martin wrote:Also, IQ still not ready to run an offense

Plus no Kemba or Rose on the bench to get in their ear.

NYKMentality wrote:

spreeeewell wrote:

NYKMentality wrote:I hope to never read Knicks fans blaming criticizing and acting as if JULIUS RANDLE is some type of player "holding NY back".

And i better NEVER see fans criticizing coach Thibs for pulling Obi and "favoring" Julius Randle.

PLEASE!!! Martin make him stop.

Sorry. But I still can't believe how many fans were attacking coach Thibs for "favoring" Julius Randle when benching Obi Toppin. I just hope these two awful loses without Julius Randle makes NY appreciate him even more.

Randle being our most talented player doesn't translate to wins if he can't play faster and move the ball more. It just means he's our most talented. These losses without don't make me appreciate him more - actually only more frustrated since he possesses the needed talent and can't adjust to a current playing style. Either way it doesn't add up to more than mediocrity. What I can acknowledge is that we are so talent deficient and play suck a stagnant offensive style that we are worse without Randle. My hope since the beginning of last season was we would sell high and cash out Randle's winning season for a high draft pick or another productive player that would mesh better with our roster. I still hope for that, although his value has decreased due to his subpar play. Most didn't say we are better without Randle - many suggested trading Randle for value since Randle = little ball movement and less production from remaining roster.

While Toppin may never produce anywhere near Randle's production - I simply can't stand watching any player dribbling the ball most of the time and kicking out when his shot is not available. Maybe some of us still have trauma from 2012-13 Melo... So for me, Toppin's flaws/limitations are easier to digest as he runs the floor, moves the ball and hustles a heck of a lot more IMO.

So imagine Julius dribbling the ball up (slowly) vs the Raptors, setting up for his ISO/back in at the high post attack... really think the outcome would have been very different? Randle plays at such a slow pace and the Raptors play fast and are mostly long armed defenders. The Raptors would have swarmed Randle and while Randle may have helped take the pressure off of the others - we are not a good enough outside shooting team to make much of a difference. We clearly have a pace (and talent) problem. You're harder to guard when you play faster, with more ball movement, etc... So while we also need more talent (with or without Randle) - we also clearly can't expect to beat many teams playing slow-paced basketball.

Truth is going back to Randle ball won't get us anywhere near high level. Yeah he is good enough to beat some mid-level teams but we really need to go in a different direction. We play 90s's to 2012 style... Whether that's trading Randle (and maybe RJ) or playing a different style offensively. Again, we play too slow for 2021 NBA basketball. Worst part is we could at least feel good (previously) about our defensive effort - and that seems to be much worse this season. Makes sense to me why our offense struggles but our defense should have picked up after some of the roster changes (before Covid changes).

Panos wrote:

NYKMentality wrote:I hope to never read Knicks fans blaming criticizing and acting as if JULIUS RANDLE is some type of player "holding NY back".

And i better NEVER see fans criticizing coach Thibs for pulling Obi and "favoring" Julius Randle.

Jesus will you shut up?!

I understand wanting to carry Julz's water. He is a Knick afterall. But the stats, advanced box numbers, show Julius isn't the same player. The numbers have shown he has had held the Knicks back on a number of occasions. Are there other issues? Sure. But ignoring the fact that Julius needs to step up isn't going to get the team any closer to solving those problems.

NYKMentality wrote:Oh well. We were on a 3 game winning streak. But now 2 brutal loses in a row and falling down the strandings. This stinks.

But at least the jets look great

og + pascal + barnes only played 4 games together all season.

we've been missing 2 and 3 of our top 8 all year.

total development/experimental season but i think we can get up to the 5th seed if we get lucky w/ health.

The reality was nowhere near your unicorn jock sniffing 60 win fantasy. Delusional? Perhaps. Are the OBI fanboys also? A bit. The “Deuce and Grimes circle jerk fan club” is also. The want it so bad cuz it makes them look good.
Who got it right? The ESPN haters who had us pegged at .500ish.

We are mid pack. Sorry it dont get you a tank. Thibs is that good a coach.

To those who can’t see the future? Get in line. Just grow up about it and stop fretting like you lost your “Binky” on the subway. It will be ok.

BigDaddyG wrote:

Panos wrote:

djsunyc wrote:first game we had our entire roster all year.

og + pascal + barnes only played 4 games together all season.

we've been missing 2 and 3 of our top 8 all year.

total development/experimental season but i think we can get up to the 5th seed if we get lucky w/ health.

We let him in? Didn't he get his passcard revoked?

I can see why Kawhi left if he had to deal with those type of fans on a consistent basis.

i just sent an email to adam silver asking him if we can play the knicks every game. would love to break gsw's 74 win record.