ramtour420 wrote:

Panos wrote:

Rookie wrote:

martin wrote:

Rookie wrote:The Knicks have a very bad history of trading for and signing aging veterans who are past their prime. This trade is a nod to the bad old days. If we had traded Grimes for a player in his prime who filled a bigger need then I wouldn't be bitching. This was a bad trade.

I have to tell you, I am a little confused as to why the Knicks traded Grimes. All things being equal, trading Grimes for Bogs, especially considering age, doesn't make sense, right? That's easy.

So, if the Knicks didn't trade Grimes, they definitely have a different type of Obi/Randle situation with Grimes/DDV, right? And DDV is fitting that starting lineup like a Villanova born and breed Glove. So where are Grimes' minutes gonna come from? Cause DDV is deserving of even more than the 25mpg, right?

Or do we need to relearn that lesson again? Is it - was it - worth it keeping Grimes in that situation? Knowing DDV is playing at historical levels of shooting good at half the price of what Grimes could ask for in contract.

As well, Bogs is easier to move than Grimes moving forward. Grimes contract would be $4M next year, which is both a blessing and a hindrance cause you need to include other big contracts to match him into a bigger trade. You can keep Fournier but he is just dead weight.

Did the Knicks position themselves better for this playoffs as well as their next trade (draft, summer or after summer) than they would have if they kept Grimes?

Tough ask. But that seems like the consideration?

My point is that neither Burks or Bojan fit the profile of players we have either signed or traded for. It fits the profile or moves we were making when Isiah was in Dolan's ear. This new group has had tremendous patience. his feels more like a desperation move

I think I'm ready to call this trade a bust. As far as I'm concerned, I would have been happier letting EF walk and keeping Grimes backing up DDV till a possibly better deal came along. Both these cats were supposed to be offensive sparks, and they have not been. Bojan has been a starter his whole career, so saying he's being asked to do too much is a fallacy. I would totally take a mulligan on that one. And to think, we also gave up 2 seconder rounders for the privilege of losing this trade.

As of right now I'd have to agree. I keep thinking about last year's playoffs and what a terrific job Grimes did guarding the best player. DM and then Butler.

Then how Grimes lost his starting job and offensive inconsistencies this year making not great progress finishing at the basket.
Im thinking how good DDV has been.
Im also thinking Deuce defense on DM will be pretty good and his shot is really coming on.
Bogs will be fine in the role he is intended for.

Hart, DDV, iHart, Deuce contract, OG/Precious trade - not to mention Brunson - the FO has plenty of good will built up to counter a meh trade.

I do feel like as long as Thibs is here though, we just need to go after Thibs guys. When everyone is in sync and playing a certain way, the guys that don't stick out like a sore thumb.

DLeethal wrote:Moving on from Grimes most likely is going to make the FO look smart again.

5.4 ppg/2.4rpg/2.2 apg 22% fg/20% 3pt in DET

He just needs to be unlocked!

Nalod wrote:He had 18 games and lost his starting job.
He played 50 this season and all stats declined.
https://www.basketball-reference.com/players/g/grimequ01.html
He is shooting .16 from three in 5 games with DET.
But look at last season vs. this one. He did really well last year.
So much we don't know but if Knicks lost confidence in him and don't want to pay him then time to move.
He was tabled "break out player in the east" by some preseason article. It did not happen, the team signed DDV and Grimes had issues of consistency. Its not always fair, and its a brutal business.
Instead we got two vets with proven abilities to add depth.
Lets see how they do going forward. Not a great trade for either team except Detroit seems to be making strides with its changes.

I preface this with I never thought Grimes was more than a decent 3 and D player and I never saw the ceiling people saw (and some still do) in Grimes. Honestly I started to really not like him when people were asking to "unlock Grimes" and constantly stroking him then turning around and giving RJ **** when he preformed better in his role than Grimes did in his (I'm sure that will be a debatable topic).

IMO, fair has nothing to do with it at all. I don't think anyone in any universe saw DD playing this well. And at that times the talk was DD was to replace IQ possibly, not Grimes. Bottom line, other players were able to not only do, but excel at the things Grimes was asked to do and failed, then complained publically about, then failed again when given a prime role against second teamers.

Didn't think it's anyones fault necessarily, but I think a lot of responsibility falls on the player here.

Panos wrote:At this point, I'm not sure Burks is worth playing. Is Shake Milton not able to contribute more than what we're seeing from Burks?
And Bogs continues to underwhelm on offense and be a turnstile on Defense. He's going to be EF'ed as soon as any big body comes off the DL.

At some point Thibs does give his incumbents a fair time but he does demote. Early in his knick tenure he was accused by some as a sort of "nepotism" getting his favorites paid but in nearly 4 seasons he will give players the hook and demote them. Fans often have a "what do we have to lose" attitude which is normal for us but obviously coaches have their process. Perhaps Shake has to demonstrate he is healthy, in shape, and in synch with his mates before any time on the court.
Alec is listed as out tonite. Perhaps Clyde gets a "Shake, Rattle and Role" this game??

KnickDanger wrote:"Win/lose" the trade aside - Grimes is out for the season. Barely played post trade. If he were still a principal rotation player...added to all the other injuries we'd have who out there? The two way guys? Perhaps the much regarded Shake? I don't know of course but that would have been a tough situation.

Bruce Brown, Dejounte Murray, Malcolm Brogan, Jordan Clarkson.....etc, etc

Panos wrote:Malachi Flynn scored 50 points off the bench last night + 6 RB + 5 assists + 5 steals.
w0w!

Wow. That's amazing.

martin wrote:Burks and Bogs now have the opportunity of a lifetime for contract extensions. Both can gain a lot by their performances during playoffs.

Get healthy, get ready.