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how about Booth and Howard for KT
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fishmike
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2/17/2005  2:40 PM
Booth sucks and doesnt play for Dallas. Howard is solid for them but they also have Daniels/Finely/Stackhouse at the 2/3.

Its gives us a very nice 2/3 player that attacks the glass and defends. I think he would compleatly shore up our backcourt/wing for the next few years. Marbury/Crawford/Ariza/Howard is a very strong 1/2 combo with Ariza and Howard being able to play some 3.

You get a long look at Sweetney at PF for the remainder of the year. To me Howard's exactly the kind of guy you would look to get with an additional late-mid #1
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TMS
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2/17/2005  2:42 PM
Josh Howard? come on fish...do you really think they'd give him up to get KT w/o a 1st round pick going back to them in the deal?
After 7 years & 40K+ posts, banned by martin for calling Nalod a 'moron'. Awesome.
Bonn1997
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2/17/2005  2:51 PM
Posted by TMS:

Josh Howard? come on fish...do you really think they'd give him up to get KT w/o a 1st round pick going back to them in the deal?
Yeah, when I read the title, I thought he was proposing Juwan Howard. No way a team gives up a young player as talented as Josh Howard for Kurt. They can get so much more for Howard
djsunyc
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2/17/2005  2:51 PM
great trade for us, but i have to agree with TMS. i don't think cuban gives up howard, especially with an injury riddled finley and a soon to be departing stack.

i do agree that we can only get a swingman or backcourt player for kurt at this point. i think a #1 is only possible from the right team and we'd still have to take back a matching contract. i think at this point, if we want to get an expiring deal and picks, we need to accept a couple of #2's and a player that's a throw in for him. i think he's real good, but i also question his trade value.

looking around, these are some other deals to throw out there other than the ones usually talked about (ruben, spoon, ervin, etc.):

kurt for divac and a #1 (divac has a player option for next season but gives us ANOTHER expiring deal next year)

kurt for devean george and a #1 (same as divacs)

kurt for scott pollard and a #1 (pollard expires next season)


this way, the teams are giving up players that are giving them nothing but only taking back 1 extra year in $$$'s. i think this is where kurt's value is highest.
Bonn1997
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2/17/2005  2:56 PM
Posted by djsunyc:

great trade for us, but i have to agree with TMS. i don't think cuban gives up howard, especially with an injury riddled finley and a soon to be departing stack.

i do agree that we can only get a swingman or backcourt player for kurt at this point. i think a #1 is only possible from the right team and we'd still have to take back a matching contract. i think at this point, if we want to get an expiring deal and picks, we need to accept a couple of #2's and a player that's a throw in for him. i think he's real good, but i also question his trade value.

looking around, these are some other deals to throw out there other than the ones usually talked about (ruben, spoon, ervin, etc.):

kurt for divac and a #1 (divac has a player option for next season but gives us ANOTHER expiring deal next year)

kurt for devean george and a #1 (same as divacs)

kurt for scott pollard and a #1 (pollard expires next season)


this way, the teams are giving up players that are giving them nothing but only taking back 1 extra year in $$$'s. i think this is where kurt's value is highest.
I don't think those teams will give up a player with a better contract AND a first round pick for Kurt. If you want a 1st rd pick, I think you have to take back a contract as long as or longer than Kurt's. You might be able to get Malik Rose and a 1st rd pick for Kurt
fishmike
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2/17/2005  2:57 PM
well they get nothing from Booth, and Josh Howard looks very good playing next to who they have. Stackhouse Finley and Daniels are all signed long term.

Howard is nice.. you guys make him sound like Dwane Wade or something.
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Bonn1997
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2/17/2005  3:01 PM
Posted by fishmike:

well they get nothing from Booth, and Josh Howard looks very good playing next to who they have. Stackhouse Finley and Daniels are all signed long term.

Howard is nice.. you guys make him sound like Dwane Wade or something.
Howard's not a superstar but he's a 24 year old putting up 11 and 7 and already impacting the game more than Kurt does. We're talking about Mark Cuban, also, don't forget. He probably feels the team doesn't have enough SFs
MS
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2/17/2005  3:08 PM
No way they give up Howard the guy can rebound the ball, and is active, i would give up Crawford and a #2 for him, or Kurt and Ariza, to get him i think he is exactly what we need

And Crawford and Marbury are dynamic but the backcourt doesn't work well, I think we let Crawford man the pg for a while and increase his stock and see what we can get.....
Bonn1997
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2/17/2005  3:12 PM
Posted by MS:

No way they give up Howard the guy can rebound the ball, and is active, i would give up Crawford and a #2 for him, or Kurt and Ariza, to get him i think he is exactly what we need

And Crawford and Marbury are dynamic but the backcourt doesn't work well, I think we let Crawford man the pg for a while and increase his stock and see what we can get.....
I might give up Crawford for him, but not Ariza. Please, just compare what Ariza's doing at age 19 (11 and 4 as a starter) to what Josh Howard is doing at age 24.
fishmike
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2/17/2005  3:14 PM
have you guys watched the Mavs? Howard gets what he gets because he's ignored. He's nice player and the 4th option on his team. If he's not playing w/ guys like Finely, Stackhouse, Dirk and Terry he's invisible.
"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
Bonn1997
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2/17/2005  3:16 PM
Posted by fishmike:

have you guys watched the Mavs? Howard gets what he gets because he's ignored. He's nice player and the 4th option on his team. If he's not playing w/ guys like Finely, Stackhouse, Dirk and Terry he's invisible.
He's an SF getting seven rebounds a game because he's ignored?? Maybe they should stop ignoring him then!
TMS
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2/17/2005  3:30 PM
i like Howard's game alot...he's like a poorman's Ron Artest...who knows, w/a little more development on his game he may be an allstar calibre player someday...i think he has the right instincts, athleticism & apparent work ethic to make him alot better down the road than he is right now.
After 7 years & 40K+ posts, banned by martin for calling Nalod a 'moron'. Awesome.
tkf
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2/18/2005  12:46 AM
Posted by fishmike:

well they get nothing from Booth, and Josh Howard looks very good playing next to who they have. Stackhouse Finley and Daniels are all signed long term.

Howard is nice.. you guys make him sound like Dwane Wade or something.


Howard I like a lot, tonight he is killing the suns, so far he has 29/6, those are great numbers... I would do that deal quick..

[Edited by - tkf on 02/18/2005 01:03:02]
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BigRedDog
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2/18/2005  12:59 AM
howard is a very good young player that any team in the league would love to get . you're proposing a totally one-sided trade that cuban would never ever do. drop it.
Briggs-- Frank is 2 yrs away from being 2 years away
martin
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2/18/2005  8:56 AM
Here are 2 reasons Cuban would trade Howard and whatever for KT: Webber and Duncan. These players can't be stopped, but KT sure can slow them down and has certainly help his ownn against them.

IF he thinks Dallas has a 2-3 year window to win the championship, why wouldn't Cuban go after the player? Shaq is gone. And you hope and pray Phoenix is on the other side of the bracket.

Dallas has enough 6-7" guys and less who can play, and in the playoffs you always need bigs who can make shots. This help spread the floor and makes EVERYONE else on the team better.

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NYKBocker
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2/18/2005  9:14 AM
I would agree with martin and fishmike. This is a great deal for us and a lousy deal for Dallas in regards with talent and youth. BUT...with what martin has indicated sometimes you need to give a lot to do something you need at the moment. I see Cuban doing this deal to slowdown KG, Duncan and Webber.
Bonn1997
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2/18/2005  10:08 AM
If the *average* PF/C shoots 55% against Kurt, Duncan, Webber, Shaq and the other elites are probably gonna shoot 65% against him. We're talking about the guy with probably the slowest feet out of any starting PF in the league.

If they're fooled by Kurt's reputation as a good defender, maybe they'd offer one of their less promising swing men with a worse contract--like Marquis Daniels for Kurt, $3 mil, and Houston's 2nd rd pick.

[Edited by - Bonn1997 on 02/18/2005 10:09:40]
martin
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2/18/2005  10:14 AM
Posted by Bonn1997:

If the *average* PF/C shoots 55% against Kurt, Duncan, Webber, Shaq and the other elites are probably gonna shoot 65% against him. We're talking about the guy with probably the slowest feet out of any starting PF in the league.

If they're fooled by Kurt's reputation as a good defender, maybe they'd offer one of their less promising swing men with a worse contract--like Marquis Daniels for Kurt, $3 mil, and Houston's 2nd rd pick.

[Edited by - Bonn1997 on 02/18/2005 10:09:40]

dude, seriously, take the blinders off. You are like a racehorse with those eye pieces on that can only see the carrot in front of you.

3 names: Marbury, Crawford, TT. Those are the guys who have gotten minutes the most with KT in the starting lineup, none of whom can keep there man in front of them. Who has to cover their asses? Nazr? No, he cannot rotate worth a lick. KT? Yup. And thus his man is Wide Freakin' OPEN.

Get over the stats.
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Bonn1997
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2/18/2005  10:51 AM
Posted by martin:
Posted by Bonn1997:

If the *average* PF/C shoots 55% against Kurt, Duncan, Webber, Shaq and the other elites are probably gonna shoot 65% against him. We're talking about the guy with probably the slowest feet out of any starting PF in the league.

If they're fooled by Kurt's reputation as a good defender, maybe they'd offer one of their less promising swing men with a worse contract--like Marquis Daniels for Kurt, $3 mil, and Houston's 2nd rd pick.

[Edited by - Bonn1997 on 02/18/2005 10:09:40]

dude, seriously, take the blinders off. You are like a racehorse with those eye pieces on that can only see the carrot in front of you.

3 names: Marbury, Crawford, TT. Those are the guys who have gotten minutes the most with KT in the starting lineup, none of whom can keep there man in front of them. Who has to cover their asses? Nazr? No, he cannot rotate worth a lick. KT? Yup. And thus his man is Wide Freakin' OPEN.

Get over the stats.
No, Kurt's defensive #s are so bad because his feet are too slow to guard anyone. Sweetney's already a better man to man defender. Maybe there's a reason why no team in the league is interested in Kurt.
Bonn1997
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2/18/2005  10:55 AM
Posted by martin:
Posted by Bonn1997:

If the *average* PF/C shoots 55% against Kurt, Duncan, Webber, Shaq and the other elites are probably gonna shoot 65% against him. We're talking about the guy with probably the slowest feet out of any starting PF in the league.

If they're fooled by Kurt's reputation as a good defender, maybe they'd offer one of their less promising swing men with a worse contract--like Marquis Daniels for Kurt, $3 mil, and Houston's 2nd rd pick.

[Edited by - Bonn1997 on 02/18/2005 10:09:40]

dude, seriously, take the blinders off. You are like a racehorse with those eye pieces on that can only see the carrot in front of you.

3 names: Marbury, Crawford, TT. Those are the guys who have gotten minutes the most with KT in the starting lineup, none of whom can keep there man in front of them. Who has to cover their asses? Nazr? No, he cannot rotate worth a lick. KT? Yup. And thus his man is Wide Freakin' OPEN.

Get over the stats.
Also, JYD rotates just as much as Kurt does. JYD doesn't get blocked shots, but he rotates and tries to draw charges. Yet, somehow opponents aren't shooting an outrageous percentage against him.
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how about Booth and Howard for KT
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