Clean wrote:I really like our defense when not taking into account our 3pt defense. I don't think I can watch another game of this type of 3pt defense. I don't even blame the players for it. This is a scheme issue. Weakside defenders sag so deep into the paint for no reason EVERY SINGLE TIME. There is no reason for weakside defender to sag into the paint if they can't make a play on the ball. All it ever does is leave weakside shooters open for the 3 after a drive and kick. This is the main source of the open 3's we give up. It has been the same problem the whole year. Seriously go back and watch how many times just that alone gives up the open 3. I literally make a disgusted face every time I see the weakside defender drop down now because I know what's going to happen.

How does one get to the point where they know it's the scheme versus how the players are executing a scheme properly or not?

I don't think Thibs taught Randle how to do the spinover. I don't think Thibs is teaching the weakside players to sag so much. I think the players are sagging too much and there is not enough recognition of who are decent shooters, where they are shooting from, etc.

martin wrote:

Clean wrote:I really like our defense when not taking into account our 3pt defense. I don't think I can watch another game of this type of 3pt defense. I don't even blame the players for it. This is a scheme issue. Weakside defenders sag so deep into the paint for no reason EVERY SINGLE TIME. There is no reason for weakside defender to sag into the paint if they can't make a play on the ball. All it ever does is leave weakside shooters open for the 3 after a drive and kick. This is the main source of the open 3's we give up. It has been the same problem the whole year. Seriously go back and watch how many times just that alone gives up the open 3. I literally make a disgusted face every time I see the weakside defender drop down now because I know what's going to happen.

How does one get to the point where they know it's the scheme versus how the players are executing a scheme properly or not?

I don't think Thibs taught Randle how to do the spinover. I don't think Thibs is teaching the weakside players to sag so much. I think the players are sagging too much and there is not enough recognition of who are decent shooters, where they are shooting from, etc.

I will admit I assume its a scheme issue. I assume that because everyone on the team have done it for the whole year. I was calling attention to this back when we lost to the Magic or Raptors early in the season. If this is not what Thibs wants them to do it's his job to get them to stop.

Clean wrote:

martin wrote:

Clean wrote:I really like our defense when not taking into account our 3pt defense. I don't think I can watch another game of this type of 3pt defense. I don't even blame the players for it. This is a scheme issue. Weakside defenders sag so deep into the paint for no reason EVERY SINGLE TIME. There is no reason for weakside defender to sag into the paint if they can't make a play on the ball. All it ever does is leave weakside shooters open for the 3 after a drive and kick. This is the main source of the open 3's we give up. It has been the same problem the whole year. Seriously go back and watch how many times just that alone gives up the open 3. I literally make a disgusted face every time I see the weakside defender drop down now because I know what's going to happen.

How does one get to the point where they know it's the scheme versus how the players are executing a scheme properly or not?

I don't think Thibs taught Randle how to do the spinover. I don't think Thibs is teaching the weakside players to sag so much. I think the players are sagging too much and there is not enough recognition of who are decent shooters, where they are shooting from, etc.

I will admit I assume its a scheme issue. I assume that because everyone on the team have done it for the whole year. I was calling attention to this back when we lost to the Magic or Raptors early in the season. If this is not what Thibs wants them to do it's his job to get them to stop.

I feel like a coach has only so many tools he can use to teach players via game play. So are we mad that Thibs pulls Obi when he makes a mistake that they have probably gone over with him a million times or do we want Thibs to pull the rookies more when they make weakside sag mistakes?

It's an incredibly hard balance. And rest assured, the coaching staff is seeing this waaaayyyy before us

Letting RJ Barrett call shots on offense for 36 minutes for the first time in Barrett's career, has raised a large RED Flag in my living room amongst fam and guest, on New Years eve.

Putting rookie McBride (aka Deuce-Deuce) in the starter lineup instead of Quickley should've raised a RED Flag to all Knicks fan!

In the Knicks 2021-22 season the only SAME-PAGE winning lineup on the Knicks roster are the lineup that WON Game 2 in the Knicks 1-4 postseason .. D.Rose, Quickley, Burks, Toppin, and Taj Gibson.
After Game 2 Thibs never put that lineup back on the court.
That same lineup, this time without D.Rose won a losing game for the Knicks the other night.
Did Thibs put that lineup on the court in the OKC game? NO! not once.

All throughout the Knicks 2021-22 regular season the majority of Knicks fans in every Knicks chat room been preaching the Knicks bench lineup perform way better than the Knicks starters.
True or False?
Julius Randle could not help the Starters poor offense or weak defense.
Why would the head-coach put a 2nd season player Obi Toppin, who been averaging 12 min of playing time the past two season, in a starter lineup of LOSERS?

Three days ago, In Wednesday game vs the (5-18) Pistons, coach Thibs favorite players Randle/Barrett performance gave the Pistons a 17 pt lead in the 3rd quarter.
Coach Thibs had to put the bench lineup (Quickley, Burks, Toppin, Taj, and rookie Deuce) into the game 3 min before the end of the 3rd quarter to stop the Pistons (high scorers Bey & Diallo) from increasing the Pistons lead over the Knicks.
Well, in 5 min the Knicks Same-Page Bench lineup went on a 19-5 run to tie the game at 71. Having 10 min remaining in the game with the score tied at 71, the Knicks Same-Page bench lineup went on a 23- 14 run over the Pistons to win the game.

In yesterday game vs OKC Thunder, coach Thibs never put the winning same-Page bench lineup of (Quickley, Burks Toppin, Taj, and rookie Deuce-Deuce) on the court once, after they won the previous previous game.
Which lead to an EMBARRASSED Knicks Loss 95-80.

Every Knicks fan by now should know 2nd season Obi Toppin's speed, and above the rim hops are a lethal scoring weapon in a lineup having D.Rose, Quickley, Burks, and Taj Gibson.
Coach Thibs put Obi Toppin in lineups with poor passing skills Fournier & Barrett, while Barrett & Fournier not clicking with any teammate in their lineup, but Barrett's calling all the shots on offense for 36 minutes, never giving rookie Deuce-Deuce the chance to play PG. So far Barrett's talent/skills as a SG has never meshed with any of our previous PG, and he don't look good in the backcourt with Kemba, D.Rose, Quickley, or Deuce-Deuce.
It may seem like I hate Barrett, but I don't, it's just Barrett, Kemba, and Fournier don't have any TEAM-Ballin skills on offense/defense.