jrodmc wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

Welpee wrote:

fishmike wrote:

Welpee wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

Welpee wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

fishmike wrote:

Welpee wrote:

fishmike wrote:

HofstraBBall wrote:

fishmike wrote:

HofstraBBall wrote:

fishmike wrote:

HofstraBBall wrote: Only one question that would proof your hater view is right.
Please name which years, that Melo was here, you, the all knowing Bball guru, thoight we had the right pieces in place to win a playoff series?

You asked this. I gave you the playoff series we should have won. It was during the 54 win season vs the Pacers. Knicks were #2 seed and had home court. Pacers were #3 seed.

We had the pieces to win that series, however the team did not play well. Starting with our star player, leader, alpha... whatever your posters say.

fishmike wrote:Oh.. and the Knicks had home court vs. Indiana. The Knicks were the #2 seed. They should have won. They were the better team. However we entered game 6 down 3-2.
Game 1, Knicks lose, Melo shoots 10-28
Game 3, Knicks lose, Melo shoots 6-16
Game 4, Knicks lose, Melo shoots 9-23

Im not sure how I can be more direct or simple. You asked a question. I gave you an answer backed with data. Melo has been a poor playoff performer. He was here as well. In talking about the "Melo era" as is the thread of this title, when thinking about Melo's career here those games stand out painfully. Unlike say John Starks and his painful (1-17) game, Melo lacks John's body of successful work to alleviate some of the pain that memory causes.

You hear blame. I just see poor play.

Nah. You claim that we had the pieces to win in 2012? Any other year? Cuz we were talking ERA. O guess that clearly proves your point thatbit was Melos fault we have underachieving here and not the talent placed around him.

But okay, which pieces, in 2012, were good enough to compete against West, Granger, Hibbert, Hill and Collison? Assuming PG and Melo were a wash.

So you were going to come up with ALL the years we had great pieces around Melo and you came up with 2012....fact

And now you will come up with why you think the likes of Smith, Felton and Tyson And cripple STAY (Who if I remember didn't playbdorst 2 or 3 games) were better than Pacer guys mentioned above.....GO.

sober up and come back to me. I have no clue wtf your saying dude

Knicks had DPOY, #3 in MVP, 6th man of the year, and a veteran cast of playoff proven guys like Camby, Sheed, Kidd, Kurt, etc... guy that played for small but meaningful stretches. Knicks were #2 for a reason. They were an excellent team. But yea... nice revisionist history to float your argument. Knicks were also favored in vegas. Higher seed. More wins. Your making **** up. Lets let this go... your right. Melo was superstar player and victimized but poor teammates, Phil Jackson and mean people on the internet. Go be happy dude.

Bro, think I just laughed for 5 minutes. I gave you a list of Pacers on their squad and our highest minute contributors and you bring up a DNP role call of non factors? You cant be serious. Some mentioned were injured and out of the series? But you claimed you watched. Lmao. Get some sleep Fish. We are done here.

Go Knicks!!

Why were the Knick's favored in the series? Your right... Knicks had NO chance to win. They had a 2nd tier all star who's career playoff numbers show a pattern of poor playoff performances, and not much after that. Your 100% right. Melo couldnt hold Paul George's jock, and the Pacers had a better supporting cast as well. You are right. Im not sure what I was trying to prove. So cant blame Melo for Knicks having no chance. Fair

Melo career regular season: 24.8 ppg/6.6 reb/45% fg
Melo career playoffs: 25.7 ppg/7.3 reb/41% fg

And yes, Lebron and Steph Curry's fg% dropped in the playoffs too. So I guess this is where someone digs up some advanced metrics to show Melo is horrible in the playoffs. Also interesting that nobody bothers to post Paul George's fg% numbers in that series.

I defended MElo a ton that season. He had a great year for the Knicks. I was frustrated with some of his playoff games so I dug into it at that time: http://www.ultimateknicks.com/forum/topic.asp?t=45742

Melo's playoff performances when looked in a W/L context are tough to ignore

Here is what I wrote:

So I was on basketball-reference.com and went through all his playoff game logs. I kept my criteria simple. 40% Shooting.
Folks have always said Melo's had to play tough teams, the West was loaded, cant hold him accountable for not beating the Spurs and Lakers etc when nobody was... we have been through it ad nauseum
I knew this year would show it pretty clearly but other years paint the same picture when you combine them.
These last playoffs: (this was the 12 playoff games after the 54 win series)
Melo shoots +40%: Knicks are 5-1
Melo shoots -40%: Knicks are 1-5
Wow. I certainly blame JR's abysmal shooting as well, and I especially kill Chandler for gettig mowed over by Hibbert but when you look at the best player on the team hard to ignore that.
His career?
Melo shoots +40%: his teams are 15-17
Melo shoots -40%: his teams are 7-24
What is uterly shocking is that in 66 playoff games Melo has failed to shoot over 40% in 34 of them.
Melo had a monster year last year and Im hoping he picks up where he left off in that regard. But come post season something needs to give if the Knicks wants to have any chance of competing.
To me the only saving grace is defense. If we build a defensive monster we can still win regardless of this. In 2009 when Melo was playing with KMart, Nene, Billups and Dante Jones they had the formula to make it work.
Can Chandler, MWP, Shump and Felton match the defense those Denver guys were able to grind out?
Hard to see this team ever sustain a playoff run without an elite caliber defense...

We can talk about his teammates and whatever people want to bring up. Sure.. its fair to say most of Melo's playoff teams were not favored or set up to advance. Does that excuse the fact that in more than half the playoff games he's played in he's failed to shoot 40%? Sorry.. thats just poor play, especially from your lead scorer.

Yes, his skills are off the charts. With smart decision making, he could have been much more efficient in the regular season and post-season. Too many contested mid range shots.
If you want to call him a hall-of-fame scorer, then he should be able to shoot efficiently even with poor teammates. That's what hall-of-fame scorers do (KG, Lebron, Westbrook, Harden, even Kevin Love ). If you want to say he's not a hall-of-fame scorer, that's another story.

Allen Iverson?

Not the kind of player I'd want to build my team around.

Fair enough, but many would include him in the NBA top 50+10 of all time.

Iverson is similar but also a bit tricky. His apex was higher than Melo (NBA finals, MVP). Iverson also has some pretty wild stats. He led the league in minutes 7 times. He has 4 scoring titles. He's led the league in steals 3 times. He lived at the FT line. There were a couple seasons where only Shaq got there more. I always thought AI was one of the toughest dudes to play in the league. He was so tiny, got whacked every night and just kept on coming....

No doubt. I wasn't comparing Melo with AI other than pointing out that you don't have to be the most efficient scorer to be consider great.

Oh I was never disputing that Melo is considered to be a great, hall-of-fame level scorer

You just maintain that he sucks at everything else. Except maybe off court charity work. Got it.

Bonn1997 wrote:

jrodmc wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

Welpee wrote:

fishmike wrote:

Welpee wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

Welpee wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

fishmike wrote:

Welpee wrote:

fishmike wrote:

HofstraBBall wrote:

fishmike wrote:

HofstraBBall wrote:

fishmike wrote:

HofstraBBall wrote: Only one question that would proof your hater view is right.
Please name which years, that Melo was here, you, the all knowing Bball guru, thoight we had the right pieces in place to win a playoff series?

You asked this. I gave you the playoff series we should have won. It was during the 54 win season vs the Pacers. Knicks were #2 seed and had home court. Pacers were #3 seed.

We had the pieces to win that series, however the team did not play well. Starting with our star player, leader, alpha... whatever your posters say.

fishmike wrote:Oh.. and the Knicks had home court vs. Indiana. The Knicks were the #2 seed. They should have won. They were the better team. However we entered game 6 down 3-2.
Game 1, Knicks lose, Melo shoots 10-28
Game 3, Knicks lose, Melo shoots 6-16
Game 4, Knicks lose, Melo shoots 9-23

Im not sure how I can be more direct or simple. You asked a question. I gave you an answer backed with data. Melo has been a poor playoff performer. He was here as well. In talking about the "Melo era" as is the thread of this title, when thinking about Melo's career here those games stand out painfully. Unlike say John Starks and his painful (1-17) game, Melo lacks John's body of successful work to alleviate some of the pain that memory causes.

You hear blame. I just see poor play.

Nah. You claim that we had the pieces to win in 2012? Any other year? Cuz we were talking ERA. O guess that clearly proves your point thatbit was Melos fault we have underachieving here and not the talent placed around him.

But okay, which pieces, in 2012, were good enough to compete against West, Granger, Hibbert, Hill and Collison? Assuming PG and Melo were a wash.

So you were going to come up with ALL the years we had great pieces around Melo and you came up with 2012....fact

And now you will come up with why you think the likes of Smith, Felton and Tyson And cripple STAY (Who if I remember didn't playbdorst 2 or 3 games) were better than Pacer guys mentioned above.....GO.

sober up and come back to me. I have no clue wtf your saying dude

Knicks had DPOY, #3 in MVP, 6th man of the year, and a veteran cast of playoff proven guys like Camby, Sheed, Kidd, Kurt, etc... guy that played for small but meaningful stretches. Knicks were #2 for a reason. They were an excellent team. But yea... nice revisionist history to float your argument. Knicks were also favored in vegas. Higher seed. More wins. Your making **** up. Lets let this go... your right. Melo was superstar player and victimized but poor teammates, Phil Jackson and mean people on the internet. Go be happy dude.

Bro, think I just laughed for 5 minutes. I gave you a list of Pacers on their squad and our highest minute contributors and you bring up a DNP role call of non factors? You cant be serious. Some mentioned were injured and out of the series? But you claimed you watched. Lmao. Get some sleep Fish. We are done here.

Go Knicks!!

Why were the Knick's favored in the series? Your right... Knicks had NO chance to win. They had a 2nd tier all star who's career playoff numbers show a pattern of poor playoff performances, and not much after that. Your 100% right. Melo couldnt hold Paul George's jock, and the Pacers had a better supporting cast as well. You are right. Im not sure what I was trying to prove. So cant blame Melo for Knicks having no chance. Fair

Melo career regular season: 24.8 ppg/6.6 reb/45% fg
Melo career playoffs: 25.7 ppg/7.3 reb/41% fg

And yes, Lebron and Steph Curry's fg% dropped in the playoffs too. So I guess this is where someone digs up some advanced metrics to show Melo is horrible in the playoffs. Also interesting that nobody bothers to post Paul George's fg% numbers in that series.

I defended MElo a ton that season. He had a great year for the Knicks. I was frustrated with some of his playoff games so I dug into it at that time: http://www.ultimateknicks.com/forum/topic.asp?t=45742

Melo's playoff performances when looked in a W/L context are tough to ignore

Here is what I wrote:

So I was on basketball-reference.com and went through all his playoff game logs. I kept my criteria simple. 40% Shooting.
Folks have always said Melo's had to play tough teams, the West was loaded, cant hold him accountable for not beating the Spurs and Lakers etc when nobody was... we have been through it ad nauseum
I knew this year would show it pretty clearly but other years paint the same picture when you combine them.
These last playoffs: (this was the 12 playoff games after the 54 win series)
Melo shoots +40%: Knicks are 5-1
Melo shoots -40%: Knicks are 1-5
Wow. I certainly blame JR's abysmal shooting as well, and I especially kill Chandler for gettig mowed over by Hibbert but when you look at the best player on the team hard to ignore that.
His career?
Melo shoots +40%: his teams are 15-17
Melo shoots -40%: his teams are 7-24
What is uterly shocking is that in 66 playoff games Melo has failed to shoot over 40% in 34 of them.
Melo had a monster year last year and Im hoping he picks up where he left off in that regard. But come post season something needs to give if the Knicks wants to have any chance of competing.
To me the only saving grace is defense. If we build a defensive monster we can still win regardless of this. In 2009 when Melo was playing with KMart, Nene, Billups and Dante Jones they had the formula to make it work.
Can Chandler, MWP, Shump and Felton match the defense those Denver guys were able to grind out?
Hard to see this team ever sustain a playoff run without an elite caliber defense...

We can talk about his teammates and whatever people want to bring up. Sure.. its fair to say most of Melo's playoff teams were not favored or set up to advance. Does that excuse the fact that in more than half the playoff games he's played in he's failed to shoot 40%? Sorry.. thats just poor play, especially from your lead scorer.

Yes, his skills are off the charts. With smart decision making, he could have been much more efficient in the regular season and post-season. Too many contested mid range shots.
If you want to call him a hall-of-fame scorer, then he should be able to shoot efficiently even with poor teammates. That's what hall-of-fame scorers do (KG, Lebron, Westbrook, Harden, even Kevin Love ). If you want to say he's not a hall-of-fame scorer, that's another story.

Allen Iverson?

Not the kind of player I'd want to build my team around.

Fair enough, but many would include him in the NBA top 50+10 of all time.

Iverson is similar but also a bit tricky. His apex was higher than Melo (NBA finals, MVP). Iverson also has some pretty wild stats. He led the league in minutes 7 times. He has 4 scoring titles. He's led the league in steals 3 times. He lived at the FT line. There were a couple seasons where only Shaq got there more. I always thought AI was one of the toughest dudes to play in the league. He was so tiny, got whacked every night and just kept on coming....

No doubt. I wasn't comparing Melo with AI other than pointing out that you don't have to be the most efficient scorer to be consider great.

Oh I was never disputing that Melo is considered to be a great, hall-of-fame level scorer

You just maintain that he sucks at everything else. Except maybe off court charity work. Got it.

I hope you're just joking and you forgot to insert smiley faces. Otherwise I seriously doubt your reading abilities and memory functioning.

I think AI and melo are good comparisons, both were high volume low percentage shooters/scorers. Iverson had more success, their decline I feel will be very similar both players failed to change their game with there aging bodies, they both don’t make there teammates better, their low percentage scoring starts to fall off the map. Dose anyone remember iverson last game? I doubt anyone will remember Melos.

Bonn1997 wrote:

Welpee wrote:

fishmike wrote:

HofstraBBall wrote:

fishmike wrote:

HofstraBBall wrote:

fishmike wrote:

HofstraBBall wrote: Only one question that would proof your hater view is right.
Please name which years, that Melo was here, you, the all knowing Bball guru, thoight we had the right pieces in place to win a playoff series?

You asked this. I gave you the playoff series we should have won. It was during the 54 win season vs the Pacers. Knicks were #2 seed and had home court. Pacers were #3 seed.

We had the pieces to win that series, however the team did not play well. Starting with our star player, leader, alpha... whatever your posters say.

fishmike wrote:Oh.. and the Knicks had home court vs. Indiana. The Knicks were the #2 seed. They should have won. They were the better team. However we entered game 6 down 3-2.
Game 1, Knicks lose, Melo shoots 10-28
Game 3, Knicks lose, Melo shoots 6-16
Game 4, Knicks lose, Melo shoots 9-23

Im not sure how I can be more direct or simple. You asked a question. I gave you an answer backed with data. Melo has been a poor playoff performer. He was here as well. In talking about the "Melo era" as is the thread of this title, when thinking about Melo's career here those games stand out painfully. Unlike say John Starks and his painful (1-17) game, Melo lacks John's body of successful work to alleviate some of the pain that memory causes.

You hear blame. I just see poor play.

Nah. You claim that we had the pieces to win in 2012? Any other year? Cuz we were talking ERA. O guess that clearly proves your point thatbit was Melos fault we have underachieving here and not the talent placed around him.

But okay, which pieces, in 2012, were good enough to compete against West, Granger, Hibbert, Hill and Collison? Assuming PG and Melo were a wash.

So you were going to come up with ALL the years we had great pieces around Melo and you came up with 2012....fact

And now you will come up with why you think the likes of Smith, Felton and Tyson And cripple STAY (Who if I remember didn't playbdorst 2 or 3 games) were better than Pacer guys mentioned above.....GO.

sober up and come back to me. I have no clue wtf your saying dude

Knicks had DPOY, #3 in MVP, 6th man of the year, and a veteran cast of playoff proven guys like Camby, Sheed, Kidd, Kurt, etc... guy that played for small but meaningful stretches. Knicks were #2 for a reason. They were an excellent team. But yea... nice revisionist history to float your argument. Knicks were also favored in vegas. Higher seed. More wins. Your making **** up. Lets let this go... your right. Melo was superstar player and victimized but poor teammates, Phil Jackson and mean people on the internet. Go be happy dude.

Bro, think I just laughed for 5 minutes. I gave you a list of Pacers on their squad and our highest minute contributors and you bring up a DNP role call of non factors? You cant be serious. Some mentioned were injured and out of the series? But you claimed you watched. Lmao. Get some sleep Fish. We are done here.

Go Knicks!!

Why were the Knick's favored in the series? Your right... Knicks had NO chance to win. They had a 2nd tier all star who's career playoff numbers show a pattern of poor playoff performances, and not much after that. Your 100% right. Melo couldnt hold Paul George's jock, and the Pacers had a better supporting cast as well. You are right. Im not sure what I was trying to prove. So cant blame Melo for Knicks having no chance. Fair

Melo career regular season: 24.8 ppg/6.6 reb/45% fg
Melo career playoffs: 25.7 ppg/7.3 reb/41% fg

And yes, Lebron and Steph Curry's fg% dropped in the playoffs too. So I guess this is where someone digs up some advanced metrics to show Melo is horrible in the playoffs.

41% is pretty bad actually but no one is saying he's a bad player. What we gave up for him (trades and salary) required him to be much better though. For a while, he had the largest contract in the country. But he was just a symptom of many more fundamental problems. He wasn't the problem.

This is where numbers guys lose me. No matter how much someone nerds up their knowledge of the game, they can't understand the real intricacies of the sport. Can Fish Fill-O-Shit or you ecplain what happens in a 7 game series to the best player on the team? Do teams double team them or guard them one on one. Do they put in place dedensive schemes do stop that player? Have you ever heard of the saying.."Make the other guys beat you"? Have you seen players like MJ, LBJ, etc need the GM to add MORE pieces after realizing this and losing a series? Do you guys really know basketball? You sure act like you have never watched a tough playoff series. The best player on the team gets focused on, muscled, beat up and yes...gets his percentage affected if he has no help. But keep beinging up those cute numbers.

Bonn1997 wrote:

fitzfarm wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

jrodmc wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

Welpee wrote:

fishmike wrote:

Welpee wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

Welpee wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

fishmike wrote:

Welpee wrote:

fishmike wrote:

HofstraBBall wrote:

fishmike wrote:

HofstraBBall wrote:

fishmike wrote:

HofstraBBall wrote: Only one question that would proof your hater view is right.
Please name which years, that Melo was here, you, the all knowing Bball guru, thoight we had the right pieces in place to win a playoff series?

You asked this. I gave you the playoff series we should have won. It was during the 54 win season vs the Pacers. Knicks were #2 seed and had home court. Pacers were #3 seed.

We had the pieces to win that series, however the team did not play well. Starting with our star player, leader, alpha... whatever your posters say.

fishmike wrote:Oh.. and the Knicks had home court vs. Indiana. The Knicks were the #2 seed. They should have won. They were the better team. However we entered game 6 down 3-2.
Game 1, Knicks lose, Melo shoots 10-28
Game 3, Knicks lose, Melo shoots 6-16
Game 4, Knicks lose, Melo shoots 9-23

Im not sure how I can be more direct or simple. You asked a question. I gave you an answer backed with data. Melo has been a poor playoff performer. He was here as well. In talking about the "Melo era" as is the thread of this title, when thinking about Melo's career here those games stand out painfully. Unlike say John Starks and his painful (1-17) game, Melo lacks John's body of successful work to alleviate some of the pain that memory causes.

You hear blame. I just see poor play.

Nah. You claim that we had the pieces to win in 2012? Any other year? Cuz we were talking ERA. O guess that clearly proves your point thatbit was Melos fault we have underachieving here and not the talent placed around him.

But okay, which pieces, in 2012, were good enough to compete against West, Granger, Hibbert, Hill and Collison? Assuming PG and Melo were a wash.

So you were going to come up with ALL the years we had great pieces around Melo and you came up with 2012....fact

And now you will come up with why you think the likes of Smith, Felton and Tyson And cripple STAY (Who if I remember didn't playbdorst 2 or 3 games) were better than Pacer guys mentioned above.....GO.

sober up and come back to me. I have no clue wtf your saying dude

Knicks had DPOY, #3 in MVP, 6th man of the year, and a veteran cast of playoff proven guys like Camby, Sheed, Kidd, Kurt, etc... guy that played for small but meaningful stretches. Knicks were #2 for a reason. They were an excellent team. But yea... nice revisionist history to float your argument. Knicks were also favored in vegas. Higher seed. More wins. Your making **** up. Lets let this go... your right. Melo was superstar player and victimized but poor teammates, Phil Jackson and mean people on the internet. Go be happy dude.

Bro, think I just laughed for 5 minutes. I gave you a list of Pacers on their squad and our highest minute contributors and you bring up a DNP role call of non factors? You cant be serious. Some mentioned were injured and out of the series? But you claimed you watched. Lmao. Get some sleep Fish. We are done here.

Go Knicks!!

Why were the Knick's favored in the series? Your right... Knicks had NO chance to win. They had a 2nd tier all star who's career playoff numbers show a pattern of poor playoff performances, and not much after that. Your 100% right. Melo couldnt hold Paul George's jock, and the Pacers had a better supporting cast as well. You are right. Im not sure what I was trying to prove. So cant blame Melo for Knicks having no chance. Fair

Melo career regular season: 24.8 ppg/6.6 reb/45% fg
Melo career playoffs: 25.7 ppg/7.3 reb/41% fg

And yes, Lebron and Steph Curry's fg% dropped in the playoffs too. So I guess this is where someone digs up some advanced metrics to show Melo is horrible in the playoffs. Also interesting that nobody bothers to post Paul George's fg% numbers in that series.

I defended MElo a ton that season. He had a great year for the Knicks. I was frustrated with some of his playoff games so I dug into it at that time: http://www.ultimateknicks.com/forum/topic.asp?t=45742

Melo's playoff performances when looked in a W/L context are tough to ignore

Here is what I wrote:

So I was on basketball-reference.com and went through all his playoff game logs. I kept my criteria simple. 40% Shooting.
Folks have always said Melo's had to play tough teams, the West was loaded, cant hold him accountable for not beating the Spurs and Lakers etc when nobody was... we have been through it ad nauseum
I knew this year would show it pretty clearly but other years paint the same picture when you combine them.
These last playoffs: (this was the 12 playoff games after the 54 win series)
Melo shoots +40%: Knicks are 5-1
Melo shoots -40%: Knicks are 1-5
Wow. I certainly blame JR's abysmal shooting as well, and I especially kill Chandler for gettig mowed over by Hibbert but when you look at the best player on the team hard to ignore that.
His career?
Melo shoots +40%: his teams are 15-17
Melo shoots -40%: his teams are 7-24
What is uterly shocking is that in 66 playoff games Melo has failed to shoot over 40% in 34 of them.
Melo had a monster year last year and Im hoping he picks up where he left off in that regard. But come post season something needs to give if the Knicks wants to have any chance of competing.
To me the only saving grace is defense. If we build a defensive monster we can still win regardless of this. In 2009 when Melo was playing with KMart, Nene, Billups and Dante Jones they had the formula to make it work.
Can Chandler, MWP, Shump and Felton match the defense those Denver guys were able to grind out?
Hard to see this team ever sustain a playoff run without an elite caliber defense...

We can talk about his teammates and whatever people want to bring up. Sure.. its fair to say most of Melo's playoff teams were not favored or set up to advance. Does that excuse the fact that in more than half the playoff games he's played in he's failed to shoot 40%? Sorry.. thats just poor play, especially from your lead scorer.

Yes, his skills are off the charts. With smart decision making, he could have been much more efficient in the regular season and post-season. Too many contested mid range shots.
If you want to call him a hall-of-fame scorer, then he should be able to shoot efficiently even with poor teammates. That's what hall-of-fame scorers do (KG, Lebron, Westbrook, Harden, even Kevin Love ). If you want to say he's not a hall-of-fame scorer, that's another story.

Allen Iverson?

Not the kind of player I'd want to build my team around.

Fair enough, but many would include him in the NBA top 50+10 of all time.

Iverson is similar but also a bit tricky. His apex was higher than Melo (NBA finals, MVP). Iverson also has some pretty wild stats. He led the league in minutes 7 times. He has 4 scoring titles. He's led the league in steals 3 times. He lived at the FT line. There were a couple seasons where only Shaq got there more. I always thought AI was one of the toughest dudes to play in the league. He was so tiny, got whacked every night and just kept on coming....

No doubt. I wasn't comparing Melo with AI other than pointing out that you don't have to be the most efficient scorer to be consider great.

Oh I was never disputing that Melo is considered to be a great, hall-of-fame level scorer

You just maintain that he sucks at everything else. Except maybe off court charity work. Got it.

I hope you're just joking and you forgot to insert smiley faces. Otherwise I seriously doubt your reading abilities and memory functioning.

I think AI and melo are good comparisons, both were high volume low percentage shooters/scorers. Iverson had more success, their decline I feel will be very similar both players failed to change their game with there aging bodies, they both don’t make there teammates better, their low percentage scoring starts to fall off the map. Dose anyone remember iverson last game? I doubt anyone will remember Melos.

Yeah, if Iverson could have been put in a situation where he was the 3rd best player on his team (like Melo now) that would have been perfect for him.

jrodmc wrote:

HofstraBBall wrote:

fishmike wrote:

HofstraBBall wrote:

fishmike wrote:

HofstraBBall wrote:

fishmike wrote:

HofstraBBall wrote: Only one question that would proof your hater view is right.
Please name which years, that Melo was here, you, the all knowing Bball guru, thoight we had the right pieces in place to win a playoff series?

You asked this. I gave you the playoff series we should have won. It was during the 54 win season vs the Pacers. Knicks were #2 seed and had home court. Pacers were #3 seed.

We had the pieces to win that series, however the team did not play well. Starting with our star player, leader, alpha... whatever your posters say.

fishmike wrote:Oh.. and the Knicks had home court vs. Indiana. The Knicks were the #2 seed. They should have won. They were the better team. However we entered game 6 down 3-2.
Game 1, Knicks lose, Melo shoots 10-28
Game 3, Knicks lose, Melo shoots 6-16
Game 4, Knicks lose, Melo shoots 9-23

Im not sure how I can be more direct or simple. You asked a question. I gave you an answer backed with data. Melo has been a poor playoff performer. He was here as well. In talking about the "Melo era" as is the thread of this title, when thinking about Melo's career here those games stand out painfully. Unlike say John Starks and his painful (1-17) game, Melo lacks John's body of successful work to alleviate some of the pain that memory causes.

You hear blame. I just see poor play.

Nah. You claim that we had the pieces to win in 2012? Any other year? Cuz we were talking ERA. O guess that clearly proves your point thatbit was Melos fault we have underachieving here and not the talent placed around him.

But okay, which pieces, in 2012, were good enough to compete against West, Granger, Hibbert, Hill and Collison? Assuming PG and Melo were a wash.

So you were going to come up with ALL the years we had great pieces around Melo and you came up with 2012....fact

And now you will come up with why you think the likes of Smith, Felton and Tyson And cripple STAY (Who if I remember didn't playbdorst 2 or 3 games) were better than Pacer guys mentioned above.....GO.

sober up and come back to me. I have no clue wtf your saying dude

Knicks had DPOY, #3 in MVP, 6th man of the year, and a veteran cast of playoff proven guys like Camby, Sheed, Kidd, Kurt, etc... guy that played for small but meaningful stretches. Knicks were #2 for a reason. They were an excellent team. But yea... nice revisionist history to float your argument. Knicks were also favored in vegas. Higher seed. More wins. Your making **** up. Lets let this go... your right. Melo was superstar player and victimized but poor teammates, Phil Jackson and mean people on the internet. Go be happy dude.

Bro, think I just laughed for 5 minutes. I gave you a list of Pacers on their squad and our highest minute contributors and you bring up a DNP role call of non factors? You cant be serious. Some mentioned were injured and out of the series? But you claimed you watched. Lmao. Get some sleep Fish. We are done here.

Go Knicks!!

Why were the Knick's favored in the series? Your right... Knicks had NO chance to win. They had a 2nd tier all star who's career playoff numbers show a pattern of poor playoff performances, and not much after that. Your 100% right. Melo couldnt hold Paul George's jock, and the Pacers had a better supporting cast as well. You are right. Im not sure what I was trying to prove. So cant blame Melo for Knicks having no chance. Fair

Vegas favored? That's your response? Bahaha.

What did Melo shoot compared to PG in the series?? In spite of being the only player, worth a ****, on the team. How many points did Melo average vs PG? Despite being the main focus of the defense? Unless you think they had their eyes on Shump and Felton.

You keep getting **** wrong every time you post. I thought i was having a debate against someone smarter than Meloshouldgo,

Btw. See how I state facts to argue with your point yet you still fail to answer my questions. (MY ORIGINAL POST THAT STARTED THIS STRING) What years supporting roster did you expect him to have a winning season with? AND..Which one of our guys was a better match up in that Pacer Playoff series? I'll even let you use your hindsight in your analysis? Unless you though going into that series that we had a better cast of players and didn't think injuries mattered?

Doesn't mattter at this point anymore Hofstra... it's been one long pissy rant. tkf, d7tkth, ChuckBuck, Splat, on and on to the more cerebral types now...

If we win, and having Melo on the team isn't "boring" it's only because of Jkidd and Camby. And maybe JR Smith. Or FluTyson. Or two weeks of LinLove. Or the fabulous genius of MDA. Or maybe it was all about George Karl.

If we lose, it's Melo and his defective useless D and his inefficient tkf-dubbed dino-iso ball.

At the end of the day, it's been about the Trade-Rape (which is cool to say, but don't ever let anyone try and explain it without wet-dream imaginary trades and even more delusional imaginary draft picks), coach-killing (and just look at the HOF records of the coaches who have died at the hands of Melo as a Knick), running such luminaries as Lin, Stat and any and all other potential stars who were just dying to come and play here, but knew that Melo was a tumorous growth that was probably contagious, and the ruining of your yoots and teammates, who only say nice things because Melo is actually a useless teddy bear masquerading as a HOF NBA player. Stupid kids should know better before their careers end up in the same sort of hell hole Me70 created for himself.

Trust me, it's not emotional with them. It's purely metrical.

Why so much emotions about some OKC SF?
I think Westbrook is much more exiting topic.
What if he will became a Knick? This is something to talk about!!!

HofstraBBall wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

Welpee wrote:

fishmike wrote:

HofstraBBall wrote:

fishmike wrote:

HofstraBBall wrote:

fishmike wrote:

HofstraBBall wrote: Only one question that would proof your hater view is right.
Please name which years, that Melo was here, you, the all knowing Bball guru, thoight we had the right pieces in place to win a playoff series?

You asked this. I gave you the playoff series we should have won. It was during the 54 win season vs the Pacers. Knicks were #2 seed and had home court. Pacers were #3 seed.

We had the pieces to win that series, however the team did not play well. Starting with our star player, leader, alpha... whatever your posters say.

fishmike wrote:Oh.. and the Knicks had home court vs. Indiana. The Knicks were the #2 seed. They should have won. They were the better team. However we entered game 6 down 3-2.
Game 1, Knicks lose, Melo shoots 10-28
Game 3, Knicks lose, Melo shoots 6-16
Game 4, Knicks lose, Melo shoots 9-23

Im not sure how I can be more direct or simple. You asked a question. I gave you an answer backed with data. Melo has been a poor playoff performer. He was here as well. In talking about the "Melo era" as is the thread of this title, when thinking about Melo's career here those games stand out painfully. Unlike say John Starks and his painful (1-17) game, Melo lacks John's body of successful work to alleviate some of the pain that memory causes.

You hear blame. I just see poor play.

Nah. You claim that we had the pieces to win in 2012? Any other year? Cuz we were talking ERA. O guess that clearly proves your point thatbit was Melos fault we have underachieving here and not the talent placed around him.

But okay, which pieces, in 2012, were good enough to compete against West, Granger, Hibbert, Hill and Collison? Assuming PG and Melo were a wash.

So you were going to come up with ALL the years we had great pieces around Melo and you came up with 2012....fact

And now you will come up with why you think the likes of Smith, Felton and Tyson And cripple STAY (Who if I remember didn't playbdorst 2 or 3 games) were better than Pacer guys mentioned above.....GO.

sober up and come back to me. I have no clue wtf your saying dude

Knicks had DPOY, #3 in MVP, 6th man of the year, and a veteran cast of playoff proven guys like Camby, Sheed, Kidd, Kurt, etc... guy that played for small but meaningful stretches. Knicks were #2 for a reason. They were an excellent team. But yea... nice revisionist history to float your argument. Knicks were also favored in vegas. Higher seed. More wins. Your making **** up. Lets let this go... your right. Melo was superstar player and victimized but poor teammates, Phil Jackson and mean people on the internet. Go be happy dude.

Bro, think I just laughed for 5 minutes. I gave you a list of Pacers on their squad and our highest minute contributors and you bring up a DNP role call of non factors? You cant be serious. Some mentioned were injured and out of the series? But you claimed you watched. Lmao. Get some sleep Fish. We are done here.

Go Knicks!!

Why were the Knick's favored in the series? Your right... Knicks had NO chance to win. They had a 2nd tier all star who's career playoff numbers show a pattern of poor playoff performances, and not much after that. Your 100% right. Melo couldnt hold Paul George's jock, and the Pacers had a better supporting cast as well. You are right. Im not sure what I was trying to prove. So cant blame Melo for Knicks having no chance. Fair

Melo career regular season: 24.8 ppg/6.6 reb/45% fg
Melo career playoffs: 25.7 ppg/7.3 reb/41% fg

And yes, Lebron and Steph Curry's fg% dropped in the playoffs too. So I guess this is where someone digs up some advanced metrics to show Melo is horrible in the playoffs.

41% is pretty bad actually but no one is saying he's a bad player. What we gave up for him (trades and salary) required him to be much better though. For a while, he had the largest contract in the country. But he was just a symptom of many more fundamental problems. He wasn't the problem.

This is where numbers guys lose me. No matter how much someone nerds up their knowledge of the game, they can't understand the real intricacies of the sport. Can Fish Fill-O-Shit or you ecplain what happens in a 7 game series to the best player on the team? Do teams double team them or guard them one on one. Do they put in place dedensive schemes do stop that player? Have you ever heard of the saying.."Make the other guys beat you"? Have you seen players like MJ, LBJ, etc need the GM to add MORE pieces after realizing this and losing a series? Do you guys really know basketball? You sure act like you have never watched a tough playoff series. The best player on the team gets focused on, muscled, beat up and yes...gets his percentage affected if he has no help. But keep beinging up those cute numbers.

arkrud wrote:

jrodmc wrote:

HofstraBBall wrote:

fishmike wrote:

HofstraBBall wrote:

fishmike wrote:

HofstraBBall wrote:

fishmike wrote:

HofstraBBall wrote: Only one question that would proof your hater view is right.
Please name which years, that Melo was here, you, the all knowing Bball guru, thoight we had the right pieces in place to win a playoff series?

You asked this. I gave you the playoff series we should have won. It was during the 54 win season vs the Pacers. Knicks were #2 seed and had home court. Pacers were #3 seed.

We had the pieces to win that series, however the team did not play well. Starting with our star player, leader, alpha... whatever your posters say.

fishmike wrote:Oh.. and the Knicks had home court vs. Indiana. The Knicks were the #2 seed. They should have won. They were the better team. However we entered game 6 down 3-2.
Game 1, Knicks lose, Melo shoots 10-28
Game 3, Knicks lose, Melo shoots 6-16
Game 4, Knicks lose, Melo shoots 9-23

Im not sure how I can be more direct or simple. You asked a question. I gave you an answer backed with data. Melo has been a poor playoff performer. He was here as well. In talking about the "Melo era" as is the thread of this title, when thinking about Melo's career here those games stand out painfully. Unlike say John Starks and his painful (1-17) game, Melo lacks John's body of successful work to alleviate some of the pain that memory causes.

You hear blame. I just see poor play.

Nah. You claim that we had the pieces to win in 2012? Any other year? Cuz we were talking ERA. O guess that clearly proves your point thatbit was Melos fault we have underachieving here and not the talent placed around him.

But okay, which pieces, in 2012, were good enough to compete against West, Granger, Hibbert, Hill and Collison? Assuming PG and Melo were a wash.

So you were going to come up with ALL the years we had great pieces around Melo and you came up with 2012....fact

And now you will come up with why you think the likes of Smith, Felton and Tyson And cripple STAY (Who if I remember didn't playbdorst 2 or 3 games) were better than Pacer guys mentioned above.....GO.

sober up and come back to me. I have no clue wtf your saying dude

Knicks had DPOY, #3 in MVP, 6th man of the year, and a veteran cast of playoff proven guys like Camby, Sheed, Kidd, Kurt, etc... guy that played for small but meaningful stretches. Knicks were #2 for a reason. They were an excellent team. But yea... nice revisionist history to float your argument. Knicks were also favored in vegas. Higher seed. More wins. Your making **** up. Lets let this go... your right. Melo was superstar player and victimized but poor teammates, Phil Jackson and mean people on the internet. Go be happy dude.

Bro, think I just laughed for 5 minutes. I gave you a list of Pacers on their squad and our highest minute contributors and you bring up a DNP role call of non factors? You cant be serious. Some mentioned were injured and out of the series? But you claimed you watched. Lmao. Get some sleep Fish. We are done here.

Go Knicks!!

Why were the Knick's favored in the series? Your right... Knicks had NO chance to win. They had a 2nd tier all star who's career playoff numbers show a pattern of poor playoff performances, and not much after that. Your 100% right. Melo couldnt hold Paul George's jock, and the Pacers had a better supporting cast as well. You are right. Im not sure what I was trying to prove. So cant blame Melo for Knicks having no chance. Fair

Vegas favored? That's your response? Bahaha.

What did Melo shoot compared to PG in the series?? In spite of being the only player, worth a ****, on the team. How many points did Melo average vs PG? Despite being the main focus of the defense? Unless you think they had their eyes on Shump and Felton.

You keep getting **** wrong every time you post. I thought i was having a debate against someone smarter than Meloshouldgo,

Btw. See how I state facts to argue with your point yet you still fail to answer my questions. (MY ORIGINAL POST THAT STARTED THIS STRING) What years supporting roster did you expect him to have a winning season with? AND..Which one of our guys was a better match up in that Pacer Playoff series? I'll even let you use your hindsight in your analysis? Unless you though going into that series that we had a better cast of players and didn't think injuries mattered?

Doesn't mattter at this point anymore Hofstra... it's been one long pissy rant. tkf, d7tkth, ChuckBuck, Splat, on and on to the more cerebral types now...

If we win, and having Melo on the team isn't "boring" it's only because of Jkidd and Camby. And maybe JR Smith. Or FluTyson. Or two weeks of LinLove. Or the fabulous genius of MDA. Or maybe it was all about George Karl.

If we lose, it's Melo and his defective useless D and his inefficient tkf-dubbed dino-iso ball.

At the end of the day, it's been about the Trade-Rape (which is cool to say, but don't ever let anyone try and explain it without wet-dream imaginary trades and even more delusional imaginary draft picks), coach-killing (and just look at the HOF records of the coaches who have died at the hands of Melo as a Knick), running such luminaries as Lin, Stat and any and all other potential stars who were just dying to come and play here, but knew that Melo was a tumorous growth that was probably contagious, and the ruining of your yoots and teammates, who only say nice things because Melo is actually a useless teddy bear masquerading as a HOF NBA player. Stupid kids should know better before their careers end up in the same sort of hell hole Me70 created for himself.

Trust me, it's not emotional with them. It's purely metrical.

Why so much emotions about some OKC SF?
I think Westbrook is much more exiting topic.
What if he will became a Knick? This is something to talk about!!!

Why any excitement over the possibility of some OKC PG coming here
when you could talk about flying pigs or
winning lottery tickets that you will find
in your next box of honey nut cheerios?