jskinny35 wrote:

Uptown wrote:Over the last 5 games, Obi is averaging 14 Pts, 6 Rbs, 65% FG, 30% 3pt fg, 25 mins per. The increase in minutes has lead to an increase in confidence. He's definitely playing more free and loose. The best part is the increase in minutes has lead to a decrease in turnovers. He hasn't turned the ball over in the last 4 games. More time, less forcing the issue?

Obi is a ball mover and his constant movement in the half court and run-outs leading the fast-breaks, puts consistent pressure on defenses. The way Obi plays the game allows him to fit most styles of play and or philosophies. If we could add another playmaker to this team, a player that knows how to pass teammates-open and can see the play before develops, will take Obi's game to another level. Hopefully, he closes the year averaging closer to 25 mins per than 15 mins. Looking forward to watching his game grow....

Yes - this is exactly correct. Randle supporter or hater - we can't deny how well Obi can possibly play if he can score 10-12 pts without any PG play. Amare (while much better) was also pretty reliant on a decent PG. He plays fast, moves the ball and the team seems to function better when he's on the floor. IQ, RJ and most of our youths play significantly faster when Randle is not on the court.

There is no stat comparison as Randle is more skilled and a better ISO/individual player. Put a healthy Rubio (even at 35) or a Brunson and I can easily see Obi scoring 15-16 per game just from hustle and speed. He will definitely need to develop some ISO ability and improve in the halfcourt (when the game slows down in the 4th) - but this snail ball we play with Randle needs to end.

First and foremost, I would like to see Obi in more pick-n-rolls. The only Iso Obi needs to perfect is a quick duck-in or a quick post up to take advantage of the smaller defender on the switch, after he sets the screen. Teams are not running their offense through the PF, so I don't think he needs an array of one-on-one moves. He does need to tighten up his handle, though, and of course he needs to improve his 3pt%. Even as a 3rd or 4th option, Obi can still average 14-16 pts per game just on hustle, basket-cuts and and knocking down the 3 on drive and kicks.

TheGame wrote:Obi has the second highest PER on the team behind Mitch. He is showing that he can get 15-18 points if given 35 minutes a game. What he has yet to show is whether he can create his own shot against a defense focused on stopping him but that may come in time. In any case, he is a good long term prospect or trade bait. He is worth at least a high first rounder (8-15 range) in my opinion, so we might package him a deal to get a young PG. Quickley and McBride have potential but neither has established themselves as a clear starter yet.

Grimes was a good 6th man until injured

blkexec wrote:As long as Randle is on the team and Thibs is the coach, obi will be on the bench. So right now what’s stopping Obi from growing his game is Randle and Thibs. Thibs refuse to play Randle and Obi together and I understand why. And if Randle plays close to 40 a game, there’s no mins for obi.

Agreed. You have to take away Thibs favorite "toys" and force him to play certain players. Randle essentially threw the ball over the fence and stormed home after the Knicks beat the Bulls. And how is he punished for his act? 36 mins the next game.

Knixkik wrote:Need to see him come back next year with a legitimately improved 3pt shot. His form looks good but it’s not repeatable yet. But that combined with a real PG to push the pace would be the 2 necessities to unlocking him.

His perimeter shooting fell off a cliff this season and one can only make the pg excuse for so long. He has played much better recently but that doesn’t eras the first 70 games of the season

On the other end we have Obi who is like an excited puppy waiting to be trained - running the court but still trying to figure out the NBA pacing and how to slow things down. Obi has not yet shown enough offensive consistency, still has defensive lapses and is mostly effective only when we play at a faster pace.

So it's tricky but I'm hoping the recent play of the youths is helping Thibs shift to a more up tempo style since it's obvious to most everyone that slow paced Randle ball was not going to work consistently in the long-term.

I agree that Obi will not play over Randle - I simply hope that FO decides to move on from Randle this offseason.

Philc1 wrote:

jskinny35 wrote:I thing one reason Randle is preferred (over Obi) is Thibs has historically played a slow tempo game. To his credit - Randle is best in a slower paced game where he can dominate the ball. He can create ISO moves when you need that (and we do at times) and when the game slows down in the 4th quarter. Problem is Randle has also shown the inability to make good decisions with the ball, has shot poorly this season, and loafs with effort level and defensive intensity.

On the other end we have Obi who is like an excited puppy waiting to be trained - running the court but still trying to figure out the NBA pacing and how to slow things down. Obi has not yet shown enough offensive consistency, still has defensive lapses and is mostly effective only when we play at a faster pace.

So it's tricky but I'm hoping the recent play of the youths is helping Thibs shift to a more up tempo style since it's obvious to most everyone that slow paced Randle ball was not going to work consistently in the long-term.

I agree that Obi will not play over Randle - I simply hope that FO decides to move on from Randle this offseason.

We needed to commit to Obi last summer by not extending Randle. We had a chance to trade Randle up until the February deadline for a nice package if we had not extended him but that was too counterintuitive I guess. Now we’re stuck with Randle at least 2-3 years while Obi is lucky to average 10 minutes a game during that stretch

Agree 100% and I suggested that all last season (eg sell high) - but it was a tough call because we were playing so well and hadn't competed for the playoffs in such a long time. I didn't believe Randle could continue at that pace - but I also didn't think his performance and attitude would fall off a cliff so quickly this season.

On a brighter note I don't think we're stuck with him - we just aren't likely to get the previous value we could have scored in the past. He can be moved as there are always teams that could use what he brings. Put him on Denver (with MPJr out) or any veteran team as the 3rd option and he will likely do much better in that kind of role. He could also go to a young team with little pressure to win (eg Houston, Portland) and help them. Just hope the FO makes this decision by draft night so we have more possibilities before figuring out our Free Agency plan.

Tell me what his issues are and then we can properly assess. Reality is if he is not right he won't be a good value on the trade market. If its a knick issue can we solve it?
He makes 23mil next year. He is very movable if he is not a headcase.

Nalod wrote:Dude was eligable for that monster extension given he was all ****ing NBA.
He took significantly less. Not because of his benevolence, but likely knicks offered him that and it makes sense.
He killed it last year. few if any thought he'd keep it up at that pace. But few if any thought he'd turn into a grumpy dude. Is he a locker room cancer? no, this team is not fractured. It is playing hard and with Joy. He is just not sitting at the yoot lunch table enjoying himself.

Tell me what his issues are and then we can properly assess. Reality is if he is not right he won't be a good value on the trade market. If its a knick issue can we solve it?
He makes 23mil next year. He is very movable if he is not a headcase.

+1 -- Here endeth the lesson.

Obi's a nice shiny jumping toy that all the Randle thumb haters are now jumping to push into the HOF based on 6 games. Unreal. We throw last season away but jack off over 6 games of Obi.

Is Randle a head case? Do we have to mention his home life again? Does he want the face of the franchise mantle ripped off his face after one season? What we do know is what he said. He wants to be here. He wants to remain a Knick. He states, despite all the hysterical fan and media "evidence" to the contrary, that he is built for NYC.

As the bold states, we have a possibly fixable asset.