KnickDanger wrote:I do think the price has gone up, but wasn’t the situation that Melo was an UFA but we did a sign and trade to accommodate a higher salary? Don’t know if that makes a difference…..

Melo was going to make the max regardless so I don’t think that’s relevant. Any team in the league was going to pay a player like Melo whatever he could make as he was still just coming into his prime. Trade wise it can be somewhat comparable to Harden who is a flawed but all time offensive player similar to melo. But again Harden is in his 30s. Thinking back it’s amazing Melo was only 26 at the time and rarely does a star become available that young. For arguments sake, Randle is the same age and can probably get back a return similar to what we traded for Melo, and he’s far less proven at this point than Melo was.

jrodmc wrote:Amazing what 10 years and some perspective will do for the "We got raped in the Melo trade" dysfunction.

Gallo was out for an entire season before he even started, and was at one time, in the top 10 of the worst contracts list in the NBA. Not quite exactly projected to be what RJ was and is. Same for Mozgov, after the howling and whining we listened to for years after the trade. Where is he now? That's right, out of the league. Felton we got back for nothing, which was about right. The Mayor...unspectacular is probably being kind.

Not to defend anything the FO did at that time, but get a #1 for Fields? Hindsight's wonderful, but what FO was giving you a first rounder for Landry ParabolaJumper Fields, who had regressed slightly after his rookie season? And then trade Lin when he's hurt after Linsanity? I think that would have been a bit too gutsy of a move given the NYC media hysteria. Better move IMHO would have been to match his 'ridiculous contract' and keep him.

The trade was nowhere near what the Knick hating media made it out to be. We were getting one of the NBA’s best players at the age of 28 for a bunch of marginal role players and picks

I just wish Melo and Lin could have gotten along better so he could have stuck around. We never win a championship but at least it would have been to watch a few more seasons instead of the window totally closing in 2014

Philc1 wrote:

jrodmc wrote:Amazing what 10 years and some perspective will do for the "We got raped in the Melo trade" dysfunction.

Gallo was out for an entire season before he even started, and was at one time, in the top 10 of the worst contracts list in the NBA. Not quite exactly projected to be what RJ was and is. Same for Mozgov, after the howling and whining we listened to for years after the trade. Where is he now? That's right, out of the league. Felton we got back for nothing, which was about right. The Mayor...unspectacular is probably being kind.

Not to defend anything the FO did at that time, but get a #1 for Fields? Hindsight's wonderful, but what FO was giving you a first rounder for Landry ParabolaJumper Fields, who had regressed slightly after his rookie season? And then trade Lin when he's hurt after Linsanity? I think that would have been a bit too gutsy of a move given the NYC media hysteria. Better move IMHO would have been to match his 'ridiculous contract' and keep him.

The trade was nowhere near what the Knick hating media made it out to be. We were getting one of the NBA’s best players at the age of 28 for a bunch of marginal role players and picks

I just wish Melo and Lin could have gotten along better so he could have stuck around. We never win a championship but at least it would have been to watch a few more seasons instead of the window totally closing in 2014

Carmelo was only 26 at the time of the trade. As far as time has passed the deal was a steal for the Knicks when you look at what similar players are going for now.

Nalod wrote:

jrodmc wrote:Amazing what 10 years and some perspective will do for the "We got raped in the Melo trade" dysfunction.

Gallo was out for an entire season before he even started, and was at one time, in the top 10 of the worst contracts list in the NBA. Not quite exactly projected to be what RJ was and is. Same for Mozgov, after the howling and whining we listened to for years after the trade. Where is he now? That's right, out of the league. Felton we got back for nothing, which was about right. The Mayor...unspectacular is probably being kind.

Not to defend anything the FO did at that time, but get a #1 for Fields? Hindsight's wonderful, but what FO was giving you a first rounder for Landry ParabolaJumper Fields, who had regressed slightly after his rookie season? And then trade Lin when he's hurt after Linsanity? I think that would have been a bit too gutsy of a move given the NYC media hysteria. Better move IMHO would have been to match his 'ridiculous contract' and keep him.

I think the OP thinks we did not pay then what Melo or a star costs now in this market.
Calm. Nobody was dissing the trade or Melo.

Landry was a second rounder who was a free agent and Toronto paid way up for him then he got hurt.
Perhaps his ceiling was Larry Shamet. Landry was better looking. Perhaps knicks thought they'd resign him until we got blown out of the water.
Lin was a free agent and again, Rockets really came in with a crazy offer. Both scenarios even in hindsight the knicks played it OK.

The market for fields was well known. Not trading him and letting him go for nothing was a mistake. Similar to if New Orleans let’s Ball walk for nothing this summer they should have grabbed a 1st for him.

As for the trade, people hated it then and 5 years later still hated it. It was a long-standing argument on this forum and I think looking back whether we won or lost the trade is irrelevant but time will tell us we got a young superstar for 50 cents on the dollar and just didn’t capitalize on it.

Age was the biggest factor here. Melo was 26 and a top 10 player and we got him for some solid players, 1 first round pick and 1 pick swap.

Knixkik wrote:What’s the asking price for a star player today ? A significant young prospect and 4-5 firsts? Now we are talking 10 years ago but Knicks got Carmelo essentially for Gallinari, Chandler, Mozgov, Felton, 1 first round pick and 1 pick swap. Carmelo was a borderline top 10 player and only 26 years old at the time. Gallinari is viewed probably as a slightly lesser prospect than Barrett, someone who was going to be good for a long time but lacked star power. Chandler, Felton and Mozgov were solid, unspectacular players. Knicks held onto Fields, who at the time was viewed as a long term starting SG on a good team. When looking at Lillard, he’s 4 years older than Melo was at the time of the trade and will demand 4-5 firsts along with Barrett and some. Similar to Melo, he has led many teams into the playoffs but not far enough. Beal matches Melo closer in age, and will cost a similar to Lillard (maybe slightly less) cost but is less proven as a star. Knicks made 3 huge mistakes following the Melo trade. 1: rushing the process by amnestying Billups 2: getting no value for Fields and 3: getting no value for Lin. If the front office had the foresight to see fields and Lin walking , they could have traded each for a 1st round pick, getting back the picks they lost for Melo and some. At the time 2 picks like that could be used in trade to land another significant piece. I just find it interesting how there’s still a perception out there that we gave a lot up for Melo, but 10 years later we are talking about a deal for Lillard and Beal costing twice as much most likely. 10 years later the Melo deal looks like a steal from that point of view. The problem was wasting the opportunity.

Look at Paul George

June 24, 2010: Drafted by the Indiana Pacers in the 1st round (10th pick) of the 2010 NBA Draft.

July 6, 2017: Traded by the Indiana Pacers to the Oklahoma City Thunder for Victor Oladipo and Domantas Sabonis.

July 6, 2018: Signed as a free agent with the Oklahoma City Thunder.

July 10, 2019: Traded by the Oklahoma City Thunder to the Los Angeles Clippers for Danilo Gallinari, Shai Gilgeous-Alexander, a 2021 1st round draft pick, a 2022 1st round draft pick, a 2023 1st round draft pick, a 2023 1st round draft pick, a 2024 1st round draft pick, a 2025 1st round draft pick and a 2026 1st round draft pick. (2021 first-round pick is MIA's unprotected pick.) (2023 first-round pick is MIA's pick, top-14 protected.) (Right to swap with LAC.) (Right to swap with LAC.)

December 10, 2020: Signed a contract extension with the Los Angeles Clippers

The first trade, the Pacers risked losing George in FA for nothing. Sabonis and Dipo were not the players then that they are today. It was a rental trade for a rental price

The second trade, the Clippers knew it was a package deal to get Leonard to sign as an UFA. Part of the trade was a handshake agreement to sign a long term extension.

The Knicks didn't get much for Zinger because his rookie deal was ending and he could simply say he wouldn't resign with Teams X or Y or Z and turn any trade into a rental price.

Same for Melo leaving Denver. The Nuggets had zero leverage. Walsh offered Wilson Chandler and a first round pick and left it there. The trade was not for Melo, but for Melo's valuable full Bird Rights. Only then did Dolan jump in and offer way more than needed. If Dolan stayed out, eventually the Nuggets would have blinked. Get something or get nothing.

Did the Knicks pay too much for Melo.

THEY PAID TOO MUCH FOR A RENTAL SITUATION ( even if Melo was a lock to resign) New York and Walsh had all the leverage. So yes, in that perspective, it was a bad trade.

Someone is having a moving sale and they are going to move in two days. They need to leave the house and move to another state. You want to buy their washer and dryer and no one else is making an offer. Who has the leverage? You can walk away and lose nothing. They however have to choose between dragging it across state lines or paying to have it disposed of or losing any value at all by leaving it for the new owners. I'm sure many of you have seen this at garage sales all your life. Power racks. Big screen TVs. Heavy gym equipment. Jet skis. Lawnmowers. Couches. Cabinet dresses. Bed frames. They can't move it easy and it's better to sell it. Fast and dirty and cheap if needed.

Lillard's value also rests, not just in his age, but his contract status

https://www.spotrac.com/nba/portland-trail-blazers/damian-lillard-10814/

You have him locked in for, at minimum, three seasons, and there's close to no reason for him to void the 4th unless he wants to skirt the Over 38 Rule for one last big deal.

He's a future locked in HOFer who spaces the floor and allows you to build your marketing around one superstar player, albeit an older one. Lillard as a Knick raises the entire franchise's valuation, even moreso than just being NY signature team.

You are taking two different situations then robbing them of all context to justify overpaying for a rental when NY had ALL the leverage.

You: "She's got the BIGGEST sweater puppies I've ever seen in my life!" ( No context)

Me: "Dude, she's 450 pounds and literally limps just enough to throw her weight to move forward. And not into a salad bar. She's gonna eat like the food is running from her. And let's be honest. It won't get that far." ( Actual context. Lettuce not ignore the actual context here in reality. Clue in, no one is eating lettuce in this scenario. They are gulping sour cream like it was water. )

How you get first round picks in trades for Lin and/or Fields baffles me. I'd like to see you break that down for all of us.