https://www.basketball-reference.com/players/p/poolejo01.html

https://www.spotrac.com/nba/golden-state-warriors/jordan-poole-31587

2020-21 Salary: $2,063,280
2021-22: $2,161,440
2022-23:$3,901,399
2023-24 Qualifying Offer:$5,813,085

https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/2020-nba-player-projections/jordan-poole/

Wins above replacement projection
Category: OK PROSPECT
5-yr market value: $35.1m
Projected RAPTOR Plus/Minus : - 2.1 / WAR: 0.3 / 2020 Market Value: 2.6 million / Total Rating: 244th out of 450 total players

https://goldengatesports.com/2020/04/21/golden-state-warriors-grading-2019-nba-draft-rookie-seasons/2/

The Warriors selected Jordan Poole out of the University of Michigan with the 28th overall pick in last year’s draft. Though teams do not normally expect to pick starting-caliber players at that stage, the 20-year-old showed an all-around skill set.

The 2019-2020 season was an up-and-down year for the Poole, but he started to find his groove just before the NBA went on hiatus due to the COVID-19 pandemic.

The struggles Poole went through are to be expected of a young player, but the shooting guard continued to show confidence in his game. This was perhaps the most encouraging sign from Poole’s rookie season.

In college, the 6-foot-4 guard was known for his shooting ability. However, that was the area where he struggled the most as he adapted to the NBA landscape.

Across 57 games, the shooting guard shot just 33 percent from the field, including a meager 28 percent from beyond the arc. On the year, Poole posted 8.8 PPG, 2.1 RPG, and 2.4 APG while being worth -1.2 win shares.

Though, with Poole, confidence and patience began to pay dividends down the stretch.

In the final 15 games of his rookie season, the 20-year-old posted 12.7 PPG, 2.4 RPG, and 3.7 APG while shooting 47 percent from the field, including 32 percent from behind the three-point line.

This 15-game sample is enough to get excited about Poole’s future. He found his shooting stroke and the type of consistency that eluded him earlier in the year.

Still, the 32 percent clip from beyond the arc leaves a bit to be desired. As his game continues to evolve, the Warriors will need to see more improvement in his scoring efficiency.

Down the stretch, Poole’s improved field goal percentage was encouraging as well as his ability to distribute the ball.

https://www.mercurynews.com/2020/01/18/how-jordan-pooles-passing-helped-get-rookie-season-back-on-track/

https://twitter.com/i/status/1277299554237313024

How Jordan Poole’s passing helped get rookie season back on track
Despite a disappointing start to the season, Jordan Poole’s passing has been a pleasant surprise for the Golden State Warriors.

By Wes Goldberg
PUBLISHED: January 18, 2020 at 6:00 a.m.

SAN FRANCISCO — As to not make it sound like a demotion, the Warriors have a public relations policy that they don’t send players “down” to the G League but, rather, “over.”

However, after making only four shots in the entire month of December, Jordan Poole was assigned to the Warriors’ G League affiliate in Santa Cruz — a move hard to argue was anything but a demotion.

That G League stint proved to be helpful in Poole discovering his game. Despite a disappointing start to the season, the playmaking he displayed as a ball handler in three games with Santa Cruz has been a pleasant surprise for the Warriors, and helped turn the rookie’s season around.

Poole, the No. 28 pick in June’s NBA Draft, was drafted because of his shooting. But, before his G League assignment, he was shooting just 25.4% overall, a league-worst among rotation players. In seven games since being called back to Golden State, Poole is shooting 39.2% and averaging 8.3 points and 2.3 assists per game off the bench.

However, after making only four shots in the entire month of December, Jordan Poole was assigned to the Warriors’ G League affiliate in Santa Cruz — a move hard to argue was anything but a demotion.

That G League stint proved to be helpful in Poole discovering his game. Despite a disappointing start to the season, the playmaking he displayed as a ball handler in three games with Santa Cruz has been a pleasant surprise for the Warriors, and helped turn the rookie’s season around.

Though he drew comparisons to an off-guard like J.R. Smith during the draft process, Poole, 20, mostly played point guard growing up in Milwaukee. From sixth grade through high school, Poole had the ball in his hands.

At Michigan, Zavier Simpson was entrenched as the starting point guard, so Poole played off the ball. In John Beilein’s rigid system, there weren’t many opportunities for Poole to flash his passing ability, though he still managed to average 2.2 assists per game as a sophomore.

“I was always a guy I felt could make it easy for other people, having the ball in my hands,” Poole said. “And then when I went to Michigan, they tried to keep me off the ball, so I had to find a way to impact (the game). I got labeled as a shooter.”

He played a similar role in Golden State before being sent to Santa Cruz, where head coach Kris Weems empowered Poole by giving him the ball. The goal was to help Poole regain confidence in his jumper but, in his first game against the Stockton Kings, he finished with a team-high seven assists.

Weems and player development coach Seth Cooper were surprised by Poole’s ability to find open teammates.

“I think the more he plays the more you’ll see his playmaking come through,” Cooper said.

In two more G League games, Poole emerged as one of the team’s top playmakers, consistently making challenging passes most rookies can’t make.

For Poole, it’s part of the learning process but, since coming back to Golden State, he has shown a renewed confidence in his jumper and is ahead of schedule as a playmaker. His innate feel for the game should make him a good fit in Golden State’s read-and-react offense going forward.

“I feel like I’m going to be in the league a real long time,” Poole said. “You’re going to go through days where you can’t get a bucket to fall, but you got to have belief in your game and you got to find a way to piece it together. And in year two, year three, you just add to your game. I’m not worried at all.”

https://www.nbcsports.com/bayarea/warriors/warriors-feel-jordan-poole-obsessed-getting-better-right-now

Poole showing Warriors he's 'obsessed' with getting better
Oct 4, 2020
by Monte Poole

A few months later, deep into the regular season, Poole looked uncomfortable, tentative. His shot, which was his ticket to the league, had abandoned him. He began December by missing 19 consecutive shots, including 10 from deep, and ended the month 3-of-32 from distance. He landed in the G League.

Even as Poole’s performance was giving the Warriors reason to second-guess themselves, the slender 6-foot-4 combo guard never openly acknowledged his struggles. Pride is hard to kill.

That factor has driven his commitment in recent months. Numerous people in the organization have noted Poole’s constant visits to the gym, for one-on-one exercises, often with player-development director Chris DeMarco but, also group drills and weightlifting sessions.

“Jordan has been here every day, really, for the last few months,” coach Steve Kerr said Saturday, the final day of formal workouts at a voluntary minicamp. “He’s been the most consistent presence in this building.”

Says DeMarco: “I’d almost say he’s obsessed with trying to get better.”

Forward Juan Toscano-Anderson, six years older than Poole but also an NBA rookie last season, says he and his teammate have separate training routines but often wind up sweating together in the bowels of Chase Center.

“He does his own thing, and I do my own thing,” Toscano-Anderson said. “But when I see him in the facility . . . he's here, and most of time he’s the last one to leave the gym. And I'm not just saying that. He is the last one to leave the gym a lot of the time.”

Poole’s work ethic implies there’s a hunger within and he’s ready to eat. He believes he’s much better than the rookie that spent time out of the rotation of a team going nowhere. He knows he can shoot better 33.3 percent from the field, including 27.9 percent beyond the arc.

He’ll have to if he’s going to get meaningful minutes next season, whenever it is. The Warriors expect to have Steph Curry and Klay Thompson in the backcourt, with Damion Lee coming off the bench. It’s looking as if they’re ready to ride with Andrew Wiggins at small forward, and there remains a chance Juan Toscano-Anderson makes the roster.

The Warriors will get the vast majority of their scoring, maybe 80 percent of it, from guards and small forwards. JP wants a piece of that action.

“He understands the level he needs to be at to contribute to this team,” DeMarco said. “His approach from the day the season ended has been, ‘How can I get better?’ He’s really put in the work on the court, in the weight room and in study.”

Though DeMarco conceded he’d like to see Poole to get better on defense, reading actions and being aware of his surroundings, the University of Michigan product was drafted largely as a shooter. That’s what the Warriors want to see, and they’d like it to be his No. 1 skill.

There is no doubt Poole noted the postseason shooting performance of someone he knows from their time as prep in greater Milwaukee. Miami Heat rookie guard Tyler Herro, the kid who dropped 37 points in an Eastern Conference Finals game, is being heralded as a future All-Star.

Somewhere in his soul, Poole believes he’s at least as good. Maybe better.

He learned the hard way last season that there are reasons why instant gratification is a mostly foreign concept in the NBA.

“There are many guys that have been here longer than you have when you come in, right? So, you’re already years behind,” Poole said recently, reflecting on his rookie season. “So, just learn as much as you can and try to learn as fast as you can.

"I think that was something that you were able to learn.”

If Year 1 was about learning, Poole’s second season is about adding a production component. He is among the projects assigned to player-mentor coach Leandro Barbosa because neither the Warriors nor Poole want to experience another season bouncing in and out of the rotation.

Showings during summer workouts and the minicamp scrimmages, during which Poole has been conspicuously good, have left all parties believing he is trending in the right direction. What’s certain is that he has no doubt he’ll get there.

“He’s earned the confidence that he's playing with,” Kerr said. “He looks like a guy who feels like he belongs.

“Usually, guys take the biggest steps in their careers between years one and two,” Kerr added. “That's been my experience, that once guys have the experience under their belt, they know what they're getting into and they feel it. And the next year, they come back with a different level of play and that's what I'm seeing with Jordan.”

If the Warriors truly believe in JP, it will factor into the draft process. Do they take another 20-year-old combo guard? Or do they address needs elsewhere?

Poole is doing all he can, without the evidence of games, to influence that decision.

********

College Profile

https://www.nbadraft.net/players/jordan-poole/

https://basketballsocietyonline.com/jordan-poole-scouting-report

https://www.peachtreehoops.com/2019/5/5/18526810/jordan-poole-nba-draft-scouting-report-profile-2019-michigan-guard

https://michigan.rivals.com/news/the-stepien-podcast-breaks-down-jordan-poole

NBA Comparison: Wayne Ellington

Strengths: Shooting guard who can flat out shoot the long ball … Shows some combo ability … Able to spot up or shoot off the dribble comfortably … Strong ball handler who can create for himself and others … An exceptional passer at the 2 spot … Solid finisher around the rim … Can finish with either hand … Demonstrates a variety of different moves offensively … 6’6.75 wingspan … Overall a solid perimeter defender … Not afraid of the moment and taking the big shot … Turned 20 a day before the 2019 NBA draft …

Weaknesses: needs to add core strength in order to contend with 2-guards at the next level … Has to take better care of the basketball and be more consistent limiting turnovers … Does not necessarily jump out of the gym compared to more athletic guards so shooting has to remain consistent … Nonchalant at times … Can improve on play making ability …

Notes: National champion in high school … measured 6’5.5 in shoes, 6’3.5 barefoot and had a 8’3.5 standing reach at the 2019 NBA Combine … A bit of a surprise pick by the Warriors at number 28 on draft night … His overall game fits right into today’s NBA …

David Green 6/24/19

Strengths: Small 2-guard with excellent shooting ability … One of the top overall shooters in the draft … Talented scorer with his outside shooting ability … Shows solid ball handling ability, can create shots on the perimeter … Showed some combo ability … 6’6.75 wingspan is decent for a shooter … Solid defender … Unlimited range on his shot … Can come off screens or pull up … Has the guts to take big shots … Developed a lot of confidence out of his coach … Turned 20 a day before the 2019 NBA Draft, so youth is on his side …

Weaknesses: There are still some question marks about his maturity … A little wild emotionally. But could be in the perfect system to fall in line … Lacks an NBA body. Needs to work hard on adding core strength and muscle to his frame … Careless with the ball … Just average athleticism at the shooting guard position … Doesn't always show focus. Can be lackadaisical at times … Not a naturally strong athlete …

Notes: Won a national title with LaLumiere in high school … Measured: Measured 6′ 3.5” barefoot, 6′ 5.5” in shoes, 190.8 lbs, 6′ 6.75” wingspan, and a 8′ 3.5” standing reach at the 2019 NBA Draft Combine … A suprise pick by the Warriors at 28 on draft night …

Aran Smith 6/20/19

Strengths:

Jordan Poole is an incredibly skilled offensive guard who might just have the biggest bag out of anyone in the nation. He can take defenders off the dribble with a wide array of moves with his tight handle and quickness.

Once Poole is able to get the defender on his hip, it’s over for him. Poole is one of the best at creating his own basket in the league and even though his athleticism isn’t eye popping, he can still finish at the rim impressively with either hand.

Jordan always loves to use that hesi and jab step to beat his defender and it’s clearly next level. He’s got a quick twitch which makes it nearly impossible for the opposition to remain in front of him. You can couple that quick twitch with his explosive first step. At 6’5, he plays like he’s 6’0 given how quick he gets into his action.

Needless to say, his handle is extremely tight and doesn’t commit too many unforced turnovers. That handle leads him to being one of the best players in the country at creating his own shot.

Speaking of his shot, that is another one of Poole’s greatest qualities. Whether it is off the dribble or spotting up, Jordan isn’t someone you can leave alone on the perimeter. He’s on pace to finish with a 3P% over 40% this year which would be a solid step up from shooting 37% last year. Jordan Poole was used sparingly for Michigan last year, but he is now one of the focal points of the offense. And rightfully so given his offensive talent.

Poole is an improved defender and a solid on-ball defender. He’s got quick feet and can do a good job of keeping the opposition in front of him despite his smaller frame.

Weaknesses:

Jordan Poole isn’t a premier playmaker although he hasn’t really needed to be. Zavier Simpson is the creator on offense and that allows Poole to be a slasher and scorer. With that being said, Poole hasn’t shown the ability to be an excellent passer. His position at the next level seems to be limited to a two guard.

Jordan also struggles off-ball on defense. More often that not, you can find him ball watching on defense. This is far too common especially during the times when his man is hovering around the ball handler. He’s a willing help defender, but it doesn’t always help his team when he leaves his man one pass away.

Another weakness for Poole is his frame. We have it down that Poole is 195 lbs which is fine for a two-guard, but not nearly as good as you’d like for someone who is listed at 6’5. As mentioned, he has quick enough feet to keep his opponent in front of him, but the problem is that he’s not strong enough to keep himself from getting backed down or out-muscled which will be a clear problem at the next level.

Jordan Poole hasn’t impressed us necessarily with his athleticism. When he gets to the rim and finishes, he’ll use his body to shield the defender or his long arms to finish around looming shot blockers. We aren’t saying that Poole isn’t athletic, but it’s something that he doesn’t often use. It’s worth monitoring just how athletic he is and if that lack of athleticism would attribute to him having increased struggles to finish at the rim in the NBA.

****

From there, many projected a leap for Poole in his second college season and, in some ways, it did arrive. He averaged 12.8 points per game while making 33 starts (37 games) and Poole exceeded the 20-point threshold on four separate occasions. Still, the full-fledged breakout never fully materialized, in part because of Poole’s individual inconsistency on both ends.

The offensive side will be where Poole makes his mark, as the theory of his profile makes a ton of sense at the NBA level. He is a good athlete with the ability to put the ball on the floor, to the point where he was largely effective when tasked with pick-and-roll creation in college. Beyond that, Poole brings gravity as a shooter and he has flashed acumen in coming off screens and creating separation, even against quality defensive competition.

As a shooter, Poole wasn’t elite in terms of three-point percentage (37 percent on 4.1 attempts per game for his career) but some of that stemmed from uneven shot selection and personal aggressiveness. A deeper look, though, would reveal that Poole was virtually elite in spot-up situations, posting 1.18 points per possession (according to Synergy) and helping to open up Michigan’s offense in that way. He was one of the most efficient spot-up shooters in the nation (91st percentile) last season. He was also able to operate well out of the pick-and-roll as both a scorer and as a playmaker, which is how he was able to finish more than one-third of his offensive possessions.

At the professional level, Poole profiles as a specialist to some degree, with the ability to score effectively in a variety of ways and force defenses to account for his three-point shooting. Until he proves to be a legitimate high-end shooter from three-point distance (upper 30’s in percentage, for instance), that is more of a theory, but Poole’s talent on the offensive end is easy to glean.

Defensively, things were more of an adventure for Poole. He isn’t devoid of tools on that end and there were encouraging moments along the way. With that said, he was in a near-perfect situation on that end of the floor with Matthews, Zavier Simpson and Jon Teske alongside him, and Poole was often the weakest link, even when playing alongside another shaky defender in Brazdeikis.

Attentiveness was an issue for Poole on both ends, but particularly when attempting to quell the opposition defensively. Because he profiles as a player with long-term offensive upside, Poole doesn’t necessarily need to be a lock-down defender as a professional but, at the same time, he’ll need to be better on that end to stick.

*****

“Poole I think is one of the better shooting prospects in this class,” Gribanov said on the podcast. “You could even make an argument he’s the best shooting prospect in the class. Just really, really good off the catch. He’s pretty automatic, 80 percent free throw. [He] has a nice pull-up game. Could shoot off screens. Really I think his biggest strength as a shooter is probably just the range. He could get out to 30 feet, especially off the catch without any issue.”

Poole was a 37.0 percent shooter from three in his two seasons at Michigan. He often took shots from the NBA 3-point range and looked comfortable doing so.

Gribanov thinks Poole can continue to get better as a shooter.

“I think something that people overlook at times is shooting among all kinds of major skills is really one thing that tends to improve with age,” Gribanov said. “Poole is pretty young for a sophomore. Considering his shooting numbers at this stage, in two or three years, you could see him becoming one of the better shooters, even in the in the NBA if that breaks right.”

For Gribanov, Poole’s passing and his dribbling are also two of his best offensive strengths. Gribanov doesn’t think Poole has the best handle or is someone you want being your top creator, but said Poole has some nice moves off the dribble.

Homan said Poole is good at running pick-and-rolls at times, but he said he could stand to improve his handle and the mid-range game because he won’t always be able to get to the rim in the NBA.

“He’s not a bad athlete, but he’s definitely not the best athlete,” Homan said on the podcast “But he still was really good around the rim. It was a smaller sample size, he wasn’t getting to the rim a ton, but he was a really good finisher around the rim due to that craft and finish in different ways.”

On the defensive end of the court, both analysts had concerns about Poole. Gribanov said he thinks at best could be not a negative defender.

“On the defensive end, he won’t be as physical or as aggressive as you want,” Gribanov said. “Most of the stuff that holds him back from being a really impact defender is just kind of focus and stuff like ball watching and attention span. You can say that’s young player stuff, but at the same time there’s a lot of guys that have that and aren’t able to improve on that in any serious amount.

“When he wants to and he really gets in a stance, he could really stick with guys. He does a pretty good job on ball overall against more two guards and even as a team defender. Has a decent frame.”

https://theathletic.com/2472417/2021/04/22/how-jordan-poole-became-an-emerging-part-of-warriors-future-his-answer-to-everything-is-more-work/

“He practiced at least twice with us,” Weems said. “The (three) games came quickly. He fit in. The guys appreciated him coming in and not trying to shoot every time. He was a playmaker, he was a second-side ballhandler. He took really efficient shots — good 3s, catch and shoot, didn’t shoot a whole lot off the dribble and he got to the basket, got to the foul line.”

Poole Studying Games and Bubble Playoffs:

Poole spent most of his isolated days studying games. DeMarco’s phone would ping regularly. Some random defensive rotation or offensive action would catch Poole’s eye and he’d take a video with his phone and send it DeMarco’s way, attached to a question or comment.

“Pretty sure I have a bunch of clips back to back to back to back on my camera roll,” Poole said.

“(Those clips) came with some good questions,” DeMarco said.

Poole tracked the Heat’s playoff run closely. He was college teammates with Duncan Robinson and has a Milwaukee connection with Tyler Herro. Plus Miami has a similar read-and-react offensive system to the Warriors, predicated on constant sharp off-ball movement from its shooters. Heat playoff games provided valuable film to study and mimic.

“I’m huge with imagery and having a vision,” Poole said. “CD helps me picture live game actions. We’d watch it the night before and go over it physically on the court.”

Poole's Offseason Study on Defense:

“I was focused on defense in the summer,” Poole said. “Terminology. Small stuff. How and when to rotate. What does trap the box mean? Who would be where if this happens?”

“If you’re looking at the defense, you’re showing him guys who are similarly sized and effective,” DeMarco said. “Guys like Gary Harris or Avery Bradley. Guys who are similar in size and good one-on-one defenders. Then it’s important to understand how to be early, help the helper, angles on closeouts, shot challenges. What angles are you giving players? How are you keeping them out of the middle if that’s what the defense wants? Then being physical when bigs are diving, box outs.”

Kerr on Poole's Current Problems on Defense:

“It’s not easy being a 6-foot-3 combo guard,” Kerr said. “I know this from personal experience. Because you’re going to end up guarding heavier guys, bigger guys. You’re going to end up cracking back, boxing out 7-footers. Massive guys who are going to throw you around. You really have to gird yourself when you’re in the fray. That’s a pretty dramatic change from college. You don’t feel that physicality and size and strength in college.”

Weems on Poole's Potential as a Defender:

“As he gets stronger, he’ll be able to guard the bigger wings,” Weems said. “Now, even the bigger 2s are like 6-7, 6-8. So even guarding a guy like Paul George and not being fazed by that, a guy that’s 30 pounds heavier and three inches taller, it’s about physically not letting them get to their spots. Physically as he gets stronger, grows into his man strength, he’ll be a better defender because he’s actually smart and he has good feet. He’s not a quick-burst athlete, but he has good agility, quick feet and he anticipates well. The big thing for him is not to reach, use his body to shield his man.”

“(Poole’s) rounding into form,” Weems said. “He’s still a baby. He has, I think, two more levels of strength he can get to....I bet he’ll be able to play up to 210, but he’ll still be really lean because his body will have changed. He works in the weight room. He’s committed. And he has some great examples. Steph is maniacal about his work. But look at Steph. He’s 33, and Jordan is 21. Steph wasn’t nearly as big as Jordan coming into the league. So you can see the progression, how that 6-3, 6-4 range, you fill out and all of a sudden you don’t get pushed around anymore.”

Why Poole Got Sent to the G League Bubble:

Wanamaker wasn’t offensively capable of handling the job he was tasked with. He isn’t the type of shot creator or playmaker who can generate enough offense in the non-Curry minutes. Poole fit better in that role...But he was also rusty. Poole hadn’t played much competitive basketball for nine months. All those offseason individual training sessions and film imagery had advanced his NBA brain well, but young players need a court canvass for some trial-and-error. He’d performed well in the team’s brief offseason practice bubble and even got in a few secretive high-level summer scrimmages with Blake Griffin and Kevin Durant, among others.

“How’d you find that out?” Poole said. “I normally keep that low-key. I don’t work out with too many people often. It was cool. I don’t talk about that too much.” But a few summer scrimmages, a few preseason games, a handful of practices and a limited, structured role running a veteran second unit for Kerr isn’t the proper environment for a creative scorer to stretch his legs, explore his talents and catch a rhythm. That’s why the G League is there.

“Go out there and play 37 minutes, 40 minutes a night,” Poole said. “It really kind of got me in shape. Just being able to see things game-speed. See game-like moments. It felt good to be in a lot of clutch situations again...Once you get in a rhythm, get in a routine, that’s hard to break. That’s what a lot of older guys tell me. Once you find your routine, stick with it.”

Draymond Watching Poole During the G League Bubble:

Poole wasn’t great to open the bubble. He went 7-of-22 shooting in his debut and turned it over seven times in the second game. Santa Cruz lost both. Green, watching from afar, reached out to Weems.

“When I first get that text from Draymond, it took me a minute to figure out who DG is,” Weems laughed. “I’m like, oh, ****, you dumbass, it’s Draymond. I get the text, we end up calling each other. He asked, ‘What’s wrong with JP?’ I’m like, as bad as it might’ve looked, he’s an emotional kid, he’s learning how to be more mature on the floor, more even.”

Poole was chatty with refs, he was engaging with trash-talking opponents, he was letting mistakes compound. Sounds a bit like Draymond. But Green typically has the ability to funnel that energy into the next play and toward winning.

“Draymond said he’d love to see him capitalize on his opportunity, not let it go to waste,” Weems said. “That would’ve been more, like, I’m down here to shoot every time and not being a good teammate. That wasn’t the case. I had to dispel that for Draymond. ‘Hey, sometimes you have to stop talking to the refs, sometimes you gotta stop talking **** to the other team. You can’t get distracted.’ That was my message to JP. Draymond, that resonated with him. He’s like, ‘I’m the first one to get distracted.’ But as a coach, it’s important guys can be fiery, can be committed to the game, but can always pull themselves back and get focused.”

What Weems Had Poole Focus On During the Bubble:

“Early on, we showed some film of him missing guys, not throwing it ahead in transition when we might’ve got a layup,” Weems said. “The growth from then to later in the bubble, we were showing clips of transition of how we want to compress the defense and throw the ball ahead and he’s the one always throwing the ball ahead every clip. There was a play, it wasn’t a chasedown block. But it was I shoot a corner 3, guy runs by me and instead of pouting about the missed shot, I run back, get a hand on the ball, we’re going the other way and I go back down and score. Not quitting on plays because your shot didn’t fall. He got better at the competition factor. It’s not just about putting the ball in the basket. What do I do to help the team?”

I wanted the Knicks to trade for Jordan Poole right after his rookie year, which by all accounts, was pretty horrific. But I was interested in his ability to get to the rim.

The belief back then was that the Warriors were in a much different asset position and trading off Poole might have been in keeping with the theory that they might sell him off before his stock tanked even further. He was a late first round pick so the level of compensation wouldn't have been as much, certainly not what they'd ask for today.

Which goes back to what I've discussed in the past about the value of those rookie contracts, particularly with slotting at where Poole was drafted. That's really a very small amount of money for the potential for some impact. I recognize the Knicks could have traded for Poole and he could have tanked on them even further than he did for the Warriors.

But he's a fearless player, certainly not a perfect one as I'm still not a fan of his shot selection and his efficiencies, and he can penetrate and get to the cup. That kind of player who would have opened up the offense for this team.

Again,as I've said before, there's a reason why I tout the players that I do.

TripleThreat wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:
how ya doin man? What can we give the gS warriors for almost any of their players TT? From the other side what r u going to take?

I'm doing OK Briggs. Post Super Bowl is a sort of break period for the entire league. So combined with the madness of the pandemic, I can edge back from the scouting and player evaluations for a bit.

Please no one ask me about Zach Wilson and Brian Flores/Brian Daboll.

It's too late to trade for Poole right now, his cost would be heavy and the Warriors wouldn't want to disrupt their chemistry this year as they are legitimate contenders. The reason I bumped a thread from two offseasons ago is to talk about trying to mine trades for young players who are struggling but still in their rookie contracts depending on their projectible skill set.

Poole would be damn useful on this team right now. But the fair argument can be made if Poole would have developed like this outside of the Dubs system. While I'm not a huge believer in franchises magically being able to "develop" players past a certain threshold, I do believe certain roles players can be bloomed out based on some situations ( i.e. Duncan Robinson and Erik Spolestra in Miami)

I'm guessing while I was gone for a while, there were some touts about trading for a guy like Russell Westbrook or something like that. And while our beloved Knicks should not be closed to any potential deals without deep examination, the real value is in situations like Poole, young guys who need playing time and can give you a long career window if they pan out. Plus trading for them implies getting the natural pathway towards their valuable Full Bird Rights.

How have you been my old friend? How is your health?

Let me ask you, does my sudden reappearance trigger more of your angst from jealousy? Or envy?

LOL. I've missed you my old friend. I've been OK. Between heavy bouts of film study on prospects, I've found time to rail a bunch of out of work by the pandemic Zumba instructors with predictably low self esteem but high narcissism that desperately wanted to get pounded. So I obliged them.

Conversation is overrated with the typical yoga pants hunnies. Everyone looks the same bent over a pool table.

But do they all make the same noises? Just asking, since I have no frame of reference with hunnies bent over pool tables.

And not for nothing, but don't we already have rookies with projectible skill sets that aren't being developed? What's the logic in trading for more of them? Just asking, as I haven't been watching film, just lots of bad highlights of Thibs riding really old people with the same results over and over again.

jrodmc wrote:
But do they all make the same noises? Just asking, since I have no frame of reference with hunnies bent over pool tables.

And not for nothing, but don't we already have rookies with projectible skill sets that aren't being developed? What's the logic in trading for more of them? Just asking, as I haven't been watching film, just lots of bad highlights of Thibs riding really old people with the same results over and over again.

My pathway that I discussed in the offseason was

1) Use Randle's option year and observe him. Some here said it would make the situation more expensive, i.e. the difference between a max deal at full Bird Rights versus Early Bird Rights. I still said wait and observe him. His production rate was likely to fall in the middle of his first Knicks year and his 2nd Knicks year

2) Rent out the cap space, the Knicks had the most in the league. Eat a big bad contract and take in draft picks and hopefully some young players to do it. Take in a John Wall or a Davis Bertans or something as such and only do it if draft picks were coming to the team for it. I pointed out Brock Aller was doing pretty good managing the total asset base and more picks just opens up way more options for the team

3) I pointed out the draft targets, well the guys I liked, were Moses Moody, Johnny Juzang, Aaron Henry, Julian Champagnie, Kessler Edwards and Josh Primo. I wasn't sure Moody would fall that far, I doubted it, but I wanted him given where the Knicks were actually picking. I wanted Primo as I thought he would fall that far and no one could predict the Spurs would take him so early.

4) I discussed the dangers of "Middle Class Contracts" i.e. situations like Courtney Lee. Guys who ate up a good chunk of cap but weren't good trade fodder and got in the way of younger players getting minutes. I used the MCC argument to advise Briggs that overpaying Cameron Payne was not a great long term idea for this team.

The Knicks would have been better off trading for a big bad contract and taking in picks to do it. I know that would suck for many people who wanted Lonzo Ball or some other free agent but I didn't see those guys coming to the Knicks. That one bad contract chews up free cap but also frees up roster spots. One massively overpaid guy like Wall is one roster spot. Combining Noel, Fournier and Walker is three roster spots. Under my view, then the Knicks could have no MCC type veterans, just barely good enough to start and making too much money to bench, but not good enough to give the team a real future, and then just play their rookies. I'm NOT a huge Obi Toppin fan, but I do believe since he's here, give him some good minutes and see what you do have.

It's not just cap dollars that are valuable, it's the opportunity cost revolving around roster spots and minutes.

Everyone who has seen me post for years know the drill from me - Get young cost controlled jumbo wings who can defend and switch and are fundamental. Then hope their offense picks up some.

I also wanted Kenny Atkinson over any other coaching candidate before Thibs was hired. I wanted a guy who had a reputation for helping to develop younger players.

The Knicks should always be open to bringing in talent period. You can never have too much talent, as long as it's the best resource management decision given the time and place. At the time I started this thread, it was 10/2020, this was the end of Poole's first disaster laden year in the league. It was really ugly. I wanted a young cheap guy who could play the point and get to the rim. And at the time, the Dubs might have been willing to dump him and at the time the Knicks young talent situation was a lot worse than today.

Knicks did exactly what I said NOT to do with Middle Class Contracts. And it ****ed them.

The salary system was designed for max contracts to real franchise players and filling the rest of the ranks with value pickups in the back end of free agency and young players on their rookie deals.

The current Warriors are more of that archetype. I recognize Green has declined a bit but he's still a core of that team and no one could predict Thompson would get hurt. But that team is filled with high upside rookie contracts ( Moody, Kuminga, Poole, Wiseman) and veteran bargains ( Porter, Bjelica, Payton II, Toscano Anderson) around their highly paid core. You can argue Wiggins is overpaid but the principles in place are there.

Fournier is a problem. He's on the high end of a MCC, he's not that great of a defender, he's streaky as a shooter, he's not really your prototype 3 And D wing, he's going to be hard to trade, he has a long time left on his contract and he's blocking younger players from valuable minutes.

If you are going to have a bad contract, then you are better off having one big ass single bad contract. Not 3-4 medium range bad contracts. People think smaller bad contracts make them "easier to move" but it's not exactly that easy to move those guys. Usually "easier to move" means bleeding out lost value somewhere else in multiple deals what are spread out.

Long story short, the Knicks should listen to me. They should have listened to me like a decade ago, the team would be in a better place for it.