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Whine whine whine..............
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Nalod
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1/5/2005  11:24 PM

Two nites in a row and nobody says a dam thing about the other team just playing well.

The assumptions are often it the knicks game to lose, not win! No props to the opponent.

Trade trade trade is so prevelent! Each nite we usually get a good game from one of our big guys, and the trades we come up with are guys underperforming elsewhere!

Fire lenny talk is also not very good. Lenny don't make the foulshots, lenny don't pick to the players! No talk about the assistants, they are the worker coaching "bees" anyway.

I even read tonite a "thank you Layden" for our financial problems!

Guys, there just is not that much that can be done than ride the ups and downs with the team! Allan still needs lots of games to shake the rust and gain stanima. He hit the first wall of recovery.

This is our team for now, some good nites some bad nites. We are very lucky we got Azira and this kid is very fun to watch. Those drives by marbs are great, Allan still got a sweet stroke, KT plays with effiecency on some nites and has been our most consistant big man!

Dalembart, Curry , or even NEne are not ready to carry this team. Im down with building a future, but that would mean more losing. I can live with this!

Azira getting the minutes shows there is an eye for the future.

Glad to see Vin put in some nice minutes. Maybe he is ready to contribute, giving us more flexibility off the bench, and dare I say making Nazr or KT available for a trade.

Miami is for real! Shaq's passing is often forgotten. Wade is on his way to being very special! They are a good team, and we lost ato a good team in their arena.
AUTOADVERT
simrud
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1/5/2005  11:30 PM
I agree, no shame in loosing to the Kings and Heat in games we battled hard.

What makes this hurt is the loss to the Nets who get blown out by Wizards and Bucks of all teams there next two games. If we would have beaten the Nets, loosing the next 2 games would not even be a problem at all.

As for Lenny, he makes poor decisisions, thats all, he is a bad coach no matter how you look at it. He is not the one to get all the balim, as this team is a .500 team no matter what, but if Sloan was coaching this squad, or Frarello, or any other good coach who is not senile, we'd be a couple of games over .500.

Somebody brought up a good point, the next 8 or so games will dertermine if we will be able to stay several games over .500. They are all against pretty bad teams, so if we go .500 there, then we are truly a .500 team. However we have a chance at going 6-2 or somethign like that and building a nice distance between us and the rest of the abismal atlantic.
A glimmer of hope maybe?!?
tkf
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1/5/2005  11:42 PM
good post nalod, if someone would of told me at the beginning of the season, we would have a record as good as or almost as good as the wolves or the Rockets, I would be like "great". Well that is the case, the knicks right now are doing what most expected from this team, considering our injury situation it could be worse. This team is developing some good young player, craw, sweetney, and yes even steph is still developing as well as nazr, let these guys grow, sprinkle in a well placed trade, Houston regaining his form, and who knows..

Patience....
Anyone who sits around and waits for the lottery to better themselves, either in real life or in sports, Is a Loser............... TKF
raven
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1/6/2005  4:04 AM
Posted by tkf:

if someone would of told me at the beginning of the season, we would have a record as good as or almost as good as the wolves or the Rockets, I would be like "great".

problem is the rockets and the wolves have a record almost as bad as ours =).

yet i agree good points nalod. everything would change if we could beat the teams we are supposed to beat, most of the time.

I hated the NJ game, and im not pissed to lose to the heat or kings. In two years ill seriously be.
rvhoss
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1/6/2005  7:54 AM
Exactly, I am still suffering from Cross River Rivalry Sickness.
all kool aid all the time.
Killa4luv
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1/6/2005  8:24 AM
Posted by Nalod:


Two nites in a row and nobody says a dam thing about the other team just playing well.

The assumptions are often it the knicks game to lose, not win! No props to the opponent.

Trade trade trade is so prevelent! Each nite we usually get a good game from one of our big guys, and the trades we come up with are guys underperforming elsewhere!

Fire lenny talk is also not very good. Lenny don't make the foulshots, lenny don't pick to the players! No talk about the assistants, they are the worker coaching "bees" anyway.

I even read tonite a "thank you Layden" for our financial problems!

Guys, there just is not that much that can be done than ride the ups and downs with the team! Allan still needs lots of games to shake the rust and gain stanima. He hit the first wall of recovery.

This is our team for now, some good nites some bad nites. We are very lucky we got Azira and this kid is very fun to watch. Those drives by marbs are great, Allan still got a sweet stroke, KT plays with effiecency on some nites and has been our most consistant big man!

Dalembart, Curry , or even NEne are not ready to carry this team. Im down with building a future, but that would mean more losing. I can live with this!

Azira getting the minutes shows there is an eye for the future.

Glad to see Vin put in some nice minutes. Maybe he is ready to contribute, giving us more flexibility off the bench, and dare I say making Nazr or KT available for a trade.

Miami is for real! Shaq's passing is often forgotten. Wade is on his way to being very special! They are a good team, and we lost ato a good team in their arena.

I been saying this all along. We are supposed to lose to the heat they are a better team than us and we have key players hurt. As long as the game was competitive and fun to watch I am happy. I hate when we come out flat, that really upsets me, because then we don't put ourselves in a position to win. But as long as we play hard against good teams, Im happy.

I think Nazzy has been our most consistant big. He had an off night tonight, playing 11 mintues less and still gave us 11 and 6. before tonight KT just gave us 2 single digit performances back to back. Nazr was averaging like 19 and 10 in the last 3 games before this.

When our players come out flat, that is the coaches fault. Part of his job is to motivate the players either through inspiration or straight fear, but it must be done. You can't have this many flat performances already in our season. They have costed us many winnable games. Lenny has to take the hit for that, among other things.

I gotta disagree with you about Curry. He is the only big out of all of the guys we discuss, that shows the flashes of greatness. He has the most skills out of any of the other bigs and could come to NY and give us much of what we need in the post. It is a risk, but he is the best young risk out there, who else comes close even on potential alone?? No one that is attainable. Aside from Brand, whose availability I really can't speak about.

Curry has the size and the developing post game to boot. He is the only center I would consider giving up much for. Granted it is still a risk, but if you take a risk, you take one with the biggest upside. He would not be carrying the team either, he would be contributing and depending on what we gave up for him, he would end up being the 3rd or 4th option.

We do need some trades, but between now, the offseason, and next season we should be in a postion to make some major moves. Lets wait and see, but I would like to see the young guys playing more if we are going to keep them or not. Let them develop.





Nalod
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1/6/2005  8:34 AM
I am fine with getting a curry and developing him. My point is that We likely give up either quality to get him. Say one of either KT or Nazr. Those two are playing more consistant THIS YEAR and curry has been inconsistant at best. That would likely lead to short term loses, which I don't know is tolerable. I like th eupside, but it seams many a fan are looking for greatness now.

Many fans are looking for more trades and a new coach.

We ahve turned over the core roster 83%, a new coach and a new GM! That is plenty for a 12 month period! We ahve taken on boat load of salary commitment to do so. My expectations are we will continue to improve, albiet at a less frantic pace than we have seen since Isiah walked thru the door.
Killa4luv
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1/6/2005  9:00 AM
you give up KT in a split second for Curry. KT and Sweets, or KT and Nazzy, but not Nazzy and sweets. I can't see us giving up 2 young bigs for one. It just doesn't make sense. I want KT gone. He can do more for another team than he can do for us. Hes older and he isn't athletic at all.

The win now mentality is what got us in this predicament.

Nazr and Curry have comparable numbers which says alot considering Nazr is having a career year and Curry is playing inconsistant.

Curry is 15 and 6.
Nazr is 12 and 9.

Nazr is 27 and Curry is 22.

Where will curry be in 5 years. If he progresses slowly over the next 5 years, he will still be significantly better than Nazr is now. You have to take that chance.
TMS
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1/6/2005  12:19 PM
apologist!
After 7 years & 40K+ posts, banned by martin for calling Nalod a 'moron'. Awesome.
Pike
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1/6/2005  12:22 PM
... we need a trade and Killa, I hope it involves Curry!!
Killa4luv
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1/6/2005  12:28 PM
Posted by Killa4luv:

you give up KT in a split second for Curry. KT and Sweets, or KT and Nazzy, but not Nazzy and sweets. I can't see us giving up 2 young bigs for one. It just doesn't make sense. I want KT gone. He can do more for another team than he can do for us. Hes older and he isn't athletic at all.

The win now mentality is what got us in this predicament.

Nazr and Curry have comparable numbers which says alot considering Nazr is having a career year and Curry is playing inconsistant.

Curry is 15 and 6.
Nazr is 12 and 9.

Nazr is 27 and Curry is 22.

Where will curry be in 5 years. If he progresses slowly over the next 5 years, he will still be significantly better than Nazr is now. You have to take that chance.

Check my trade topic I contradict myself, but this makes sense fo us.

http://www.ultimateknicks.com/forum/topic.asp?t=7263

I guess no one likes it, but we get curry, and it is realistic, maybe a tweek or two.
newyorknewyork
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1/6/2005  1:26 PM
We definatly need to make swaps for younger players. If we are going to be inconsistant than Id rather do it with younger players than Muhammad,KT,Houston,Thomas,Penny. But we probably won't be able to make changes until the offseason.
https://vote.nba.com/en Vote for your Knicks.
diderotn
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1/6/2005  3:21 PM
The very first thing that Isiah needs to do is pull the plugg on Lenny. He has been doing nothing but hurting our team. We are soft because of him. Second thing will be to trade Kurt
The true Knickabocker..........
fishmike
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1/6/2005  3:30 PM
Posted by diderotn:

The very first thing that Isiah needs to do is pull the plugg on Lenny. He has been doing nothing but hurting our team. We are soft because of him. Second thing will be to trade Kurt
your such a moax. Just for the record, when you say "We are soft because of him." why were TT, Penny, Nazr, Houston and Crawford soft before they got here? And your solution is to trade one of the only guys that isnt soft? Where do you come up with this stuff?
"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
franco12
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1/6/2005  3:36 PM
We definatly need to make swaps for younger players. If we are going to be inconsistant than Id rather do it with younger players than Muhammad,KT,Houston,Thomas,Penny. But we probably won't be able to make changes until the offseason.

Nazr will be 28 at the start of next season (DOB.9/77)- I am not sure he counts as old- especially since he is 7 months younger than Marbury.
Pike
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1/6/2005  3:39 PM
For better or worse, here's the list that I believe is our nucleus to build on:

Marbury
Crawford
Sweetney
Ariza

then there's the nice but can be improved upon list:

KT
Mohammed
JYD

then there's the I wish we could get rid of them list:

TT
Houston
Moochie
Penny
etc., etc.

that's it.



[Edited by - Pike on 01/06/2005 15:42:44]
Whine whine whine..............

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