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Not quite comfortable with Marbles now in the good graces of the team as some spokes person. He is very much out there on podcasts, olympic sidelines, and now knick commercials. Two time Allstar, none with kicks. In parts of 5 seasons here played only 4 playoff games. Got swept by Nets. His time here was not that great. MDA like many of his coaches wanted no part of him.
He only played in 32 career playoff games. 11 wins and 21 losses. 14 of them was with Boston were he avg. 11 min a game off the bench. Seven of those wins was with Celtics where he scored 52 pts....

The "legend" of Marbury is one of a very good street ball player who left everywhere NBA teams under less than desirable circumstances and had difficulty with his coaches.
Playoff glory? None.
His olympic moments? We did not win gold in 2004 and Larry brown wanted him sent home. Not saying Larry was totally without fault.
Its not that he lacked talent. He lacked sense.

Sorry, I remember too much from the Isiah days, our poor record, the sulking under a towel and his petty attitude wanting to leave Minny, "all alone in Jersey, and MDA wanted no part of him in PHX and Collangelo used him to dump Penny Hardaway's contract. PHX then went on to sign Steve Nash and they got really good from there.

Lost in history was the draft picks Isiah used to get him. The one for Kirk Snyder was long forgotten but the 2010 pick that was the 9th pick that Utah got from PHX via trade was used to get Gordan Haywood. The 10th pick was used by Indy to get Paul George. Thats not on Marbles. But lack of success makes it relevant.
Scott Layden was fired in part for not wanting to do that trade. Dolan wanted it bad, wanted a "Star". Isiah was hired and did it less than two weeks after he was in power. Layden was letting contracts expire and did not want to trade picks. Team was dismal and Layden did not succeed post Ewing. Dolan was highly impatient which we come to learn was a bad thing. Im not saying Layden would have succeeded but he and the knicks were on a different rebuilding path.

Despite his well documented marital issues, financial issues, and career mistakes, I believe he is good hearted. Dude is ****ing nutty in a sort of "Tracy Morgan" scrambled egg brained good kind of way. Starbury was a hell of a basketball player but failed to lead his teams in the NBA. Thats what great PG's do. Isiah Lord Thomas included.

Doleac (a stretch 5)
Kurt Thomas
Van Horn
Houston
Marbury

When we had that lineup he was thriving, why? Because he had a bunch of guys that could catch and shoot. They didn’t need the ball to be effective and it was giving him all of that spacing. He was thriving with that team. Problem is that Houston came back too soon from his surgery that he had in the summer. Then Isiah traded all the catch & shoot hustle guys away for non-shooting ball stoppers that clogged the paint. Then it all culminated with the Larry Brown hiring.It really is that simple.

Had Allan Houston recovered from injury and we never did the Eddy Curry trade, we could have kept our picks to draft Lamarcus Aldridge instead. I know history probably would have changed if we didn’t do the Curry trade, but imagine if we had Frye/ Aldridge/Ariza/Houston/steph. That lineup would have complimented his skillset much better than what we had.

That is the team we should have had instead of the Larry Brown mess. Btw, I once saw in an interview that Isiah did that he didn’t actually want Larry Brown. Allegedly Joe Dumars told him that unless you had a championship team already in place that Brown was a huge headache that wasn’t worth it. Instead he recommended that Isiah hire Detroit assistant Mike Woodson because he was ready to be a head coach for an upcoming team. Isiah said that the MSG higher ups were in Dolan’s ear and convinced him to get Larry Brown instead. That decision sealed Marbury’s fate because Woodson would have been the perfect coach for him. Then again, had Woodson guided him to some successful playoff runs then that amazing China experience probably never happens so it was probably for the best.

Nalod wrote:

BigDaddyG wrote:I get the apprehension. But it was clear he was going through some things I enjoy listening to him talk about his battle with mental health. I don't think he's delusional about his time and there's no denying his fandom. I'm sure they monitor him around the interns. He should be good.

So he gets to strut at the olympics and knick games as fan as if history did not happen?

GustavBahler wrote:

Nalod wrote:

KEEPCAMBYNY wrote:I think we were all disappointed with Steph’s time here, but it wasn’t all his fault. When he first got here our starting lineup was:

Doleac (a stretch 5)
Kurt Thomas
Van Horn
Houston
Marbury

When we had that lineup he was thriving, why? Because he had a bunch of guys that could catch and shoot. They didn’t need the ball to be effective and it was giving him all of that spacing. He was thriving with that team. Problem is that Houston came back too soon from his surgery that he had in the summer. Then Isiah traded all the catch & shoot hustle guys away for non-shooting ball stoppers that clogged the paint. Then it all culminated with the Larry Brown hiring.It really is that simple.

Had Allan Houston recovered from injury and we never did the Eddy Curry trade, we could have kept our picks to draft Lamarcus Aldridge instead. I know history probably would have changed if we didn’t do the Curry trade, but imagine if we had Frye/ Aldridge/Ariza/Houston/steph. That lineup would have complimented his skillset much better than what we had.

That is the team we should have had instead of the Larry Brown mess. Btw, I once saw in an interview that Isiah did that he didn’t actually want Larry Brown. Allegedly Joe Dumars told him that unless you had a championship team already in place that Brown was a huge headache that wasn’t worth it. Instead he recommended that Isiah hire Detroit assistant Mike Woodson because he was ready to be a head coach for an upcoming team. Isiah said that the MSG higher ups were in Dolan’s ear and convinced him to get Larry Brown instead. That decision sealed Marbury’s fate because Woodson would have been the perfect coach for him. Then again, had Woodson guided him to some successful playoff runs then that amazing China experience probably never happens so it was probably for the best.

I agree. The Isiah thing was so bad from day one. The first thing he did was overpay for Marbury and handed him the keys to the team. Marbury was not a good steward of what he was given responsibility for.
Not hoping we gonna see a lot of Marbury. I appreciate he is a knick fan despite his exile and perhaps he has matured and accepts whats on him. Melo seems to have come to grips with things. Thing is Marbury never had a grip on things. His testimony during the Anucha civil suit vs Isiah was epic! The hours long broadcast were he eating vaseline, and who could forget "we Youthier now"!

Oh, the memories of a brain dead NY legend!!!

Isiah shouldn't have traded Doleac and KVH. Marbury and Doleac had a very effective PNR going, and Doleac was a very good defensive big man. Watched him play with the Magic, surprised a lot of Knicks fans at how good his interior defense was.

KVH was Mr. Softee until he joined the Knicks. I "hated" him more than any other NBA player, next to Greg Ostertag. But he was a legit two way player with the Knicks.

Isiah wanted to put his own stamp on the team, chemistry be dammed.

Doleac is the exact type of backup center we need on the current Knicks right now. And that KVH for Tim Thomas trade is still one of the most regrettable trades we made, I would have rather kept KVH until the offseason.

KEEPCAMBYNY wrote:

GustavBahler wrote:

Nalod wrote:

KEEPCAMBYNY wrote:I think we were all disappointed with Steph’s time here, but it wasn’t all his fault. When he first got here our starting lineup was:

Doleac (a stretch 5)
Kurt Thomas
Van Horn
Houston
Marbury

When we had that lineup he was thriving, why? Because he had a bunch of guys that could catch and shoot. They didn’t need the ball to be effective and it was giving him all of that spacing. He was thriving with that team. Problem is that Houston came back too soon from his surgery that he had in the summer. Then Isiah traded all the catch & shoot hustle guys away for non-shooting ball stoppers that clogged the paint. Then it all culminated with the Larry Brown hiring.It really is that simple.

Had Allan Houston recovered from injury and we never did the Eddy Curry trade, we could have kept our picks to draft Lamarcus Aldridge instead. I know history probably would have changed if we didn’t do the Curry trade, but imagine if we had Frye/ Aldridge/Ariza/Houston/steph. That lineup would have complimented his skillset much better than what we had.

That is the team we should have had instead of the Larry Brown mess. Btw, I once saw in an interview that Isiah did that he didn’t actually want Larry Brown. Allegedly Joe Dumars told him that unless you had a championship team already in place that Brown was a huge headache that wasn’t worth it. Instead he recommended that Isiah hire Detroit assistant Mike Woodson because he was ready to be a head coach for an upcoming team. Isiah said that the MSG higher ups were in Dolan’s ear and convinced him to get Larry Brown instead. That decision sealed Marbury’s fate because Woodson would have been the perfect coach for him. Then again, had Woodson guided him to some successful playoff runs then that amazing China experience probably never happens so it was probably for the best.

I agree. The Isiah thing was so bad from day one. The first thing he did was overpay for Marbury and handed him the keys to the team. Marbury was not a good steward of what he was given responsibility for.
Not hoping we gonna see a lot of Marbury. I appreciate he is a knick fan despite his exile and perhaps he has matured and accepts whats on him. Melo seems to have come to grips with things. Thing is Marbury never had a grip on things. His testimony during the Anucha civil suit vs Isiah was epic! The hours long broadcast were he eating vaseline, and who could forget "we Youthier now"!

Oh, the memories of a brain dead NY legend!!!

Isiah shouldn't have traded Doleac and KVH. Marbury and Doleac had a very effective PNR going, and Doleac was a very good defensive big man. Watched him play with the Magic, surprised a lot of Knicks fans at how good his interior defense was.

KVH was Mr. Softee until he joined the Knicks. I "hated" him more than any other NBA player, next to Greg Ostertag. But he was a legit two way player with the Knicks.

Isiah wanted to put his own stamp on the team, chemistry be dammed.

Doleac is the exact type of backup center we need on the current Knicks right now. And that KVH for Tim Thomas trade is still one of the most regrettable trades we made, I would have rather kept KVH until the offseason.

Agree with everything you wrote. Shaq said that Doleac was the best backup center he had ever played with, until they signed Alonzo Mourning.

SergioNYK wrote:I'm not a Marbury fan at all. His stint here was embarrassing and he was a huge reason those teams had nothing but drama and turmoil.

Yeah but $20 sneakers

Philc1 wrote:

GustavBahler wrote:

Nalod wrote:

KEEPCAMBYNY wrote:I think we were all disappointed with Steph’s time here, but it wasn’t all his fault. When he first got here our starting lineup was:

Doleac (a stretch 5)
Kurt Thomas
Van Horn
Houston
Marbury

When we had that lineup he was thriving, why? Because he had a bunch of guys that could catch and shoot. They didn’t need the ball to be effective and it was giving him all of that spacing. He was thriving with that team. Problem is that Houston came back too soon from his surgery that he had in the summer. Then Isiah traded all the catch & shoot hustle guys away for non-shooting ball stoppers that clogged the paint. Then it all culminated with the Larry Brown hiring.It really is that simple.

Had Allan Houston recovered from injury and we never did the Eddy Curry trade, we could have kept our picks to draft Lamarcus Aldridge instead. I know history probably would have changed if we didn’t do the Curry trade, but imagine if we had Frye/ Aldridge/Ariza/Houston/steph. That lineup would have complimented his skillset much better than what we had.

That is the team we should have had instead of the Larry Brown mess. Btw, I once saw in an interview that Isiah did that he didn’t actually want Larry Brown. Allegedly Joe Dumars told him that unless you had a championship team already in place that Brown was a huge headache that wasn’t worth it. Instead he recommended that Isiah hire Detroit assistant Mike Woodson because he was ready to be a head coach for an upcoming team. Isiah said that the MSG higher ups were in Dolan’s ear and convinced him to get Larry Brown instead. That decision sealed Marbury’s fate because Woodson would have been the perfect coach for him. Then again, had Woodson guided him to some successful playoff runs then that amazing China experience probably never happens so it was probably for the best.

I agree. The Isiah thing was so bad from day one. The first thing he did was overpay for Marbury and handed him the keys to the team. Marbury was not a good steward of what he was given responsibility for.
Not hoping we gonna see a lot of Marbury. I appreciate he is a knick fan despite his exile and perhaps he has matured and accepts whats on him. Melo seems to have come to grips with things. Thing is Marbury never had a grip on things. His testimony during the Anucha civil suit vs Isiah was epic! The hours long broadcast were he eating vaseline, and who could forget "we Youthier now"!

Oh, the memories of a brain dead NY legend!!!

Isiah shouldn't have traded Doleac and KVH. Marbury and Doleac had a very effective PNR going, and Doleac was a very good defensive big man. Watched him play with the Magic, surprised a lot of Knicks fans at how good his interior defense was.

KVH was Mr. Softee until he joined the Knicks. I "hated" him more than any other NBA player, next to Greg Ostertag. But he was a legit two way player with the Knicks.

Isiah wanted to put his own stamp on the team, chemistry be dammed.

Isiah was a horrible GM but Scott Leyden was even worse. Leyden just wasn’t around as long and was more low key. But then again, Layden couldn’t speak in public so there’s that.

How was he "worse"? How do you quantify the roster? Wins vs. Losses? What about salary? Did Layden come after an era of success and tasks to rebuild with few draft picks? Who directed Layden to get a superstar in McDyess? You think new neophyte GM's have freedom to spend 100mm without owners blessing or an owner like Dolan who might be telling him to get a star?
Layden made a two really bad signings, Howard Eisley and Shannon Anderson. Perhaps the era was no to trade picks either.
So if you want to lay down a statement, you might want to respect the guys here, and yourself by adding some context.

Many of us understood the era and what happened. It was bad. You had an owner who did not give his execs autonomy then as he does now. So the blame game is complicated. It was bad. No denying Layden was tasked with turning around a stale franchise. He failed. Isiah made it worse.

Kind of like your posts.

GustavBahler wrote:

Philc1 wrote:

GustavBahler wrote:

Nalod wrote:

KEEPCAMBYNY wrote:I think we were all disappointed with Steph’s time here, but it wasn’t all his fault. When he first got here our starting lineup was:

Doleac (a stretch 5)
Kurt Thomas
Van Horn
Houston
Marbury

When we had that lineup he was thriving, why? Because he had a bunch of guys that could catch and shoot. They didn’t need the ball to be effective and it was giving him all of that spacing. He was thriving with that team. Problem is that Houston came back too soon from his surgery that he had in the summer. Then Isiah traded all the catch & shoot hustle guys away for non-shooting ball stoppers that clogged the paint. Then it all culminated with the Larry Brown hiring.It really is that simple.

Had Allan Houston recovered from injury and we never did the Eddy Curry trade, we could have kept our picks to draft Lamarcus Aldridge instead. I know history probably would have changed if we didn’t do the Curry trade, but imagine if we had Frye/ Aldridge/Ariza/Houston/steph. That lineup would have complimented his skillset much better than what we had.

That is the team we should have had instead of the Larry Brown mess. Btw, I once saw in an interview that Isiah did that he didn’t actually want Larry Brown. Allegedly Joe Dumars told him that unless you had a championship team already in place that Brown was a huge headache that wasn’t worth it. Instead he recommended that Isiah hire Detroit assistant Mike Woodson because he was ready to be a head coach for an upcoming team. Isiah said that the MSG higher ups were in Dolan’s ear and convinced him to get Larry Brown instead. That decision sealed Marbury’s fate because Woodson would have been the perfect coach for him. Then again, had Woodson guided him to some successful playoff runs then that amazing China experience probably never happens so it was probably for the best.

I agree. The Isiah thing was so bad from day one. The first thing he did was overpay for Marbury and handed him the keys to the team. Marbury was not a good steward of what he was given responsibility for.
Not hoping we gonna see a lot of Marbury. I appreciate he is a knick fan despite his exile and perhaps he has matured and accepts whats on him. Melo seems to have come to grips with things. Thing is Marbury never had a grip on things. His testimony during the Anucha civil suit vs Isiah was epic! The hours long broadcast were he eating vaseline, and who could forget "we Youthier now"!

Oh, the memories of a brain dead NY legend!!!

Isiah shouldn't have traded Doleac and KVH. Marbury and Doleac had a very effective PNR going, and Doleac was a very good defensive big man. Watched him play with the Magic, surprised a lot of Knicks fans at how good his interior defense was.

KVH was Mr. Softee until he joined the Knicks. I "hated" him more than any other NBA player, next to Greg Ostertag. But he was a legit two way player with the Knicks.

Isiah wanted to put his own stamp on the team, chemistry be dammed.

Isiah was a horrible GM but Scott Leyden was even worse. Leyden just wasn’t around as long and was more low key. But then again, Layden couldn’t speak in public so there’s that.

I’d say as bad as Layden was, Isiah was worse for what he did not only to the team’s competitiveness, but what he also did to the franchise’s reputation off the court.

One reason why Leon is such a good team president is that he built on what Perry did as GM Kept good, young, players, stockpiled draft picks. Kept the game plan of not going for the quick fix like Isiah did. Didn’t sign over the hill stars to bloated contracts. Didn’t overpay for promising young players like Isiah did with Eddie Curry.

The roster now is Leon’s, he put his stamp on the team, without gutting it prematurely. It was done organically. He had some whiffs like all NBA execs, but none so big that they sunk the team’s chances at contending like Isiah did with Eddie Curry. How long did it take to get past that fiasco?

Isiah had a rostered salaried that was 40% MORE THEN THE SECOND HIGHEST ROSTER AND WON JUST 23 GAMES!!!
Traded for Eddy Curry who the Bulls were trying to retire due to a heart irregularity and it was so bad they were two high lottery picks! He hired Larry Brown. Dumb. Larry was awful, but its on the him.

PhilC: Layden in 4.3 seasons winning % was .492. Yes he inherited a decent team but it he had to trade Ewing and had no money to spend or picks.
Isiah had picks and money to spend. Very different circumstance. Dolan was gettin heat from fans to do something. He wanted to starphuch with Magic Johnson but got Isiah instead.

Isiah wining % was.368 in 5 years.

Don't tell us Layden was much worse. If so explain. both sucked. Isiah had some decent picks. Ariza was a good one. Then he traded him for steve Francis and made him team captain. The kid was drinking his way out of the league!!! Layden hired Don Chaney. Don was OK and was limited by a really bad roster. He won 50 and then 48 games. he had inherited gimpy H20, surley mad as hell Spree, and had to dump Ewing. Orthella harrington, Weaterspoon, the not so great Charlie ward: Here you go...https://www.basketball-reference.com/teams/NYK/2003.html Anderson and Eisley were big misses. Lee Nailon!!!! Laydens next two years knnicks won 30, then 37 games. Layden thought Anderson and Eisley were ready for bigger roles. Nope.

He drafted one player of with a about the only pick worth a damn, 2003 Mike Sweetney. BTW, that was Lebrons Draft!!! After the top 5, it was a **** draft.
Layden did not really wiff on players that went after. https://www.basketball-reference.com/draft/NBA_2003.html
Other rookies rostered in he Layden Era: Frank Williams, Larvar Postal, Demarco Johnson, and of course Mirsad Turkan!!!!!!
Nothing. Shit picks with **** draft positions.

Layden was left with little to work with after the starphuch hang over by a late decade run that yielded finals run in 1999. Remember Camby fell apart in 2000. He had a really bad family thing and he was hurt alot. JVG held it together then bailed despondent.
He had a **** roster in part from Ewing getting that last monster contract by scared owner who meddled. Had he not fired Earnie JVG would have been fired and we would have had a modern roster. Instead Dolan kept JVG who had an aging roster in a league that was starting to run. Layden was tasked as a neophyte to cater to his starphuch whims. It was awful. I stand by the Mcdyess deal born from a starphuching owner and on paper was a good idea actually but proved to be a disaster!

Im not defending Layden. Im defending accuracy. Knick fans here deserve to not read lazy ass ****. new fans not familiar with the era and come here need to be informed.

PhilC, this is how you do it. Not be lazy and say stupid ****. Layded sucked. Isiah was worse.