote:I defended Isiah for many years...It came to the point where the results were the results and I had no choice to examine them..I had to man up and accept the errors of my analysis...Isiah knew talent but couldn't assemble a team to play team basketball...I manned up...

MDA is not a good coach.. He is a guy with a system that works with the perfect PG to run it...Not every PG can run it..He needs a coach on the floor to run it...Nash is old..

He goes from place to place putting up the same results and his defenders blame the players and the organization..At some point you have to look at the man...At some point reality should set in...Other coaches have won with Kobe, Gasol and Medda..Add Nash and DHow who is not the same player but is still the best center in the league, the results are still bad...What gives???..

Bill Parcells once said your are what your record says you are...

And does Armelo I took the "C" out of Closer Anthony's record say what he is? Riiiiight!

It certainly does...His scoring averages tells you he is one of the better scorers in the league...Not sure about this, but, I think he led his team(Denver) to seven 50 win seasons in the West with notable scoring sidekicks like Earl Boykins and Vershon? Leonard...When he got a decent PG, he got to the ECF...So, Do we have a decent PG??..Check!!!..Are we on the road to 50 wins?? Double Check!!!...ECF??,The big dance???, a possible ring???..Check back later!!!

Do people play basketball for Regular Season greatness? Last time I did CHECK it apperared the goal was winning an NBA championship.

Melo one trip to the WCF
MDA one trip to the WCF

CHECK that.

TKF on Melo ::....he is a punk, a jerk, a self absorbed out of shape, self aggrandizing, unprofessional, volume chucking coach killing playoff loser!!
nykshaknbake
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1/26/2013  4:05 PM

nixluva wrote:
holfresh wrote:MDA always need a scapegoat..First, with us, it was Marbury, then it was Nate...Melo was the problem after "the trade"...It was Gasol as soon as he got to LA...When asked why he benched Gasol in the 4th qt after a loss, he said because he wanted to win...So now it's Kobe and DHow...Can't wait to see who we dig up next week...

You clearly don't know what you're talking about. Did you watch those games? Do you know what it looks like when a player is not giving his all and it hurts the team? When star players act like little girls and stop playing hard it effects the entire team and that's what happened. Rather than actually give the new system a 110% effort and try to see how it works. The Laker stars all acted like children and stopped giving max effort. It's the same crap Melo did and sooner or later you're going to see that fact.

That's why even without Melo and STAT the teams role players played better. They actually trusted in what MDA was coaching and they found some success. It's also why the team played better when MDA left cuz all of a sudden Melo played hard and his teammates followed. It's always that way. The players have to give a damn and play hard. If they act like spoiled brats it's not gonna work.

It seems MDA is pretty good at turning high performing stars into little girls who don't play hard.

holfresh
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1/26/2013  4:08 PM
loweyecue wrote:
holfresh wrote:
loweyecue wrote:
holfresh wrote:I defended Isiah for many years...It came to the point where the results were the results and I had no choice to examine them..I had to man up and accept the errors of my analysis...Isiah knew talent but couldn't assemble a team to play team basketball...I manned up...

MDA is not a good coach.. He is a guy with a system that works with the perfect PG to run it...Not every PG can run it..He needs a coach on the floor to run it...Nash is old..

He goes from place to place putting up the same results and his defenders blame the players and the organization..At some point you have to look at the man...At some point reality should set in...Other coaches have won with Kobe, Gasol and Medda..Add Nash and DHow who is not the same player but is still the best center in the league, the results are still bad...What gives???..

Bill Parcells once said your are what your record says you are...

And does Armelo I took the "C" out of Closer Anthony's record say what he is? Riiiiight!

It certainly does...His scoring averages tells you he is one of the better scorers in the league...Not sure about this, but, I think he led his team(Denver) to seven 50 win seasons in the West with notable scoring sidekicks like Earl Boykins and Vershon? Leonard...When he got a decent PG, he got to the ECF...So, Do we have a decent PG??..Check!!!..Are we on the road to 50 wins?? Double Check!!!...ECF??,The big dance???, a possible ring???..Check back later!!!

Do people play basketball for Regular Season greatness? Last time I did CHECK it apperared the goal was winning an NBA championship.

Melo one trip to the WCF
MDA one trip to the WCF

CHECK that.

Well it's a team game..If your team isn't good then most likely u wont go deep into the playoffs..But if u want to put that on Melo's shoulders ok...

gunsnewing
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1/26/2013  4:11 PM
Dantoni is not a very good communicator with his star players thats for sure. We'll see. Lakers turn it around kobe and dantoni will get credit. They miss the playoffs Dantoni is the goat because he is the HEAD COACH
OT: Lakers Player Mutiny Against D'AnToni

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