Knixkik wrote:Knicks have to make a decision on these guys going into next season. I think quickley is a no brainer that has earned his 6th man contract. Probably have to pay him Fournier money considering he’s still on the way up. He’s proving his ability to be both an elite 6th man and starter at 2 positions when needed. That’s invaluable. Toppin is a bit more complicated. The common theme is he’s underutilized and therefore should eventually be moved since he’s stuck behind Randle. I disagree with that today. I believe he is as useful a backup PF as we will ever have and gives a different look than Randle. And he’s very capable of handling a large role when Randle misses any time. If we moved him, we would need a replacement anyway. He’s not really seeing the normal opportunity and trajectory of a lottery pick, but I think we should still give him a mid level contract and worry about his future role later. He may not be happy in this role forever, but that’s a problem for a different day. Knicks can continue to use a bench led by Quickley and complimented by Toppin and one of the centers. The final rotation spot belongs to Deuce, but it feels like maybe the Knicks can find a wing in the draft who can offer more offense while still holding his own defensively. Should be able to find a solid 9th man in the draft and still have deuce as a defensive specialist when needed. But I’m a proponent of locking up IQ and Toppin and trying to maintain a bench around the homegrown talent for as long as possible.

Nalod wrote:

Jmpasq wrote:

Knixkik wrote:Knicks have to make a decision on these guys going into next season. I think quickley is a no brainer that has earned his 6th man contract. Probably have to pay him Fournier money considering he’s still on the way up. He’s proving his ability to be both an elite 6th man and starter at 2 positions when needed. That’s invaluable. Toppin is a bit more complicated. The common theme is he’s underutilized and therefore should eventually be moved since he’s stuck behind Randle. I disagree with that today. I believe he is as useful a backup PF as we will ever have and gives a different look than Randle. And he’s very capable of handling a large role when Randle misses any time. If we moved him, we would need a replacement anyway. He’s not really seeing the normal opportunity and trajectory of a lottery pick, but I think we should still give him a mid level contract and worry about his future role later. He may not be happy in this role forever, but that’s a problem for a different day. Knicks can continue to use a bench led by Quickley and complimented by Toppin and one of the centers. The final rotation spot belongs to Deuce, but it feels like maybe the Knicks can find a wing in the draft who can offer more offense while still holding his own defensively. Should be able to find a solid 9th man in the draft and still have deuce as a defensive specialist when needed. But I’m a proponent of locking up IQ and Toppin and trying to maintain a bench around the homegrown talent for as long as possible.

Toppin should be moved for a combo forward. If they resign him its only because the front office doesn't want to admit they screwed the team longterm royally by not drafting Haliburton. If they move Toppin for a draft pick they should make a small move to bring Taj back. Quickley is a nice player and will be in demand around the league. He will get 15-20 million a year

Resigning him as a away to not admit they made mistake? Thats how it works?
I’d think with all the picks we have they’d move on by trading him. They so afraid of media and fans they resign him and bury him on the bench?

Is there anything wrong with just resigning him to be the backup to Randle ? Randle is durable but won’t play 82 games most years. It was a mistake passing on Haliburton and Vassell but it’s not like Toppin is a bust. He’s plenty useful in his current role. There’s always been a perception that’s it’s either Randle or Toppin, but if we get out of the fact that Toppin was a lottery pick, I think we are fine as is.

But if I can only keep one, I'm keeping IQ over Obi.

BigDaddyG wrote:

Knixkik wrote:

Nalod wrote:

Jmpasq wrote:

Knixkik wrote:Knicks have to make a decision on these guys going into next season. I think quickley is a no brainer that has earned his 6th man contract. Probably have to pay him Fournier money considering he’s still on the way up. He’s proving his ability to be both an elite 6th man and starter at 2 positions when needed. That’s invaluable. Toppin is a bit more complicated. The common theme is he’s underutilized and therefore should eventually be moved since he’s stuck behind Randle. I disagree with that today. I believe he is as useful a backup PF as we will ever have and gives a different look than Randle. And he’s very capable of handling a large role when Randle misses any time. If we moved him, we would need a replacement anyway. He’s not really seeing the normal opportunity and trajectory of a lottery pick, but I think we should still give him a mid level contract and worry about his future role later. He may not be happy in this role forever, but that’s a problem for a different day. Knicks can continue to use a bench led by Quickley and complimented by Toppin and one of the centers. The final rotation spot belongs to Deuce, but it feels like maybe the Knicks can find a wing in the draft who can offer more offense while still holding his own defensively. Should be able to find a solid 9th man in the draft and still have deuce as a defensive specialist when needed. But I’m a proponent of locking up IQ and Toppin and trying to maintain a bench around the homegrown talent for as long as possible.

Toppin should be moved for a combo forward. If they resign him its only because the front office doesn't want to admit they screwed the team longterm royally by not drafting Haliburton. If they move Toppin for a draft pick they should make a small move to bring Taj back. Quickley is a nice player and will be in demand around the league. He will get 15-20 million a year

Resigning him as a away to not admit they made mistake? Thats how it works?
I’d think with all the picks we have they’d move on by trading him. They so afraid of media and fans they resign him and bury him on the bench?

Is there anything wrong with just resigning him to be the backup to Randle ? Randle is durable but won’t play 82 games most years. It was a mistake passing on Haliburton and Vassell but it’s not like Toppin is a bust. He’s plenty useful in his current role. There’s always been a perception that’s it’s either Randle or Toppin, but if we get out of the fact that Toppin was a lottery pick, I think we are fine as is.

Wouldn't be bad ideally. But does Obi want to remain Randle's backup? I dont know, but I'm guessing he'd want to spread his wings somewhere. How much would you be willing to pay a backup? Obi has shown enough that a team might be willing to swoop in and overpay based on potential. Do you match just because and possibly get stuck in another Blazers/Allen Crabbe situation? I think if the FO just sees Obi as a backup, then the best move is to trade him and maximize his value. I think the team needs more of a combo forward anyway, TBH. And this is all coming from someone who likes Obi.

Most important point.
Would prefer keeping both but it's all about the business side. Hopefully Obi doesn't read the fan forums and overplay his worth. Would like to see him continue his development here.

martin wrote:

Knixkik wrote:Knicks have to make a decision on these guys going into next season. I think quickley is a no brainer that has earned his 6th man contract. Probably have to pay him Fournier money considering he’s still on the way up. He’s proving his ability to be both an elite 6th man and starter at 2 positions when needed. That’s invaluable. Toppin is a bit more complicated. The common theme is he’s underutilized and therefore should eventually be moved since he’s stuck behind Randle. I disagree with that today. I believe he is as useful a backup PF as we will ever have and gives a different look than Randle. And he’s very capable of handling a large role when Randle misses any time. If we moved him, we would need a replacement anyway. He’s not really seeing the normal opportunity and trajectory of a lottery pick, but I think we should still give him a mid level contract and worry about his future role later. He may not be happy in this role forever, but that’s a problem for a different day. Knicks can continue to use a bench led by Quickley and complimented by Toppin and one of the centers. The final rotation spot belongs to Deuce, but it feels like maybe the Knicks can find a wing in the draft who can offer more offense while still holding his own defensively. Should be able to find a solid 9th man in the draft and still have deuce as a defensive specialist when needed. But I’m a proponent of locking up IQ and Toppin and trying to maintain a bench around the homegrown talent for as long as possible.

I'd even take the IQ/Obi discussion one step back further.

The Knicks need to figure out if they want to be in the FA market in summer of 2024 or 2025 and what opportunities exist there against the cost of extending each of those guys. Cause it's one or the other.

I think they split the difference: Keep IQ and move Obi but lots of possibilities out there.

I think the only thing missing from these discussions is a cap analysis. We have 2 frp’s and probably Jokubaitus coming. That’s 3 roster spots and what, 12-15M cap? We are very near having to start consolidating assets. Makes everything speculative.

Rookie wrote:

martin wrote:

Knixkik wrote:Knicks have to make a decision on these guys going into next season. I think quickley is a no brainer that has earned his 6th man contract. Probably have to pay him Fournier money considering he’s still on the way up. He’s proving his ability to be both an elite 6th man and starter at 2 positions when needed. That’s invaluable. Toppin is a bit more complicated. The common theme is he’s underutilized and therefore should eventually be moved since he’s stuck behind Randle. I disagree with that today. I believe he is as useful a backup PF as we will ever have and gives a different look than Randle. And he’s very capable of handling a large role when Randle misses any time. If we moved him, we would need a replacement anyway. He’s not really seeing the normal opportunity and trajectory of a lottery pick, but I think we should still give him a mid level contract and worry about his future role later. He may not be happy in this role forever, but that’s a problem for a different day. Knicks can continue to use a bench led by Quickley and complimented by Toppin and one of the centers. The final rotation spot belongs to Deuce, but it feels like maybe the Knicks can find a wing in the draft who can offer more offense while still holding his own defensively. Should be able to find a solid 9th man in the draft and still have deuce as a defensive specialist when needed. But I’m a proponent of locking up IQ and Toppin and trying to maintain a bench around the homegrown talent for as long as possible.

I'd even take the IQ/Obi discussion one step back further.

The Knicks need to figure out if they want to be in the FA market in summer of 2024 or 2025 and what opportunities exist there against the cost of extending each of those guys. Cause it's one or the other.

I think they split the difference: Keep IQ and move Obi but lots of possibilities out there.

I think the only thing missing from these discussions is a cap analysis. We have 2 frp’s and probably Jokubaitus coming. That’s 3 roster spots and what, 12-15M cap? We are very near having to start consolidating assets. Makes everything speculative.

100%.

Rokas won't count against cap until he is signed (and that can be the last move) but the 2 picks would. Grimes was pick #25 and his salary slot this year is around $2.5M. Pick #15 salary this year will be around $3M, so that's the range'ish. 2 picks around the lottery cuttoff will be about $6M total, which is significant but not cap busting.

MS wrote:Obi doesn’t have any real basketball skills outside of his athleticism, he’s definitely going to be moved. Feel bad for him as it’s an awful situation. Thibs doesn’t seem to like to run plays for Mitch, Grimes or Obi, which limits easy baskets.

I saw a trade for Josh Hart that might be interesting. Bench glue guy that can play multiple positions is really what we need.

IQ is a no brainer, hopefully they can keep him for a decent number, but he wants to start. His defensive numbers are very good.

Sign them both, have to keep as much young talent as possible. Staying young is really important.

Offense could use an offensive coordinator from the Kerr school.

Alpha1971 wrote:

MS wrote:Obi doesn’t have any real basketball skills outside of his athleticism, he’s definitely going to be moved. Feel bad for him as it’s an awful situation. Thibs doesn’t seem to like to run plays for Mitch, Grimes or Obi, which limits easy baskets.

I saw a trade for Josh Hart that might be interesting. Bench glue guy that can play multiple positions is really what we need.

IQ is a no brainer, hopefully they can keep him for a decent number, but he wants to start. His defensive numbers are very good.

Sign them both, have to keep as much young talent as possible. Staying young is really important.

What's the trade for Josh Heart ?

I’d be curious about Josh hart too. He’s a nice glue guy, he was teammates with Brunson, Thibs is a known fan of him , and he’s a CAA client. Also has a player option for this summer, so likely free agent.