So we could acquire big Z in a sign and trade + our 30th, which would be an immense value to them especially in this deep draft. I'm gonna put it together later cause its late and I'm sleepy. i know some of you don't want Z and think Bynum is the next Shaq, but I'm trying to be somewhat realistic here. Z is a good center and we'd be better with him period. I'll figure out a trade by the morning or hopefully one of you guys beats me too it.

Penny + 30

Posted by fishmike:

Z sucks... I would rather live with KT untill something better comes along

goodluck waiting for a Center better than Z to come along

how is something better going to come along though?

In order for a better center to come along we have to win no more than 20games and win the lottery in a year where there's a phenom Center. Something better like Samuel Dalembert? How far is that getting us? We need a guy who score inside so that we don't rely on jumpshooting so much. Now if we had Amare or duncan then It would be alot easier to wait for a servicable Center to come by but we don't we have Kurt Thomas. nevermind the 2.12 blocks per game Z averages putting him in the top 8.

Posted by martin:

Posted by fishmike:

Z sucks... I would rather live with KT untill something better comes along

I second that.

This is the problem I have with some Knick fans. Its like if a player has a flaw or is in some way imperfect, they dont want him.

What kind of players do you guys think we can get? The only centers that are better or more effective than him are Shaq and maybe Yao Ming. If you have to choose between KT and Z you choose KT? Thats really really stupid. I just can't think of any other words to describe that. KT has zero pesence in the lane, zero blocked shots and his offense consists of 16-18 footers. Z has a presence in the lane, blocks shots, has a consistant 16-18 footer and has a post game, and he's 7-3 in a league starved for centers.

If there is a counter-argument for getting Big Z, KT isn't apart of it. The perfect center doesn't exist, and the players we may really covet aren't available, Big Z is a much more than serviceable answer to our center problem. Its just as simple as that.

Ive watched some Cavs games. Z can score. He gets some blocks because he's huge, but he's no intimidator by any means. He's a hell of a scorer. Only a total tard would deny that. Would he help? I have no doubt, but at what cost? Do we really need a 30+ year old center with limited mobility and multiple anke problems signed to a 4 year $50mm contract? Thats on the low end to boot... my guess is he would want something Dampier like.

He's a retread

Posted by fishmike:

Ive watched some Cavs games. Z can score. He gets some blocks because he's huge, but he's no intimidator by any means. He's a hell of a scorer. Only a total tard would deny that. Would he help? I have no doubt, but at what cost? Do we really need a 30+ year old center with limited mobility and multiple anke problems signed to a 4 year $50mm contract? Thats on the low end to boot... my guess is he would want something Dampier like.

He's a retread

I watched Cav games too and I watched when we played them and his presence kept Steph out of the lane for the most part. And I think we can all agree that Steph is pretty fearless when it comes to attacking the rim. No one ever called him an intimidator, I said he is a presence in the lane, which is a huge Steph up from K 'Matador' Thomas.

Hes not 30 plus, hes 30, which isn't old for big men. Hes been healthy for about 3-4 seasons, and ankle problems tend not to put guys out, we have KT and Steph who have had ankle problems on bothe feet and are ironmen in the league.

Are there really better options than him? I would say no, the best we have is a dream in the draft, and the remote possibility of a S & T for Dalembert, Gadzuric, or signing of Steven Hunter. All of whom are about 1/3 of the player Z is. There are younger, more atheltic guys, but as far as getting the point production plus blocks and rebounds, it simply is non-existant in the league.

His cotract is something to consider, but that is precisely because he is one of the best players available at his position. I'd love to have Elton Brand and get a Steven Hunter type to play alongside him, but it isn't happening. Get big Z and get a Frye, Taft, or even a petro to play alongside him, and that is entirely possible.

Allanfan-
giving up penny or TT and 30th pick for one of the best centers in the game is suicide? You are hilarious!

Posted by fishmike:

Z sucks... I would rather live with KT untill something better comes along

that's just crazy. Z has his flaws but you don't make it to the all-star team by sucking. He's a good scorer and shot-blocker; Penny plus pick #30 would be a huge steal.

thats just plain dumb. it would be huge to get Z for only the #30th, basically a 2nd round pick. what a joke you wouldnt trade a 2nd round pick for one of the best centers in the league.

has anyone wondered why Cle doesnt win games?

Posted by Allanfan20:

Hey man, ignorance is bliss. I never denied that Z was a good player, b/c he is, but that's on the offensive end. However, the guy has major issues in terms of his health b/c of all those foot problems he has had. He's slow as all hell. He's soft on defense. He hasn't been nearly as good this year as expected. The past couple of seasons have been decent, but you've started to hear the health issues again this one, and can easily be injury plagued for the rest of his career.

There can be a ton of real good players left at pick 30. Heck, like Bonn says all the time, most people expect Bynum to be there (Which we all know he wont.) My point being is this is a deep deep draft, which means steals steals stealsm particularly at pick 30. Sorry, but I'm not sold on giving up that pick. Even though it's only the 30th pick, it's VERY BIG.

How big? This Big:
17, 8, and over 2bpg? Because thats very big from the center position, but are we gonna get that from any player at any position with the #30th pick? I would say emphatically no.

Ranks #19 in the NBA in Rebounds Per Game(8.6)
Ranks #8 in the NBA in Blocks Per Game(2.12)
Ranks #17 in the NBA in Free Throws(402.0)
Ranks #18 in the NBA in Free Throw Attempts(503.0)
Ranks #1 in the NBA in Offensive Rebounds(299.0)
Ranks #2 in the NBA in Offensive Rebounds Per Game(3.8)
Ranks #6 in the NBA in Blocks(165.0)

Yes he is slow, but he still makes an impact on defense, and he certainly is skilled on the offensive end. Your arguments not to get him are totally irrational. He has not been seruiously injured since the 00-01 season, I don't know if that is what most here consider major issues because of health. What injury issues have you heard this year, he played 78 games and thats more than Dwayne Wade who has yet to play 78 games in his career, Z has played 78, 81, 81, the last 3 years playing over 30 minutes per game so, WTF are you talking about?

I know you guys love homegrown talent and I know you guys are in love with getting fresh young talent, and so am I, but when you get a chance to get an all-star center in his prime, and all you give up is the number 30 pick and an expiring deal, you just do it.

The only reasonable concern in my mind is the size and length of the contract; but unless he wants max money or 6 years, I would say a deal seems workable. Not to mention the fact that he wants to play for the Knicks and we have a dynamic point guard who would compliment his game very very much.