Good points, Although I think Playa you wait in the wings with almost seems like gleem to prove the teamis not that good in the face of the Kool Aid intoxicated.

We are not as good as we think (fans) when we win as we think we are bad when we lose. Fans sentiment, like the stock market are emotional barometers that tend to go to extremes.

We need not new players after a loss, as there will no doubt continue to see posts suggesting personel moves, or lament over the missed opportunities we think we blew based on rumors or here say, but instead continue to grow and build chemistry.

I see this team is improving.

Fans are pissed because Marbury said something stupid, and the net haters really can't stand to seem them fair well, let alone have them beat the knicks in MSG.

I did not watch that game, so I have nothing really to comment about the teams play.

Its not about playing better with out craw, it was about better ball movement, its not about Allan being washed up, its about him hitting the FIRST wall of a recovery after a great start. Evens Grant Hills miricle hits walls. It happens. TT's great comeback was born of patience by lenny and Isiah that giving him minutes w/return him to form.

Sweets and Aziras minutes are cut because they are great in short stretches, but there are times when they are inneffective due to fouls, impatience, and bodies not ready for the daily banging.

Marbs is also a piece of work. Like it or not, his past arrogant attitude is still not 100% excorcised from him. He gets full of himself and goes off. He does it on the floor also. Getting all verbal about being aggresive and having 3 great games under your belt does not proclaim you the best point in the land.

Mitch the bitch's article about cousey's take on marbs are 100% correct. He had 6 future hall of famers on the court, but the bottom line was if he did not do the job, then he was not going to play. THe arguement of Marbs teammates in Jersey and Phoenix wer not as good is kinda funny. Marbs had Kidds players in PHoenix and visa versa. Its clear Kidd did better with them. But marbs is not a true point no matter how many assists he has. The fact he has the ball on 90% of the time will lead to lots of assists. Throw the ball to an open man and he hits an open shot 8 times is not that big a deal when you have the ball 50 times a game.

Marbs is a great player, and the knicks have good talent, but it takes time. We are more pretenders than contenders, but we are improving!

Is the content with mediacrity? Maybe, but the improvement must come from within, with patience, and the draft than thru forcing trades. If opportunity knocks, then make a trade.

I give Isiah credit, he is trying, but has yet to give the store away. I thought going after Damp and Vince did not make sense, but it creates a buzz even if no deal was made.

playa you are right, we had no business losing to nets. like i stated in briggs thread before the game...nets vs. ny is all about rivalry.how many losses will it take to convince knick fans and management that nets own knicks ?...17 out of last 20 may not be good enough to do anything. you never know they may have to market this a little harder, especially after steph’s remarks jkidd says, “don’t hammer him too hard, its too early in the season” maybe what kidd is trying to say is wait till we meet in the playoffs …i’ll show you the meaning of hammer time. in all fairness, steph put on a nice performance but failed to carry the victory. if you say you the best, scoring don’t mean jack, winning does and you find a way.

It was a bad loss. But it was one of the worst officiated games I have seen in awhile. Joe Crawford and his gang swallowed their whistles. We seemed to get the worse of it. TT was going hard to the hole and got clobbered on multiple occasions and got no call. Sweetney too. Marbury was the only one who got a fair whistle. Joe Crawford only gives the stars the benefit of the doubt, even at home.

Posted by Vmart:

Playa I agree with you on your points. This team has no business being in first place if not for a crap azz division they would be 7th or 8th seed at best. This team needs to accept a youth movement and get KT out of there and get Sweetney in there. I'm not at all happy with Marbury this guy make no one better. His agenda isn't about winning he trying to pump his stat so he can call him self the best PG to ever play the game of basketball. Well for me the what determines a great PG is winning consistently and getting the team involved. I hate to say it but Charlie Ward was better than Marbury gettting teammates involved.

And that line right there buddy has just put you over the top. YOu need a timeout. and not a 20 second timeout a full timeout. Charlie Ward was not a point guard on the offensive end. He ran plays. Getting teamates involved better than steph, you have got to be kidding. Everyone goes through their emotional swings after a knick loss, but lets not get crazy.

b]Posted by Vmart:[/b]

This team isn't that good that they can put the future on hold or play it sparingly. I see no point to having KT start I can't see this guy win a championship in this year or the next or for that matter anytime soon. The move should be made to Sweetney. Sweetney needs to be out ther and getting experience. The fricken Nets are playing Kristic in his first year. The fricken Heat are playing Haslem. Orlando, Howard. This is just a no brainer go with Sweetney now and next year this guy gives the team 17 points and 10 rebounds. All they are doing is delaying a positive future by playing KT over Sweetney. Sweetney will make mistakes but hey this team isn't going to win a championship anyway this year.

I totally agree. Sweets should see at least 20 minutes a game each night. We should trade KT because we have JYD who is a better defender and who is a spark plug off of the bench. Sweets could give us the same or comparable numbers to KT right now once he learns how to stay out of foul trouble. He can only learn by playing.

I'm done with PGs that score or their main foucus is to score. I would rather have a PG that is a distributer. Give me a PG that scores when presented rather than one that goes out of his way to score. Those are the ones that make the team better they are the ones that keep their teammates on thier toes run the set plays with consistency.

The Nets are still better. Why? Kidd. He is about winning. Marbury can burn him 1 on 1 but as part of a team, Kidd makes his teammates better than Marbury makes his teammates.

The Nets strength is at the 1,2,3

The Knicks Strength is at the 1,2,??? This is a a problem.

NY is still a legit superstar away from being an elite team in the East.

The Nets have 3 potential all-stars. The Knicks have 1 for sure, and maybe 1 in Craw and a borderline Nazr but against a super player he is not there.

The Nets are better and their coach makes them play D.

You are right, the Knicks are deeper BUT the NBA is a superstar league and the Nets have at least 1 more than NY does.

Look at Detroit last season. Everyone said how it was such a team but, they had Hamilton a legit 2, Rasheed, a legit player and Wallace a top player at what he does. Add to that, Billups who is solid and a guy doing the dirty work in Prince and you had a championship team.

The Knicks still do not have that. I think that is why IT wants to make a deal for another star. Marbury is there, Craw can be if his shot selection improves and then they need one more. Here is where they need to make a deal.

But you are right, after the Nets 3 they are pretty weak. Scalabrine is ok and Kristic is coming on big time for them.

This is about realistic expectations. Let's be objective. We're 2 games over 500. We've been w/o either Houston or Craw for pretty much the whole season. And we are younger, more athletic, and have a roster that provides more trading flexibility than before Isaih came to town.

Agree completely w/ Bonn. This is progressing about as well as it could be expected.

We're not that good yet. We all know we need an all-star big who can play help D. Isaih will deliver in the summer or at the deadline.

We'll have a lot of bad losses this year. But we'll also win 45 or so games and get a good run in the playoffs, maybe even win a series. Everything is going according to plan.

Wow. Playa, I agree. The Knicks are better than they were but they are mediocore. I am not sure what else IT can do this season to make them better for this year. For next year, he has some expiring contracts. To make deals, you need talent or expiring contracts. Maybe NY can package TT and penny for a decent PF with a big contract on a bad team. Hmmmm? Who fits that bill?

I would still like to see NENE here. I was so happy when we drafted him and then sad to see him traded. What could we offer Denver? They need a SG. Penny could fill that role for them but they would need some promise as well. Penny and Sweets for Nene and Tskitish plus bad contract? I make that deal.

Anyone elsE?