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How much would it take to get Caron Butler now?
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Bonn1997
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2/3/2005  8:39 PM
The Lakers can't be happy about owing Vlade $10 mil and Brian Grant $42 mil. Could something like Kurt + Nazy plus $3 mil and Houston's 2nd rounder for Caron and Brian Grant work out or are the Lakers much higher on Caron than that? That would allow them to move Odom back to SF, which is a better position for him. Would you give up Ariza or Sweetney to get Caron?
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TMS
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2/3/2005  8:45 PM
hmm, good question...i'd give up Sweetney to get Caron but then what happens w/Ariza? would that stunt his development in the process?
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MaTT4281
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2/3/2005  8:52 PM
Would you give up Ariza or Sweetney to get Caron?
I really liked Caron his rookie year, but last year he was pretty disappointing, and I haven't even seen him play this year.
I don't think I'd give up either of those two, atleast not yet. Let me see how Sweetney deals with a starting job before I send him off.
Definately would hold onto Ariza.
Bonn1997
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2/3/2005  8:58 PM
Caron came off surgery and probably returned too early last year. He really struggled in the first half of the season, which deflated his overall #s. But if you look at the 2nd half of last year plus his other two seasons, he's a legitimate 15/6 player who's only 24.

TMS: I think when you have two players as versatile as Butler and Ariza, you can't go wrong. They can play multiple positions. If you assume that they can only play SF, though, you could still play them each 28 mpg, with the two of them playing out of position for only 4 mpg each
diderotn
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2/3/2005  9:04 PM
How about a move for Odom?????
The true Knickabocker..........
Bonn1997
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2/3/2005  9:11 PM
Posted by diderotn:

How about a move for Odom?????
I don't think that's realistic unless we're giving up Marbury, which wouldn't be worthwhile no matter how frustrated people are at the moment
diderotn
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2/3/2005  9:22 PM
How about Brian Grant and Medvedenko for Kurt and Nazr?????? We need cap space and Grant contract is scheduled to come off of the book by the end of next season...

Grant
Houston
TT
Penny

would have all come off our books at the same time.
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Bonn1997
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2/3/2005  9:35 PM
Posted by diderotn:

How about Brian Grant and Medvedenko for Kurt and Nazr?????? We need cap space and Grant contract is scheduled to come off of the book by the end of next season...

Grant
Houston
TT
Penny

would have all come off our books at the same time.
Forget about saving salary. We're not gonna get the best player in the deal AND save money.

BTW, Brian Grant is owed 3 years, $42 mil anyway
TMS
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2/3/2005  9:36 PM
Posted by diderotn:

How about Brian Grant and Medvedenko for Kurt and Nazr?????? We need cap space and Grant contract is scheduled to come off of the book by the end of next season...

Grant
Houston
TT
Penny

would have all come off our books at the same time.

you might want to check the figures again...Grant doesn't come off the books until the end of the 06/07 season.

http://www.hoopshype.com/salaries/la_lakers.htm
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TMS
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2/3/2005  9:46 PM
Posted by Bonn1997:

Caron came off surgery and probably returned too early last year. He really struggled in the first half of the season, which deflated his overall #s. But if you look at the 2nd half of last year plus his other two seasons, he's a legitimate 15/6 player who's only 24.

TMS: I think when you have two players as versatile as Butler and Ariza, you can't go wrong. They can play multiple positions. If you assume that they can only play SF, though, you could still play them each 28 mpg, with the two of them playing out of position for only 4 mpg each

if you could possibly play Caron at SG, then i would love to make the deal (TT, Sweetney & HOU's 2nd rounder for Grant, Caron & protected 1st round pick?)...then try to deal Crawford for a young shotblocking C like Dalembert & Corliss Williamson as filler?

C - Dalembert / Nazr
PF - KT / Grant / JYD
SF - Ariza / Corliss
SG - Caron / Penny
PG - Marbury / Brewer / Moochie
IR - Houston / Baker / Sundov

that team is alot deeper in the frontcourt than now w/added toughness in Corliss & Grant.
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Rich
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2/3/2005  10:15 PM
No way I would give up Sweetney for Butler. This team needs more young PF/C types, not less.
teslawlo
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2/3/2005  10:26 PM
maybe wait until the end of the season or even longer to determine whether it is worth trading ariza or sweetney for players of butler's caliber
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Bonn1997
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2/3/2005  10:36 PM
Posted by TMS:
Posted by Bonn1997:

Caron came off surgery and probably returned too early last year. He really struggled in the first half of the season, which deflated his overall #s. But if you look at the 2nd half of last year plus his other two seasons, he's a legitimate 15/6 player who's only 24.

TMS: I think when you have two players as versatile as Butler and Ariza, you can't go wrong. They can play multiple positions. If you assume that they can only play SF, though, you could still play them each 28 mpg, with the two of them playing out of position for only 4 mpg each

if you could possibly play Caron at SG, then i would love to make the deal (TT, Sweetney & HOU's 2nd rounder for Grant, Caron & protected 1st round pick?)...then try to deal Crawford for a young shotblocking C like Dalembert & Corliss Williamson as filler?

C - Dalembert / Nazr
PF - KT / Grant / JYD
SF - Ariza / Corliss
SG - Caron / Penny
PG - Marbury / Brewer / Moochie
IR - Houston / Baker / Sundov

that team is alot deeper in the frontcourt than now w/added toughness in Corliss & Grant.
Are you convinced Ariza can't play SG? I think he'll be fine on defense at SG or SF. He'd need to improve his jumper to play extended minutes at SG, but you can get away with an SG for a few min a game who doesn't have a jumper if he plays strong defense.
BRIGGS
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2/3/2005  11:59 PM
Brian Grant is done. No more trading for players who have max contracts for multiple years unless the other guy coming back has the name Tim Duncan.

We need a franchise frontcourt player or atleast very close to something like that, anything else can be had in smallish deals, mLE's LLes or drafts. The only exception I would make is Artest.

Read the Philly papers, they said dalembart will not be traded and will match any reasonable offer. I guess if Atlanta wants to give him 10mm, he could be gone.


What this team needs is a top 5 pick, and hopefully the top pick.I cant believe someone wants Brian Grant, he cant even move.
RIP Crushalot😞
Solace
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2/4/2005  6:58 AM
I don't like these ideas at all. How backcourt heavy are we supposed to be? We have very little in the frontcourt. Brian Grant is moving toward his last licks, and Caron Butler is just an average starter (he's good, but nothing to write home about). Butler also doesn't have a lot of defensive prescence, as he's undersized, although he can steal the ball a little.

Not interested in Butler when we already have Marbury, Ariza, Crawford, Houston, Penny, Tim Thomas, Jerome Williams, etc etc... we have too much in the backcourt and not enough in the frontcourt. We have to focus on upgrading the frontcourt for the future, otherwise guys like Caron Butler will be playing center for us!
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diderotn
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2/4/2005  7:12 AM
You are insane for suggesting to trade Sweetney instead of Kurt Thomas....



[if you could possibly play Caron at SG, then i would love to make the deal (TT, Sweetney & HOU's 2nd rounder for Grant, Caron & protected 1st round pick?)...then try to deal Crawford for a young shotblocking C like Dalembert & Corliss Williamson as filler?

C - Dalembert / Nazr
PF - KT / Grant / JYD
SF - Ariza / Corliss
SG - Caron / Penny
PG - Marbury / Brewer / Moochie
IR - Houston / Baker / Sundov

that team is alot deeper in the frontcourt than now w/added toughness in Corliss & Grant.
The true Knickabocker..........
Bonn1997
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2/4/2005  7:39 AM
Butler's a forward, not a backcourt player.

No one *wants* Brian Grant. The point is that you can accept his short-term contract if you get Butler. He has only one full year after this one before he has an expiring contract.
TMS
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2/4/2005  1:22 PM
Posted by diderotn:

You are insane for suggesting to trade Sweetney instead of Kurt Thomas....

name me 1 quality young player we can get for Kurt Thomas & we can discuss...otherwise, that's a pretty ridiculous comment you just made.
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TMS
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2/4/2005  1:24 PM
Posted by Bonn1997:

Butler's a forward, not a backcourt player.

No one *wants* Brian Grant. The point is that you can accept his short-term contract if you get Butler. He has only one full year after this one before he has an expiring contract.

serious...Grant is not exactly the centerpiece of that trade.

Bonn, as to your last post, i think Caron would make a better SG than Ariza since he has a better perimeter J...Ariza is a Tayshaun Prince w/o the jumper...i think he's best suited as a SF.
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Solace
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2/4/2005  3:41 PM
Posted by Bonn1997:

Butler's a forward, not a backcourt player.

No one *wants* Brian Grant. The point is that you can accept his short-term contract if you get Butler. He has only one full year after this one before he has an expiring contract.

Dude, he was measured at 6'5" on draft day. I know he plays SF because the Heat and Lakers were undersized, but that doesn't make him a small forward. He's really a SG, otherwise just a REALLY REALLY undersized SF. He's a backcourt player, I don't care if he's listed as a SF or not.

But, you're right in one regard: on the Knicks, after the suggested trades, he's a SF, maybe a PF. Like I said, keep up these kinds of ideas and guys like Caron Butler will have to play center for us.
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