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Time to put KP in second unit.
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franco12
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11/9/2016  8:48 AM
I think part might be not so much putting KP to the 2nd unit as far as not having him at the four and melo at the 3.

Maybe we would have been better off without Noah and spending the money elsewhere on the roster.
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HofstraBBall
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11/9/2016  8:49 AM
blkexec wrote:Why not take Melo out early....keep him fresh for the playoffs....it gives the 2nd unit a boast when he comes back in. He's getting older.. keeps him fresh.

Sure, why not. In favor of resting him. Anything to help lose leads in second unit. Think JH has tried that as well.

'Knicks focus should be on players that have grown up playing soccer or cricket' - Triplethreat 8/28/2020
jrodmc
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11/9/2016  9:22 AM
Wow. Bench KP? What are you doing, trying to undermine the "ceding of primacy" movement? LOL
Yes, please, instead let's bench Rose. He's just one of the best starting PG's in the league. Then we follow that by benching Melo.

Then we can let KP play the 3 and the 4 AND the point. Hopefully, by playing 3 positions, KP can still keep his FGA below 18.

Anyway, if he doesn't, it will be Melo's fault; selfish douche by osmosis syndrome.

After 6 games, it's "Time". SMH
Knixkik
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11/9/2016  10:09 AM
jrodmc wrote:Wow. Bench KP? What are you doing, trying to undermine the "ceding of primacy" movement? LOL
Yes, please, instead let's bench Rose. He's just one of the best starting PG's in the league. Then we follow that by benching Melo.

Then we can let KP play the 3 and the 4 AND the point. Hopefully, by playing 3 positions, KP can still keep his FGA below 18.

Anyway, if he doesn't, it will be Melo's fault; selfish douche by osmosis syndrome.

After 6 games, it's "Time". SMH

I cleared this up with OP earlier in the thread. He doesn't seem to be referring to "benching" KP. More like staggering the rotation so KP spends more time with the 2nd unit so he can remain a focal point in the offense. To an extent, we are already doing that, so i am not even really sure the point of the thread. I guess its just to continue that strategy, maybe with more emphasis.
jrodmc
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11/9/2016  10:15 AM
Knixkik wrote:
jrodmc wrote:Wow. Bench KP? What are you doing, trying to undermine the "ceding of primacy" movement? LOL
Yes, please, instead let's bench Rose. He's just one of the best starting PG's in the league. Then we follow that by benching Melo.

Then we can let KP play the 3 and the 4 AND the point. Hopefully, by playing 3 positions, KP can still keep his FGA below 18.

Anyway, if he doesn't, it will be Melo's fault; selfish douche by osmosis syndrome.

After 6 games, it's "Time". SMH

I cleared this up with OP earlier in the thread. He doesn't seem to be referring to "benching" KP. More like staggering the rotation so KP spends more time with the 2nd unit so he can remain a focal point in the offense. To an extent, we are already doing that, so i am not even really sure the point of the thread. I guess its just to continue that strategy, maybe with more emphasis.


Yeah, I got your point and the op's, even though the thread title is a bit more than misleading. It's been stated that Horny realized in Utah that we can't really score anywhere near as easily without KP.

I'm responding more to the amusing responses posted than the actual intent of the thread.
HofstraBBall
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11/9/2016  3:01 PM
jrodmc wrote:Wow. Bench KP? What are you doing, trying to undermine the "ceding of primacy" movement? LOL
Yes, please, instead let's bench Rose. He's just one of the best starting PG's in the league. Then we follow that by benching Melo.

Then we can let KP play the 3 and the 4 AND the point. Hopefully, by playing 3 positions, KP can still keep his FGA below 18.

Anyway, if he doesn't, it will be Melo's fault; selfish douche by osmosis syndrome.
After 6 games, it's "Time". SMH

More of a point that we all want to see KP as the main option. And the secomd umitbis in need of one. Funny how everyone's panties are in a wad if they think your suggesting KP start on the bench, which I wasn't. Just think he would get more touches with second unit and therefore should get a lot of minutes with them. More Melo at his stronger position, IMO, the 4. It's already happening but would want to see more of it. Not the apocalyptic **** everyone isalong it out to be.

'Knicks focus should be on players that have grown up playing soccer or cricket' - Triplethreat 8/28/2020
Knixkik
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11/9/2016  3:38 PM
HofstraBBall wrote:
jrodmc wrote:Wow. Bench KP? What are you doing, trying to undermine the "ceding of primacy" movement? LOL
Yes, please, instead let's bench Rose. He's just one of the best starting PG's in the league. Then we follow that by benching Melo.

Then we can let KP play the 3 and the 4 AND the point. Hopefully, by playing 3 positions, KP can still keep his FGA below 18.

Anyway, if he doesn't, it will be Melo's fault; selfish douche by osmosis syndrome.
After 6 games, it's "Time". SMH

More of a point that we all want to see KP as the main option. And the secomd umitbis in need of one. Funny how everyone's panties are in a wad if they think your suggesting KP start on the bench, which I wasn't. Just think he would get more touches with second unit and therefore should get a lot of minutes with them. More Melo at his stronger position, IMO, the 4. It's already happening but would want to see more of it. Not the apocalyptic **** everyone isalong it out to be.


I think the misleading thread title has caused a lot of what you are alluding to. I believe KP will have to eventually move to the 5 and Melo to the 4 anyways. That was the reason to resign Lance. So you have that 3/4 who can defend and fit with 2 scorers. Noah will continue to start at the 5, but he will only play 20-24 mpg for the rest of his career, so the bulk of KP's minutes should be at the center anyways. Would like to see if we can eventually add a better combo forward than Lance either via draft or free agency that can eventually start next to Melo and KP. Not this year, but maybe a year or 2 down the road when Noah in the 2nd half of his contract and only able to play a backup role for his energy/leadership.
HofstraBBall
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11/10/2016  6:59 AM
Knixkik wrote:
HofstraBBall wrote:
jrodmc wrote:Wow. Bench KP? What are you doing, trying to undermine the "ceding of primacy" movement? LOL
Yes, please, instead let's bench Rose. He's just one of the best starting PG's in the league. Then we follow that by benching Melo.

Then we can let KP play the 3 and the 4 AND the point. Hopefully, by playing 3 positions, KP can still keep his FGA below 18.

Anyway, if he doesn't, it will be Melo's fault; selfish douche by osmosis syndrome.
After 6 games, it's "Time". SMH

More of a point that we all want to see KP as the main option. And the secomd umitbis in need of one. Funny how everyone's panties are in a wad if they think your suggesting KP start on the bench, which I wasn't. Just think he would get more touches with second unit and therefore should get a lot of minutes with them. More Melo at his stronger position, IMO, the 4. It's already happening but would want to see more of it. Not the apocalyptic **** everyone isalong it out to be.


I think the misleading thread title has caused a lot of what you are alluding to. I believe KP will have to eventually move to the 5 and Melo to the 4 anyways. That was the reason to resign Lance. So you have that 3/4 who can defend and fit with 2 scorers. Noah will continue to start at the 5, but he will only play 20-24 mpg for the rest of his career, so the bulk of KP's minutes should be at the center anyways. Would like to see if we can eventually add a better combo forward than Lance either via draft or free agency that can eventually start next to Melo and KP. Not this year, but maybe a year or 2 down the road when Noah in the 2nd half of his contract and only able to play a backup role for his energy/leadership.

True, see your point. What I saw last night was exactly what I was suggesting. Melo highlighted in 3rd and KP in 4th. The first half seemed to force them into trying to share the ball, which is good, but didn't seem natural. Think with time they will get better at letting shots come in the flow. Hope he stays with letting those two play on different units until the first unit can flow, like it did in the first quarter of Utah game. A bonus last night was to see JH go with some of the younger guys. KO and LT have been disappointing thus far. Hopefully they turn it around. Jennings played good pressure defense and found the go to guys.

'Knicks focus should be on players that have grown up playing soccer or cricket' - Triplethreat 8/28/2020
blkexec
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11/10/2016  8:36 AM
HofstraBBall wrote:
blkexec wrote:Why not take Melo out early....keep him fresh for the playoffs....it gives the 2nd unit a boast when he comes back in. He's getting older.. keeps him fresh.

Sure, why not. In favor of resting him. Anything to help lose leads in second unit. Think JH has tried that as well.

Did I call it......Take Melo out and bring him back with the second unit. That way he can focus on scoring, which is better than him passing. KPs offense is different since he relies on the PG play to get him the ball. And Rose is not the best facilitator. Seems like Jennings should be starting and rose come off the bench. That way rose can be rose, which is the only way he can be impact full right now.

Born in Brooklyn, Raised in Queens, Lives in Maryland. The future is bright, I'm a Knicks fan for life!
dk7th
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11/10/2016  9:00 AM
blkexec wrote:
HofstraBBall wrote:
blkexec wrote:Why not take Melo out early....keep him fresh for the playoffs....it gives the 2nd unit a boast when he comes back in. He's getting older.. keeps him fresh.

Sure, why not. In favor of resting him. Anything to help lose leads in second unit. Think JH has tried that as well.

Did I call it......Take Melo out and bring him back with the second unit. That way he can focus on scoring, which is better than him passing. KPs offense is different since he relies on the PG play to get him the ball. And Rose is not the best facilitator. Seems like Jennings should be starting and rose come off the bench. That way rose can be rose, which is the only way he can be impact full right now.

you have selective memory, baba:

http://www.ultimateknicks.com/forum/topic.asp?t=50975

i hope there will be no hard feelings having taken a trip down memory lane-- we did get at each other but i am officially extending an olive branch. hope you take it.

meanwhile there are some other posts in that thread by posters whose blood pressure will be sure to rise.

knicks win 38-43 games in 16-17. rose MUST shoot no more than 14 shots per game, defer to kp6 + melo, and have a usage rate of less than 25%
fishmike
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11/10/2016  9:16 AM
I understand the premise of the thread... not to demote KP, but to feature him in the 2nd unit or find a rotation that is better balanced.

I remember with the Spree finals team that squad played two very different styles of play. They started Ewing/Kurt/Spree/Houston/Ward. It was a defensive half court squad to start the game. Then when the bench came in it was Camby/LJ/Childs and the Knicks pushed more, slashed more, used more ball movement and played a very different style. What made it work was mixing and matching the right parts.

This squad and staff have yet to do that. You can see there is a solid amount of individual talent which shows itself. However rarely this year has that talent made other talent better. That will come in time, and finding the right pairings of players is huge.

The only change I would make is bring Holiday off the bench first for either KP or Noah. Move Melo to the 4. If its KP that sits then he comes back with Jennings and Melo sits and KP is the focal point of the offense. That would be one scenario... its up to the coaches to sort this and the players to make it work. The only pressure is to win enough games so by the time you hope to have it sorted your season isnt buried.

I would expect us to be a much better looking squad by 20ish games and be .500 ish. I think if we are pretty much sorted with rotations and defense by that point we can really take off.

"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
blkexec
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11/10/2016  10:07 AM
Melo and rose are the only players who can create their own shot. Let them create.....while the others play team ball. Stop trying to force melo into something he's not. He's the best iso player in the NBA. Until they double him, let him destroy and carry the scoring when KP is on the bench or with the second unit like last night.

Rose is the same way.....hes better at creating for himself. But u cant play too many iso players at one time.....

Born in Brooklyn, Raised in Queens, Lives in Maryland. The future is bright, I'm a Knicks fan for life!
blkexec
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11/10/2016  10:21 AM
dk7th wrote:
blkexec wrote:
HofstraBBall wrote:
blkexec wrote:Why not take Melo out early....keep him fresh for the playoffs....it gives the 2nd unit a boast when he comes back in. He's getting older.. keeps him fresh.

Sure, why not. In favor of resting him. Anything to help lose leads in second unit. Think JH has tried that as well.

Did I call it......Take Melo out and bring him back with the second unit. That way he can focus on scoring, which is better than him passing. KPs offense is different since he relies on the PG play to get him the ball. And Rose is not the best facilitator. Seems like Jennings should be starting and rose come off the bench. That way rose can be rose, which is the only way he can be impact full right now.

you have selective memory, baba:

http://www.ultimateknicks.com/forum/topic.asp?t=50975

i hope there will be no hard feelings having taken a trip down memory lane-- we did get at each other but i am officially extending an olive branch. hope you take it.

meanwhile there are some other posts in that thread by posters whose blood pressure will be sure to rise.

Are you trying to sabotage yourself, by bringing up your own racist comments? Seriously.....
Martin already gave you a warning.....Fish already chewed you up. Wow... At this point, I refuse to steep down to ur level and just pray that we as a people continue to move forward with love and less bigotry and racist insults. Less DK like comments and more love.....

Born in Brooklyn, Raised in Queens, Lives in Maryland. The future is bright, I'm a Knicks fan for life!
dk7th
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11/10/2016  10:28 AM    LAST EDITED: 11/10/2016  10:30 AM
blkexec wrote:
dk7th wrote:
blkexec wrote:
HofstraBBall wrote:
blkexec wrote:Why not take Melo out early....keep him fresh for the playoffs....it gives the 2nd unit a boast when he comes back in. He's getting older.. keeps him fresh.

Sure, why not. In favor of resting him. Anything to help lose leads in second unit. Think JH has tried that as well.

Did I call it......Take Melo out and bring him back with the second unit. That way he can focus on scoring, which is better than him passing. KPs offense is different since he relies on the PG play to get him the ball. And Rose is not the best facilitator. Seems like Jennings should be starting and rose come off the bench. That way rose can be rose, which is the only way he can be impact full right now.

you have selective memory, baba:

http://www.ultimateknicks.com/forum/topic.asp?t=50975

i hope there will be no hard feelings having taken a trip down memory lane-- we did get at each other but i am officially extending an olive branch. hope you take it.

meanwhile there are some other posts in that thread by posters whose blood pressure will be sure to rise.

Are you trying to sabotage yourself, by bringing up your own racist comments? Seriously.....
Martin already gave you a warning.....Fish already chewed you up. Wow... At this point, I refuse to steep down to ur level and just pray that we as a people continue to move forward with love and less bigotry and racist insults. Less DK like comments and more love.....

i extended the olive branch, brother. you didn't do the right thing here.... sorry that you are going to join the list.

god bless.

knicks win 38-43 games in 16-17. rose MUST shoot no more than 14 shots per game, defer to kp6 + melo, and have a usage rate of less than 25%
jrodmc
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11/10/2016  11:19 AM
blkexec wrote:Melo and rose are the only players who can create their own shot. Let them create.....while the others play team ball. Stop trying to force melo into something he's not. He's the best iso player in the NBA. Until they double him, let him destroy and carry the scoring when KP is on the bench or with the second unit like last night.

Rose is the same way.....hes better at creating for himself. But u cant play too many iso players at one time.....

Agreed, but both have shown that they can also facilitate, especially Rose; although as I've pointed out ad nauseum, Melo has to be getting crack highs seeing all this single coverage

HofstraBBall
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11/10/2016  12:40 PM
blkexec wrote:Melo and rose are the only players who can create their own shot. Let them create.....while the others play team ball. Stop trying to force melo into something he's not. He's the best iso player in the NBA. Until they double him, let him destroy and carry the scoring when KP is on the bench or with the second unit like last night.

Rose is the same way.....hes better at creating for himself. But u cant play too many iso players at one time.....

Agree 100%

'Knicks focus should be on players that have grown up playing soccer or cricket' - Triplethreat 8/28/2020
HofstraBBall
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11/10/2016  12:41 PM
fishmike wrote:I understand the premise of the thread... not to demote KP, but to feature him in the 2nd unit or find a rotation that is better balanced.

I remember with the Spree finals team that squad played two very different styles of play. They started Ewing/Kurt/Spree/Houston/Ward. It was a defensive half court squad to start the game. Then when the bench came in it was Camby/LJ/Childs and the Knicks pushed more, slashed more, used more ball movement and played a very different style. What made it work was mixing and matching the right parts.

This squad and staff have yet to do that. You can see there is a solid amount of individual talent which shows itself. However rarely this year has that talent made other talent better. That will come in time, and finding the right pairings of players is huge.

The only change I would make is bring Holiday off the bench first for either KP or Noah. Move Melo to the 4. If its KP that sits then he comes back with Jennings and Melo sits and KP is the focal point of the offense. That would be one scenario... its up to the coaches to sort this and the players to make it work. The only pressure is to win enough games so by the time you hope to have it sorted your season isnt buried.

I would expect us to be a much better looking squad by 20ish games and be .500 ish. I think if we are pretty much sorted with rotations and defense by that point we can really take off.

Smart post.

'Knicks focus should be on players that have grown up playing soccer or cricket' - Triplethreat 8/28/2020
Knixkik
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11/10/2016  12:44 PM
Having either Melo/Rose or KP/Jennings in the game at all times makes sense. With these 4 players, there should be no reason not to have at least 2 in at a time.
jrodmc
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11/10/2016  1:04 PM
Knixkik wrote:Having either Melo/Rose or KP/Jennings in the game at all times makes sense. With these 4 players, there should be no reason not to have at least 2 in at a time.

If Jennings can remain this type of a pest on D, then I'm all for playing him with Rose. Would keep the pressure up on Lee to keep producing as well.
I just don't get all this let "Rose be Rose", like we're all watching the unveiling of Starbles II.
fishmike
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11/10/2016  1:07 PM
dk7th wrote:
blkexec wrote:
dk7th wrote:
blkexec wrote:
HofstraBBall wrote:
blkexec wrote:Why not take Melo out early....keep him fresh for the playoffs....it gives the 2nd unit a boast when he comes back in. He's getting older.. keeps him fresh.

Sure, why not. In favor of resting him. Anything to help lose leads in second unit. Think JH has tried that as well.

Did I call it......Take Melo out and bring him back with the second unit. That way he can focus on scoring, which is better than him passing. KPs offense is different since he relies on the PG play to get him the ball. And Rose is not the best facilitator. Seems like Jennings should be starting and rose come off the bench. That way rose can be rose, which is the only way he can be impact full right now.

you have selective memory, baba:

http://www.ultimateknicks.com/forum/topic.asp?t=50975

i hope there will be no hard feelings having taken a trip down memory lane-- we did get at each other but i am officially extending an olive branch. hope you take it.

meanwhile there are some other posts in that thread by posters whose blood pressure will be sure to rise.

Are you trying to sabotage yourself, by bringing up your own racist comments? Seriously.....
Martin already gave you a warning.....Fish already chewed you up. Wow... At this point, I refuse to steep down to ur level and just pray that we as a people continue to move forward with love and less bigotry and racist insults. Less DK like comments and more love.....

i extended the olive branch, brother. you didn't do the right thing here.... sorry that you are going to join the list.

god bless.


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The Proud
The LIST

Love this guy.

Careful... there is dogpoo on the end of that olive branch

"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
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