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Bullish on Deuce
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blkexec
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3/25/2024  5:28 PM
Nalod wrote:
martin wrote:
EwingsGlass wrote:
martin wrote:
EwingsGlass wrote:
martin wrote:
DLeethal wrote:I've never seen a contract so good that I actually feel bad for the guy who signed it. Deuce is gonna be 29 before his next contract kicks in. He basically locked up his entire prime years for 1/3rd of his current worth. Great deal for Knicks, kind of sucks for Deuce.

haha 23yo and gonna be making in the $5M range and he wildly underpaid. Life sucks sometimes!

Opportunity cost. He could of turned it down and never got his shot.

Oh for sure. And no amount of money is gonna live up to playing near 48 minutes in 3 straight games and then starting to hear your name shouted out just as you are taking a 3 point shot. Dude living the dream.

Realistically (and I am adding facts that don't exist here), if he turned it down, do you think he is the one that ends up in Detroit?

I am sure it went down like this: "Deuce, we love you man, but we have a trade to Detroit OR you can sign this sweet sweet 3-year team friendly deal. We really want you to think it over for a long time but the trade deadline is in an hour and we all up against a wall. Do you want to stick to NY or go to a losing team? You got an hour, so get back to us! And remember we love you!!!"

More like his agent having pestered them for a commitment of time or some assurance he could be free to seek other opportunities. Its the benefit of being a 2nd round pick and exceeding. What this deal gives him is the confidence he has a contract for 3 more years and a value proposition from the team to give him minutes he earned.
He has fulfilled the teams and his schedule and now has IQ minutes to establish himself in the league. If he outgrows his role off the bench he'll be desired by other teams and knicks will be compensated as will he in time! Not a bad thing here.
Grimes will be behind Ivey, Cade, and sasser and perhaps others being drafted. He started the season as the incumbant starter in the worlds most famous arena!
He needs to polish up a few areas and find a team that can give him a path. I don't fault him for complaining. He is frustrated and should be. As was Drose. As was Evan. Its a tough business. Maybe his agent played the wrong hand.

Yes deuce was held out of trade talks but so was grimes. And grimes then had more value than deuce now. I believe as Nalod said towards the end, Grimes and his agent played the wrong hand. Grimes was untouchable as we saw in the d.Mitchel potential trade, until grimes went to the media and complained about Thibs, just like rose did and Fournier. Now look where all 3 are?

Deuce is like the young child watching all his siblings get in trouble. He just sits back and learn what not to do or say. And it’s paying off.

One thing about Thibs, when he likes you and trust you, it’s hard to break that bond. He’s very loyal (to a fault) until he’s blindsided by players leaking to media.

Deuce aka Marcus Smart with a jumper, aka lil OG, aka tank cause he’s built like a solid football player with a football players mentality. That’s huge when you are undersized as a 6’1 SG. But in today’s game, the 6’6 prototypical SGs are SFs now. And SFs play PF. Perfect timing for a player like deuce.

Then learning from JB on how to be an NBA PG is huge. Learning on the job while impacting wins. It’s a win win situation for everybody. Don’t forget he turns down good shots for great ones. Ultimate team player. Classic glue guy. Lil OG.

Born in Brooklyn, Raised in Queens, Lives in Maryland. The future is bright, I'm a Knicks fan for life!
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Knixkik
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3/25/2024  7:31 PM
I thought the Knicks didn’t really have any real prospects left but Deuce is one. He may have real value on the market given his contract. But obviously I’d love to see him remain a homegrown talent and end up as an elite backup guard. His ability to play alongside Brunson is a welcomed surprise and really critical for this team going forward.
Nalod
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3/26/2024  7:56 AM
blkexec wrote:
Nalod wrote:
martin wrote:
EwingsGlass wrote:
martin wrote:
EwingsGlass wrote:
martin wrote:
DLeethal wrote:I've never seen a contract so good that I actually feel bad for the guy who signed it. Deuce is gonna be 29 before his next contract kicks in. He basically locked up his entire prime years for 1/3rd of his current worth. Great deal for Knicks, kind of sucks for Deuce.

haha 23yo and gonna be making in the $5M range and he wildly underpaid. Life sucks sometimes!

Opportunity cost. He could of turned it down and never got his shot.

Oh for sure. And no amount of money is gonna live up to playing near 48 minutes in 3 straight games and then starting to hear your name shouted out just as you are taking a 3 point shot. Dude living the dream.

Realistically (and I am adding facts that don't exist here), if he turned it down, do you think he is the one that ends up in Detroit?

I am sure it went down like this: "Deuce, we love you man, but we have a trade to Detroit OR you can sign this sweet sweet 3-year team friendly deal. We really want you to think it over for a long time but the trade deadline is in an hour and we all up against a wall. Do you want to stick to NY or go to a losing team? You got an hour, so get back to us! And remember we love you!!!"

More like his agent having pestered them for a commitment of time or some assurance he could be free to seek other opportunities. Its the benefit of being a 2nd round pick and exceeding. What this deal gives him is the confidence he has a contract for 3 more years and a value proposition from the team to give him minutes he earned.
He has fulfilled the teams and his schedule and now has IQ minutes to establish himself in the league. If he outgrows his role off the bench he'll be desired by other teams and knicks will be compensated as will he in time! Not a bad thing here.
Grimes will be behind Ivey, Cade, and sasser and perhaps others being drafted. He started the season as the incumbant starter in the worlds most famous arena!
He needs to polish up a few areas and find a team that can give him a path. I don't fault him for complaining. He is frustrated and should be. As was Drose. As was Evan. Its a tough business. Maybe his agent played the wrong hand.

Yes deuce was held out of trade talks but so was grimes. And grimes then had more value than deuce now. I believe as Nalod said towards the end, Grimes and his agent played the wrong hand. Grimes was untouchable as we saw in the d.Mitchel potential trade, until grimes went to the media and complained about Thibs, just like rose did and Fournier. Now look where all 3 are?

Deuce is like the young child watching all his siblings get in trouble. He just sits back and learn what not to do or say. And it’s paying off.

One thing about Thibs, when he likes you and trust you, it’s hard to break that bond. He’s very loyal (to a fault) until he’s blindsided by players leaking to media.

Deuce aka Marcus Smart with a jumper, aka lil OG, aka tank cause he’s built like a solid football player with a football players mentality. That’s huge when you are undersized as a 6’1 SG. But in today’s game, the 6’6 prototypical SGs are SFs now. And SFs play PF. Perfect timing for a player like deuce.

Then learning from JB on how to be an NBA PG is huge. Learning on the job while impacting wins. It’s a win win situation for everybody. Don’t forget he turns down good shots for great ones. Ultimate team player. Classic glue guy. Lil OG.

Evan Fornier said nothing until the season was over. Not fair to point him as anything but professional. Maybe we got a little bit of “FrancoPHobia” or a euro thing against him? We americans like a villain.
He tried but his game did not mesh with others and what Thibs needed from him. Not a good signing for either except he got good money. Lets not forget he had a great season before he got here and we needed shooting!
After the season he expressed his frustration and wanted to be traded. AFTER THE SEASON!
He played well in the summer FIBA thing.
He was not traded.
Once the season started he did not say a thing. Nobody in the knicks organization ever said a bad thing about him but fans like to make him the bad guy? DRose is beloved and he as quoted saying “WHY THE FUCK ARE WE HERE” on the bench. OK, also frustrated about no playing time and perhaps wanted out. None of these guys were problems at all. WE loved Drose and really forgot his AWAL season were he left mid year with a bit of a mental exhaustion break down.

The emergence of Brunson and last year Grimes changed the minutes.
Im glad DDV got the per game record and will likley break the season long record. Not because EV complained, but because of DVV excellence.

newyorknewyork
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3/26/2024  10:14 AM
Knixkik wrote:I thought the Knicks didn’t really have any real prospects left but Deuce is one. He may have real value on the market given his contract. But obviously I’d love to see him remain a homegrown talent and end up as an elite backup guard. His ability to play alongside Brunson is a welcomed surprise and really critical for this team going forward.

No reason for Mcbride to not be a long term fixture with the club.

https://vote.nba.com/en Vote for your Knicks.
Nalod
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3/26/2024  11:56 AM
newyorknewyork wrote:
Knixkik wrote:I thought the Knicks didn’t really have any real prospects left but Deuce is one. He may have real value on the market given his contract. But obviously I’d love to see him remain a homegrown talent and end up as an elite backup guard. His ability to play alongside Brunson is a welcomed surprise and really critical for this team going forward.

No reason for Mcbride to not be a long term fixture with the club.

Unless he outgrows the role? By that, has "per 36" type starting numbers and wants a bigger role but is stuck behind Brunson?
For now he still has growth to do and we can simply enjoy his ascension for a while!
If so its a good problem. If not, we have a solid dude. Things are fluid. We suck at predicting the future but its sure fun!

Panos
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3/27/2024  9:56 PM
29 pts on 10 of 17, 9 of 14 from 3pt, 7 assists.
ALmost breaks the franchise record for 3pts 1 game after DDV broke it.
We have some serious shooting on this team right now.
martin
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3/27/2024  9:59 PM
Panos wrote:29 pts on 10 of 17, 9 of 14 from 3pt, 7 assists.
ALmost breaks the franchise record for 3pts 1 game after DDV broke it.
We have some serious shooting on this team right now.

While being a terror on D

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Panos
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3/27/2024  9:59 PM
Nalod wrote:
newyorknewyork wrote:
Knixkik wrote:I thought the Knicks didn’t really have any real prospects left but Deuce is one. He may have real value on the market given his contract. But obviously I’d love to see him remain a homegrown talent and end up as an elite backup guard. His ability to play alongside Brunson is a welcomed surprise and really critical for this team going forward.

No reason for Mcbride to not be a long term fixture with the club.

Unless he outgrows the role? By that, has "per 36" type starting numbers and wants a bigger role but is stuck behind Brunson?
For now he still has growth to do and we can simply enjoy his ascension for a while!
If so its a good problem. If not, we have a solid dude. Things are fluid. We suck at predicting the future but its sure fun!

His role is to be the third head of this 3-headed dog of nasty guard rotation: Brunson/DDV/McBride. Plenty of minutes available to him to excel.

Panos
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3/27/2024  10:00 PM
martin wrote:
Panos wrote:29 pts on 10 of 17, 9 of 14 from 3pt, 7 assists.
ALmost breaks the franchise record for 3pts 1 game after DDV broke it.
We have some serious shooting on this team right now.

While being a terror on D


Our little Miles is all grown up.

KnickDanger
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3/27/2024  10:13 PM
None of us saw this coming. Amazing and some compensation for the s#!tty injuries.
newyorknewyork
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3/27/2024  10:15 PM
Nalod wrote:
newyorknewyork wrote:
Knixkik wrote:I thought the Knicks didn’t really have any real prospects left but Deuce is one. He may have real value on the market given his contract. But obviously I’d love to see him remain a homegrown talent and end up as an elite backup guard. His ability to play alongside Brunson is a welcomed surprise and really critical for this team going forward.

No reason for Mcbride to not be a long term fixture with the club.

Unless he outgrows the role? By that, has "per 36" type starting numbers and wants a bigger role but is stuck behind Brunson?
For now he still has growth to do and we can simply enjoy his ascension for a while!
If so its a good problem. If not, we have a solid dude. Things are fluid. We suck at predicting the future but its sure fun!

In 3+ years when his contract is up and he's dead smack in his prime at 26/27. Odds are high he would be a player Knicks continue to move forward with as a core piece. Pay him well while giving him all the mins he can get as the 6th man PG/SG.

The way he can defend and shoot. The price for a team to take him from us....

https://vote.nba.com/en Vote for your Knicks.
martin
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3/27/2024  10:24 PM
When your season starting 3rd string PG is putting up these stat lines

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Clean
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3/27/2024  11:50 PM
KnickDanger wrote:None of us saw this coming. Amazing and some compensation for the s#!tty injuries.

none of us? I been fighting for him to get time from when he was destroying the G League. People were dismissing his shooting in the G League but I said the dimensions of the court are the same in the G league and the NBA. You can dismiss a lot of things from the G League but hitting shots is not one of them. The only difference is he was in rhythm since he got consistant minutes. The wonderful thing is all the receipts are in this very thread.

KnickDanger
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3/28/2024  12:14 AM
Clean wrote:
KnickDanger wrote:None of us saw this coming. Amazing and some compensation for the s#!tty injuries.

none of us? I been fighting for him to get time from when he was destroying the G League. People were dismissing his shooting in the G League but I said the dimensions of the court are the same in the G league and the NBA. You can dismiss a lot of things from the G League but hitting shots is not one of them. The only difference is he was in rhythm since he got consistant minutes. The wonderful thing is all the receipts are in this very thread.

You predicted this level of play? Good for you then.

blkexec
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3/28/2024  10:43 AM
KnickDanger wrote:
Clean wrote:
KnickDanger wrote:None of us saw this coming. Amazing and some compensation for the s#!tty injuries.

none of us? I been fighting for him to get time from when he was destroying the G League. People were dismissing his shooting in the G League but I said the dimensions of the court are the same in the G league and the NBA. You can dismiss a lot of things from the G League but hitting shots is not one of them. The only difference is he was in rhythm since he got consistant minutes. The wonderful thing is all the receipts are in this very thread.

You predicted this level of play? Good for you then.

Me and clean was some of the few that was fighting to get deuce more time.

I saw this coming due to work ethic and with more PT. Not with the spot mins he was getting before. He showed this level of play in the g league and before that in college. The main difference is his improvement as a 3pt sniper.

He was a mid range sniper who just needed some time in the lab and PT. Right now his individual work ethic, 3 yrs of NBA experience and more PT is the perfect storm.l and why we are seeing positive results.

But regardless of who said what first or who saw this coming. That means nothing at this point. What matters most is how will Thibs manage his PT once everybody is back and fully healthy??

To Thibs credit, he found him and hand picked him. So out of everyone Thibs gets all the credit (from acquisition to development).

Born in Brooklyn, Raised in Queens, Lives in Maryland. The future is bright, I'm a Knicks fan for life!
blkexec
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3/28/2024  11:03 AM
Nalod wrote:
blkexec wrote:
Nalod wrote:
martin wrote:
EwingsGlass wrote:
martin wrote:
EwingsGlass wrote:
martin wrote:
DLeethal wrote:I've never seen a contract so good that I actually feel bad for the guy who signed it. Deuce is gonna be 29 before his next contract kicks in. He basically locked up his entire prime years for 1/3rd of his current worth. Great deal for Knicks, kind of sucks for Deuce.

haha 23yo and gonna be making in the $5M range and he wildly underpaid. Life sucks sometimes!

Opportunity cost. He could of turned it down and never got his shot.

Oh for sure. And no amount of money is gonna live up to playing near 48 minutes in 3 straight games and then starting to hear your name shouted out just as you are taking a 3 point shot. Dude living the dream.

Realistically (and I am adding facts that don't exist here), if he turned it down, do you think he is the one that ends up in Detroit?

I am sure it went down like this: "Deuce, we love you man, but we have a trade to Detroit OR you can sign this sweet sweet 3-year team friendly deal. We really want you to think it over for a long time but the trade deadline is in an hour and we all up against a wall. Do you want to stick to NY or go to a losing team? You got an hour, so get back to us! And remember we love you!!!"

More like his agent having pestered them for a commitment of time or some assurance he could be free to seek other opportunities. Its the benefit of being a 2nd round pick and exceeding. What this deal gives him is the confidence he has a contract for 3 more years and a value proposition from the team to give him minutes he earned.
He has fulfilled the teams and his schedule and now has IQ minutes to establish himself in the league. If he outgrows his role off the bench he'll be desired by other teams and knicks will be compensated as will he in time! Not a bad thing here.
Grimes will be behind Ivey, Cade, and sasser and perhaps others being drafted. He started the season as the incumbant starter in the worlds most famous arena!
He needs to polish up a few areas and find a team that can give him a path. I don't fault him for complaining. He is frustrated and should be. As was Drose. As was Evan. Its a tough business. Maybe his agent played the wrong hand.

Yes deuce was held out of trade talks but so was grimes. And grimes then had more value than deuce now. I believe as Nalod said towards the end, Grimes and his agent played the wrong hand. Grimes was untouchable as we saw in the d.Mitchel potential trade, until grimes went to the media and complained about Thibs, just like rose did and Fournier. Now look where all 3 are?

Deuce is like the young child watching all his siblings get in trouble. He just sits back and learn what not to do or say. And it’s paying off.

One thing about Thibs, when he likes you and trust you, it’s hard to break that bond. He’s very loyal (to a fault) until he’s blindsided by players leaking to media.

Deuce aka Marcus Smart with a jumper, aka lil OG, aka tank cause he’s built like a solid football player with a football players mentality. That’s huge when you are undersized as a 6’1 SG. But in today’s game, the 6’6 prototypical SGs are SFs now. And SFs play PF. Perfect timing for a player like deuce.

Then learning from JB on how to be an NBA PG is huge. Learning on the job while impacting wins. It’s a win win situation for everybody. Don’t forget he turns down good shots for great ones. Ultimate team player. Classic glue guy. Lil OG.

Evan Fornier said nothing until the season was over. Not fair to point him as anything but professional. Maybe we got a little bit of “FrancoPHobia” or a euro thing against him? We americans like a villain.
He tried but his game did not mesh with others and what Thibs needed from him. Not a good signing for either except he got good money. Lets not forget he had a great season before he got here and we needed shooting!
After the season he expressed his frustration and wanted to be traded. AFTER THE SEASON!
He played well in the summer FIBA thing.
He was not traded.
Once the season started he did not say a thing. Nobody in the knicks organization ever said a bad thing about him but fans like to make him the bad guy? DRose is beloved and he as quoted saying “WHY THE FUCK ARE WE HERE” on the bench. OK, also frustrated about no playing time and perhaps wanted out. None of these guys were problems at all. WE loved Drose and really forgot his AWAL season were he left mid year with a bit of a mental exhaustion break down.

The emergence of Brunson and last year Grimes changed the minutes.
Im glad DDV got the per game record and will likley break the season long record. Not because EV complained, but because of DVV excellence.

Are you high?
Are you a EV lover that got their feelings hurt when EV was traded?
Let me copy what I said, which was nothing compared to my entire post. But I’ll play your game for now. Here’s my statement that got you feeling tight.

Grimes was untouchable as we saw in the d.Mitchel potential trade, until grimes went to the media and complained about Thibs, just like rose did and Fournier. Now look where all 3 are?

When someone like you gets upset when I state a fact, I look at you different man. What did I say in this statement above that has you bent over backwards? Just Google search yourself. EV complaints on Thibs and playing time. I’m not going to argue facts. So I don’t understand what u mean by “it’s not fare to call him out”. Huh?🤔 And why are you giving EV so much attention when my boy DEUCE is killing it. Answer that for me 🤔

Now do you want to talk about EV and why he should or shouldn’t be on the team? Go ahead. Start a thread. I’ll add my 2 cents. I’m ON RECORD saying I love 2 way players. EV is barely a ONE WAY player at this point. I don’t care if he’s the most professional player in the world, he’s barely a 1 WAY player.

As CP the franchise would say. “Put him in the trunk”

Born in Brooklyn, Raised in Queens, Lives in Maryland. The future is bright, I'm a Knicks fan for life!
KnickDanger
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3/28/2024  11:22 AM
blkexec wrote:
KnickDanger wrote:
Clean wrote:
KnickDanger wrote:None of us saw this coming. Amazing and some compensation for the s#!tty injuries.

none of us? I been fighting for him to get time from when he was destroying the G League. People were dismissing his shooting in the G League but I said the dimensions of the court are the same in the G league and the NBA. You can dismiss a lot of things from the G League but hitting shots is not one of them. The only difference is he was in rhythm since he got consistant minutes. The wonderful thing is all the receipts are in this very thread.

You predicted this level of play? Good for you then.

Me and clean was some of the few that was fighting to get deuce more time.

I saw this coming due to work ethic and with more PT. Not with the spot mins he was getting before. He showed this level of play in the g league and before that in college. The main difference is his improvement as a 3pt sniper.

He was a mid range sniper who just needed some time in the lab and PT. Right now his individual work ethic, 3 yrs of NBA experience and more PT is the perfect storm.l and why we are seeing positive results.

But regardless of who said what first or who saw this coming. That means nothing at this point. What matters most is how will Thibs manage his PT once everybody is back and fully healthy??

To Thibs credit, he found him and hand picked him. So out of everyone Thibs gets all the credit (from acquisition to development).


I salute then. My point was about his current level of play vs expectations. I too and others were pro Deuce and looked to see him get minutes and progress. Perhaps I should speak only for myself only in saying I had no expectation of him playing at this level which if sustained would put him in all star conversation.

And that play is a major contribution to “saving the season” with all the injuries. A great story. To those that predicted it again I tip my Knicks cap.

Panos
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3/28/2024  11:35 AM
blkexec wrote:
KnickDanger wrote:
Clean wrote:
KnickDanger wrote:None of us saw this coming. Amazing and some compensation for the s#!tty injuries.

none of us? I been fighting for him to get time from when he was destroying the G League. People were dismissing his shooting in the G League but I said the dimensions of the court are the same in the G league and the NBA. You can dismiss a lot of things from the G League but hitting shots is not one of them. The only difference is he was in rhythm since he got consistant minutes. The wonderful thing is all the receipts are in this very thread.

You predicted this level of play? Good for you then.

Me and clean was some of the few that was fighting to get deuce more time.

I saw this coming due to work ethic and with more PT. Not with the spot mins he was getting before. He showed this level of play in the g league and before that in college. The main difference is his improvement as a 3pt sniper.

He was a mid range sniper who just needed some time in the lab and PT. Right now his individual work ethic, 3 yrs of NBA experience and more PT is the perfect storm.l and why we are seeing positive results.

But regardless of who said what first or who saw this coming. That means nothing at this point. What matters most is how will Thibs manage his PT once everybody is back and fully healthy??

To Thibs credit, he found him and hand picked him. So out of everyone Thibs gets all the credit (from acquisition to development).

Are you forgetting the OP?

Panos
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3/28/2024  11:40 AM
Uptown wrote:
Panos wrote:I'll also say that I'm higher on McBride than Grimes.

Same

Grimes has a nice looking shot and he hustles on D but I think Deuce can impact the game in more ways

For a while I thought I might have to eat crow on this statement, but maybe it was right afterall.

Nalod
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3/28/2024  12:08 PM

Deuce tore up the Gleague then did not translate that to the NBA right away. It was not pretty at times.
Lots of guys can do that. I also said how big the big the gap between the NBA and Gleague is but Deuce defense is keeping him in the show and progressing.

Evan complained after the season was over publicly. Yes? He wanted to be traded. Yes?
Evan early in his first season was part of Randles "off" year. His timing on his cuts was off and he was messing him up early. I read this. It contributed to Randles turnovers. Not the sole reason mind you. Team started rough, then got better.
Evan's defense was uneven and when he focused on that his shooting fell. Evan has good hands on defense but its not how Thibs likes it. He tried.
Grimes took his job. Simple. I was happy because we grew a solution instead of trades.
I don't agree that Grimes was traded because he complained publicly. Its not cool to take things outside the house but if he was unhappy and there was market for him and we had needs then so be it. I don't recall anything about him being traded bacause of his verbal comments.

I know, its all nice that "My BOY Deuce" and its warm fuzzy's get to play out. Were you also calling out Thibs for "holding him back?" You know, like you his big brother or he your pet project? Or citing the Macri interview with one of his college coaches who said when drafted "deuce came out early and would have been a 1st rounder but was cool to learn from the bench and develop for the first couple of seasons". With that KNOWLEDGE Nalod gathered there was a plan and a process that Deuce had to go thru. Most players drafted have them so its not "exclusive". I don't get to hear about from coaches about it though. Perhaps you have special access?
After that interview I understood his path and not that he was being "held back".

Is it also a Nalodian statement that its ok to trade players to make room for others? Including IQ. I was not predicting it was Grimes or Deuce but "good teams move on from players and its best to grow internally". It logic, not fanciful "Im right, look at me".

I don't vilify players after they are traded. Yes, Im sticking what I believe is correct that EF was a good solid pro when here.
Its all fun to take stabs and try to predict things but fans mostly have no clue other than what we read. Logic and hope is what we got. If yo must, than I offer my congratulations on your dude Deuce on his break out! I love when he is interviewed when he gives glory to god and you for credit!

Bullish on Deuce

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