[ IMAGES: Images ON turn off | ACCOUNT: User Status is LOCKED why? ]

David Fizdale
Author Thread
Chandler
Posts: 22545
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 11/26/2015
Member: #6197

4/18/2018  10:55 AM
Intrigued but would pass. IMO he wants a team of defensive grinders and will push the superstars to be super (nothing wrong with any of this in principle) However, our superstar is a bit sensitive (sorry love KP, but it's true) and we don't have the team or DNA for what he wants

Intrigued by Stack, expecting Blatt will make it to the final cut, and hoping that somehow our FO is smarter than they appear to me and actually can get a coach with some new ideas (Wright? who is the next Stevens) to extract the most out of a team, instill an identity, and find better ways to maximize KP's unique talents.

DJMUSIC: Fisher talked a good game in Post game but aside from that Derek Fisher was ALL CHIT CHAT SH_t and produced nothing!
AUTOADVERT
Uptown
Posts: 26662
Alba Posts: 3
Joined: 4/1/2008
Member: #1883

4/18/2018  12:58 PM
Chandler wrote:Intrigued but would pass. IMO he wants a team of defensive grinders and will push the superstars to be super (nothing wrong with any of this in principle) However, our superstar is a bit sensitive (sorry love KP, but it's true) and we don't have the team or DNA for what he wants

Intrigued by Stack, expecting Blatt will make it to the final cut, and hoping that somehow our FO is smarter than they appear to me and actually can get a coach with some new ideas (Wright? who is the next Stevens) to extract the most out of a team, instill an identity, and find better ways to maximize KP's unique talents.

So, you're saying he wants defensive grinders and he will push his superstars to the next level and you dont want this guy? You must be in love with the product we have been been putting on the floor the past decade

Basically, you are saying we do not have any players on this team with Championship DNA?! If thats the case, why are any of them worth keeping? Other than KP, everyone else is expendable. If he is the coach that can do everything you say he can, we need to hire him ASAP so we can get this thing turned around.

fishmike
Posts: 48783
Alba Posts: 1
Joined: 7/19/2002
Member: #298
USA
4/18/2018  1:36 PM
Uptown you have made me very open to Fizdale. Didnt know a ton about him. The Gasol thing is a question mark that should be answered. I mean you have to do a better job regardless of how difficult a player is being. But all signs point to him being a quality hire with a great BB mind.

I think the only guy I would dislike is Jackson. His issues suggest its a personality problem. We will see. In many ways this is the first defining move of the org. You knew they had to trade Melo. They clearly already decided on the draft so this is the first BIG call. It must be a developmental guy (which actually may be JAckson's strength).

Its very hard to quantify coaches... I am sure most are pretty good and could succeed in the right setting. Some succeed in more settings than others. Really what needs to happen is we get a guy who works well with the front office. If that is Blatt, Stackhouse or Fizdale fine.

Chandler
Posts: 22545
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 11/26/2015
Member: #6197

4/18/2018  1:58 PM
Uptown wrote:
Chandler wrote:Intrigued but would pass. IMO he wants a team of defensive grinders and will push the superstars to be super (nothing wrong with any of this in principle) However, our superstar is a bit sensitive (sorry love KP, but it's true) and we don't have the team or DNA for what he wants

Intrigued by Stack, expecting Blatt will make it to the final cut, and hoping that somehow our FO is smarter than they appear to me and actually can get a coach with some new ideas (Wright? who is the next Stevens) to extract the most out of a team, instill an identity, and find better ways to maximize KP's unique talents.

So, you're saying he wants defensive grinders and he will push his superstars to the next level and you dont want this guy? You must be in love with the product we have been been putting on the floor the past decade

Basically, you are saying we do not have any players on this team with Championship DNA?! If thats the case, why are any of them worth keeping? Other than KP, everyone else is expendable. If he is the coach that can do everything you say he can, we need to hire him ASAP so we can get this thing turned around.


Haha. As is said nothing wrong with any of this in principle. Issue is you need another rebuild from bottom up to fit his style.

I'm hoping for someone a bit more creative. You look at Brad Stevens and he made a no-defense smurf an MVP candidate somehow extracting his strengths and hiding his weaknesses. I would like a coach who can similarly maximize our guys like KP (e.g., hide his weak defense at the perimeter) or Frank (so the news is always about his defense and its impact -- and not that he's not a Rose/DSJ-type).

We need more talent for sure but we also need a great, great coach

DJMUSIC: Fisher talked a good game in Post game but aside from that Derek Fisher was ALL CHIT CHAT SH_t and produced nothing!
knicks1248
Posts: 37409
Alba Posts: 1
Joined: 2/3/2004
Member: #582
4/18/2018  2:16 PM
fishmike wrote:Uptown you have made me very open to Fizdale. Didnt know a ton about him. The Gasol thing is a question mark that should be answered. I mean you have to do a better job regardless of how difficult a player is being. But all signs point to him being a quality hire with a great BB mind.

I think the only guy I would dislike is Jackson. His issues suggest its a personality problem. We will see. In many ways this is the first defining move of the org. You knew they had to trade Melo. They clearly already decided on the draft so this is the first BIG call. It must be a developmental guy (which actually may be JAckson's strength).

Its very hard to quantify coaches... I am sure most are pretty good and could succeed in the right setting. Some succeed in more settings than others. Really what needs to happen is we get a guy who works well with the front office. If that is Blatt, Stackhouse or Fizdale fine.


Every Coach is going to have flaws, and every coach we interview (aside fram Stack) was fired for one reason or another.

The worst part is, after listening to this POD CAST http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/basketball/knicks/dn-sports-talk-podcast-knicks-talk-stefan-bondy-article-1.3939715

These guys are right, perry was part of a FO in orlando that had no success hiring coaches, and Mills was part of The fisher/JH process.

Now if you trust the FO to learn from it's many mistakes and overlook their blunders and poor decisions. why don't you do the same for every candidate including mark. Your basing your opinion on his relationship with someone else.

ES
Nalod
Posts: 55712
Alba Posts: 151
Joined: 12/24/2003
Member: #508
USA
4/18/2018  2:30 PM
Good points by all.
Its hard to assimilate a past situation and extrapolate it into the future!
Have to admit its a recipe that can't be replicated.
To say "New ideas" but change is not always improvement, and its the personal!
Melo had how many coaches and only Woodson did he thrive under who basically let him be himself. You trade for Melo, that's what your supposed to do.
MDA could not bend him.
Gasol might be a salty one and non yielding. Fizz might be 100% correct as was Don Nelson with Ewing but whats right for the franchise is whats best.
We have talked the dynamics of ownership as having the final say and we don't know why ORlando was so bad under their GM and assistant. Vogel was a good hire for them and they mucked it up. To transpose that dynamic to NY is a stretch unless there are relevant circumstances.
Just Cuz MIlls was in the room with Phil does not mean it was wrong. I thought Kerr was a good hire was was Fish. Who Knew Fish would divorce his wife and start phuching everything in sight? JH was not a bad hire. Lets be real, some of the same problems might have surfaced with the same cast of players. Noah's PED's, Rose Awals, KP gets 'Tude, Melo shown the door, etc. Another coach might have more or a different drama.
Its a Soap opera in NY!!!
Knicks1248: 1. Dolan should be more involved! 2. Why would any knick fan want pick 8, when that spot has a history of producing marginal NBA taken. (He prefers pick 9th instead)
Uptown
Posts: 26662
Alba Posts: 3
Joined: 4/1/2008
Member: #1883

4/18/2018  2:56 PM
fishmike wrote:Uptown you have made me very open to Fizdale. Didnt know a ton about him. The Gasol thing is a question mark that should be answered. I mean you have to do a better job regardless of how difficult a player is being. But all signs point to him being a quality hire with a great BB mind.

I think the only guy I would dislike is Jackson. His issues suggest its a personality problem. We will see. In many ways this is the first defining move of the org. You knew they had to trade Melo. They clearly already decided on the draft so this is the first BIG call. It must be a developmental guy (which actually may be JAckson's strength).

Its very hard to quantify coaches... I am sure most are pretty good and could succeed in the right setting. Some succeed in more settings than others. Really what needs to happen is we get a guy who works well with the front office. If that is Blatt, Stackhouse or Fizdale fine.

Agreed on all accounts...This is a huge decision for this franchise, one that could push us forward into respectability and eventually contention. I believe Fizdale can do that. He's a basketball lifer, 24/7 workaholic who was apart of a championship coaching staff (twice) and worked under Riles and Spo. He's young, and from I read he relates well to the players, Lebron, Wade, etc all love him. I agree that he does need to answer about the Gasol situation but to me, he's the best candidate on out list by far.

This hire can also push us back into the Circus like atmosphere. Thats why, I agree that I wold stay as far away from Mark Jackson as possible...Supposedly, Jackson had a really good relation with Curry and Klay but he has too much baggage. The last thing this Franchise needs is another Diva (Isiah, Big Chief Triangle, Next-Town-Brown). We need a coach and front office that will keep all Knick business on the court!!!! Mark strikes me a coach that will ruffle some feathers and 2 years from now, all kinds of behind the scenes nonsense will surface. No thanks!!!

fishmike
Posts: 48783
Alba Posts: 1
Joined: 7/19/2002
Member: #298
USA
4/18/2018  3:12 PM
Uptown wrote:
fishmike wrote:Uptown you have made me very open to Fizdale. Didnt know a ton about him. The Gasol thing is a question mark that should be answered. I mean you have to do a better job regardless of how difficult a player is being. But all signs point to him being a quality hire with a great BB mind.

I think the only guy I would dislike is Jackson. His issues suggest its a personality problem. We will see. In many ways this is the first defining move of the org. You knew they had to trade Melo. They clearly already decided on the draft so this is the first BIG call. It must be a developmental guy (which actually may be JAckson's strength).

Its very hard to quantify coaches... I am sure most are pretty good and could succeed in the right setting. Some succeed in more settings than others. Really what needs to happen is we get a guy who works well with the front office. If that is Blatt, Stackhouse or Fizdale fine.

Agreed on all accounts...This is a huge decision for this franchise, one that could push us forward into respectability and eventually contention. I believe Fizdale can do that. He's a basketball lifer, 24/7 workaholic who was apart of a championship coaching staff (twice) and worked under Riles and Spo. He's young, and from I read he relates well to the players, Lebron, Wade, etc all love him. I agree that he does need to answer about the Gasol situation but to me, he's the best candidate on out list by far.

This hire can also push us back into the Circus like atmosphere. Thats why, I agree that I wold stay as far away from Mark Jackson as possible...Supposedly, Jackson had a really good relation with Curry and Klay but he has too much baggage. The last thing this Franchise needs is another Diva (Isiah, Big Chief Triangle, Next-Town-Brown). We need a coach and front office that will keep all Knick business on the court!!!! Mark strikes me a coach that will ruffle some feathers and 2 years from now, all kinds of behind the scenes nonsense will surface. No thanks!!!

Jason Kidd is another. You nailed it... lets pass on the circus and focus on the game.
Uptown
Posts: 26662
Alba Posts: 3
Joined: 4/1/2008
Member: #1883

4/18/2018  3:16 PM
Chandler wrote:
Uptown wrote:
Chandler wrote:Intrigued but would pass. IMO he wants a team of defensive grinders and will push the superstars to be super (nothing wrong with any of this in principle) However, our superstar is a bit sensitive (sorry love KP, but it's true) and we don't have the team or DNA for what he wants

Intrigued by Stack, expecting Blatt will make it to the final cut, and hoping that somehow our FO is smarter than they appear to me and actually can get a coach with some new ideas (Wright? who is the next Stevens) to extract the most out of a team, instill an identity, and find better ways to maximize KP's unique talents.

So, you're saying he wants defensive grinders and he will push his superstars to the next level and you dont want this guy? You must be in love with the product we have been been putting on the floor the past decade

Basically, you are saying we do not have any players on this team with Championship DNA?! If thats the case, why are any of them worth keeping? Other than KP, everyone else is expendable. If he is the coach that can do everything you say he can, we need to hire him ASAP so we can get this thing turned around.


Haha. As is said nothing wrong with any of this in principle. Issue is you need another rebuild from bottom up to fit his style.

I'm hoping for someone a bit more creative. You look at Brad Stevens and he made a no-defense smurf an MVP candidate somehow extracting his strengths and hiding his weaknesses. I would like a coach who can similarly maximize our guys like KP (e.g., hide his weak defense at the perimeter) or Frank (so the news is always about his defense and its impact -- and not that he's not a Rose/DSJ-type).

We need more talent for sure but we also need a great, great coach

What part of the rebuild do you think we are in? We are pretty close to the bottom now. Hopefully we will make it back to the playoffs in our lifetime and when we do, how many of our current starters do you think will still be starting? Lots of room and time to build a team the way Fiz might want it...

BTW, what makes you think he isn't creative? He won and went to the playoffs with a Griz team that wasn't built in his image according to you...So, he can adjust if need be.

We definitely need to hit a homerun with our next coach, but what is it about the other candidates that you think they have a better chance at being great than Fiz does?

fishmike
Posts: 48783
Alba Posts: 1
Joined: 7/19/2002
Member: #298
USA
4/18/2018  3:19 PM
knicks1248 wrote:
fishmike wrote:Uptown you have made me very open to Fizdale. Didnt know a ton about him. The Gasol thing is a question mark that should be answered. I mean you have to do a better job regardless of how difficult a player is being. But all signs point to him being a quality hire with a great BB mind.

I think the only guy I would dislike is Jackson. His issues suggest its a personality problem. We will see. In many ways this is the first defining move of the org. You knew they had to trade Melo. They clearly already decided on the draft so this is the first BIG call. It must be a developmental guy (which actually may be JAckson's strength).

Its very hard to quantify coaches... I am sure most are pretty good and could succeed in the right setting. Some succeed in more settings than others. Really what needs to happen is we get a guy who works well with the front office. If that is Blatt, Stackhouse or Fizdale fine.


Every Coach is going to have flaws, and every coach we interview (aside fram Stack) was fired for one reason or another.

The worst part is, after listening to this POD CAST http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/basketball/knicks/dn-sports-talk-podcast-knicks-talk-stefan-bondy-article-1.3939715

These guys are right, perry was part of a FO in orlando that had no success hiring coaches, and Mills was part of The fisher/JH process.

Now if you trust the FO to learn from it's many mistakes and overlook their blunders and poor decisions. why don't you do the same for every candidate including mark. Your basing your opinion on his relationship with someone else.

I dont do either of those things. Nor have a professed my trust for this front office. That is you talking for me. This FO has some minor victories but nothing to write home about.
1) good job not getting hosed on a Melo trade
2) great job getting/developing Burke
3) Beas, Troy Williams, Jack, Kornet, Hicks all good low cost pickups for various reasons
4) THjr is OK

What bad have they done? They have done a good job with small deals and staying put. The next Knicks coach will in a better position than the last (although we have a way to go before we see the roster).

There is no trust or faith. Just an honest look at what they have done.

Chandler
Posts: 22545
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 11/26/2015
Member: #6197

4/18/2018  11:53 PM
Uptown wrote:
Chandler wrote:
Uptown wrote:
Chandler wrote:Intrigued but would pass. IMO he wants a team of defensive grinders and will push the superstars to be super (nothing wrong with any of this in principle) However, our superstar is a bit sensitive (sorry love KP, but it's true) and we don't have the team or DNA for what he wants

Intrigued by Stack, expecting Blatt will make it to the final cut, and hoping that somehow our FO is smarter than they appear to me and actually can get a coach with some new ideas (Wright? who is the next Stevens) to extract the most out of a team, instill an identity, and find better ways to maximize KP's unique talents.

So, you're saying he wants defensive grinders and he will push his superstars to the next level and you dont want this guy? You must be in love with the product we have been been putting on the floor the past decade

Basically, you are saying we do not have any players on this team with Championship DNA?! If thats the case, why are any of them worth keeping? Other than KP, everyone else is expendable. If he is the coach that can do everything you say he can, we need to hire him ASAP so we can get this thing turned around.


Haha. As is said nothing wrong with any of this in principle. Issue is you need another rebuild from bottom up to fit his style.

I'm hoping for someone a bit more creative. You look at Brad Stevens and he made a no-defense smurf an MVP candidate somehow extracting his strengths and hiding his weaknesses. I would like a coach who can similarly maximize our guys like KP (e.g., hide his weak defense at the perimeter) or Frank (so the news is always about his defense and its impact -- and not that he's not a Rose/DSJ-type).

We need more talent for sure but we also need a great, great coach

What part of the rebuild do you think we are in? We are pretty close to the bottom now. Hopefully we will make it back to the playoffs in our lifetime and when we do, how many of our current starters do you think will still be starting? Lots of room and time to build a team the way Fiz might want it...

BTW, what makes you think he isn't creative? He won and went to the playoffs with a Griz team that wasn't built in his image according to you...So, he can adjust if need be.

We definitely need to hit a homerun with our next coach, but what is it about the other candidates that you think they have a better chance at being great than Fiz does?

the grizzlies were totally built for him. A bunch of tough players who could get after it on D, and run on offense (or pound it down low). Heat has/had a bunch of grinders too. I have nothing against Fiz. My one question (and since i don't know the answer i don't hold anything against him) is that his Grizz relationship lasted a little more than a season. I will admit there's something weird about that team because the exit of the prior coach (who landed in Sac) was just as bizarre. But having said that, that exit needs some serious attention

I guess what it comes down to for me is that Fiz-type of identity is good -- but not great. You have to go back to the Pistons for that to win big unless your team also has LBJ, Wade, Bosh too. Who knows maybe he can do it. I see it as more of a team that tops out at 50-30 ish

I am greedier than that but i think reasonably so. Take a look at Kerr. He inherited a good team and added like 20 wins. Team passed way more, and hid its defensive flaws pretty well. Or Stevens, who has done wonders, or you could even say Rockets.

While basketball is heavily influenced by star play, having a great coach is also a huge influence (and unrestricted by salary cap FWIW).

Is it too much to expect/hope that we can't get an elite coach (for the future). A lot of these names are the "usual suspects", retreads, or broken down old models (e.g., JVG who never was that good plus a quitter)

I am more intrigued by Wright. He has won two championships with teams that often don't have first round talent, and clearly not as much so as some of his competition. He finds ways to build teams and win with less. Can his skills translate to NBA I don't know, but it's that type of "it" factor I'd get excited about. I'll also admit i could easily be wrong about him. there have been plenty of successful coaches who won with "less" talent who did not translate to stud NBA coaches.

DJMUSIC: Fisher talked a good game in Post game but aside from that Derek Fisher was ALL CHIT CHAT SH_t and produced nothing!
fitzfarm
Posts: 23717
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 10/28/2010
Member: #3285

4/19/2018  12:38 AM
I’m actually really intrigued by Jerry Stackhouse, he’s done a really good job of developing the youth, he’s exactly what we need during our rebuilding process, Jerry will be a very good coach in this league why not with us?

He probably would be our best two guard as well hahaha

blkexec
Posts: 24563
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 9/3/2004
Member: #748
4/19/2018  10:14 AM
fitzfarm wrote:I’m actually really intrigued by Jerry Stackhouse, he’s done a really good job of developing the youth, he’s exactly what we need during our rebuilding process, Jerry will be a very good coach in this league why not with us?

He probably would be our best two guard as well hahaha

If I was Perry or Mills.....I'm not looking to hire one person, but rather a team of people that would work together.

Q: What is the difference between a Knicks fan and a baby? A: The baby will stop whining after awhile.
David Fizdale

©2001-2012 ultimateknicks.com All rights reserved. About Us.
This site is not affiliated with the NY Knicks or the National Basketball Association in any way.
You may visit the official NY Knicks web site by clicking here.

All times (GMT-05:00) Eastern Time.