Uptown wrote:

Knixkik wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

dwiley20 wrote:team will suck until we get a PG

Agree.

Yup it’s really this simple.

Need shooters too...If you have a pg that can play down hill, you need shooters for him to kick it out to...Tough to win in today's NBA if you can't shoot.

Definitely agree. I would start Knox and Morris who are both good catch and shoot players. Let Randle feast on second units. Adding shooters is necessary but the lineup can be tweaked so that we have a good outside shooting group.

GustavBahler wrote:

NYKBocker wrote:

GustavBahler wrote:We need help at PG asap. Has to be the lowest scoring starting, backcourt in the league. Its a deficit the rest of the lineup has to make up. Smith jr. showed some flashes, but its probably late december before he is up to speed. Id give Dotson more time at PG. Frank's output on offense is a liability when you're trying to get off to a hot start. Saw some P&R. Considering this is a team without stars, should see it more. Asking too many players to create like guards, with all the ISO. Want to see whoever is the PG, create like one.

I need to see Fizdale put the ball in Frank's hand. Call his number all the time. If he fails then we move on but I have to see if he can do it. That defense is just too good to give up on without seeing if he can do it on the other side of the ball

Coaches have been trying to get Frank to be more aggressive since he was drafted, veteran teammates as well. Like Jarett Jack. At some point its on Frank, and that time is now. Agree with those who say that Frank should have some screens set for him, more opportunities for P&Rs, but it doesnt explain away so few trips to the line, and so few shot attempts. Believe we're coming close to the point (if we arent here already) to say that Frank as a player is who he is. No shame in being a quality bench player.

I get your point, but I think it would be a huge mistake to let Fiz be the last coach to try to get the offense from Frank. Fiz shows he doesn’t really like Frank’s game even in his best ones. I totally agree that before giving up on Frank, force some offense from him. Set some plays for him to be the finisher and give it a considerable chance. You just know if he is traded, the next team will do that and we will see Frank improve from a inside.

Yes, he HAS to be more aggressive on offense and it’s on him, but he has done it in small spurts. We aren’t winning anything soon so if you don’t even experiment with your own talent, then what is the freaking point?

The result?

Arguably the worst team in the league and most shocking, we are a few levels worse from last season. This is a perfect storm of bad coaching, bad roster fit and too much turmoil. It’s rather shocking how we got so much worse.

NYKBocker wrote:

GustavBahler wrote:We need help at PG asap. Has to be the lowest scoring starting, backcourt in the league. Its a deficit the rest of the lineup has to make up. Smith jr. showed some flashes, but its probably late december before he is up to speed. Id give Dotson more time at PG. Frank's output on offense is a liability when you're trying to get off to a hot start. Saw some P&R. Considering this is a team without stars, should see it more. Asking too many players to create like guards, with all the ISO. Want to see whoever is the PG, create like one.

I need to see Fizdale put the ball in Frank's hand. Call his number all the time. If he fails then we move on but I have to see if he can do it. That defense is just too good to give up on without seeing if he can do it on the other side of the ball

His D was good again last night and he had a good spurt in the 2nd quarter on the D end to get the team back in the game.

GoNyGoNyGo wrote:

smackeddog wrote:Move randle to the bench, move Morris to starting PF, Knox to starting SF, never play Portus again. That should get rid of the hero ball problem.

good place to start.

Once Mitch comes back - Portis goes to bench.

Knox is atrocious on D, he defends with one arm up, never looking at the defender, act as if his opponent is contagious, and gets caught BALL watching.

The spacing for any penetration is a complete joke.

One day it's Trier, the next it's Ellington, the next it's Dotson, fiz never sticking with one guy for more than a quarter or 2, great way to build chemistry

The 3 stooges (fiz, perry and mills) continue to shatter The knicks losing records. After breaking a number of them last season, the trend continues

With the defeat, the Knicks tied a franchise record for most losses through 11 games.

Fast forward to a 2019 Knicks practice and coach says to Randall, "Julius, dribble that ball on offense a bit more. Let's see what happens."

Am I supposed to believe that in practice this simple exercise works so well that the ENTIRE F'n coaching staff nods in agreement, "OH YEAH, let's do that in the game - A LOT!"

What am I missing?

fwk00 wrote:

NYKBocker wrote:

Knicksfan wrote:

GustavBahler wrote:

NYKBocker wrote:

GustavBahler wrote:We need help at PG asap. Has to be the lowest scoring starting, backcourt in the league. Its a deficit the rest of the lineup has to make up. Smith jr. showed some flashes, but its probably late december before he is up to speed. Id give Dotson more time at PG. Frank's output on offense is a liability when you're trying to get off to a hot start. Saw some P&R. Considering this is a team without stars, should see it more. Asking too many players to create like guards, with all the ISO. Want to see whoever is the PG, create like one.

I need to see Fizdale put the ball in Frank's hand. Call his number all the time. If he fails then we move on but I have to see if he can do it. That defense is just too good to give up on without seeing if he can do it on the other side of the ball

Coaches have been trying to get Frank to be more aggressive since he was drafted, veteran teammates as well. Like Jarett Jack. At some point its on Frank, and that time is now. Agree with those who say that Frank should have some screens set for him, more opportunities for P&Rs, but it doesnt explain away so few trips to the line, and so few shot attempts. Believe we're coming close to the point (if we arent here already) to say that Frank as a player is who he is. No shame in being a quality bench player.

I get your point, but I think it would be a huge mistake to let Fiz be the last coach to try to get the offense from Frank. Fiz shows he doesn’t really like Frank’s game even in his best ones. I totally agree that before giving up on Frank, force some offense from him. Set some plays for him to be the finisher and give it a considerable chance. You just know if he is traded, the next team will do that and we will see Frank improve from a inside.

Yes, he HAS to be more aggressive on offense and it’s on him, but he has done it in small spurts. We aren’t winning anything soon so if you don’t even experiment with your own talent, then what is the freaking point?

Plus. What are you going to lose if you force it on Frank? You take the ball away from Randle? Yes please. You take the ball away from Morris? Please tell me more! Figuring out if you have a starting PG? Ok..it makes too much sense. I get why Fizdale doesn't want to do it.

YES.

And this is messing with Ntilikina's head and game. Fizdale keeps trying to make Randall and Morris into something they are not during games that count.

It is not Knox who should be playing SF but Dot or RJ... whatever but get Dot into the mix. He too plays D.

I'm at wit's end with Fizdale - basketball lunacy game after game.

Hate to dissapoint but running more PnR's with Frank won't change things. Agree that biggest issue right now is with Randle. He is simply putting way to much on his shoulders. Guy plays like if he doesn't score every time he will lose his job. Ironically, he is the only one guaranteed a long term deal.
You look at last nights game and Taj was better for the team.

Would like to see Frank just put in to guard the best offensive player on the other team. The way OKC used Roberson. Thought Fiz was getting him in once White hit 2 threes. Unfortunately, White hit another and when Frank came in he was also unable to stop him. Don't think Frank even likes to be a focus point on offense. Have to give Smith more minutes to get back into shape. He showed some good spots last night but still seems to be forcing things and without confidence. I would like to see him focus on driving and creating for other and only look to score by going strong to hoop and draw fouls. In regards to Portis and Randle, agree that Fiz should go with either Portis or Randle depending on who is playing best team ball. But never both of them. If neither playing well then go with Taj. At least he passes and plays Defense, In those cases go small with RJ, Morris or Knox at 4.,

The losses fall squarely on the coach and the scheme. I mean almost everywhere you turn he makes mistakes, from trying to initiate through PFs (who are good IMO) but who can't dribble, to hiding Frank in the corner as if all of a sudden he's a 3 point sniper, to playing people together whose games are not complimentary -- honestly DSJ, Randle, and Barret (no spacing all driving into traffic)

I also don't think the team has come close to quitting and think their effort is at least on par w league if not better

Our team is not good but not close to being this bad either, if properly coached

FO put together this very awkward roster, no floor leadership, no shooting . Think how much more horrible it would be if RJ wasn't playing as well as he has. 70+mill and KP as a trade chip. At the moment we're literally a laughing stock. I watch all of the games on league pass and as a result see a lot of feeds from opposing announcers. They have a great time cracking themselves up over our misfortune. Particularly embarassing when their own teams suck too

I mean honestly what was Mills and Perry envisioning? What was their view of how the offense would roll. We don't know because they haven't told us

Chandler wrote:This is not Frank's, Randle's or Morris's fault. They are all good players in their own respect and can contribute to success if used properly

The losses fall squarely on the coach and the scheme. I mean almost everywhere you turn he makes mistakes, from trying to initiate through PFs (who are good IMO) but who can't dribble, to hiding Frank in the corner as if all of a sudden he's a 3 point sniper, to playing people together whose games are not complimentary -- honestly DSJ, Randle, and Barret (no spacing all driving into traffic)

I also don't think the team has come close to quitting and think their effort is at least on par w league if not better

Our team is not good but not close to being this bad either, if properly coached

FO put together this very awkward roster, no floor leadership, no shooting . Think how much more horrible it would be if RJ wasn't playing as well as he has. 70+mill and KP as a trade chip. At the moment we're literally a laughing stock. I watch all of the games on league pass and as a result see a lot of feeds from opposing announcers. They have a great time cracking themselves up over our misfortune. Particularly embarassing when their own teams suck too

I mean honestly what was Mills and Perry envisioning? What was their view of how the offense would roll. We don't know because they haven't told us

This is the biggest problem in terms of inconsistent play on the floor, moreso than the coaching or lack thereof...

Uptown wrote:

Chandler wrote:This is not Frank's, Randle's or Morris's fault. They are all good players in their own respect and can contribute to success if used properly

The losses fall squarely on the coach and the scheme. I mean almost everywhere you turn he makes mistakes, from trying to initiate through PFs (who are good IMO) but who can't dribble, to hiding Frank in the corner as if all of a sudden he's a 3 point sniper, to playing people together whose games are not complimentary -- honestly DSJ, Randle, and Barret (no spacing all driving into traffic)

I also don't think the team has come close to quitting and think their effort is at least on par w league if not better

Our team is not good but not close to being this bad either, if properly coached

FO put together this very awkward roster, no floor leadership, no shooting . Think how much more horrible it would be if RJ wasn't playing as well as he has. 70+mill and KP as a trade chip. At the moment we're literally a laughing stock. I watch all of the games on league pass and as a result see a lot of feeds from opposing announcers. They have a great time cracking themselves up over our misfortune. Particularly embarassing when their own teams suck too

I mean honestly what was Mills and Perry envisioning? What was their view of how the offense would roll. We don't know because they haven't told us

This is the biggest problem in terms of inconsistent play on the floor, moreso than the coaching or lack thereof...

You may be right. But I also think the coach is playing a lot of guys to their weaknesses, e.g., Randle is a good passer but a poor dribbler

That's why i think Fizz's head will roll. if team plays better with new coach then it was coaching problem. If team plays horrible Mills' and Perry's heads will roll. No great loss IMO but realize others think differently

Uptown wrote:

NYKBocker wrote:

Knicksfan wrote:

GustavBahler wrote:

NYKBocker wrote:

GustavBahler wrote:We need help at PG asap. Has to be the lowest scoring starting, backcourt in the league. Its a deficit the rest of the lineup has to make up. Smith jr. showed some flashes, but its probably late december before he is up to speed. Id give Dotson more time at PG. Frank's output on offense is a liability when you're trying to get off to a hot start. Saw some P&R. Considering this is a team without stars, should see it more. Asking too many players to create like guards, with all the ISO. Want to see whoever is the PG, create like one.

I need to see Fizdale put the ball in Frank's hand. Call his number all the time. If he fails then we move on but I have to see if he can do it. That defense is just too good to give up on without seeing if he can do it on the other side of the ball

Coaches have been trying to get Frank to be more aggressive since he was drafted, veteran teammates as well. Like Jarett Jack. At some point its on Frank, and that time is now. Agree with those who say that Frank should have some screens set for him, more opportunities for P&Rs, but it doesnt explain away so few trips to the line, and so few shot attempts. Believe we're coming close to the point (if we arent here already) to say that Frank as a player is who he is. No shame in being a quality bench player.

I get your point, but I think it would be a huge mistake to let Fiz be the last coach to try to get the offense from Frank. Fiz shows he doesn’t really like Frank’s game even in his best ones. I totally agree that before giving up on Frank, force some offense from him. Set some plays for him to be the finisher and give it a considerable chance. You just know if he is traded, the next team will do that and we will see Frank improve from a inside.

Yes, he HAS to be more aggressive on offense and it’s on him, but he has done it in small spurts. We aren’t winning anything soon so if you don’t even experiment with your own talent, then what is the freaking point?

Plus. What are you going to lose if you force it on Frank? You take the ball away from Randle? Yes please. You take the ball away from Morris? Please tell me more! Figuring out if you have a starting PG? Ok..it makes too much sense. I get why Fizdale doesn't want to do it.

Did Fiz force Frank to be more aggressive against Dallas or was that Frank stepping his game up? You guys put too much on the coach! This ain't junior high or High school ball..Frank being passive is on Frank. Mudiay aint have no problem getting up shots last year playing for Fiz. Same for DSJ and Allen last year!