wargames wrote:

Knixkik wrote:We need a star game-changing wing. DeRozan is a rare one that’s on the market. He’s only 31 and is very durable. The best ability is availability as they say. His style of play and overall health makes him a low-risk as far as his next contract losing value. He should hold up fine. The lack of shooting can be manageable on our team if we also add a high volume outside shooting PG. Lowry, Ball, Nunn or Graham all make a high amount of threes and can play off the ball. Randle and Barrett have become good shooters so it’s workable. DeRozan got his numbers and was an impact player in San Antonio despite not being paired with any other big scorers and having no shooting at all in the lineup. With the Knicks we have shooters and another elite scorer in Randle. Randle will recover from the playoffs but it shows we need a guy who can just go out and score. DeRozan can do that. He can get to the line and draw defenders so Randle sees single coverage. DeRozan will require a big contract but no trade will be needed and we would be adding a player who doesn’t miss time. He would be a difference maker, especially while adding a strong perimeter threat at PG.

C Robinson
F Randle
F DeRozan
G Barrett
G Ball/Nunn/Lowry/Graham

Bench Gibson Toppin Bullock Quickley Rose picks

The shooting would be really, really, really if a team shuts the PG down in your plan. You would need someone of the caliber of Dame to be effective through the double teams that would be sent their way.

You have 2 players in Randle and Barrett who made 2 threes a game and shot it at 40+ %. Add a PG who also makes threes at a high rate. That gives you 3 guys who make 2+ a night at 38% or better in your lineup. How many teams have better than that ?

How does he fit our offense tho? He duplicates ( triplicates) what we already have in Randle and RJ. He needs the ball to attack the hoop. RJ and Randle would be reduced to spot up 3 point shooters because DeRozan cannot make a 3 to save his life. That's the best case scenario and I don't like it already. In the worst case scenario they would take turns ISOing at the basket. I am sick and tired of the lack of offensive plays to keep the defense guessing. Like the rest of the league is using PnR to do that. We have great roll men, our teams best 4 players, our future ( Randle, RJ, Obi and Mitch) would give the league nightmares as we could always single out the worst defender and PnR him to death. DeRozan doesn't give us that. Don't forget that he is playing for an offense that features off the ball movement, cuts and screens to get ppl easy shots. If he came here his playmaking would take a dip. No thanks

Knixkik wrote:We need a star game-changing wing. DeRozan is a rare one that’s on the market. He’s only 31 and is very durable. The best ability is availability as they say. His style of play and overall health makes him a low-risk as far as his next contract losing value. He should hold up fine. ..... He can get to the line and draw defenders so Randle sees single coverage. DeRozan will require a big contract but no trade will be needed and we would be adding a player who doesn’t miss time. He would be a difference maker, especially while adding a strong perimeter threat at PG.

DeRozan can be useful depending on cost. But that's true of nearly every player in the NBA who can generally make a team's rotation.

So if the Knicks get DeRozan, it has to be realistic on what it means. Not every team is going to be a contender. Not every team needs to be a contender. A super charged treadmill team is not the worst thing in the entire world. No one believed the SSOL Suns were going to win a championship. But they were fun to watch and they gave their fans a good time and having season tickets or going to a game was a good event for people. The Grit And Grind Grizzlies were never going to win a championship. They were a hard working and admirable team who were too good to get a high lottery pick they needed to get over the top but never great enough to win a ring with their core of Gasol/Conley/Zbo/Tony Allen/Etc. But they gave their fans a good time and their money's worth to watch.

So DeRozan as a Knick means the ceiling is a hopefully fun super charged treadmill team you hope will make it to the 2nd round of the playoffs consistently. Nothing wrong with that. That talk bothers some people, but after a couple of decades of pure woe for this team, having some consistent but measured success is not the worst thing in the entire world.

I would give him no more than a 3 year deal, with the 3rd year as a team option. 3/30. He'll get more than that and I understand why that will happen but that's what I think the actual market value will lie. What a player's market value will be and what MARKET PRICE he garners can be two different things. He would be a MCC ( Middle Class Contract), and while those are typically cap poison, he's got a solid track record and you know what you are getting. He's not going to give you defense nor floor spacing nor much to help a Space and Pace motion offense, but he's going to give you moderate shot creation ability and will work very hard and give you all he has within him.

What's interesting is there are LOTS of NBA guys who want to play with Steph Curry. There are lots of guys who still believe the Warriors can push into another ring or two before it's all over. There are lots of guys who might take a one year minimum deal to play with Curry. People love playing with Wardell, he makes everyone better. Look at how much being around Green and Curry has done for Wiggins and Oubre. While it might be more of a fit for a Rudy Gay type to do that, I wouldn't rule out anyone spending a season with Curry because they want to just enjoy the game after they've already made generational money.

TripleThreat wrote:

Knixkik wrote:We need a star game-changing wing. DeRozan is a rare one that’s on the market. He’s only 31 and is very durable. The best ability is availability as they say. His style of play and overall health makes him a low-risk as far as his next contract losing value. He should hold up fine. ..... He can get to the line and draw defenders so Randle sees single coverage. DeRozan will require a big contract but no trade will be needed and we would be adding a player who doesn’t miss time. He would be a difference maker, especially while adding a strong perimeter threat at PG.

DeRozan can be useful depending on cost. But that's true of nearly every player in the NBA who can generally make a team's rotation.

So if the Knicks get DeRozan, it has to be realistic on what it means. Not every team is going to be a contender. Not every team needs to be a contender. A super charged treadmill team is not the worst thing in the entire world. No one believed the SSOL Suns were going to win a championship. But they were fun to watch and they gave their fans a good time and having season tickets or going to a game was a good event for people. The Grit And Grind Grizzlies were never going to win a championship. They were a hard working and admirable team who were too good to get a high lottery pick they needed to get over the top but never great enough to win a ring with their core of Gasol/Conley/Zbo/Tony Allen/Etc. But they gave their fans a good time and their money's worth to watch.

So DeRozan as a Knick means the ceiling is a hopefully fun super charged treadmill team you hope will make it to the 2nd round of the playoffs consistently. Nothing wrong with that. That talk bothers some people, but after a couple of decades of pure woe for this team, having some consistent but measured success is not the worst thing in the entire world.

I would give him no more than a 3 year deal, with the 3rd year as a team option. 3/30. He'll get more than that and I understand why that will happen but that's what I think the actual market value will lie. What a player's market value will be and what MARKET PRICE he garners can be two different things. He would be a MCC ( Middle Class Contract), and while those are typically cap poison, he's got a solid track record and you know what you are getting. He's not going to give you defense nor floor spacing nor much to help a Space and Pace motion offense, but he's going to give you moderate shot creation ability and will work very hard and give you all he has within him.

What's interesting is there are LOTS of NBA guys who want to play with Steph Curry. There are lots of guys who still believe the Warriors can push into another ring or two before it's all over. There are lots of guys who might take a one year minimum deal to play with Curry. People love playing with Wardell, he makes everyone better. Look at how much being around Green and Curry has done for Wiggins and Oubre. While it might be more of a fit for a Rudy Gay type to do that, I wouldn't rule out anyone spending a season with Curry because they want to just enjoy the game after they've already made generational money.

I disagree with the ceiling. If he’s your #1 option sure. But we would essentially be bringing him in as a #2 or possibly 3 if we acquired Lillard for example. And signing as a free agent means no cost as far as assets and youth. Adding him straight up plus a moderate improvement at PG puts us as a sustainable top 4 seed with the ability to improve having not sacrificed any assets or youth to get to that point.

TPercy wrote:I love his play making ability but he is a certified SELLER during post season. If we can grab him for a one year deal he might be the move.

That's why I don't want him- after watching the whole team slump in the playoffs, the last thing we need to add is a player who slumps in the playoffs every year.

Pass

Welpee wrote:

smackeddog wrote:

TPercy wrote:I love his play making ability but he is a certified SELLER during post season. If we can grab him for a one year deal he might be the move.

That's why I don't want him- after watching the whole team slump in the playoffs, the last thing we need to add is a player who slumps in the playoffs every year.

He is obviously a good player, just don't know if he's a good fit for how the roster appears to be developing. In a lot of ways he's essentially what we're trying to develop RJ into. Why not just allow RJ the room to continue to grow?

We need a wing who can shoot. Derozan is not a good shooter he is an athletic slasher on the wrong side of 30

ramtour420 wrote:

How does he fit our offense tho? He duplicates ( triplicates) what we already have in Randle and RJ. He needs the ball to attack the hoop. RJ and Randle would be reduced to spot up 3 point shooters because DeRozan cannot make a 3 to save his life. That's the best case scenario and I don't like it already. In the worst case scenario they would take turns ISOing at the basket. I am sick and tired of the lack of offensive plays to keep the defense guessing. Like the rest of the league is using PnR to do that. We have great roll men, our teams best 4 players, our future ( Randle, RJ, Obi and Mitch) would give the league nightmares as we could always single out the worst defender and PnR him to death. DeRozan doesn't give us that. Don't forget that he is playing for an offense that features off the ball movement, cuts and screens to get ppl easy shots. If he came here his playmaking would take a dip. No thanks

Hard to claim a player won't fit. He may be ball dominant but he is a good assist guy. Biggest question for me may be that I think tall athletic floor spacers are needed at the SF position, Derozan is just 6'6 and can't shoot a three. However, I disagree that the NBA has a whole bunch of teams focused on ball movement or intricate plays. If you look at most teams, especially in playoffs, they focus heavy on ISO or PnR for the majority of the game. Watching teams like Denver, Clips, Nets you notice it's just guys "taking turns" going ISO with the occasional pass out on double teams. Therefore I would definitely take Derozan. At the end of the day we need GOOD players. And Derozan is definitely a good player that can help any team.