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Fiz, Mudiay will eventually get a chance to start at point guard
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StarksEwing1
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10/29/2018  3:37 PM
HofstraBBall wrote:
Knickoftime wrote:
HofstraBBall wrote:
Knickoftime wrote:
Uptown wrote: If only he can learn to finish through contact at the basket...Also, his jumper is broken.

I don't think the former is a teachable skill, at least at this point.

Think that he can improve his jump shot. It is definitely teachable? Probably the thing most NBA players look to improve most and do each year. Kid is only 22. Some forget that.

I understand jump shots can be improved. I am bearish though on rewriting broke-ass jump shots.

As a phenomenal shooter , I think the single most important factor in shooting is not technique but confidence. Something that cannot be taught but can improve with repetition and success. If you look at some of the better shooters in the league, their technique varies.

confidence is very important. My outside shot was always decent but not great(especially from 3) but you are right you need the right attitude
AUTOADVERT
BigDaddyG
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10/29/2018  3:40 PM
StarksEwing1 wrote:
HofstraBBall wrote:
Knickoftime wrote:
HofstraBBall wrote:
Knickoftime wrote:
Uptown wrote: If only he can learn to finish through contact at the basket...Also, his jumper is broken.

I don't think the former is a teachable skill, at least at this point.

Think that he can improve his jump shot. It is definitely teachable? Probably the thing most NBA players look to improve most and do each year. Kid is only 22. Some forget that.

I understand jump shots can be improved. I am bearish though on rewriting broke-ass jump shots.

As a phenomenal shooter , I think the single most important factor in shooting is not technique but confidence. Something that cannot be taught but can improve with repetition and success. If you look at some of the better shooters in the league, their technique varies.

confidence is very important. My outside shot was always decent but not great(especially from 3) but you are right you need the right attitude

Yes, but at the same time, there are basic fundamentals that all the great shoots adhere to. Mudiay's J is broken in these respects.
Always... always remember: Less is less. More is more. More is better and twice as much is good too. Not enough is bad, and too much is never enough except when it's just about right. - The Tick
HofstraBBall
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10/29/2018  3:44 PM
Vmart wrote:
knicks1248 wrote:
HofstraBBall wrote:
Knickoftime wrote:
Uptown wrote: If only he can learn to finish through contact at the basket...Also, his jumper is broken.

I don't think the former is a teachable skill, at least at this point.

Think that he can improve his jump shot. It is definitely teachable? Probably the thing most NBA players look to improve most and do each year. Kid is only 22. Some forget that.


His shooting form is "Camby/kevin martin like ugly, but it really doesn't matter the form, it's the release that matters the most. His release is different every time he shoots. Frank and THJ suffer the same problem, there timing on releasing shots are extremely different, it's either to hard or to soft depending on where they shoot from. They both a have beautiful shooting forms, but they rush there shots too much.

Harping in age suck he is only 22 all the grabage. He is a 4 year vet now. Age doesn’t mean talent.


We are a rebuilding team To acquire a 22 year old player and give up on him after not even a half a year is not only irrational and impatient but also contradictory to what you claim to be.

This is a problem. Think teams are starting to get that 4 years in the NBA after being drafted at 17 or 18, just makes you what you were 15 years ago in the NBA..... a ROOK!

HofstraBBall
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10/29/2018  3:49 PM    LAST EDITED: 10/29/2018  3:52 PM
BigDaddyG wrote:
StarksEwing1 wrote:
HofstraBBall wrote:
Knickoftime wrote:
HofstraBBall wrote:
Knickoftime wrote:
Uptown wrote: If only he can learn to finish through contact at the basket...Also, his jumper is broken.

I don't think the former is a teachable skill, at least at this point.

Think that he can improve his jump shot. It is definitely teachable? Probably the thing most NBA players look to improve most and do each year. Kid is only 22. Some forget that.

I understand jump shots can be improved. I am bearish though on rewriting broke-ass jump shots.

As a phenomenal shooter , I think the single most important factor in shooting is not technique but confidence. Something that cannot be taught but can improve with repetition and success. If you look at some of the better shooters in the league, their technique varies.

confidence is very important. My outside shot was always decent but not great(especially from 3) but you are right you need the right attitude

Yes, but at the same time, there are basic fundamentals that all the great shoots adhere to. Mudiay's J is broken in these respects.

Sure, but your telling me that an NBA palyer, ie Mudiay, does not have those?
And how many unorthodox shooting styles are there/have been in the NBA? Geez, I remember people saying Curry was just chucking the ball up with his technique.

Lol. Got a kick out of this.

Knicksfan
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10/29/2018  3:53 PM
meloshouldgo wrote:
Vmart wrote:Not a fan of anyone getting a shot at pg. It’s Franks and no one should interfere with his development.

Based on what I have seen from Mudiay, I have to agree. The more we experiment the less these guys develop into their roles. But I also think everyone deserves a shot. So not really sure how I feel about this overall.

My hope is that Frank makes the experiment unnecessary with his solid play. I think the next change in the starting lineup should be when Knox earns his way into it and then when KP gets back. Maybe Robinson will lose it to Kanter at some point but Im hoping not because the defense in the starting lineup is nice and Mitch is a big part of it.

Knicks_Fan
TripleThreat
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10/29/2018  4:21 PM
HofstraBBall wrote:We are a rebuilding team To acquire a 22 year old player and give up on him after not even a half a year is not only irrational and impatient but also contradictory to what you claim to be.

This is a problem. Think teams are starting to get that 4 years in the NBA after being drafted at 17 or 18, just makes you what you were 15 years ago in the NBA..... a ROOK!


22 years old is very very young if you want to be an accountant.

He's had plenty of playing time/opportunity in his first three years in the league. He's past the point of development into something that approximates a major leap in skill/production. Other players that people are citing in this thread, they at least showed early on, at least ONE marketable skill set to stay in an NBA rotation. Mudiay is literally good at nothing. Worse, he seems to not care.

People are applying real life standards to a pro sports timeline. Not the same. Two years is FOREVER in professional sports. Four years is an eternity.

"Should have paid Lin and rid ourselves of Melo. Lin makes every team better." - HofstraBBall 11/12/2018
BigDaddyG
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10/29/2018  4:38 PM
HofstraBBall wrote:
BigDaddyG wrote:
StarksEwing1 wrote:
HofstraBBall wrote:
Knickoftime wrote:
HofstraBBall wrote:
Knickoftime wrote:
Uptown wrote: If only he can learn to finish through contact at the basket...Also, his jumper is broken.

I don't think the former is a teachable skill, at least at this point.

Think that he can improve his jump shot. It is definitely teachable? Probably the thing most NBA players look to improve most and do each year. Kid is only 22. Some forget that.

I understand jump shots can be improved. I am bearish though on rewriting broke-ass jump shots.

As a phenomenal shooter , I think the single most important factor in shooting is not technique but confidence. Something that cannot be taught but can improve with repetition and success. If you look at some of the better shooters in the league, their technique varies.

confidence is very important. My outside shot was always decent but not great(especially from 3) but you are right you need the right attitude

Yes, but at the same time, there are basic fundamentals that all the great shoots adhere to. Mudiay's J is broken in these respects.

Sure, but your telling me that an NBA palyer, ie Mudiay, does not have those?
And how many unorthodox shooting styles are there/have been in the NBA? Geez, I remember people saying Curry was just chucking the ball up with his technique.

Lol. Got a kick out of this.


Yeah. For one, when he spots up, he lands all over the place. He just floats to random spots instead having a nice, compact, up down form. That's why his balance looked all screwy last season. Also, all great shooters, no matter how wacky their form is, stay consistent with their motion. Mudiay's shot motion can change from shot to shot in the same game.
Always... always remember: Less is less. More is more. More is better and twice as much is good too. Not enough is bad, and too much is never enough except when it's just about right. - The Tick
Chandler
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10/29/2018  4:49 PM
BigDaddyG wrote:
HofstraBBall wrote:
BigDaddyG wrote:
StarksEwing1 wrote:
HofstraBBall wrote:
Knickoftime wrote:
HofstraBBall wrote:
Knickoftime wrote:
Uptown wrote: If only he can learn to finish through contact at the basket...Also, his jumper is broken.

I don't think the former is a teachable skill, at least at this point.

Think that he can improve his jump shot. It is definitely teachable? Probably the thing most NBA players look to improve most and do each year. Kid is only 22. Some forget that.

I understand jump shots can be improved. I am bearish though on rewriting broke-ass jump shots.

As a phenomenal shooter , I think the single most important factor in shooting is not technique but confidence. Something that cannot be taught but can improve with repetition and success. If you look at some of the better shooters in the league, their technique varies.

confidence is very important. My outside shot was always decent but not great(especially from 3) but you are right you need the right attitude

Yes, but at the same time, there are basic fundamentals that all the great shoots adhere to. Mudiay's J is broken in these respects.

Sure, but your telling me that an NBA palyer, ie Mudiay, does not have those?
And how many unorthodox shooting styles are there/have been in the NBA? Geez, I remember people saying Curry was just chucking the ball up with his technique.

Lol. Got a kick out of this.


Yeah. For one, when he spots up, he lands all over the place. He just floats to random spots instead having a nice, compact, up down form. That's why his balance looked all screwy last season. Also, all great shooters, no matter how wacky their form is, stay consistent with their motion. Mudiay's shot motion can change from shot to shot in the same game.

I shoot better than Mudiay -- and I suck big time. I really hope we (as a team) don't get caught up thinking we'll fix Mudiay. Besides being highly unlikely the time and effort are better spent elsewhere (almost anywhere)

DJMUSIC: Fisher talked a good game in Post game but aside from that Derek Fisher was ALL CHIT CHAT SH_t and produced nothing!
meloshouldgo
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10/29/2018  5:52 PM
Chandler wrote:
BigDaddyG wrote:
HofstraBBall wrote:
BigDaddyG wrote:
StarksEwing1 wrote:
HofstraBBall wrote:
Knickoftime wrote:
HofstraBBall wrote:
Knickoftime wrote:
Uptown wrote: If only he can learn to finish through contact at the basket...Also, his jumper is broken.

I don't think the former is a teachable skill, at least at this point.

Think that he can improve his jump shot. It is definitely teachable? Probably the thing most NBA players look to improve most and do each year. Kid is only 22. Some forget that.

I understand jump shots can be improved. I am bearish though on rewriting broke-ass jump shots.

As a phenomenal shooter , I think the single most important factor in shooting is not technique but confidence. Something that cannot be taught but can improve with repetition and success. If you look at some of the better shooters in the league, their technique varies.

confidence is very important. My outside shot was always decent but not great(especially from 3) but you are right you need the right attitude

Yes, but at the same time, there are basic fundamentals that all the great shoots adhere to. Mudiay's J is broken in these respects.

Sure, but your telling me that an NBA palyer, ie Mudiay, does not have those?
And how many unorthodox shooting styles are there/have been in the NBA? Geez, I remember people saying Curry was just chucking the ball up with his technique.

Lol. Got a kick out of this.


Yeah. For one, when he spots up, he lands all over the place. He just floats to random spots instead having a nice, compact, up down form. That's why his balance looked all screwy last season. Also, all great shooters, no matter how wacky their form is, stay consistent with their motion. Mudiay's shot motion can change from shot to shot in the same game.

I shoot better than Mudiay -- and I suck big time. I really hope we (as a team) don't get caught up thinking we'll fix Mudiay. Besides being highly unlikely the time and effort are better spent elsewhere (almost anywhere)

Right. If we had drafted him, I would feel differently but as is he isn't our project This is why I had issue with the Burke and Mudiay signings. They are not going to help us win and wr have players with equal or higher upside to develop in Frank and Dotson. The justification given that they were "lottery picks" and so worth another shot was always pretty lame. They don't do anything very well. But people fell in love with Burke's ball hogging and scoring to nobody's surprise. Even if we had gotten one instead of two it would have made sense, but our FO didn't make sense. And the fact that Frank is trying to change his game shows he is coachable and willing to adjust. Makes you wonder WTF Hornacek was doing?

I cannot teach anybody anything. I can only try to make them think - Socrates
Vmart
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10/29/2018  6:15 PM
Only reason Mudiay is getting opportunities is simply because he was a lottery pick nothing more. I wish the Knicks had given a shot like Mudiay is getting for Greek Freaks brother.
Kemet
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10/29/2018  6:46 PM
Mudiay are the only guard I seen play well alongside of Timmy !!!
BigDaddyG
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10/29/2018  6:50 PM
Kemet wrote:Mudiay are the only guard I seen play well alongside of Timmy !!!

Timmy plays the same no matter who is in the backcourt. He doesn't need much chemistry to jack up shots lol

Always... always remember: Less is less. More is more. More is better and twice as much is good too. Not enough is bad, and too much is never enough except when it's just about right. - The Tick
Welpee
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10/29/2018  8:46 PM    LAST EDITED: 10/29/2018  8:50 PM
TripleThreat wrote:
HofstraBBall wrote:We are a rebuilding team To acquire a 22 year old player and give up on him after not even a half a year is not only irrational and impatient but also contradictory to what you claim to be.

This is a problem. Think teams are starting to get that 4 years in the NBA after being drafted at 17 or 18, just makes you what you were 15 years ago in the NBA..... a ROOK!


22 years old is very very young if you want to be an accountant.

He's had plenty of playing time/opportunity in his first three years in the league. He's past the point of development into something that approximates a major leap in skill/production. Other players that people are citing in this thread, they at least showed early on, at least ONE marketable skill set to stay in an NBA rotation. Mudiay is literally good at nothing. Worse, he seems to not care.

People are applying real life standards to a pro sports timeline. Not the same. Two years is FOREVER in professional sports. Four years is an eternity.

Everybody is love with Terry Rozier now. Compare his stats through age 22 with Mudiay's at the same age, both actual stats and per 36 minutes. Compare his stats to Chauncey Billups at the same age.

For the record, I'm off the Mudiay bandwagon but I don't agree with the "you are who you are at age 22" argument.

HofstraBBall
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10/30/2018  7:49 AM    LAST EDITED: 10/30/2018  9:44 AM
TripleThreat wrote:
HofstraBBall wrote:We are a rebuilding team To acquire a 22 year old player and give up on him after not even a half a year is not only irrational and impatient but also contradictory to what you claim to be.

This is a problem. Think teams are starting to get that 4 years in the NBA after being drafted at 17 or 18, just makes you what you were 15 years ago in the NBA..... a ROOK!


22 years old is very very young if you want to be an accountant.

He's had plenty of playing time/opportunity in his first three years in the league. He's past the point of development into something that approximates a major leap in skill/production. Other players that people are citing in this thread, they at least showed early on, at least ONE marketable skill set to stay in an NBA rotation. Mudiay is literally good at nothing. Worse, he seems to not care.

People are applying real life standards to a pro sports timeline. Not the same. Two years is FOREVER in professional sports. Four years is an eternity.

Underatood. You think 22 is too old. My opinion was that it is only irrational, impatient fans who have that expectation. And bad NBA front offices. Perry and Fizdale are showing that they agree and are not. Your opinion that he is literally good at nothing only emphasizes my point.

Nalod
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10/30/2018  8:00 AM
Dig deeper and perhaps we can see the potential and what FO might see as POTENTIAL.
His year in China was a waste, he was hurt. I think he missed a lot of his second year. This kid has not gotten off to a good start and Denver Drafts Murray who is the real deal.
We might perceive "because he was lotto pick" as why FO is giving him a chance. Thats all it is btw, a chance. He is not being handed anything.
What he does well is not being discussed. Lets be real, he is not here because he was succeeding elsewhere, he is a project that might become and enigma. To simply say "he is garbage" is easy. To say "he won't amount to anything" does not make anyone here smart, its just math. The odds are not in his favor given the logical reasons. The fact he has not succeeded anywhere but in high school at a high level and is now 22 puts him at the crossroads of a career. Its not looking good.
But he put in the work and your looking at incremental improvement.
He can penetrate but needs to finish stronger. He needs to improve his shot. The rest of it is pretty good. He passes well and is a big strong kid. We have little to lose here. Baker is about cooked here and Clee is off the timeline. I think Trier sticks and Burke will move on.

This is how it works, nobody saw Trier coming and you try things. "Luck" is created with frequent opportunities. Vonleh looks like a keeper but price will eventually matter. Mario might not be beyond this year as Knox and KP will eat many minutes in the front court. We have free agent money and likely a top 10 draft pick.

Knicks1248: 1. Dolan should be more involved! 2. Why would any knick fan want pick 8, when that spot has a history of producing marginal NBA taken. (He prefers pick 9th instead)
franco12
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10/30/2018  9:11 AM
TripleThreat wrote:
HofstraBBall wrote:We are a rebuilding team To acquire a 22 year old player and give up on him after not even a half a year is not only irrational and impatient but also contradictory to what you claim to be.

This is a problem. Think teams are starting to get that 4 years in the NBA after being drafted at 17 or 18, just makes you what you were 15 years ago in the NBA..... a ROOK!


22 years old is very very young if you want to be an accountant.

He's had plenty of playing time/opportunity in his first three years in the league. He's past the point of development into something that approximates a major leap in skill/production. Other players that people are citing in this thread, they at least showed early on, at least ONE marketable skill set to stay in an NBA rotation. Mudiay is literally good at nothing. Worse, he seems to not care.

People are applying real life standards to a pro sports timeline. Not the same. Two years is FOREVER in professional sports. Four years is an eternity.

So should we cut Trey Burke? He's much older, had more opportunity and is only serviceable for us?

Until he is out of the league, he has potential. TO my eye, he's shown flashes of having an NBA game. True, the inconsistent play has been worrying.

This is really his year to prove whether he belongs. I hope we do our best to help him fulfill his potential. You can't teach the physical skills and attributes he has.

SupremeCommander
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10/30/2018  9:12 AM
Marv wrote:i'm digging vonleh. he's a beast and has good aggressiveness, but at the same time he's got some surprising ball skills, like an anthony mason.

funny to see you say this. I am a big fan of Vonleh and his old school game. I think he got given up on because he's not a new school stretch big. Whatever. He brings something to the table for sure, especially at $1.6 million

GustavBahler said: Check please....
Cartman718
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10/30/2018  9:20 AM
Welpee wrote:
TripleThreat wrote:
HofstraBBall wrote:We are a rebuilding team To acquire a 22 year old player and give up on him after not even a half a year is not only irrational and impatient but also contradictory to what you claim to be.

This is a problem. Think teams are starting to get that 4 years in the NBA after being drafted at 17 or 18, just makes you what you were 15 years ago in the NBA..... a ROOK!


22 years old is very very young if you want to be an accountant.

He's had plenty of playing time/opportunity in his first three years in the league. He's past the point of development into something that approximates a major leap in skill/production. Other players that people are citing in this thread, they at least showed early on, at least ONE marketable skill set to stay in an NBA rotation. Mudiay is literally good at nothing. Worse, he seems to not care.

People are applying real life standards to a pro sports timeline. Not the same. Two years is FOREVER in professional sports. Four years is an eternity.

Everybody is love with Terry Rozier now. Compare his stats through age 22 with Mudiay's at the same age, both actual stats and per 36 minutes. Compare his stats to Chauncey Billups at the same age.

For the record, I'm off the Mudiay bandwagon but I don't agree with the "you are who you are at age 22" argument.

Agree. It's not like Frank didn't play pro ball before getting drafted. Its not like Mudiay didn't play pro ball before getting drafted. If Frank can grow, why not Mudiay. It's not an age thing, it's a mindset thing. Mudiay needs to play with the same fire as Trier and he will be fine. He might even get into the starting lineup if he plays with that much aggression.

Nixluva is posting triangle screen grabs, even when nobody asks - Fishmike. LOL So are we going to reference that thread like the bible now? "The thread of Wroten Page 14 post 9" - EnySpree
Cartman718
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10/30/2018  9:22 AM
franco12 wrote:
TripleThreat wrote:
HofstraBBall wrote:We are a rebuilding team To acquire a 22 year old player and give up on him after not even a half a year is not only irrational and impatient but also contradictory to what you claim to be.

This is a problem. Think teams are starting to get that 4 years in the NBA after being drafted at 17 or 18, just makes you what you were 15 years ago in the NBA..... a ROOK!


22 years old is very very young if you want to be an accountant.

He's had plenty of playing time/opportunity in his first three years in the league. He's past the point of development into something that approximates a major leap in skill/production. Other players that people are citing in this thread, they at least showed early on, at least ONE marketable skill set to stay in an NBA rotation. Mudiay is literally good at nothing. Worse, he seems to not care.

People are applying real life standards to a pro sports timeline. Not the same. Two years is FOREVER in professional sports. Four years is an eternity.

So should we cut Trey Burke? He's much older, had more opportunity and is only serviceable for us?

Until he is out of the league, he has potential. TO my eye, he's shown flashes of having an NBA game. True, the inconsistent play has been worrying.

This is really his year to prove whether he belongs. I hope we do our best to help him fulfill his potential. You can't teach the physical skills and attributes he has.

Burke is good NOW with young legs and able to create separation, but it's not like he's great coming off screens like Timmy or Trier. But in no way do I see him doing the same things for this team 3 years from now.

Nixluva is posting triangle screen grabs, even when nobody asks - Fishmike. LOL So are we going to reference that thread like the bible now? "The thread of Wroten Page 14 post 9" - EnySpree
Knicksfan
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10/30/2018  9:29 AM
As someone already mentioned, not giving Mudiay a chance to settle into a solid pro player given his young age and lack of a steady opportunity so far in his career would be a terrible mistake. Will that be as a starting point guard? Might not be the way Frank is setting into his new role, but it doesn't mean that Mudiay can't become a valuable 6th man and leader of the second unit.

Im not sure about Burke, so Mudiay fulfilling the promise that made him a lottery pick at some point would be an amazing development and we seem to have the best coach on the job. Will it happen? Its up to Mudiay, but it should be exciting for him to know that he will have the opportunity. Hopefully he will seize it and prove to be another valuable piece for the future.

Knicks_Fan
Fiz, Mudiay will eventually get a chance to start at point guard

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