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Scattered uneven play too reliant on 3
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BRIGGS
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11/17/2021  10:25 PM
Game to game its just unknown inconsistent play. Impossible rotations because of the uneven play

How does this team take 50/89 3 point shots? Horrible shot management

move the ball drive the ball post the ball run some plays. STOP JACKING UP LAZY BAD 3SSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS

RIP Crushalot😞
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blkexec
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11/17/2021  10:40 PM
Randle donate x amount of money for each 3. 11 three pt attempts for Randle. Mmmmm
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ramtour420
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11/17/2021  11:00 PM
blkexec wrote:Randle donate x amount of money for each 3. 11 three pt attempts for Randle. Mmmmm

Yeah,like wtf. Charity is good and dandy and Randle is a giving man but it's should not dictate his shot selection

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Knixkik
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11/17/2021  11:20 PM
We still have a winning record. It’s been a mix of good wins and bad losses. The backcourt has struggled but we know Fournier and Walker will come around as the season goes on. Honestly considering the new pieces haven’t got going yet, things could be a whole lot worse. I think the goal was always to stumble to 45 wins but be more dangerous come playoff time. Obviously the goals haven’t changed. The starting 5 will get going at some point.
Jmpasq
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11/18/2021  5:42 AM
Knixkik wrote:We still have a winning record. It’s been a mix of good wins and bad losses. The backcourt has struggled but we know Fournier and Walker will come around as the season goes on. Honestly considering the new pieces haven’t got going yet, things could be a whole lot worse. I think the goal was always to stumble to 45 wins but be more dangerous come playoff time. Obviously the goals haven’t changed. The starting 5 will get going at some point.

They are going to be way under .500 after the next 10 games. I think after the Rockets game which they should win the team is going to implode. I think they could easily lose the next 8 or 9 games.

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Jmpasq
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11/18/2021  6:36 AM    LAST EDITED: 11/18/2021  6:47 AM
The problem is Randles play. This might be who Randle is as a player. Last year was the mirage. He just can't play with a crowd. In front of the home crowd, he tries to be the man. He holds the ball like he is Melo. He pounds the ball into the court and everyone just stands around. After 20 seconds someone will jack a terrible 3. He destroys team chemistry every time he steps on the floor. He is capable of better, we saw it last year.
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blkexec
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11/18/2021  6:57 AM
Jmpasq wrote:The problem is Randles play. This might be who Randle is as a player. Last year was the mirage. He just can't play with a crowd. In front of the home crowd he trys to be the man. He holds the ball like he is Kobe Bryant. He pounds the ball into the court. He destroys team chemistry every time he steps on the floor.

He’s learning how to be a #1 option. But naturally he’s a player that compliments the #1. The affects of the crowd and living up to expectations is not easy for average to below average teams. Last year nobody expected us to make the playoffs so there’s no pressure to win. That’s when we play better. And there was no crowd. Perfect combination for Randle and the avg to below avg knicks last year.

The difference between a solid #1 player or a true playoff team, is learning how to meet or exceed expectations. I said this last year as to why we was so good. And the challenge this year is now everybody is expecting us to play better and beat teams that are worse. No more hiding. Fans and the media are now expecting the knicks win. Especially against bad teams. Expecting Randle to lead a team that’s better on paper. Unfortunately when u fold under that kind of pressure, it tells you a lot about this team, and Randle. He’s not ready to lead a playoff team yet. And the knicks aren’t ready to leave that comfort space of nobody is expecting us to win.

Just look at the teams we beat so far. We was expected to lose. And the teams that beat us, we are expected to win. This is called an average to below average team tendencies.

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BMart
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11/18/2021  7:16 AM
I have never seen a team dynamic like this. We have 2 teams at the moment who play a completely different style of basketball. Continuing to let the starters play the 3rd and build a deficit and have the 2nd team come in to increase tempo, speed and effectiveness is a problem. Julius is starting to hear boos and that surely is not helping his confidence. He didn’t even look at the basket the last 4 minutes. When the second team is going on a run and the garden is getting loud, Randle is no where to be seen. He is on the end of bench hiding. I would rather lose with the second team, because at least they are fun to watch and it is team basketball with a lot of movement and energy. The lineup of Rose, IQ, Burka or RJ. Obi and any either Taj, Mitch, Noel is our best chance to win.
BRIGGS
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11/18/2021  7:57 AM
Our coach has to get a handle on things. Scattered line ups style of play and reliance on bad shots.

I STILL BELIEVE that one path to a better team is playing Obi more and inserting Grimes into the rotation.

Id start IQ at PG and give Grimes the bench minutes. For now Kemba out. Not anything on kemba accept his D Fourmier should be next on the minutes chopping block hes been awful.

The way to get back is through defense.BUT u CANNOT shoot 50 3s and think your D will be great--to many fast breaks off the 3 ball. We need to cap 3's at 33% max

RIP Crushalot😞
franco12
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11/18/2021  8:20 AM    LAST EDITED: 11/18/2021  8:21 AM
BRIGGS wrote:Our coach has to get a handle on things. Scattered line ups style of play and reliance on bad shots.

I STILL BELIEVE that one path to a better team is playing Obi more and inserting Grimes into the rotation.

Id start IQ at PG and give Grimes the bench minutes. For now Kemba out. Not anything on kemba accept his D Fourmier should be next on the minutes chopping block hes been awful.

The way to get back is through defense.BUT u CANNOT shoot 50 3s and think your D will be great--to many fast breaks off the 3 ball. We need to cap 3's at 33% max

What is that? Scattered line ups style of play? I thought we had been advocating for Thibs to mix things up on the line up - which he did last night.

Rose, IQ & OBI all have been bringing energy. That is needed desperately in the starting line up, desperately needed by Randle and RJ, the two stars of the starting line up that have been underperforming.

TO me, this seems like an EASY FIX. Put Rose, IQ & Obi into the starting line up with RJ & Randle.

And you make sure you ALWAYS have at least one of our energy guys out there.

Randle played 38 minutes a game last year, IQ can play 48 if you need to.

Fournier hasn't played in Q4, clearly that is a signing that could end up looking more horrible than it does now- we should have kept Ntilikina.

My bench would be Fournier or Kemba and Taj Gibson. If Fournier or Kemba struggle, let's go with Grimes - he has shown energy on both sides of the ball, something I haven't seen from Fournier or Kemba.

Noel and Mitch aren't healthy. Mitch is a gamer, but I continue to believe he is either completely horribly out of shape and banged up, or has some undiagnosed metabolic condition.

Go give Sims a shot if we need a big. It's not like Mitch is some skill cog of our offense that we would miss.

knicks1248
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11/18/2021  8:33 AM
Our biggest issue is there is no Glue guy, Last yr Bullock missed 7 games and we were 1-6 in those games.

Somebody mention this in another thread, who the hell is our glue guy in the starting unit, it really should be Mitch, but he can't pass, and he can't guard the perimeter.

Anybody can see that mitch belongs with the second unit, that group plays together, plays faster, moves the ball better, plays with the most energy.

Taj or Noel is a much better fit for the starting unit, but none of those guys can stay healthy enough to get anything accomplish.

Did we really just invest 21 mill in NOEL, the guy who's suing his X agent for loss wages.... WTF

ES
Vmart
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11/18/2021  8:54 AM
knicks1248 wrote:Our biggest issue is there is no Glue guy, Last yr Bullock missed 7 games and we were 1-6 in those games.

Somebody mention this in another thread, who the hell is our glue guy in the starting unit, it really should be Mitch, but he can't pass, and he can't guard the perimeter.

Anybody can see that mitch belongs with the second unit, that group plays together, plays faster, moves the ball better, plays with the most energy.

Taj or Noel is a much better fit for the starting unit, but none of those guys can stay healthy enough to get anything accomplish.

Did we really just invest 21 mill in NOEL, the guy who's suing his X agent for loss wages.... WTF

You are right. There is no glue guy. That is why they need to trade for Simmons. He is that guy who can make everyone better. For all his faults Payton was a glue guy. That kept Randle efficient, there were multiple glue guys on the team. Bullock, Payton, Frank. These guys aren’t looking to score every trip down, they were creating flow for the others. The defense has fallen as well. We need to get a guy who looks to pass, plays defense. I think Simmons is that guy. Lonzo was my ideal choice in free agency for me. But that ship has sailed. Would look to get Simmons in any trade scenario.

martin
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11/18/2021  9:09 AM
Vmart wrote:
knicks1248 wrote:Our biggest issue is there is no Glue guy, Last yr Bullock missed 7 games and we were 1-6 in those games.

Somebody mention this in another thread, who the hell is our glue guy in the starting unit, it really should be Mitch, but he can't pass, and he can't guard the perimeter.

Anybody can see that mitch belongs with the second unit, that group plays together, plays faster, moves the ball better, plays with the most energy.

Taj or Noel is a much better fit for the starting unit, but none of those guys can stay healthy enough to get anything accomplish.

Did we really just invest 21 mill in NOEL, the guy who's suing his X agent for loss wages.... WTF

You are right. There is no glue guy. That is why they need to trade for Simmons. He is that guy who can make everyone better. For all his faults Payton was a glue guy. That kept Randle efficient, there were multiple glue guys on the team. Bullock, Payton, Frank. These guys aren’t looking to score every trip down, they were creating flow for the others. The defense has fallen as well. We need to get a guy who looks to pass, plays defense. I think Simmons is that guy. Lonzo was my ideal choice in free agency for me. But that ship has sailed. Would look to get Simmons in any trade scenario.

Thing with Simmons is you need 4 shooters around him to be successful. So, is he a C in a small ball lineup? Can you live with him with Mitch/Noel?

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franco12
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11/18/2021  9:26 AM
martin wrote:
Vmart wrote:
knicks1248 wrote:Our biggest issue is there is no Glue guy, Last yr Bullock missed 7 games and we were 1-6 in those games.

Somebody mention this in another thread, who the hell is our glue guy in the starting unit, it really should be Mitch, but he can't pass, and he can't guard the perimeter.

Anybody can see that mitch belongs with the second unit, that group plays together, plays faster, moves the ball better, plays with the most energy.

Taj or Noel is a much better fit for the starting unit, but none of those guys can stay healthy enough to get anything accomplish.

Did we really just invest 21 mill in NOEL, the guy who's suing his X agent for loss wages.... WTF

You are right. There is no glue guy. That is why they need to trade for Simmons. He is that guy who can make everyone better. For all his faults Payton was a glue guy. That kept Randle efficient, there were multiple glue guys on the team. Bullock, Payton, Frank. These guys aren’t looking to score every trip down, they were creating flow for the others. The defense has fallen as well. We need to get a guy who looks to pass, plays defense. I think Simmons is that guy. Lonzo was my ideal choice in free agency for me. But that ship has sailed. Would look to get Simmons in any trade scenario.

Thing with Simmons is you need 4 shooters around him to be successful. So, is he a C in a small ball lineup? Can you live with him with Mitch/Noel?

I don't think it's glue we're missing, it's energy.

If we are worried that Randle has reverted because of pressure, expectations and fans, what the heck will happen to the fragile Ben Simmons?

knicks1248
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11/18/2021  9:32 AM    LAST EDITED: 11/18/2021  9:36 AM
martin wrote:
Vmart wrote:
knicks1248 wrote:Our biggest issue is there is no Glue guy, Last yr Bullock missed 7 games and we were 1-6 in those games.

Somebody mention this in another thread, who the hell is our glue guy in the starting unit, it really should be Mitch, but he can't pass, and he can't guard the perimeter.

Anybody can see that mitch belongs with the second unit, that group plays together, plays faster, moves the ball better, plays with the most energy.

Taj or Noel is a much better fit for the starting unit, but none of those guys can stay healthy enough to get anything accomplish.

Did we really just invest 21 mill in NOEL, the guy who's suing his X agent for loss wages.... WTF

You are right. There is no glue guy. That is why they need to trade for Simmons. He is that guy who can make everyone better. For all his faults Payton was a glue guy. That kept Randle efficient, there were multiple glue guys on the team. Bullock, Payton, Frank. These guys aren’t looking to score every trip down, they were creating flow for the others. The defense has fallen as well. We need to get a guy who looks to pass, plays defense. I think Simmons is that guy. Lonzo was my ideal choice in free agency for me. But that ship has sailed. Would look to get Simmons in any trade scenario.

Thing with Simmons is you need 4 shooters around him to be successful. So, is he a C in a small ball lineup? Can you live with him with Mitch/Noel?

I'm almost certain Mitch, Rose and RJ would be part of that trade, besides that we have no one else the sixers would be remotely interested in.

Leon said the knicks will still look to be aggressive on the trade front, so I'm thinking some kind of trade will happen before the deadline

On another note, this season bullock is shoot 37%fg, 31% 3pt and has taken just 4 FT attempts the entire season

ES
blkexec
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11/18/2021  11:42 AM
knicks1248 wrote:Our biggest issue is there is no Glue guy, Last yr Bullock missed 7 games and we were 1-6 in those games.

Somebody mention this in another thread, who the hell is our glue guy in the starting unit, it really should be Mitch, but he can't pass, and he can't guard the perimeter.

Anybody can see that mitch belongs with the second unit, that group plays together, plays faster, moves the ball better, plays with the most energy.

Taj or Noel is a much better fit for the starting unit, but none of those guys can stay healthy enough to get anything accomplish.

Did we really just invest 21 mill in NOEL, the guy who's suing his X agent for loss wages.... WTF

Yes, I mentioned this before so it was probably me. But regardless who said it, it's a fact. You can't have 4 players in your starting unit, all looking to get their own, and not willing to do the little things that helps teams win. Fournier was not paid to be a glue guy. In this scenario, our glue guy would've been at the PG spot, since we already gave Fournier, Randle and next RJ a big contract. Mitch is perfect with these guys because he doesn't need the ball in impact the game. Now you may not like Mitch, which is fine. But next is the PG spot where someone like Ball would've been perfect, because he doesn't need to score the ball, because he understands his role as a defensive specialist and ball mover / 3pt shooter. If Kemba and Fournier are not scoring the ball, they are a walking liability. They are not locking up anybody right now. This is also why Randle hasn't look too good lately. If he's not scoring, what is he doing to impact the game? At least Mitch is grabing rebounds and protecting the rim. Noel and Gibson are the same thing. They are glue guys. We need that one more, McBride type of player who enjoys locking up their man and playing scrappy type defense, while spreading the floor on offense with his shooting. This team needs to find a Bullock replacement and Burks is the closest we have right now.

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blkexec
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11/18/2021  11:45 AM
franco12 wrote:
martin wrote:
Vmart wrote:
knicks1248 wrote:Our biggest issue is there is no Glue guy, Last yr Bullock missed 7 games and we were 1-6 in those games.

Somebody mention this in another thread, who the hell is our glue guy in the starting unit, it really should be Mitch, but he can't pass, and he can't guard the perimeter.

Anybody can see that mitch belongs with the second unit, that group plays together, plays faster, moves the ball better, plays with the most energy.

Taj or Noel is a much better fit for the starting unit, but none of those guys can stay healthy enough to get anything accomplish.

Did we really just invest 21 mill in NOEL, the guy who's suing his X agent for loss wages.... WTF

You are right. There is no glue guy. That is why they need to trade for Simmons. He is that guy who can make everyone better. For all his faults Payton was a glue guy. That kept Randle efficient, there were multiple glue guys on the team. Bullock, Payton, Frank. These guys aren’t looking to score every trip down, they were creating flow for the others. The defense has fallen as well. We need to get a guy who looks to pass, plays defense. I think Simmons is that guy. Lonzo was my ideal choice in free agency for me. But that ship has sailed. Would look to get Simmons in any trade scenario.

Thing with Simmons is you need 4 shooters around him to be successful. So, is he a C in a small ball lineup? Can you live with him with Mitch/Noel?

I don't think it's glue we're missing, it's energy.

If we are worried that Randle has reverted because of pressure, expectations and fans, what the heck will happen to the fragile Ben Simmons?

What you see with Randle is what you get. Ben can't shoot so that's a bad mix since we already have Mitch, Noel and Gibson who cant shoot. The paint would be too crowded and the other 3 players would get double team if 1 or 2 of them gets hot. To me a glue guy and a energy guy is the same thing. Not caught up in titles. Just someone who can impact the game, without the need to over dribble or score a bunch of points.

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Knixkik
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11/18/2021  11:46 AM
Jmpasq wrote:
Knixkik wrote:We still have a winning record. It’s been a mix of good wins and bad losses. The backcourt has struggled but we know Fournier and Walker will come around as the season goes on. Honestly considering the new pieces haven’t got going yet, things could be a whole lot worse. I think the goal was always to stumble to 45 wins but be more dangerous come playoff time. Obviously the goals haven’t changed. The starting 5 will get going at some point.

They are going to be way under .500 after the next 10 games. I think after the Rockets game which they should win the team is going to implode. I think they could easily lose the next 8 or 9 games.

Easy to say that after a loss like this. Life of being a Knicks fan. There will be a ton of good wins and bad losses throughout the year and we can’t get too hung up on any of them.

blkexec
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11/18/2021  11:50 AM
martin wrote:
Vmart wrote:
knicks1248 wrote:Our biggest issue is there is no Glue guy, Last yr Bullock missed 7 games and we were 1-6 in those games.

Somebody mention this in another thread, who the hell is our glue guy in the starting unit, it really should be Mitch, but he can't pass, and he can't guard the perimeter.

Anybody can see that mitch belongs with the second unit, that group plays together, plays faster, moves the ball better, plays with the most energy.

Taj or Noel is a much better fit for the starting unit, but none of those guys can stay healthy enough to get anything accomplish.

Did we really just invest 21 mill in NOEL, the guy who's suing his X agent for loss wages.... WTF

You are right. There is no glue guy. That is why they need to trade for Simmons. He is that guy who can make everyone better. For all his faults Payton was a glue guy. That kept Randle efficient, there were multiple glue guys on the team. Bullock, Payton, Frank. These guys aren’t looking to score every trip down, they were creating flow for the others. The defense has fallen as well. We need to get a guy who looks to pass, plays defense. I think Simmons is that guy. Lonzo was my ideal choice in free agency for me. But that ship has sailed. Would look to get Simmons in any trade scenario.

Thing with Simmons is you need 4 shooters around him to be successful. So, is he a C in a small ball lineup? Can you live with him with Mitch/Noel?

Agree....it works if Simmons plays center. But as good as Simmons is on defense, he's not a rim protector like Mitch. So the rim would be wide open. Switch out Mitch and input Turner or some other center who can shoot and you have a winning team. But Simmons is tricky to build around. I feel the same way with Randle. He's not a shooter, but he puts up 11 shoot attempts from 3? At least RJ attacks the rim and plays defense. RJ brings energy. So when his shot isn't falling, it's not a total hit because he does other things well.

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Vmart
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11/18/2021  12:54 PM
martin wrote:
Vmart wrote:
knicks1248 wrote:Our biggest issue is there is no Glue guy, Last yr Bullock missed 7 games and we were 1-6 in those games.

Somebody mention this in another thread, who the hell is our glue guy in the starting unit, it really should be Mitch, but he can't pass, and he can't guard the perimeter.

Anybody can see that mitch belongs with the second unit, that group plays together, plays faster, moves the ball better, plays with the most energy.

Taj or Noel is a much better fit for the starting unit, but none of those guys can stay healthy enough to get anything accomplish.

Did we really just invest 21 mill in NOEL, the guy who's suing his X agent for loss wages.... WTF

You are right. There is no glue guy. That is why they need to trade for Simmons. He is that guy who can make everyone better. For all his faults Payton was a glue guy. That kept Randle efficient, there were multiple glue guys on the team. Bullock, Payton, Frank. These guys aren’t looking to score every trip down, they were creating flow for the others. The defense has fallen as well. We need to get a guy who looks to pass, plays defense. I think Simmons is that guy. Lonzo was my ideal choice in free agency for me. But that ship has sailed. Would look to get Simmons in any trade scenario.

Thing with Simmons is you need 4 shooters around him to be successful. So, is he a C in a small ball lineup? Can you live with him with Mitch/Noel?

Let’s not make him out to be a non scorer. He does average 15-17 points a game. What Simmons does is allow for Quickly, to play. The line up consists of shooters and decent passers on the floor. What people for get is he a really good defensive player as well.

Scattered uneven play too reliant on 3

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