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Article on the option of buying out and stretching a contract to make the cap hit less
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CrushAlot
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9/1/2018  10:12 AM
The article is written about Luol Deng but could apply to Noah as well.
https://www.givemesport.com/1381117-with-a-deadline-coming-up-the-luol-deng-situation-could-soon-be-resolved
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TheGame
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9/1/2018  10:27 AM    LAST EDITED: 9/1/2018  12:10 PM
CrushAlot wrote:The article is written about Luol Deng but could apply to Noah as well.
https://www.givemesport.com/1381117-with-a-deadline-coming-up-the-luol-deng-situation-could-soon-be-resolved

Thanks. Good read. We should tell Noah either agree to a buyout saving us $5-$7 mil or we will sit you all season and not cut you until next summer.

Playoffs or bust
CrushAlot
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9/1/2018  11:33 AM
You playTrey Burke... Wally Szcerbiak
smackeddog
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9/1/2018  3:31 PM
Deng gave up 7.5mil in the buyout! We can but hope Noah has such mercy
meloshouldgo
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9/1/2018  3:43 PM
smackeddog wrote:Deng gave up 7.5mil in the buyout! We can but hope Noah has such mercy

All we have done is dump on him, why should he? Hope is not a good approach toi decision making. If we stretch him, we should undertstand what he wants to do - first.

I cannot teach anybody anything. I can only try to make them think - Socrates
CrushAlot
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9/1/2018  4:43 PM
meloshouldgo wrote:
smackeddog wrote:Deng gave up 7.5mil in the buyout! We can but hope Noah has such mercy

All we have done is dump on him, why should he? Hope is not a good approach toi decision making. If we stretch him, we should undertstand what he wants to do - first.


I would think that the Knicks would give Noah's agent permission to explore the market for Noah if he were to be a free agent. The amount Noah would give back he would get in his next contract. That is generally how buyouts work. The recent buyouts, Melo, Howard and Deng all involved the player giving back money they would make on their next deal.
In regards to Noah, a lot of the blame for things not working out is on him. Coming to camp out of shape and getting injured, getting suspended for ped use is all on him. I thought Jeff pulling him out of his last game during garbage time was an @sshole move. But the guy had made many mistakes prior to that. The Knicks pay Noah 18 mil annually. He hasn't been very professional during his time in ny.
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meloshouldgo
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9/1/2018  7:13 PM
CrushAlot wrote:
meloshouldgo wrote:
smackeddog wrote:Deng gave up 7.5mil in the buyout! We can but hope Noah has such mercy

All we have done is dump on him, why should he? Hope is not a good approach toi decision making. If we stretch him, we should undertstand what he wants to do - first.


I would think that the Knicks would give Noah's agent permission to explore the market for Noah if he were to be a free agent. The amount Noah would give back he would get in his next contract. That is generally how buyouts work. The recent buyouts, Melo, Howard and Deng all involved the player giving back money they would make on their next deal.
In regards to Noah, a lot of the blame for things not working out is on him. Coming to camp out of shape and getting injured, getting suspended for ped use is all on him. I thought Jeff pulling him out of his last game during garbage time was an @sshole move. But the guy had made many mistakes prior to that. The Knicks pay Noah 18 mil annually. He hasn't been very professional during his time in ny.

This only shows your level of hate, that you blame getting injured on the player.
If Noah had any shot aary a contact after this Hornacek's ideology and Knicks management have completely destroyed it.

I cannot teach anybody anything. I can only try to make them think - Socrates
TLover
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9/1/2018  10:39 PM
I can see Noah giving up what he would get for a vet minimum (that’s all he’ll get) Can’t see him giving up as much as Deng did. For all we know, Magic (or his buddies) will make a charitable donation to where Deng is from in Africa to make up the difference.
CrushAlot
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9/1/2018  10:52 PM
meloshouldgo wrote:
CrushAlot wrote:
meloshouldgo wrote:
smackeddog wrote:Deng gave up 7.5mil in the buyout! We can but hope Noah has such mercy
All we have done is dump on him, why should he? Hope is not a good approach toi decision making. If we stretch him, we should undertstand what he wants to do - first.

I would think that the Knicks would give Noah's agent permission to explore the market for Noah if he were to be a free agent. The amount Noah would give back he would get in his next contract. That is generally how buyouts work. The recent buyouts, Melo, Howard and Deng all involved the player giving back money they would make on their next deal.
In regards to Noah, a lot of the blame for things not working out is on him. Coming to camp out of shape and getting injured, getting suspended for ped use is all on him. I thought Jeff pulling him out of his last game during garbage time was an @sshole move. But the guy had made many mistakes prior to that. The Knicks pay Noah 18 mil annually. He hasn't been very professional during his time in ny.

This only shows your level of hate, that you blame getting injured on the player.
If Noah had any shot aary a contact after this Hornacek's ideology and Knicks management have completely destroyed it.
I loved Noah on the Bulls. I was worried about the signing because every guy that I respect that covers the NBA hated the deal he got at his age. But coming into camp out of shape and getting injured is all on Noah. Taking peds and getting suspended is on Noah. If calling him out for that is hate I will own it. But I'd long see it that way.
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QnzKnickerbocker87
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9/2/2018  12:24 AM
I thought I read somewhere that not only does Noah want to play, he's adamant abt getting the full value of what's left of his contract. He aint givin money back in a buyout. Sorry to burst any1's bubble with that but its just wishful thinking
smackeddog
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9/2/2018  3:42 AM
QnzKnickerbocker87 wrote:I thought I read somewhere that not only does Noah want to play, he's adamant abt getting the full value of what's left of his contract. He aint givin money back in a buyout. Sorry to burst any1's bubble with that but its just wishful thinking

He's also desperate to play. If he plays again this year he has a reasonable chance of at least being a backup with another team for a few seasons. If he misses another full season (because we won't play him or release him), then I think his chances of getting another chance decline (as well as him losing another year when he only has a few left). If he refuses to lose any money in a buyout then we can actually hold his career to ransom and say we'll only stretch him at the end of the season. We do have some leverage.

arkrud
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9/2/2018  10:40 AM
LA need every dollar of the cap to contend while LBJ is still cooking.
Knicks are not going to win many games this season so why would they take on more salary later when it matters.
Noah will be expireable at right time so just let him play if he can or send him to smoke weed with Phil ans talk Zen.
He can teach them to meditate... but no one can control even his own mind...
CrushAlot
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9/2/2018  12:13 PM
You playTrey Burke... Wally Szcerbiak
smackeddog
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9/2/2018  2:03 PM
If we have a max slot without dumpling Lee's salary, maybe the wiser thing is to look into trading him for a similar 2 year contract but for a pf/s or SF, rather than a salary dump. Any suggestions?
TripleThreat
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9/2/2018  9:31 PM
meloshouldgo wrote:
CrushAlot wrote:
meloshouldgo wrote:
smackeddog wrote:Deng gave up 7.5mil in the buyout! We can but hope Noah has such mercy

All we have done is dump on him, why should he? Hope is not a good approach toi decision making. If we stretch him, we should undertstand what he wants to do - first.


I would think that the Knicks would give Noah's agent permission to explore the market for Noah if he were to be a free agent. The amount Noah would give back he would get in his next contract. That is generally how buyouts work. The recent buyouts, Melo, Howard and Deng all involved the player giving back money they would make on their next deal.
In regards to Noah, a lot of the blame for things not working out is on him. Coming to camp out of shape and getting injured, getting suspended for ped use is all on him. I thought Jeff pulling him out of his last game during garbage time was an @sshole move. But the guy had made many mistakes prior to that. The Knicks pay Noah 18 mil annually. He hasn't been very professional during his time in ny.

This only shows your level of hate, that you blame getting injured on the player.
If Noah had any shot aary a contact after this Hornacek's ideology and Knicks management have completely destroyed it.

Noah got caught doing PEDS. In the NBA, in the modern era, if you are caught using PEDS and are not a fringe player, you are one of two things

1) An idiot
2) An *******

Fringe players like Lance Thomas might have an excuse. They are repped often by lower level agents without access. They don't get endorsement and brand support. The league doesn't care about them. The networks don't care about them.

Noah is an established veteran player, who comes from bloodlines from his dad in terms of professional sports. His agent is Bill Duffy, well established. It's your agents job to let you know when your PEDS tests, the "random" ones are coming up.

EVERYONE uses PEDS. EVERYONE.

Getting caught means you are an imbecile. Or you just don't give a ****. Neither answer is good.

Take Hornacek out of the equation, put in any other coach. And guess what? Noah is still an *******. Got busted for PEDS. Bitched to the media. Came in out of shape. Entitled. Played like **** when he did get on the court.

Ryan Anderson was overpaid but was a good teammate and still worked hard and still did his part in his lockerroom.

It's on Noah to show up, be in shape, not be a total *******, try and don't get caught cheating when the structure is designed so no one really gets caught cheating. The NBA literally giftwraps it to you. How do you **** this up?

Is it his fault he's injured? Be in shape and you remove all criticism for your injury. We all watched CC Sabathia go hot and cold over time. He's great sometimes now and then he's not. All that weight doesn't help.

Noah wanted a max paycheck to go play for Thibs. That's it. That's where all this bull**** is coming from. If he actually tried, that's one thing. But he didn't. I don't have a problem with players who put in the work and effort and just can't make it. Scotty Machado was a one note type player, great passer and nothing else, who put his heart on the floor when he got a chance. Just not good enough. OK, it happens. That's one thing. Just not giving a **** is another. Fuck Noah.

A disgrace every time he put on that beloved Knicks jersey.

Fuck Noah. Piece of ****.

"Should have paid Lin and rid ourselves of Melo. Lin makes every team better." - HofstraBBall 11/12/2018
Marv
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9/3/2018  3:01 PM
and f**k that moron jackson for that signing. how the hell do you give that player at that age in that physical shape with that injury history that contract?
“This board has become a repository for mentally unstable attention seekers. Or gimmick posters.” - sebstar
smackeddog
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9/3/2018  4:28 PM
Marv wrote:and f**k that moron jackson for that signing. how the hell do you give that player at that age in that physical shape with that injury history that contract?

I think the reasoning at the time was that Phil met him and pulled his arm, which was all the proof needed that his shoulder was mined and he would be healthy forever more.

TripleThreat
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9/3/2018  7:56 PM
Marv wrote:and f**k that moron jackson for that signing. how the hell do you give that player at that age in that physical shape with that injury history that contract?


Dealing with the Bulls or former Bulls was an issue

Bill Paxton is in the Bull front office.

BJ Armstrong is Derrick Rose's agent

Billy Duffy, Noah's agent, had ties to Jackson from the international basketball community.

Noah in his prime was a close to prototypical Triangle pivot. High IQ, relentless defender, a really good decision maker on the court. What really set Noah apart from many pivots was his incredible timing. Not on a Draymond Green/Joe Dumars level, but just innate ability to read the floor and predict how a play would eventually unfold. Master of sliding in and out to avoid the three second violation. Great help defender. Could range out anywhere.

Jackson, as the rumors go, avoided a lot of other front office people he didn't know well, because he couldn't actually answer many questions that would arise in trade talks. He was a coach, never trained to run a front office.

It's like the show Friends, Chandler married Monica because she was single and lived next door. That's it. Path of least resistance. Noah was a path of least resistance. Jackson was in love what Noah used to be, needed to make the playoffs to keep his job and so gutted the Knicks future to get Noah, Lee, Jennings, Rose, etc. And Noah was in the small circle around where Jackson would actually engage other front offices. Lots of people sadly could not reach Phil Jackson when he was with the Knicks.

What is key to note is relationships. Most of you are still in the working world right now. Relationships are critical. People will help and engage people they know and trust and bond with and can relate to in some way. A guy like Perry has those relationships in place. A guy like Jackson did not. Jackson sought options based on his pre-existing relationships in the league. He just was not wired in to other GMs, scouts, agents and other owners like most seasoned front office guys.

I recognize in all of the major New York sports, fans get livid when the Jets or Mets get a retread. An aging has been coach or GM who didn't do much in his last few stops. Well again, those relationships are critical. While the guy might be an idiot, he might just be wired in and that's enough. If Rich Paul wasn't best friends with LBJ, he'd be running a car wash. He's like that midget on the show Entourage. Power by mere association.

If you want proof, just remember Brian Schottenheimer dragging the Jets offense into the ground again and again. He's not there because he's some world class talent, he's there because his dad Marty was beloved by many of the old guard in the league.

In his prime, Noah would have really tore the league apart if he was a Triangle center with some real talent around him. Noah has just raw willpower. He willed himself into being a better player. Just blood and grit. I love the old version of Noah. Used to be one of my most favorite players. But now he's just an *******. The difference is just raw effort. Again, some of you are in management somewhere, anyone here ever give a new kid a chance because you liked his moxy, his work ethic, his relentless dogged pursuit of excellence?

Noah could still be a useful, but heavily overpaid, player, but he just doesn't care.

Bad contract is on Phil.
Not giving a **** is on Noah.

What guys currently playing do not understand is real despair. I've seen it up close and it's brutal. It's guys who didn't do their best/try their best and live to regret it every day the rest of their lives. Guys like Donovan McNabb, huffing and puffing to the line of scrimmage in the Super Bowl because he wasn't in better shape, burning precious seconds on the clock. The kid who stole Derek Jeter's glove, then got dumped in a trade and had to wonder what if he didn't do that, would his career be different. Noah, guys like him and Melo, one day, they will look back, and regret it all.

"Should have paid Lin and rid ourselves of Melo. Lin makes every team better." - HofstraBBall 11/12/2018
TLover
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9/3/2018  10:08 PM
Ideally I would like to trade C.Lee for expirings & a young prospect then trade Noah for Gourgi Deng whose contract runs a year longer but a couple million less per. Might even get a pick out of Minny for taking extra year and Deng would be a good backup center. With C.Lee off the books and Deng making a few million less than Noah we should have enough for a max contract next season.
Cartman718
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9/4/2018  11:21 AM    LAST EDITED: 9/4/2018  11:22 AM
smackeddog wrote:
Marv wrote:and f**k that moron jackson for that signing. how the hell do you give that player at that age in that physical shape with that injury history that contract?

I think the reasoning at the time was that Phil met him and pulled his arm, which was all the proof needed that his shoulder was mined and he would be healthy forever more.

yes coz Phil thought he knows more than physio therapist experts in the world.

Nixluva is posting triangle screen grabs, even when nobody asks - Fishmike. LOL So are we going to reference that thread like the bible now? "The thread of Wroten Page 14 post 9" - EnySpree
Article on the option of buying out and stretching a contract to make the cap hit less

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