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Knicks frontcourt vs Bobcats frontcourt
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bigpimpin
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11/17/2004  11:05 AM
sf - gerald wallace
pf - emeka okafor
c - brezec


sf -tiny tim
pf -kurt thomas
c- key to the deal nazr mohammad

while having a cup of tea this morning with my glazed doughnut, me and an associate happen to stumble upon an argument about the bobcas having a better frontcourt than the knicks

so i just wanted to get the opinion of some well-informed knicks fans and see if i looked like a fool or not when i calmy grabbed him by his neck and repeated to him

"the bobcats are an expansion team"

"Anyone who sits around waiting to hit the lottery, whether basketball or real life, in order to better their position is a loser."
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nykdunk
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11/17/2004  11:20 AM
Interesting question. Going by stats alone Brezec has more PPG, more RPG, and more blocks than Nazy. Okafor and KT have almost identical numbers in every category. And Wallace has more PPG, more RPG, more APG, more turnovers per game, but more heart and more brains per game than TT.

That's just this year. The Bobcats front court also has far more potential down the road. And to make matters worse the teams also have almost identical records right now. So, in a nutshell, you must have looked like a fool when you grabbed your associate by the neck!
Silverfuel
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11/17/2004  11:21 AM
Damn this is rough. They are close but I would say the Knicks have a better front line RIGHT NOW! The bobcats have more potential and upside.

TT over Gerald (I am out of control on offense) Wallace
KT over Emeka (Give me one season and I will dominate) Okafor
Nazr over Primoz Primoz he's our man. If he can't do it, no one can.

The Bobcats frontline is better than our front line next year. they will probably get better by January. Damn, thats depressing
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diderotn
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11/17/2004  11:25 AM
The Bobcats are better mainly because we have the wrong players on the court as starters. I am going to beat this argument to death. TT, Sweet, Kurt, is far better than TT, Kurt, Naser. If Lenny makes the simple change that I have just mentioned, the Knicks front-cout will be far better.
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EnySpree
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11/17/2004  11:35 AM
when i was checking stats this morning i was thinking the same thing about Charlotte.

I've been checking them out on the League Pass preview....I think I might sign up for it for the year.....

The Bobcats play hard. Not just their front court.

We wish KT was Okafor.
We wish TT was Wallace.
We wish Nazr was Primo.

Charlotte got Bogans too now and he is gonna be a gem for them.

They are just as good as the Knicks right now.

Sad days man. Guys keep saying give them time....which is try but like the great Boy George says "Time won't give me time"
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diderotn
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11/17/2004  11:44 AM
Give them time????? I need a line up change as soon as possible. TT is currently struggling and that is understandable, but he and Naser are liabilities specially defensively. the back-court was never knowned for defense and they will never do. Therefore, I am proposing to either instill JYD or Sweet as our starters to replace TT or Naser.

Posted by EnySpree:

when i was checking stats this morning i was thinking the same thing about Charlotte.

I've been checking them out on the League Pass preview....I think I might sign up for it for the year.....

The Bobcats play hard. Not just their front court.

We wish KT was Okafor.
We wish TT was Wallace.
We wish Nazr was Primo.

Charlotte got Bogans too now and he is gonna be a gem for them.

They are just as good as the Knicks right now.

Sad days man. Guys keep saying give them time....which is try but like the great Boy George says "Time won't give me time"
The true Knickabocker..........
SKY
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11/17/2004  11:46 AM
If you include the bench, Knicks are way better. But just focusing on the starters... It's "the bobcats are an expansion team" Charlotte.

They are already quite good exceeding expectations. They can only get better down the road with more PT/experience and improved chemistry. Next yr, if the same frintline faced off, Bobcats could humiliate the Knicks. Now, that's pathetic for a team with $100 million payroll.
diderotn
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11/17/2004  11:51 AM
At this point, any frontline can humiliate ours. Again, we are very soft at the 3 and the 5.
The true Knickabocker..........
Bonn1997
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11/17/2004  2:33 PM
KVH>>>>>>TT

The correct comparison is:

Marbury + Crawford + TT + Nazy >>>>>>>>> Eisley + Anderson + KVH + Doleac

because those are all the players they've replaced
fishmike
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11/17/2004  3:06 PM
what it comes down to is Ok4. The Knicks dont have anyone with that potential. Sweetney has nice upside, but Ok4 can be a Zo type type player. Aside from Ok4 the rest are doodoo. Sac didnt want Gerald, and its pretty easy to see why. Please dont throw #s at me... its one thing to fill out a box score when you get minutes and your losing every game, its another to actually win NBA games.

TT is in a slump and he's fugazy and he's overpaid, but Gerald Wallace isnt better. KT is a solid role player and Ariza, Sweetney and JYD are a strong 2nd unit.

This is a pretty lame debate come to think of it.
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BigSm00th
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11/17/2004  3:29 PM
Easily the answer here is the Bobcats frontline.

Wallace vs. TT
14 ppg v. 9 ppg
6.5 rpg v. 3.5 rpg
2.2 apg v. .3 apg
40% FG v. 35% FG
64% FT. v. 89%FT
33 FTA v. 9 FTA
Gerald Wallace Salary: $1.4 million
Tim Thomas Salary: $12.9 million

Emeka Okafor v. Kurt Thomas
10 ppg v. 9 ppg
10 rpg v. 11 rpg
1 apg v. 1 apg
1.3 bpg v. 1.5 bpg
39% FG v. 44% FG
74% FT v. 33% FT
However, Okafor's about 10 years younger.
Emeka Okafor Salary: $3.7 million
Kurt Thomas Salary: $5.8 million

Primoz Brezec v. Nazr Mohammed
14 ppg v. 10 ppg
7 rpg v. 6 rpg
1.2 steals v. 0.2 steals
1 bpg v. .8 bpg
45% FG v. 55% FG
64% FT v 75% FT
Primoz is playing more minutes, but obviously the price comes into play again:
Brezec's Salary: $1.5 million
Nazr's Salary: $5.3 million

Timmy is obviously having an awful season, no way around that. However, Wallace's #'s are about where TT is for his career, so I don't think anyone can make the argument with Wallace vs. TT.


Knicks thank goodness have a deeper bench, so overall the NY frontline is better, but their starters would abuse the Knicks. However, when you factor in youth and price, they're frontline far out-performs the Knicks frontline, theres on way around that. That is a scary team if they can snag a good guard in the draft, a Julius Hodge or Chris Paul (both go to schools in Carolina, too).
#Knickstaps
Vmart
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11/17/2004  3:33 PM
The Knicks have a vet front court and the Bobcats don't. The Bobcat front court is better in the stat dept as of now. So I have to say the Bobcat front court is better. Another thing the Bobcat front court hasn't been together as long as the NYK front. The Bobcat front court is way better as of now. They have upside the kNicks well only have downside.
fishmike
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11/17/2004  3:51 PM
to me those stats are totally meaningless... its like when people thought KT was a good center because he average 14/9 en route to a 32 win season.
"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
Vmart
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11/17/2004  7:09 PM
Posted by fishmike:

to me those stats are totally meaningless... its like when people thought KT was a good center because he average 14/9 en route to a 32 win season.

I think if you think in terms of if the Bobcat group was teamed with the Crawrord, Marbury back court where would the kNicks be. Its all a guessing game but I would definitely take the bobcat front court over the Knicks.
Bonn1997
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11/17/2004  7:39 PM
Posted by diderotn:

At this point, any frontline can humiliate ours. Again, we are very soft at the 3 and the 5.
The Knicks frontline is so bad that the team is NOT being out-rebounded or outplayed in blocked shots
Vmart
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11/17/2004  8:07 PM
Block shot isn't always the measure to patrolling the lane. The NYK front line is the reason they haven't plaed all that well. Here are some numbers to think about from the NYK starting front line.

TT: 9.3 points per game
KT: 9.3 points per game
Nazr: 10 points per game

The NYK starting front line is averaging a total of 28.6ppg.
Bonn1997
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11/17/2004  8:17 PM
Posted by Vmart:

Block shot isn't always the measure to patrolling the lane. The NYK front line is the reason they haven't plaed all that well. Here are some numbers to think about from the NYK starting front line.

TT: 9.3 points per game
KT: 9.3 points per game
Nazr: 10 points per game

The NYK starting front line is averaging a total of 28.6ppg.
Players have different roles. 10 PPG from Nazy and Kurt each is *fine*. We already know TT's struggling; there's no point in going over that in this thread too
Vmart
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11/17/2004  8:32 PM
You maybe ok with that but I'm not. 10 ppg from two position well actually three isn't enough. These player command valuable minutes and they need to produce in those minutes. I'm not asking for 20 ppg but at least 14-16 points per game out of those position. As of now Sweetney is the best producer after Marbury and Crawford, he is out producing three of the starter in less minutes.

[Edited by - Vmart on 11/17/2004 20:33:09]
Bonn1997
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11/17/2004  9:24 PM
Kurt's played his role excellently. I don't know how you could complain about him.
Vmart
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11/17/2004  9:43 PM
Posted by Bonn1997:

Kurt's played his role excellently. I don't know how you could complain about him.

His role would be much appreciated if the KNicks had Shaq, Kobe or Jordan, Pippen on the team. But we don't so as far as I'm concerned he needs to bring more to the table on the offensive end. He is cammanding close to 40 minutes a game and 9.3 points average ain't getting it done. Pick up the Offense or step aside. This team has been nothing but losers ever since KT has been in the lineup. People wake up everything has changed around him but the results are the same. You can't have three frinken guys averageing altogether 28.6 points a game. The team will not win much with that kind of out put. Lets put it another way the Knicks aren't good enough to have role players, they need more than role players.
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