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Jackie Bulter vs. Mike Sweetney
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EnySpree
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6/14/2005  10:15 PM
What is the difference? 1 inch?

All the reports I've read about Jackie when he was in the draft process had him being compared to Elton Brand. Sweets is currently being compared to Elton too. At least we all hope he can be Elton.

Jackie is not a center and he is not 6'10". He's around 6'9" maybe in shoes. Sweets is 6'8" in shoes. Both have long wing spans at 7'1" each.

Sweetney put up 10pts and 6 rebs in 23 minutes in April.....8/5 in 19 mins overall. How much better will he get? Should we trade him now and try to loosen up the power fwd glut?

Jackie Butler seems like the same player only younger with less baby fat to get rid of. Jackie is 250lbs and Sweets is 270 after taking a large dump.

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Marv
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6/14/2005  10:46 PM
I don't want to trade Sweetney.

He's always struck me as a player who will steadily improve. It's exactly what he did in college too.

Let's see what Butler can produce. Let's see how well Sweets can grow his game.


If we draft a couple of 6'10" - 7'ers then Sweets and Butler could end up forming a dynamite power quartet with them. Then we can work on shedding all the PF's we have and maybe pick up some needed help backing up the 1, 2 and 3 spots.

And of course maybe - just maybe - we move Penny +/or TT if the deal is right for the franchise.
purple012870
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6/14/2005  11:04 PM
Man...this site is littered with guys who define players by height/weight. Jackie Butler is also roughly the same height & weight as Magic & Larry Bird. Maybe he's a top 50 player? Geez....this is a CBAer with an outside shot to make an NBA team. Sweetney has his shortcomings (no pun intended) but he's a heluva lot better than Butler.
purple012870
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6/14/2005  11:06 PM
There's a another nugget of wisdom I missed. Not only is Jackie Butler better than Sweets, but he's another Elton Brand. And we know this because he is 6'9" 250 lbs & hit a few garbage time lay-ups.
TMS
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6/14/2005  11:20 PM
maybe we should hold off on the comparisons until Jackie actually breaks into the regular rotation?
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EnySpree
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6/14/2005  11:22 PM
so purple....how can you judge a man that you haven't seen play?

I never said he was Elton Brand based on size. This is what has been written about him. Read the post. Please don't ruin the thread with stupidity.

I just want to know if anyone is putting alot of hope on any one of these guys shoulders......because they both are reletively easy to get rid of compared to the rest of the Power fwds the Knicks have.

Or do we keep both and continue to try and trade the harder sells like JYD, Rose, and Taylor?
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EnySpree
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6/14/2005  11:22 PM
Posted by TMS:

maybe we should hold off on the comparisons until Jackie actually breaks into the regular rotation?

We will know come July when the summer leagues start. What if Jackie plays well? Then what?
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TMS
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6/14/2005  11:33 PM
Posted by EnySpree:
Posted by TMS:

maybe we should hold off on the comparisons until Jackie actually breaks into the regular rotation?

We will know come July when the summer leagues start. What if Jackie plays well? Then what?

look, people were comparing Sweets to Elton Brand & Charles Barkley before he ever touched an NBA court...let's not get excited about these young guys before we see them actually play extended minutes against NBA level competition...i told people to temper their comparisons w/Sweetney & got dismissed as a hater...how's he living up to the comparisons now? there really isn't any comparison if you ask me...Sweetney will be lucky to be a starter for much longer if he doesn't get into shape during the offseason...on the same token, it's going to take alot more than just a few minutes played in garbage time in sporadic action towards the end of the season, or some good showings in summer league games for that matter, to convince me that Butler is even worth holding onto much less even remotely comparable to star players in the NBA.
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bigpimpin
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6/15/2005  12:29 AM
Common sense says you keep Sweetney if it comes down to him and Butler. Let me guess, Enyspree started this thread?

TMS, i also wondered about those who compared Sweetney to Brand, Barkley, etc.

I even remember telling someone that he won't be better than Weatherspoon was in his first years in the league. Needless to say, I got cursed out while being called an idiot, moron, etc. (You know, all the internet lingo).
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nyballer
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6/15/2005  12:46 AM
if jackie butler was that great he would've gotten playing time. someone other than the knicks would have picked him up and he wouldve emerged as a good player. Sweetney might be another one of those overrated college players but hes proven something at the NCAA level at least. I don't think sweetney will be a great player but he should be able to put up solmetihng like 12/9 in his prime off the bench...Jackie Butler might be young and big but let's not acts like he's the next brand. We all know how much the Knicks like to win meaningless games, if butler was that great he would have been in there during the year.
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fishmike
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6/15/2005  7:13 AM
right now we are in no position to trade young players that work hard
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Pharzeone
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6/15/2005  8:53 AM
Posted by purple012870:

Man...this site is littered with guys who define players by height/weight. Jackie Butler is also roughly the same height & weight as Magic & Larry Bird. Maybe he's a top 50 player? Geez....this is a CBAer with an outside shot to make an NBA team. Sweetney has his shortcomings (no pun intended) but he's a heluva lot better than Butler.
That remains to be seen. What Butler did in the NBDL was extremely impressive just based on his age. I would hate to see what he would be doing in that league if he actually knew the game as a veteran. Butler was playing the center position and is not as vertically challenged as Sweets. It would be a nice competition for those two. I would like to see an open competition this year, like what Lenny had with Kurt (which really pissed him off) and Sweetney last training camp. Ariza vs TT is a must.
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gunsnewing
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6/15/2005  8:58 AM
Posted by Pharzeone:
Posted by purple012870:

Man...this site is littered with guys who define players by height/weight. Jackie Butler is also roughly the same height & weight as Magic & Larry Bird. Maybe he's a top 50 player? Geez....this is a CBAer with an outside shot to make an NBA team. Sweetney has his shortcomings (no pun intended) but he's a heluva lot better than Butler.
That remains to be seen. What Butler did in the NBDL was extremely impressive just based on his age. I would hate to see what he would be doing in that league if he actually knew the game as a veteran. Butler was playing the center position and is not as vertically challenged as Sweets. It would be a nice competition for those two. I would like to see an open competition this year, like what Lenny had with Kurt (which really pissed him off) and Sweetney last training camp. Ariza vs TT is a must.

exactly!

well said!
simrud
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6/15/2005  8:59 AM
Weatherspoon was pretty good in his prime you know.

If Sweetney can at least be as good as Spoon was in his best years it would be alredy nice.

That draft was just really bad, its not like we passed on somebody good to take Sweetney.

Who would you rather have from that year, Nick Collison?
A glimmer of hope maybe?!?
Killa4luv
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6/15/2005  9:05 AM
Posted by simrud:

Weatherspoon was pretty good in his prime you know.

If Sweetney can at least be as good as Spoon was in his best years it would be alredy nice.

That draft was just really bad, its not like we passed on somebody good to take Sweetney.

Who would you rather have from that year, Nick Collison?
Yeah you can't be mad that we have sweetney, he was a good pick and there were only like 6 players that whole draft worth anything.
fishmike
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6/15/2005  9:23 AM
Spoon was actually explosive. Some actually thought he had Barkley potential. Then he got fat and slow and his game went to crap. He was a beast with Phili... the teams sucked but he was a real horse.
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Killa4luv
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6/15/2005  9:40 AM
Posted by fishmike:

Spoon was actually explosive. Some actually thought he had Barkley potential. Then he got fat and slow and his game went to crap. He was a beast with Phili... the teams sucked but he was a real horse.
Yeah and he was SICK in college too. I watched alot of his games, he was looking like he could be the next Barkley for real.

Now he just sucks ass.
Bonn1997
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6/15/2005  9:59 AM
Posted by simrud:

Weatherspoon was pretty good in his prime you know.

If Sweetney can at least be as good as Spoon was in his best years it would be alredy nice.

That draft was just really bad, its not like we passed on somebody good to take Sweetney.

Who would you rather have from that year, Nick Collison?
I'd rather have Josh Howard, but I'm not going to criticize Layden for taking Sweetney over Howard. 27 other GMs also passed on Howard.
Nalod
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6/15/2005  10:16 AM
Sweets is playing for contract this year. It will define his career if he succeeds.

Sweets had flashes (some hot?) of brilliance and can dominate some players in some situations. This is very encouraging and be a sign of what can be.

IF he rocks, then he is more valuable to us on the floor and as trade fodder if need be. Jackie Blue's success also benefits us by making Sweets expendable.

FatSpoon had a nice 5 year run in the NBA.
BRIGGS
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6/15/2005  10:24 AM
Sweetney is a good player. the guy is a bull[although he needs to keep his weight in check] and highly skilled, and built to battle in the post. Now he will never guard the KGs of the world, but I see him as a guy along the lines of a sixth man FC type who plays 25 minutes off the bench like Dice does for Detroit. you really do need 4 guys who can play in the frontcourt, 3 who get 25 + minutes.

In 25 minutes Sweetney in shape should average 12-13 points 8 reb shooting 50%+

Now all we need is two frontcourt starters:>(
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Jackie Bulter vs. Mike Sweetney
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