I have read that since few games seperated after the 3rd seed there is strong possibity we fall. Not because we did not improve but that others did. It might be said if the season lasted 82 games we could have fallen to the 6th spot. Fact is were were the 4th seed but was one and done losing 4-1 to the 5th seed who was surging. It was still a great season!!

WE are better on paper. I expect randle to still improve but incrementally not as big a jump. RJ is the Wild Card as his ceiling is still to be determined. Obi and IQ had proper off seasons. But so has every rookie from last year. We have two good ones though!!!! I can see IQ in the dog house a bit as Thibs might have raised the bar on him and we are deeper. If he rises the the challange thats a win for all. Frank got the bar raised and he is no longer a knick. OBI has his own standards to fill as Randles understudy.
I don’t expect Grimes and McBride to see much time early on unless they kill it. We are developing but playing time is based on real contributions not potential. There will be opportunities. really all but Pinson and Harper got chances.
Knox? We’ll see………….

Nalod wrote:Jackson and turner are mostly fan discussions. I Have not see any smoke from beat reporters. Bloggers are like us but with better skills. If either of those deals fall to reality we improve but depth is expendable. Other than Jaren Jackson Dad being a knicks coach there is little substance to the rumors. I’d go no higher than Mitch and a protected to 15 1st round pick. Ok, throw in Knox for salary MItch to Indy makes sense if his salary after this year is resonable but absorbing his 20mil is an issue. Mitch and Knox for him is reaonable.

I have read that since few games seperated after the 3rd seed there is strong possibity we fall. Not because we did not improve but that others did. It might be said if the season lasted 82 games we could have fallen to the 6th spot. Fact is were were the 4th seed but was one and done losing 4-1 to the 5th seed who was surging. It was still a great season!!

WE are better on paper. I expect randle to still improve but incrementally not as big a jump. RJ is the Wild Card as his ceiling is still to be determined. Obi and IQ had proper off seasons. But so has every rookie from last year. We have two good ones though!!!! I can see IQ in the dog house a bit as Thibs might have raised the bar on him and we are deeper. If he rises the the challange thats a win for all. Frank got the bar raised and he is no longer a knick. OBI has his own standards to fill as Randles understudy.
I don’t expect Grimes and McBride to see much time early on unless they kill it. We are developing but playing time is based on real contributions not potential. There will be opportunities. really all but Pinson and Harper got chances.
Knox? We’ll see………….

Turner and Jackson have both been discussed by beat writers. Apparently the Knicks were serious about Turner (coming from Indy reporter) and Marc berman who has been very accurate this year says there is noise around Jackson. It all likely amounts to nothing. Most improvements will come internally. If I look at an area of improvement in the top 10, it would be eventually replacing Burks with an elite defensive wing. Otherwise I think we are pretty locked in until a star comes along.

Experience
Leadership
Talent
Coaching
Chemistry
Luck

I think if you have that covered you should be good

LivingLegend wrote:

Knixkik wrote:Starters: Kemba, Barrett, Fournier, Randle, Robinson
Rotation: Rose, IQ, Burks, Toppin, Noel
Situational/Developmental: McBride, Grimes, Gibson

Seems these 13 are locked in as commitments on the roster. I can’t remember the last time the Knicks had a rotation going into the season that was so set in stone. Typically there’s many unknowns, but the hierarchy on the roster seems so laid out.

My question is, where’s the potential to upgrade on this group besides an obvious star? Turner and Jaren Jackson are discussed with Mitch's contract being the last question mark, but otherwise I don’t see opportunity anywhere in the rotation. Is it just as simple as this being the group until some combination of RJ, IQ, and Toppin, and picks combined with the contracts of Fournier and/or Burks can be turned into a superstar and then those spots in the rotation are back-filled by McBride and Grimes? I always like to think what the next step is and seems like we are at the point where it’s star or bust and there’s no other true gaps to fill.

If we have enough to get a superstar than we have enough to get virtually anybody who becomes available so what’s the problem?

No problem at all. The question is are there any other moves to make to upgrade this rotation before a star becomes available ? Any implied problem you see is a good problem to have.

Knixkik wrote:

Nalod wrote:Jackson and turner are mostly fan discussions. I Have not see any smoke from beat reporters. Bloggers are like us but with better skills. If either of those deals fall to reality we improve but depth is expendable. Other than Jaren Jackson Dad being a knicks coach there is little substance to the rumors. I’d go no higher than Mitch and a protected to 15 1st round pick. Ok, throw in Knox for salary MItch to Indy makes sense if his salary after this year is resonable but absorbing his 20mil is an issue. Mitch and Knox for him is reaonable.

I have read that since few games seperated after the 3rd seed there is strong possibity we fall. Not because we did not improve but that others did. It might be said if the season lasted 82 games we could have fallen to the 6th spot. Fact is were were the 4th seed but was one and done losing 4-1 to the 5th seed who was surging. It was still a great season!!

WE are better on paper. I expect randle to still improve but incrementally not as big a jump. RJ is the Wild Card as his ceiling is still to be determined. Obi and IQ had proper off seasons. But so has every rookie from last year. We have two good ones though!!!! I can see IQ in the dog house a bit as Thibs might have raised the bar on him and we are deeper. If he rises the the challange thats a win for all. Frank got the bar raised and he is no longer a knick. OBI has his own standards to fill as Randles understudy.
I don’t expect Grimes and McBride to see much time early on unless they kill it. We are developing but playing time is based on real contributions not potential. There will be opportunities. really all but Pinson and Harper got chances.
Knox? We’ll see………….

Turner and Jackson have both been discussed by beat writers. Apparently the Knicks were serious about Turner (coming from Indy reporter) and Marc berman who has been very accurate this year says there is noise around Jackson. It all likely amounts to nothing. Most improvements will come internally. If I look at an area of improvement in the top 10, it would be eventually replacing Burks with an elite defensive wing. Otherwise I think we are pretty locked in until a star comes along.

Hey, I don’t catch everything. I know things get implied but never saw anything heavy in a “Discussion”, but as I have said “Im not in the room”.
I am totally down with what we are doing by having marketable contracts for reasonably desirable players.
As for trades, Im ok with most scenarios so long as RJ is not an allstar in two years and we are not truly contending.

Lakers built their current roster from the draft. The core of gettng AD was from assets via the draft. That we wiffed on Knox and Frank has hurt us.
Bucks, Giannis via draft.
ATL, Suns….Draft.
PHilly…… as much as the process yielded little, it was enough to snag Embiid.
Nets? Starphuch supreme but they needed to develope a respectable core which got them over .500 and enough to get harden with deft cap space.

For now Randle was a god send and if he holds up as either on court or as trade fodder. RJ upside is still a guess. We need OBI or IQ to exceed draft position. OBI can be a Brandon Ingrm type trade value?
Turner would fit very nice on this roster. Jackson could be a play if we are willing to accept a financial risk due to his physical outlook that Memphis is not. He has to be willing to walk though. Not that he does, but its the threat that creates leverage to get him here vs. any other team.
As a fan it seems Leon and Co. are do try many things but are looking for a deal. Did we try to snag Haywood for 100mil when he went for 120? Perhaps.
Success is when you assaign your own value and then accomplish. If another wants to pay more, so be it.
Same for the draft. We get our guys and get at a low level pick up another pick. Do that enough we might then tip the balance of a trade with that extra asset. Its a process that only hindsight tells us if it worked.

EwingsGlass wrote:Going in to training camp, you have a two way slot open and a bit of a battle for last roster spot. After that it’s a minutes battle - guys trying to take each other’s minutes.

Most improvement on the current roster will come through team development and player development and the MLE or other roster exceptions.

This team has better floor spacing, so at this point all the Elf/Barrett same space arguments I made last season as an impediment to Barrett’s growth.

This year, the starting 5 is well balanced and my question is about shot allocation in the starting 5. Last year this team had a propensity to settle for 18 foot jumpers which are not that efficient. The question is whether that was a byproduct of limited outside shooting or a weakness in the offensive set?

With Kemba on the court with Randle, you are wasting Kemba if he is not the primary ball handler. At which point the question will be how Randle reacts to not having the ball coming through him immediately.

In short, our downside risk is that this roster fails to establish its new identity. Our upside is that the players added have better fundamental skills than last years roster. And our youth may have higher upside potential than our re-signed core. But the roster appears to be locked for 2 years as you say, barring a trade.

My final thought is who’s minutes are McBride/Grimes going to take. I have McBride chasing Quickley and Grimes chasing Burks.

I can also imagine Grimes taking SG minutes from IQ, since he's bigger than McBride and doesn't need as much space to get his shot off as IQ.

BRIGGS wrote:I think there is a possibility Grimes can be a star shooter in the NBA. Id give him time to develop.

Our best shot at a home grown superstar is RJ. His shooting percentages went up dramatically last year (thanks to Fiz leaving). If he can continue to improve he could be our own home grown face of the nba

Will Luka get sick of Dallas and pull a KP

Lillard

Booker

Trae