Uptown wrote:

nykshaknbake wrote:

Uptown wrote:

TripleThreat wrote:

Uptown wrote:

meloshouldgo wrote:Uptown - you keepasking why I don'tlike Midiay? Rewind and watch the last 6 posessions.

It's a mixed bag with him...he made a great pass to Knox cutting to the basket, then turned it over on the next...I get it...but again, he is making the mistakes you would expect a 22 yr old who never made college ball to make.

Mudiay is making the SAME MISTAKES since he started in the league.

He's outside his prime developmental window.

Guys who take a little longer to figure it out tend to have at least one bedrock/anchor skill set that keeps them in a rotation.

Does he even have an average three point shot? If the answer is No , then he's not working hard enough. You can improve your long range shooting with attrition and grind it out hard work.

Is he in elite physical condition? If the answer is No ( it's No), then he's not working hard enough. You can be in elite physical condition by choice.

It would be one thing if you saw a developmental trajectory over time. I.E. Mudiay getting a little better each season at something. Is that happening? So why should it happen now?

The job is there to take. He's not taking it with his play. He also seems to not understand that the team needs him to get to the rim.

On Ebay, sometimes people sell junk lots. They buy out an abandoned storage unit at auction, then try to sell the bigger pieces. Some of the scrap at the end, what's left, the assorted random crap, gets thrown in a box and sometimes people bid a few bucks on it. Often it's NOT worth even the shipping.

That's as much mixed bag as Mudiay will ever get.

Some of you guys are hoping for change from a player who has never shown change. For years. Across multiple teams.

He's at least improved in 2 areas: He has a career 36% FG from the field, he is currently shooting 50% from the field. Mudiay is also finishing much better at the rim....Still a long way to go for him. It's possible that Mudiay's window may have closed, its alo possible that he can still turn it around...He has a coach that hasn't written him off and seems to believe in him which is leading to Mudiay playing with more confidence so we shall see...

This. He has flaws in his game and if he's the best we come up with its suboptimal. But in an effort to boost Frank, we've developed ridiculous standards on this board. No one wants to be accused of not knowing the importance of defense so things like fg% are irrelevant now(especially since frank is good at the former and exceptionally bad at the latter). Muiday or Burke have good games..oh but they messed up a play in the 4th quarter so they are useless. Frank has a horrid game but makes a nice stop or hits a shot, its see he us going to be great.

Here's a question, if Frank were to be traded would we get a 1st rounder in the top half of the draft back? If we did a redraft would he go 8 still?

Great points here!!! There is definitely a double standard by some posters on this board when it comes to defending Frank and knocking Burke and Mudiay. Mudiay is 22 years old and has shown improvement, but since he wasn't drafted by us, he is treated like an outcast who's window is already closed. Yet, I've seen posters claim that Frank can develop at a Chauncey Billups pace, yet, Mudiay isn't afforded the same luxury.

Mudiay hasn’t improved at all and has been in the league for 4 seasons now.

We really need to stop treating every young player like he has potential to be great. Mudiay doesn’t have the work ethic or basketball IQ to ever be a consistently good NBA player.

JamesKPolk wrote:

Uptown wrote:

nykshaknbake wrote:

Uptown wrote:

TripleThreat wrote:

Uptown wrote:

meloshouldgo wrote:Uptown - you keepasking why I don'tlike Midiay? Rewind and watch the last 6 posessions.

It's a mixed bag with him...he made a great pass to Knox cutting to the basket, then turned it over on the next...I get it...but again, he is making the mistakes you would expect a 22 yr old who never made college ball to make.

Mudiay is making the SAME MISTAKES since he started in the league.

He's outside his prime developmental window.

Guys who take a little longer to figure it out tend to have at least one bedrock/anchor skill set that keeps them in a rotation.

Does he even have an average three point shot? If the answer is No , then he's not working hard enough. You can improve your long range shooting with attrition and grind it out hard work.

Is he in elite physical condition? If the answer is No ( it's No), then he's not working hard enough. You can be in elite physical condition by choice.

It would be one thing if you saw a developmental trajectory over time. I.E. Mudiay getting a little better each season at something. Is that happening? So why should it happen now?

The job is there to take. He's not taking it with his play. He also seems to not understand that the team needs him to get to the rim.

On Ebay, sometimes people sell junk lots. They buy out an abandoned storage unit at auction, then try to sell the bigger pieces. Some of the scrap at the end, what's left, the assorted random crap, gets thrown in a box and sometimes people bid a few bucks on it. Often it's NOT worth even the shipping.

That's as much mixed bag as Mudiay will ever get.

Some of you guys are hoping for change from a player who has never shown change. For years. Across multiple teams.

He's at least improved in 2 areas: He has a career 36% FG from the field, he is currently shooting 50% from the field. Mudiay is also finishing much better at the rim....Still a long way to go for him. It's possible that Mudiay's window may have closed, its alo possible that he can still turn it around...He has a coach that hasn't written him off and seems to believe in him which is leading to Mudiay playing with more confidence so we shall see...

This. He has flaws in his game and if he's the best we come up with its suboptimal. But in an effort to boost Frank, we've developed ridiculous standards on this board. No one wants to be accused of not knowing the importance of defense so things like fg% are irrelevant now(especially since frank is good at the former and exceptionally bad at the latter). Muiday or Burke have good games..oh but they messed up a play in the 4th quarter so they are useless. Frank has a horrid game but makes a nice stop or hits a shot, its see he us going to be great.

Here's a question, if Frank were to be traded would we get a 1st rounder in the top half of the draft back? If we did a redraft would he go 8 still?

Great points here!!! There is definitely a double standard by some posters on this board when it comes to defending Frank and knocking Burke and Mudiay. Mudiay is 22 years old and has shown improvement, but since he wasn't drafted by us, he is treated like an outcast who's window is already closed. Yet, I've seen posters claim that Frank can develop at a Chauncey Billups pace, yet, Mudiay isn't afforded the same luxury.

Mudiay hasn’t improved at all and has been in the league for 4 seasons now.

We really need to stop treating every young player like he has potential to be great. Mudiay doesn’t have the work ethic or basketball IQ to ever be a consistently good NBA player.

The bolded could be true....But, the perfect storm is in front of him...He has a chance this season, perhaps a final chance to prove that he can be a good player because he finally has a coach who is in his corner, he has a franchise that's rebuilding and literally begging someone to take over the pg position...If he can't make it happen this year and take advantage of this situation, then may end up a journeymen and will bounce around from team to team until he's bounced from the league...

No one said Mudiay has the potential to be great, not sure where that's coming from...But, the same applies for Frank as well...

Nalod wrote:What is the baseline about him improving or not in his three years?
We do hold Frank to a very high level and a high level of hope because of his age.
Mudiay we are brutal on.
Same for Hardaway because of the money.

There's definitely high hope for Frank. But there is not a high level or bar. I think Crush posted an article that had a takeaway that if he struggles at 20 minutes it must be confidence that 30+ minutes would fix...so the more he sucks the more playing time he deserves. People have stated here he has a good shot and has proved he can shoot, while being one of the worst shooters in the NBA. Frank does D well, but its stated as gospel that he does many things very well, without stating what any of those are. I would argue that most here would say Frank has or will have a successful season and prove his worth regardless of his play or improvement and that's lunacy.

He is partially ok on the young guy piece but is now failing on defensive/offensive system fronts.

These are such obvious failures it does make me believe/suspect that we are just tanking.

Best way to tank is to keep changing line-ups / rotations because the more you change the more nobody knows what is going on --- confusion in terms of offensive execution and rotations.

If we are tanking - ok but if it is at the cost of a defensive ID and putting in an "unselfish" system -- that's a bad idea.