Posted by OldFan:

The Knicks have no heart and soul. That term is used to describe what makes good teams go - this team is not good.

True, but me and a few others like to think the Knicks (that are not a good team) can still have a heart and soul. It's the same heart and soul that has taken them from missing the playoffs the last two years to a .500 season with a little bit of promise for the future. Call me an idiot but the Knicks, my favorite team in the NBA that is not so good, does have a heart and soul and thats Stephon Marbury.

If anyone else wants to say that you cannot have a heart and soul when you are not contending for anything, fine. Let me and some others (even if it is 2 or 3 others) have some fun with our slightly improved team. Awesome Picture rvhoss and I completely agree with you. Stephon who took us to the playoffs last year and will agian this year is the heart and soul of our not so good team.

A lot of people disagree with me. I am just more of the patient kind. IMO, as fans we should recognize that this is a rebuilding phase and it will take some time for our team to win 50 games and 2 playoff series. Especially after what Layden did. The coach is terrible, the team does play hard, our rotation's blow etc etc. There are many things our team can do to improve but we cannot do them all at once.

In the mean time, instead of being devastated after every loss, I try and shrug it off. Its easier said than done but it has to be done. I think Isiah can run the Knicks better than anyone on this forum and I want to believe he is trying to make them better. Even a average .500 team needs motivation and a leader. I think the Knicks have a leader in Stephon.

They can do better than him but right now, I am glad he is the leader of this team and not the sad excuse for a franchise player called Allan Houston. I honestly believe Stephon is the heart and soul of this team. Two years ago, I would have killed to see the Knicks with Stephon and a .500 record. I am sure everyone here would've too. The same goes for Lenny Wilkens over Don Chaney who played HOWARD EISLEY, WEATHERSPOON and SHANDON ANDERSON!

With the same record we have now, Knick fans would have a party watching Stephon drive instead of seeing a bunch of players watch Allan Houston hold the ball for 20 seconds and then clank it off the rim 50% of the times. I know I am not telling you anything you dont know but I am trying to get to a point. Everyone would've called Stephon the heart and soul of this team in 2002. If that is the same as "different definitions of the term", sorry about the long post.

Posted by rvhoss:

we are still bringing it together.
Last year the Heat were in the same situation...a team in dissarray putting different pieces together with a new coach.

I still see us matching up with anybody in the East when we have our full team...with this roster last year (no crawford, jyd or ariza) we matched up well...losing TT and H20 in the playoffs was the main contributor to us being swept.

Marbs has a comfort level with Crawford that was awesome to see in the Garden...I mean, I have gone to more games so far this year than the previous 4 combined, and I'm really looking forward to the chicago game monday (if I can get tix)

When Houston came back and we had him and craw together I saw the contending team we all want to see...when Sweets, Craw and TT return, you will see the contending knicks (the one that beat Houston, the nets, etc.)

These current depleted knicks are a mirage. :)

Looking at the full contending squad...Marbs is the heart and soul.

This injury riddled rag tag bunch is worst then last year pre marbury. You'll see.

The heat comparison is funny. The heat didn't evolve over the last two years into a good team. They got SHAQ! Any team that acquires SHAQ is going to be good. Obtaining Shaq is not something that can be used as a rebuilding model.

Last year they made it to the second round of the playoffs...that's all we are hoping for this year...well, that's all I expected.

Over the summer, I'm POSITIVE Zeke brings that young athletic big we all covet in a sign and trade of either TT or Penny (preferred) and package KT as well.

Could be with Dallas when they realize they screwed up...could be with philly if they can't sign Dalembart (i still think he's overrated), could be another suprise draft pick (ala ariza, who knew?!?!?), and not only will we be better than the Heat (are they really that much better than us...sweets went down during the game and craw didn't play).

They gave up 3 core players for shaq, and last year's lakers were better than the this year's heat and they got crushed by detroit.

Second round this year for sure for the knicks, and then the Heat probably sweep us out of the second round.

I'm happy with that.