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If DDV was on the open market right now, how much is he getting signed for per year?
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martin
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3/1/2024  10:32 AM
nycericanguy wrote:He's having a great year but he's averaging 1 FT per game on the year, he's not a guy that really extrapolates well to 30+mpg. His best role seems to be that 26mpg type role. So I'd say 4/60m?

I look at it from a different angle. How well is he doing his role and how much is that worth to team?

DDV will never be a high usage player. And although he cuts to basket and can put ball on floor, it's not his job to collect FT's. He is asked to space, shoot, move, and move ball. And defend.

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EwingPSD
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3/1/2024  12:14 PM
right now I think he'd get around 15 a year. If he could show that this season isn't a one-hit wonder and then hit the market I think he might get 20.
DLeethal
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3/1/2024  2:05 PM    LAST EDITED: 3/1/2024  2:05 PM
martin wrote:
nycericanguy wrote:He's having a great year but he's averaging 1 FT per game on the year, he's not a guy that really extrapolates well to 30+mpg. His best role seems to be that 26mpg type role. So I'd say 4/60m?

I look at it from a different angle. How well is he doing his role and how much is that worth to team?

DDV will never be a high usage player. And although he cuts to basket and can put ball on floor, it's not his job to collect FT's. He is asked to space, shoot, move, and move ball. And defend.

Agree - role players, especially floor spreaders, aren't really out there to get to the FT line. Stars do the bulk of that job. Seems like a cherry picked critique.

EwingPSD
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3/1/2024  3:21 PM
DLeethal wrote:He would get the Josh Hart contract. Guys who can shoot 40% on that volume and also bring great hustle/intangibles, solid defense are hard to find.

I don't think the volume is appreciated enough. He is second in the NBA in 3s per 36. Only Curry takes more. He is one of 5 guys taking 10 per 36. He is shooting .411%. Curry is the only one of those 5 shooting higher % and he is barely better (.412%). Only Curry, CJ, and Doug McDermot shoot over 9 per 36 and shoot a higher % than DDV. He is been been all-time good shooting this year

Nalod
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3/1/2024  4:01 PM
EwingPSD wrote:
DLeethal wrote:He would get the Josh Hart contract. Guys who can shoot 40% on that volume and also bring great hustle/intangibles, solid defense are hard to find.

I don't think the volume is appreciated enough. He is second in the NBA in 3s per 36. Only Curry takes more. He is one of 5 guys taking 10 per 36. He is shooting .411%. Curry is the only one of those 5 shooting higher % and he is barely better (.412%). Only Curry, CJ, and Doug McDermot shoot over 9 per 36 and shoot a higher % than DDV. He is been been all-time good shooting this year

His volume kicked up when he got the start, and more so with injuries to others.
Thus, his % might start to come down.
But.....Its really good what he doing and long term he should be solid.
For the money, he is exceptional!

EwingPSD
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3/1/2024  4:13 PM    LAST EDITED: 3/1/2024  4:17 PM
Nalod wrote:
EwingPSD wrote:
DLeethal wrote:He would get the Josh Hart contract. Guys who can shoot 40% on that volume and also bring great hustle/intangibles, solid defense are hard to find.

I don't think the volume is appreciated enough. He is second in the NBA in 3s per 36. Only Curry takes more. He is one of 5 guys taking 10 per 36. He is shooting .411%. Curry is the only one of those 5 shooting higher % and he is barely better (.412%). Only Curry, CJ, and Doug McDermot shoot over 9 per 36 and shoot a higher % than DDV. He is been been all-time good shooting this year

His volume kicked up when he got the start, and more so with injuries to others.
Thus, his % might start to come down.
But.....Its really good what he doing and long term he should be solid.
For the money, he is exceptional!

His volume has gone up recently and is probably a little too high for him to maintain this % right now but he has been sround top 10 per 36 all year. He was definitely over 9 per 36 before everyone got injuried

EwingPSD
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3/4/2024  10:38 AM
EwingPSD wrote:right now I think he'd get around 15 a year. If he could show that this season isn't a one-hit wonder and then hit the market I think he might get 20.

Fuck it. He'd get 20 right now. I never disliked DDV but I owe him an apology. I didn't think he could make a big leap and felt his value would be about the same as Deuce or Grimes if they got minutes. He's really good

nycericanguy
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3/4/2024  11:38 AM
martin wrote:
nycericanguy wrote:He's having a great year but he's averaging 1 FT per game on the year, he's not a guy that really extrapolates well to 30+mpg. His best role seems to be that 26mpg type role. So I'd say 4/60m?

I look at it from a different angle. How well is he doing his role and how much is that worth to team?

DDV will never be a high usage player. And although he cuts to basket and can put ball on floor, it's not his job to collect FT's. He is asked to space, shoot, move, and move ball. And defend.

he's great at his role, my point was he's not a sustainable 20ppg guy even if you gave him 32+mpg, because he can't create enough for himself. You'll never find a 20ppg scorer that averages 1 FT per game. He just went through a 5 game stretch playing huge minutes where he didn't attempt a single FT.

his ideal role is probably 26mpg, 12-14ppg shooter. So I'm not sure teams would pay starter money for that.

martin
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3/4/2024  12:14 PM    LAST EDITED: 3/4/2024  12:16 PM
nycericanguy wrote:
martin wrote:
nycericanguy wrote:He's having a great year but he's averaging 1 FT per game on the year, he's not a guy that really extrapolates well to 30+mpg. His best role seems to be that 26mpg type role. So I'd say 4/60m?

I look at it from a different angle. How well is he doing his role and how much is that worth to team?

DDV will never be a high usage player. And although he cuts to basket and can put ball on floor, it's not his job to collect FT's. He is asked to space, shoot, move, and move ball. And defend.

he's great at his role, my point was he's not a sustainable 20ppg guy even if you gave him 32+mpg, because he can't create enough for himself. You'll never find a 20ppg scorer that averages 1 FT per game. He just went through a 5 game stretch playing huge minutes where he didn't attempt a single FT.

his ideal role is probably 26mpg, 12-14ppg shooter. So I'm not sure teams would pay starter money for that.

Candidly, if DDV was doing the minutes, ball-handling, and FT thing you are refereeing to, he would be a $25-30M player.

Miami thought Duncan Robinson was worth $19M per several years ago. Herro got the potential thing and rookie contract thing going on and nabbed $27M.

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martin
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3/28/2024  2:55 PM
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martin
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3/28/2024  3:21 PM
The opportunity was right there for Grimes, he was not ready for it yet

DDV averaging 28 minutes a game

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DLeethal
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3/28/2024  7:04 PM
martin wrote:The opportunity was right there for Grimes, he was not ready for it yet

DDV averaging 28 minutes a game

Yea DDV pretty much poured water on the narrative that Thibs' offense was holding back Grimes and then the McBridge surge has officially stomped it into an oblivion.

franco12
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3/28/2024  8:57 PM
DLeethal wrote:
martin wrote:The opportunity was right there for Grimes, he was not ready for it yet

DDV averaging 28 minutes a game

Yea DDV pretty much poured water on the narrative that Thibs' offense was holding back Grimes and then the McBridge surge has officially stomped it into an oblivion.

What happened to Grimes? Is he hurt? Did he not practice and work on his shot and exercise? Or is he simply Frank N 2.0, Kevin Knox 2.0, Landry Fields 2.0- guys that flash promise and then poof, gone.

fishmike
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3/28/2024  9:44 PM
Panos wrote:
fishmike wrote:
BigDaddyG wrote:
Nalod wrote:
BigDaddyG wrote:It's not at the Dallas/Brunson level, but GSW probably has some regrets about letting him go.
He was making 4.25mil last year on the Mini MLE with them and they are hard capped. He had a player option year two. He was not really there for the long term. unless injured or regressed. He did not.
No regrets as he would not have the same opportunity he had here.
Lets hope he stays healthy!

I understand the cap reasons, but still... I could see him eating into a bunch of Klay's minutes now. GSW could really use him now

because TODAY Donte is the better player.

Its just so rare DD makes a bad play. He had a TO (bad pass) and I raised my eye brows. All he does is take good shots and make them.

DD is 3rd in the league in 3s make and is shooting .416 from there. He's aggressive taking it to the basket and has a nice drive and dish game as well. He REALLY reminds me of John Starks. Just always aggressive, flies around on both ends of the floor and is never intimidated. In fact he plays happy. Dude is intense but plays with joy.

Honestly DD's contract, age and role make him an important piece of competing for a title. Having him locked in here a few years at that value is huge

He's been terrific, far exceeding expectations.
I'd say he's at least as impactful a player as Quickly was, just a pure SG, not really combo guard. I can't recall a play he's made that was low IQ. Gets after it on defense too and not just a shooter, but fast and athletic.
Compare him to what we thought we were getting from EF and we paid $18m for that.

I think if Quickly is worth $25m as some of you suggest, no way DDV is less than $20m.

he reminds me SO MUCH of John Starks. Obviously more of a green light on the 3 but they really play similar
"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
gradyandrew
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3/28/2024  11:48 PM    LAST EDITED: 3/28/2024  11:53 PM
nycericanguy wrote:
martin wrote:
nycericanguy wrote:He's having a great year but he's averaging 1 FT per game on the year, he's not a guy that really extrapolates well to 30+mpg. His best role seems to be that 26mpg type role. So I'd say 4/60m?

I look at it from a different angle. How well is he doing his role and how much is that worth to team?

DDV will never be a high usage player. And although he cuts to basket and can put ball on floor, it's not his job to collect FT's. He is asked to space, shoot, move, and move ball. And defend.

he's great at his role, my point was he's not a sustainable 20ppg guy even if you gave him 32+mpg, because he can't create enough for himself. You'll never find a 20ppg scorer that averages 1 FT per game. He just went through a 5 game stretch playing huge minutes where he didn't attempt a single FT.

his ideal role is probably 26mpg, 12-14ppg shooter. So I'm not sure teams would pay starter money for that.

Do you have any data to back that up?

As a starter he's averaging 30 minutes 17/4/3 on 60% True Shooting with 120/112 offensive/ defensive rating splits. Keldon Johnson is a good comparison in terms of raw stats and he got 18 million despite shooting 33% on on 6 3PA last summer.

Poole, RJ, and Herro got 27-32 last summer. Those guys were younger so teams were betting they would take a leap, but I don't think a 3 years for 75 million would be questioned this summer for DDV.

nycericanguy
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3/29/2024  8:47 AM    LAST EDITED: 3/29/2024  8:50 AM
gradyandrew wrote:
nycericanguy wrote:
martin wrote:
nycericanguy wrote:He's having a great year but he's averaging 1 FT per game on the year, he's not a guy that really extrapolates well to 30+mpg. His best role seems to be that 26mpg type role. So I'd say 4/60m?

I look at it from a different angle. How well is he doing his role and how much is that worth to team?

DDV will never be a high usage player. And although he cuts to basket and can put ball on floor, it's not his job to collect FT's. He is asked to space, shoot, move, and move ball. And defend.

he's great at his role, my point was he's not a sustainable 20ppg guy even if you gave him 32+mpg, because he can't create enough for himself. You'll never find a 20ppg scorer that averages 1 FT per game. He just went through a 5 game stretch playing huge minutes where he didn't attempt a single FT.

his ideal role is probably 26mpg, 12-14ppg shooter. So I'm not sure teams would pay starter money for that.

Do you have any data to back that up?

As a starter he's averaging 30 minutes 17/4/3 on 60% True Shooting with 120/112 offensive/ defensive rating splits. Keldon Johnson is a good comparison in terms of raw stats and he got 18 million despite shooting 33% on on 6 3PA last summer.

Poole, RJ, and Herro got 27-32 last summer. Those guys were younger so teams were betting they would take a leap, but I don't think a 3 years for 75 million would be questioned this summer for DDV.

i mean just look at his game logs. As his minutes have gone up his efficiency has gone down significantly. JAN was that big 15-2 run for us where we had OG and Randle and he wasn't asked to do too much. To me that's his best role and peak efficiency/production.

DEC - 13.1ppg 55/49 shooting - 22.2mpg
JAN - 15.6ppg 45/40 shooting - 26.8mpg
FEB - 21.7ppg 43/37 shooting - 37.5mpg
MAR - 19.5ppg 41/37 shooting - 36.2mpg

You're comparing him to guys who have scored 20+ppg and were 3-4 years younger and bigger overall.

He compares more to Malik Beasely than he does to those guys above.

DDV has had a great year but yea I think he's probably best suited to a 26-28mpg role, that's not a knock on him, he just starts to fall off efficiency wise if you're asking him to play big minutes.

If we can upgrade the SG spot he'd be a deadly 6th man.

DLeethal
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3/29/2024  8:58 AM
nycericanguy wrote:
gradyandrew wrote:
nycericanguy wrote:
martin wrote:
nycericanguy wrote:He's having a great year but he's averaging 1 FT per game on the year, he's not a guy that really extrapolates well to 30+mpg. His best role seems to be that 26mpg type role. So I'd say 4/60m?

I look at it from a different angle. How well is he doing his role and how much is that worth to team?

DDV will never be a high usage player. And although he cuts to basket and can put ball on floor, it's not his job to collect FT's. He is asked to space, shoot, move, and move ball. And defend.

he's great at his role, my point was he's not a sustainable 20ppg guy even if you gave him 32+mpg, because he can't create enough for himself. You'll never find a 20ppg scorer that averages 1 FT per game. He just went through a 5 game stretch playing huge minutes where he didn't attempt a single FT.

his ideal role is probably 26mpg, 12-14ppg shooter. So I'm not sure teams would pay starter money for that.

Do you have any data to back that up?

As a starter he's averaging 30 minutes 17/4/3 on 60% True Shooting with 120/112 offensive/ defensive rating splits. Keldon Johnson is a good comparison in terms of raw stats and he got 18 million despite shooting 33% on on 6 3PA last summer.

Poole, RJ, and Herro got 27-32 last summer. Those guys were younger so teams were betting they would take a leap, but I don't think a 3 years for 75 million would be questioned this summer for DDV.

i mean just look at his game logs. As his minutes have gone up his efficiency has gone down significantly. JAN was that big 15-2 run for us where we had OG and Randle and he wasn't asked to do too much. To me that's his best role and peak efficiency/production.

DEC - 13.1ppg 55/49 shooting - 22.2mpg
JAN - 15.6ppg 45/40 shooting - 26.8mpg
FEB - 21.7ppg 43/37 shooting - 37.5mpg
MAR - 19.5ppg 41/37 shooting - 36.2mpg

You're comparing him to guys who have scored 20+ppg and were 3-4 years younger and bigger overall.

He compares more to Malik Beasely than he does to those guys above.

DDV has had a great year but yea I think he's probably best suited to a 26-28mpg role, that's not a knock on him, he just starts to fall off efficiency wise if you're asking him to play big minutes.

If we can upgrade the SG spot he'd be a deadly 6th man.

What you think his fair market value is and what someone might actually pay him are two different things though. Lots of guys get the bag and then people think they are overpaid. Not crazy to think DDV could get the bag on the market. He brings a highly coveted set of skills, and he actually plays great team defense which many of these comps don't.

Swishfm3
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3/29/2024  9:05 AM
DDV gets 20mil easy.

Those who remember him with the Bucks could see the potential he had as a scoring point guard. Its a shame (for them) that Bucks gave up on him after his injury but, at the time, I guess they didn't really need him. I was surprised to see that he wasn't the primary ball handler when Brunson went down in those few games.

point is..DDV can do more but he's not asked too. His signing alone should get Rose EOTY

Swishfm3
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3/29/2024  9:08 AM
DLeethal wrote:
martin wrote:The opportunity was right there for Grimes, he was not ready for it yet

DDV averaging 28 minutes a game

Yea DDV pretty much poured water on the narrative that Thibs' offense was holding back Grimes and then the McBridge surge has officially stomped it into an oblivion.

I think this is a bit unfair to say.

You're comparing Grimes to NBA vet who has learned how to maneuver around certain situations (playing with ball dominate players) and coaches, and McBride who was given a major opportunity with all the injuries the team as suffered this season.

DLeethal
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3/29/2024  9:11 AM
Swishfm3 wrote:
DLeethal wrote:
martin wrote:The opportunity was right there for Grimes, he was not ready for it yet

DDV averaging 28 minutes a game

Yea DDV pretty much poured water on the narrative that Thibs' offense was holding back Grimes and then the McBridge surge has officially stomped it into an oblivion.

I think this is a bit unfair to say.

You're comparing Grimes to NBA vet who has learned how to maneuver around certain situations (playing with ball dominate players) and coaches, and McBride who was given a major opportunity with all the injuries the team as suffered this season.

Not really, I'm comparing guys whose bread and butter in this league is/will be quick release shooting. Grimes got the same opportunity Deuce did, he was showered with starters minutes for like two full seasons.

If DDV was on the open market right now, how much is he getting signed for per year?

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