https://forums.realgm.com/boards/posting.php?mode=quote&f=11&p=103648228

afarmenian wrote:I try not to be prisoner of the moment, but lets have an honest conversation about the last 12 months. The cavs are a half game worse than they were at this point last year. At what point do we start to question this trade and the direction of this team?

The facts are that Mitchell is a fun player to watch puts up gaudy numbers, but the results right now point to about the same number of wins with significantly diminished war chest and very little flexibility going forward. Last year with Levert you gave up assets for the idea of the player you wanted in the backcourt and it did not have an impact on wins and losses correct? They were worse after the Levert trade than before is that a fact?

That is two players, two guards for wait for it.....4 first round picks, a rookie first round pick, an all star this year Lauri, and also a rotation player in Sexton. That gets you LESS win rate than the previous year and overall. This looks bad....really really bad, a complete botch the future bad.....Is anybody feeling any kind of optimism for how this team becomes a true contender?

The only path I see is for Mobley to develop into a superstar in the next couple years which is a pretty ridiculous ask even for a unicorn. I for one have started to feel quite a bit of regret that we maybe blew up something that could have been special for instant gratification.

Gun to my head this was a terrible terrible mistake to break up the team they had I hope to be proven to be an idiot in the coming months.

Cleveland draft summary:

First round picks
----------------------------------
2023 - 1-14 Own; 15-30 to IND
2024 - Own
2025 - To UTH
2026 - Own or swapped pick (via UTH)
2027 - To UTH
2028 - Own or UTH (via UTH swap for CLE)
2029 - To UTH

Second round picks
----------------------------------
2023 - More favorable of CLE and GOS then other to MIL (via GOS to NOP to UTH to CLE to DET)
2024 - More favorable of CLE and UTH to NYK; more favorable of (i) IND and (ii) less favorable of CLE and UTH to MEM then other to IND (via UTH swap for CLE; via MIL to MEM); GOS 56-60 (via ATL to HOU)
2025 - To IND if CLE does not convey 1st round pick to IND in 2023; MIL
2026 - Own; LAL if CLE conveys 1st round pick to IND in 2023
2027 - Own; DEN
2028 - Own
2029 - Own

Contracts:
https://www.basketball-reference.com/contracts/CLE.html

LaVert and Love UFA's this summer.

I do the same. It’s fun to see the other side’s perspective.

Nalod wrote:Thanks for posting this Martin. Shows fans basically suck. Half a season and regret already.
Expectations are incredible for fans. Its like if they can't see it, it can't happen. Mobley is still a kid.
DM is their Mooby. They eat this **** up and can't handle a multi year process.

The poster didnt say he was bailing on the team, said he hoped to be proven wrong. Doesnt sound like a bad fan. Many of us had these concerns, and they're legit. You're right its too early to judge this trade, Cavs have more moves to make. But if the Cavs end up too hamstrung to be competitive for the next 2-3 seasons, those concerns will have been proven to be spot on.

Nalod wrote:

GustavBahler wrote:

Nalod wrote:Thanks for posting this Martin. Shows fans basically suck. Half a season and regret already.
Expectations are incredible for fans. Its like if they can't see it, it can't happen. Mobley is still a kid.
DM is their Mooby. They eat this **** up and can't handle a multi year process.

The poster didnt say he was bailing on the team, said he hoped to be proven wrong. Doesnt sound like a bad fan. Many of us had these concerns, and they're legit. You're right its too early to judge this trade, Cavs have more moves to make. But if the Cavs end up too hamstrung to be competitive for the next 2-3 seasons, those concerns will have been proven to be spot on.

Sounds like a whiny bitch. We got some on here too.
Im sure I do it too.

I would call him a bitch if he didnt air his concerns on a hoops message board for a couple of seasons. Pointless.

blkexec wrote:

GustavBahler wrote:

Nalod wrote:Thanks for posting this Martin. Shows fans basically suck. Half a season and regret already.
Expectations are incredible for fans. Its like if they can't see it, it can't happen. Mobley is still a kid.
DM is their Mooby. They eat this **** up and can't handle a multi year process.

The poster didnt say he was bailing on the team, said he hoped to be proven wrong. Doesnt sound like a bad fan. Many of us had these concerns, and they're legit. You're right its too early to judge this trade, Cavs have more moves to make. But if the Cavs end up too hamstrung to be competitive for the next 2-3 seasons, those concerns will have been proven to be spot on.

Those concerns are spot on. Unless it’s MJ or Kobe level iso player, it’s difficult to add a chucker to a team that plays the right way.

During our game, DM took all the shots towards the end and came up short. Without DM, they probably win that game against us. But that’s the regular season. DM value will be seen during the playoffs.

L2M report stars Mitchell was fouled 2x at the end of the game and it wasn’t called. I’m not a fan of refs deciding games. I’m still happy we didn’t do the trade. The cost was too much and much like Cleveland it wouldn’t have made us a contender. Mitchell plays no defence. It’s going to hurt them in the playoffs. We have our own chuckers. Chuckers gonna’ chuck

It looks like Cleveland fully healthy also played a 9 man rotation so they are a little thin in the depth department after the trade. I’m not counting the 2 players who played 3 min

Nalod wrote:Thanks for posting this Martin. Shows fans basically suck. Half a season and regret already.
Expectations are incredible for fans. Its like if they can't see it, it can't happen. Mobley is still a kid.
DM is their Mooby. They eat this **** up and can't handle a multi year process.

You realize that most of your posts merely criticize the poster and not deal with the substance of the post? I thought the Cavs analysis was well thought out. Maybe overlooked the future development aspect of the Cavs. And Lauri Markannen’s emergence couldn’t have been predicted by anyone. That said, he isn’t wrong. If we gave up all those picks and had the same record, I too would be disappointed.

With their two big men + their guard duo (especially Donovan Mitchell) those guys could become super exciting come postseason play + a very, tough out.

Panos wrote:

Nalod wrote:Thanks for posting this Martin. Shows fans basically suck. Half a season and regret already.
Expectations are incredible for fans. Its like if they can't see it, it can't happen. Mobley is still a kid.
DM is their Mooby. They eat this **** up and can't handle a multi year process.

Can someone remind me WTF is a Mooby?

And for the next 2 years Donovan will have his way with the franchise cause they GOTTA resign him or are toast for a long time. He can pretty much ask for his supermax extension right now and he'll be playing at the $50m mark or whatnot without having to play defense once.

EwingsGlass wrote:

Nalod wrote:Thanks for posting this Martin. Shows fans basically suck. Half a season and regret already.
Expectations are incredible for fans. Its like if they can't see it, it can't happen. Mobley is still a kid.
DM is their Mooby. They eat this **** up and can't handle a multi year process.

You realize that most of your posts merely criticize the poster and not deal with the substance of the post? I thought the Cavs analysis was well thought out. Maybe overlooked the future development aspect of the Cavs. And Lauri Markannen’s emergence couldn’t have been predicted by anyone. That said, he isn’t wrong. If we gave up all those picks and had the same record, I too would be disappointed.

Most of the posts you remember are me going after ignorant posts that echo falsehoods. I back my statements with facts or state its an opinon, not make **** up like im in the know.
Those stand out in your mind? Ok. Thats your opinion. My opinion is the Cavs dude is a whiney bitch who half a season in and Mobley having a sophmore slump is all “woe is me” and can’t see a future.
We do the same **** here too.
Many of us who influenced by the short term.
8 game streak and we all about that, then a 4 game losing streak and we all about firing the coach and blowing it up.
Some fans ride the bipolar coaster.
Im not going after any one except PhilC who might be a great guy but his posts suck in my book. All of them? Not really, but I back up with facts when he is wrong. You don’t like that? OK.
Most everyone else Im cool with even if I dont’ agree with.
Seems some of us presented with facts don’t digest them and echo inaccuracies. Im hardley the only one who debates and installs facts.
Good trend here is when dudes say they are wrong and admit it. Thats a smart fan who is about making a point of progress than defending their ground even when wrong.

Blow trades out of ones ass with no respect to the money or roster spots like its a video game? Thats not how adults discuss stuff.

Ewingsglass, you might not dig my stuff but thats ok. Its all friendly banter. We all fans. Even grumpy kemet and MS! LOL