F500ONE wrote:

mreinman wrote:

F500ONE wrote:

RonRon wrote:The NBA today is not the same as the NBA when Phil Jackson had the best talent on his teams
Kerr fully understand this and evolves with the rest of the league while getting the most production out of his players/bench/strengths of his team

Green has the ability to defend, go inside and out to intitiate the offense, and play off the ball, rebound/steals/blocks/defense
His understanding of the game would have a signifigant upgrade and leadership that we lack
He could pass this on to our young guys of our future with Thanasis and our #1 pick
He works hard on and off the court and it would have a direct effect on the development of our our guys

He is like a young Shawn Marion but with better OFFENSE than his younger days

I like the fact

- He's had several 3blk games or more

- He's had several 3stl games or more

- He's had several 10reb games or more

- He's had several 6ast games or more

- He has 1 Triple Double and 3 near triple doubles

- He needs no plays called for him to be effective

http://www.ultimateknicks.com/forum/topic.asp?t=48477

you need to get your boy to stop shooting so many threes.

4 is possibly just about right in their system

My preference would be slightly less maybe 3-3.5

He needs to continue working on being a little more

Efficient as in making them because his FG% should be around 46% or better

Much like Kevin Love probably should be around 3-4 range

Might help improve Cleveland's overall winning % if he focused less on shooting them

ah ... 4 is right for their system uh-kay.

Your preference obviously means jack. His smart coach has him shooting 4.8 threes per 36 and the dude is only hitting them at 33.5%. Wonder why his smart coach still has him shooting these stupid 3's?

Stop being such a know it all and learn the game from the pro's who are teaching it.

You say X. So if the GM or Coach does not do X then they are either idiots or its a conspiracy. Why? Because you say X is correct.

Try doing some research or ask the pro's what X is and how it was born. Then come back and tell us about this X that you have been taught about.

Don't read articles to see if they match your view of X, read them and learn from them. Allow them to lead you.

Your brain reminds me of Carmelo's jump shot. You both think it is da-bomb! And you are both very wrong.

F500ONE wrote:

mreinman wrote:

F500ONE wrote:

mreinman wrote:

F500ONE wrote:

RonRon wrote:The NBA today is not the same as the NBA when Phil Jackson had the best talent on his teams
Kerr fully understand this and evolves with the rest of the league while getting the most production out of his players/bench/strengths of his team

Green has the ability to defend, go inside and out to intitiate the offense, and play off the ball, rebound/steals/blocks/defense
His understanding of the game would have a signifigant upgrade and leadership that we lack
He could pass this on to our young guys of our future with Thanasis and our #1 pick
He works hard on and off the court and it would have a direct effect on the development of our our guys

He is like a young Shawn Marion but with better OFFENSE than his younger days

I like the fact

- He's had several 3blk games or more

- He's had several 3stl games or more

- He's had several 10reb games or more

- He's had several 6ast games or more

- He has 1 Triple Double and 3 near triple doubles

- He needs no plays called for him to be effective

http://www.ultimateknicks.com/forum/topic.asp?t=48477

you need to get your boy to stop shooting so many threes.

4 is possibly just about right in their system

My preference would be slightly less maybe 3-3.5

He needs to continue working on being a little more

Efficient as in making them because his FG% should be around 46% or better

Much like Kevin Love probably should be around 3-4 range

Might help improve Cleveland's overall winning % if he focused less on shooting them

ah ... 4 is right for their system uh-kay.

Your preference obviously means jack. His smart coach has him shooting 4.8 threes per 36 and the dude is only hitting them at 33.5%. Wonder why his smart coach still has him shooting these stupid 3's?

Stop being such a know it all and learn the game from the pro's who are teaching it.

You say X. So if the GM or Coach does not do X then they are either idiots or its a conspiracy. Why? Because you say X is correct.

Try doing some research or ask the pro's what X is and how it was born. Then come back and tell us about this X that you have been taught about.

Don't read articles to see if they match your view of X, read them and learn from them. Allow them to lead you.

Your brain reminds me of Carmelo's jump shot. You both think it is da-bomb! And you are both very wrong.

Well 33% is not efficient right but in order to keep them

In a spread on offense Green has to operate and take what's there

And be aggressive to draw the defense out so when they want they penetrate

The middle stays open, so which is it with you

Take the 3s regardless of efficiency or take the 3s based on efficiency

Or are you disappointed in the fact Kevin Love is sucking at the 3ball this year

I'll be watching our next game to see if Lou Admundson is working on that stretch 4 play from beyond

Of course he needs to shoot it. Even at that rate his eFg is 50% but stick to FG talk. It makes us believe in you more.

I could care less about love. He is missing his shots, your point?

your line about Admundson was not funny stick to trying to be smart. funny aint happenin

F500ONE wrote:

mreinman wrote:

F500ONE wrote:

mreinman wrote:

F500ONE wrote:

mreinman wrote:

F500ONE wrote:

RonRon wrote:The NBA today is not the same as the NBA when Phil Jackson had the best talent on his teams
Kerr fully understand this and evolves with the rest of the league while getting the most production out of his players/bench/strengths of his team

Green has the ability to defend, go inside and out to intitiate the offense, and play off the ball, rebound/steals/blocks/defense
His understanding of the game would have a signifigant upgrade and leadership that we lack
He could pass this on to our young guys of our future with Thanasis and our #1 pick
He works hard on and off the court and it would have a direct effect on the development of our our guys

He is like a young Shawn Marion but with better OFFENSE than his younger days

I like the fact

- He's had several 3blk games or more

- He's had several 3stl games or more

- He's had several 10reb games or more

- He's had several 6ast games or more

- He has 1 Triple Double and 3 near triple doubles

- He needs no plays called for him to be effective

http://www.ultimateknicks.com/forum/topic.asp?t=48477

you need to get your boy to stop shooting so many threes.

4 is possibly just about right in their system

My preference would be slightly less maybe 3-3.5

He needs to continue working on being a little more

Efficient as in making them because his FG% should be around 46% or better

Much like Kevin Love probably should be around 3-4 range

Might help improve Cleveland's overall winning % if he focused less on shooting them

ah ... 4 is right for their system uh-kay.

Your preference obviously means jack. His smart coach has him shooting 4.8 threes per 36 and the dude is only hitting them at 33.5%. Wonder why his smart coach still has him shooting these stupid 3's?

Stop being such a know it all and learn the game from the pro's who are teaching it.

You say X. So if the GM or Coach does not do X then they are either idiots or its a conspiracy. Why? Because you say X is correct.

Try doing some research or ask the pro's what X is and how it was born. Then come back and tell us about this X that you have been taught about.

Don't read articles to see if they match your view of X, read them and learn from them. Allow them to lead you.

Your brain reminds me of Carmelo's jump shot. You both think it is da-bomb! And you are both very wrong.

Well 33% is not efficient right but in order to keep them

In a spread on offense Green has to operate and take what's there

And be aggressive to draw the defense out so when they want they penetrate

The middle stays open, so which is it with you

Take the 3s regardless of efficiency or take the 3s based on efficiency

Or are you disappointed in the fact Kevin Love is sucking at the 3ball this year

I'll be watching our next game to see if Lou Admundson is working on that stretch 4 play from beyond

Of course he needs to shoot it. Even at that rate his eFg is 50% but stick to FG talk. It makes us believe in you more.

I could care less about love. He is missing his shots, your point?

your line about Admundson was not funny stick to trying to be smart. funny aint happenin

No matter how hard you try with discussing basic math

Of converting 2s for 3s at various %s it doesn't make you smart

You try too hard to sound smart

Nevertheless since Dray has the same shooting % from 3 this yr as Love

And he's an Elite level metric stud on the defensive side of the ball

He should command what Kevin Love is making because you're all about being brainy and math right

see thats the thing. I am not claiming to be smart. I am just reading what smart people have to say. You on the other hand think its cool to come up with your own methodologies and arguments (that happen to make very little sense) and do your little "who's your daddy" dance.

He can command whatever he wants. Is he worth what Love will get (dray has a lower max)? The market will tell you very soon. And if he does not get the money, then you can scream "CONSPIRACY"!

BRIGGS wrote:

F500ONE wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

F500ONE wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

RonRon wrote:its funny, everyone wants to play like Golden State

No GS is not run by Curry or Klay or ANY ONE player
We need players that understand this and can execute this
Players that could defend 3 positions and do a bit of everything

Briggs, you clearly do not watch GS play, you watch numbers, look at measurements, look at stats, and watch at highlights and continue to try to find that steal that you think no one else can see but you

How are you gong to compare Acy with Green, really?

CA for Nate Walters and/or Kelly Olynicks

CA is a flawed player, we need someone that could defend multiple positions and do multiple things
With or without CA in NY, that is the type of talent we need moving forward

Ron--If Steph Curry and Klay Thompson were not on that team-we wouldnt be talking about Dreymond Green. The way I look at things--you need stars to win games and stars is where the money should be allocated--then fill in.

The "stars" are in the lottery picks and the upper tier FA's. I understand that Drey Green is playing well--but take a man out of the element he is in now and bang he may be a 4 mm $ player you have now signed for 12. Those two guards open up things for every body on BOTh sides of the ball. GS is a unique team that is far above us. We are in the process of finding our own Dreymond greens--that is the process I see--but not at 12mm--we need to find them at pick 26 38 41 etc... Paying 12 mm to dreymond green is buying super high. Dragic for this team is a much better value. He's a 20-7-4 PG 50% who can control the rhythm of the game. Think football and QB--you need those guys and thats where you spend the money

You couldn't be more wrong, eye test you've neglected no question here

If the busy college schedule is getting in the way

Maybe once again just maybe you need to take a break from it

And get focused because there's no way you would type the above if

You watched him play with a 'Scouts Eye'

With that said looking at his stats alone prove you're being clueless here

http://espn.go.com/nba/player/gamelog/_/id/6589/draymond-green

There's plenty of intel here to suggest Curry and Klay aren't having

Near the impact you're trying to imply they have on his game

Ive probably seen GS 3-4 times this year. I would never pay Drey Green 12 mm--maybe gS would--hes very valuable to them--Im not sure--that still a lot of money. You take away Steph Cury and Thompson and that team is barely .500 If you left Curry and Thomspon and removed Green and Harrison(the other two starters) they wouldnt be 35-5 but theyd be 27-10. Steph Curry is an MVP type player(a top 3 NBA player) and Klay Thompson is a top 10 NBA player--maybe the best SG in the NBA. Its impossible to guard GS because they have two super stars who also control the ball. Drey Green and everyone else on that team get great shots becuase of them--they get to play free and hard on D. Bring Drey Green to the Knicks and its not going to be the same--we are FAR away from GS talent-wise. We need to focus our assets on tier 1 players--guys like Curry and Thompson. Drey Green is an intangibles player and it is possible that he could sign a highly lucrative contract and move back to a 38% shooter without the assistance of those 2 guards.

Dray makes David near expendable, you know a guy who is making $16mil/yr

Have you ever advocated bringing Lee back to New York at his pay scale

Yet you'd squak at paying Dray $3-4mil/yr less than him

Are you limited in your abilities to scout a player tunnel vision only on offensive basic metrics

Dray's rebounding-steals-blks in any given game have absolutely nothing to do with Steph or Klay

He also has very good passing ability

His versatility to switch between guarding 1-4 positions have absolutely nothing to do with Steph or Klay

His +/- and Win Shares are also rather chunky here have a look

Scroll Down
http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/g/greendr01.html

This isnt 1990--this isnt the same type of basketball. Offense wins games now.

RonRon wrote:just to further my point on Draymond Green

Was Korver just a role player on a defensive team to spread the floor for Thibs and The Bulls?
I know their games are completely different, however, my point is that probably EVERYONE would say Korver was JUST A ROLE PLAYER
Well, he is not JUST a role player, he is a big part of the success with EVERYONE else on the Atlanta Hawks

Green is a elite defender and can do EVERYTHING, you put him in ANY SYSTEM and he still will be a great defender
He is used to INITIATE the OFFENSE at times in the post and he can spread the floor OFF the ball as well

He is a big part of the success that GS has this year, as he was very limited in minutes with Mark Jackson
His versatilty on OFFENSE and DEFENSE is exactly what we need

So what is the difference between GS in the past years and this year?
Draymond Green in the STARTING LINEUP and their DEFENSE, with even better ball movement/floor spacing that he provides

and they now have a much better ccach

STATMELO wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

F500ONE wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

RonRon wrote:its funny, everyone wants to play like Golden State

No GS is not run by Curry or Klay or ANY ONE player
We need players that understand this and can execute this
Players that could defend 3 positions and do a bit of everything

Briggs, you clearly do not watch GS play, you watch numbers, look at measurements, look at stats, and watch at highlights and continue to try to find that steal that you think no one else can see but you

How are you gong to compare Acy with Green, really?

CA for Nate Walters and/or Kelly Olynicks

CA is a flawed player, we need someone that could defend multiple positions and do multiple things
With or without CA in NY, that is the type of talent we need moving forward

Ron--If Steph Curry and Klay Thompson were not on that team-we wouldnt be talking about Dreymond Green. The way I look at things--you need stars to win games and stars is where the money should be allocated--then fill in.

The "stars" are in the lottery picks and the upper tier FA's. I understand that Drey Green is playing well--but take a man out of the element he is in now and bang he may be a 4 mm $ player you have now signed for 12. Those two guards open up things for every body on BOTh sides of the ball. GS is a unique team that is far above us. We are in the process of finding our own Dreymond greens--that is the process I see--but not at 12mm--we need to find them at pick 26 38 41 etc... Paying 12 mm to dreymond green is buying super high. Dragic for this team is a much better value. He's a 20-7-4 PG 50% who can control the rhythm of the game. Think football and QB--you need those guys and thats where you spend the money

You couldn't be more wrong, eye test you've neglected no question here

If the busy college schedule is getting in the way

Maybe once again just maybe you need to take a break from it

And get focused because there's no way you would type the above if

You watched him play with a 'Scouts Eye'

With that said looking at his stats alone prove you're being clueless here

http://espn.go.com/nba/player/gamelog/_/id/6589/draymond-green

There's plenty of intel here to suggest Curry and Klay aren't having

Near the impact you're trying to imply they have on his game

Ive probably seen GS 3-4 times this year. I would never pay Drey Green 12 mm--maybe gS would--hes very valuable to them--Im not sure--that still a lot of money. You take away Steph Cury and Thompson and that team is barely .500 If you left Curry and Thomspon and removed Green and Harrison(the other two starters) they wouldnt be 35-5 but theyd be 27-10. Steph Curry is an MVP type player(a top 3 NBA player) and Klay Thompson is a top 10 NBA player--maybe the best SG in the NBA. Its impossible to guard GS because they have two super stars who also control the ball. Drey Green and everyone else on that team get great shots becuase of them--they get to play free and hard on D. Bring Drey Green to the Knicks and its not going to be the same--we are FAR away from GS talent-wise. We need to focus our assets on tier 1 players--guys like Curry and Thompson. Drey Green is an intangibles player and it is possible that he could sign a highly lucrative contract and move back to a 38% shooter without the assistance of those 2 guards.

Do you watch games 27-10? This mans impact is on another level watch the games man...that defense is nowhere near the same without him on the floor, he is a star...on the defensive end. Do you realize we're arguably the worst defense in the league and haven't had an elite defense in over 12 years?

You do realize just about every champion in the history of this game has been a top 10 defense or a fringe top 10 defense? It seems like all you want is offensive players.

"Dray plays hard on D because of Thompson and Curry", the game doesn't work like that man. He'd be an elite defender on any squad.

Briggs just isn't a good scout at least not at the NBA level

He may get a couple prospects right out of 10,000 he shoves down your throat

At the collegiate and high school level

But I'd never pay him 6 figures to scout an NBA team

And for darn sure know the league would run circles around whatever product he attempted to put on the floor

F500ONE wrote:

STATMELO wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

F500ONE wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

RonRon wrote:its funny, everyone wants to play like Golden State

No GS is not run by Curry or Klay or ANY ONE player
We need players that understand this and can execute this
Players that could defend 3 positions and do a bit of everything

Briggs, you clearly do not watch GS play, you watch numbers, look at measurements, look at stats, and watch at highlights and continue to try to find that steal that you think no one else can see but you

How are you gong to compare Acy with Green, really?

CA for Nate Walters and/or Kelly Olynicks

CA is a flawed player, we need someone that could defend multiple positions and do multiple things
With or without CA in NY, that is the type of talent we need moving forward

Ron--If Steph Curry and Klay Thompson were not on that team-we wouldnt be talking about Dreymond Green. The way I look at things--you need stars to win games and stars is where the money should be allocated--then fill in.

The "stars" are in the lottery picks and the upper tier FA's. I understand that Drey Green is playing well--but take a man out of the element he is in now and bang he may be a 4 mm $ player you have now signed for 12. Those two guards open up things for every body on BOTh sides of the ball. GS is a unique team that is far above us. We are in the process of finding our own Dreymond greens--that is the process I see--but not at 12mm--we need to find them at pick 26 38 41 etc... Paying 12 mm to dreymond green is buying super high. Dragic for this team is a much better value. He's a 20-7-4 PG 50% who can control the rhythm of the game. Think football and QB--you need those guys and thats where you spend the money

You couldn't be more wrong, eye test you've neglected no question here

If the busy college schedule is getting in the way

Maybe once again just maybe you need to take a break from it

And get focused because there's no way you would type the above if

You watched him play with a 'Scouts Eye'

With that said looking at his stats alone prove you're being clueless here

http://espn.go.com/nba/player/gamelog/_/id/6589/draymond-green

There's plenty of intel here to suggest Curry and Klay aren't having

Near the impact you're trying to imply they have on his game

Ive probably seen GS 3-4 times this year. I would never pay Drey Green 12 mm--maybe gS would--hes very valuable to them--Im not sure--that still a lot of money. You take away Steph Cury and Thompson and that team is barely .500 If you left Curry and Thomspon and removed Green and Harrison(the other two starters) they wouldnt be 35-5 but theyd be 27-10. Steph Curry is an MVP type player(a top 3 NBA player) and Klay Thompson is a top 10 NBA player--maybe the best SG in the NBA. Its impossible to guard GS because they have two super stars who also control the ball. Drey Green and everyone else on that team get great shots becuase of them--they get to play free and hard on D. Bring Drey Green to the Knicks and its not going to be the same--we are FAR away from GS talent-wise. We need to focus our assets on tier 1 players--guys like Curry and Thompson. Drey Green is an intangibles player and it is possible that he could sign a highly lucrative contract and move back to a 38% shooter without the assistance of those 2 guards.

Do you watch games 27-10? This mans impact is on another level watch the games man...that defense is nowhere near the same without him on the floor, he is a star...on the defensive end. Do you realize we're arguably the worst defense in the league and haven't had an elite defense in over 12 years?

You do realize just about every champion in the history of this game has been a top 10 defense or a fringe top 10 defense? It seems like all you want is offensive players.

"Dray plays hard on D because of Thompson and Curry", the game doesn't work like that man. He'd be an elite defender on any squad.

Briggs just isn't a good scout at least not at the NBA level

He may get a couple prospects right out of 10,000 he shoves down your throat

At the collegiate and high school level

But I'd never pay him 6 figures to scout an NBA team

And for darn sure know the league would run circles around whatever product he attempted to put on the floor

ah ... but you are a good scout?

STATMELO wrote:

Tweet was deleted or there was problem with the URL:

https://twitter.com/SherwoodStrauss/status/547258310441721858

Green is a restricted free agent, it's going to be difficult for Golden State to keep him with the money they have committed to Steph, Iggy, Klay, Bogut and Lee. I've liked him since he played at Michigan State, compared him to Anthony Mason coming out of the draft because of his ability to handle the ball at his size, pass, his versatility and defense.

He's having a tremendous defensive year as a combo forward for the Warriors. He's quick enough laterally to hang with 3's and has the brute strength to guard 4's, he's even defended 5's like Marc Gasol. He has some of the quickest strongest hands in the league averaging about 1.5 blocks and 1.5 steals a game, dudes defensive I.Q. is just through the roof. He's on pace to accumulate over 6 defensive win shares (leading the league at the moment) only forwards to have done that recently are LeBron James ('09) and Paul George ('13). Historically, the other guys to have done it are Marion ('01), Pippen ('94, '95), Havlicek ('69), DeBusschere ('71) and Rodman ('91).

He's leading the league in defensive rating as well, and ranks fourth in defensive box plus minus behind Bogut, Gobert and Duncan. The Warriors are 6 points worse with him off the floor, take into account even with him off the floor they are an elite defense his impact is ridiculous.

I'd offer him a max contract thoughts? Here's his mixtape just for you guys who don't get to see him.

Draymond Green '14-'15: 11.5 points, 8 rebounds, 3.5 assists, 1.6 steals, 1.5 blocks, 54% TS, 32 minutes

One of my friends at another forum compared him favorably to Dave DeBusschere quite interesting wouldn't mind if you guys give it a read if you have the time...

http://hoops-nation.com/community/topic/116124-draymond-green-is-this-generations-dave-debusschere/

I've been a fan since he played at Michigan St but i'm not sure he's worth a max contract. I mean he's worth a big contract and would be one heck of a get for us but not max.

STATMELO wrote:

EnySpree wrote:

Knicks1969 wrote:

FistOfOakley wrote:as good as he is.. and i loved him in college.... he's only been able to do this for half a nba season so far...

we don't need to spend 12-15 million on glue guys... we need young talent who can be transformative...

Sorry dude, this kid is not a glue guy. He is well worth the money. You are to be able to see what a kid will be from the jump. This dude can only get better from where he is right now. He will be a hell of a leader.

Before this year nobody was really talking about Green. Overpaying a player like this exactly what the Knicks have done historically. He's undersized too at 6'7".

We need to talk to everyone and try to find the right mix, but we also need to be fiscally responsible.

It doesn't matter that he's undersized he's had no problems defending 3-5 and is averaging 8 boards...people have been talking about Green since last years playoffs. This is the first year he's getting big minutes. I don't think y'all understand how good this kid is.