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Our center situation
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newyorknewyork
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2/24/2018  11:06 AM
Kanter - Has a PO, and will have one season left if he opt in
KOQ - Will be an UFA
Noah - Is exiled
Willy - Got traded, 0'Bryant got cut

Its looking like only Kanter may be back with the possibility that none of them come back. Feel it all comes down to Kanter which we don't really know if Perry feels he is a long term center option for us or not. I don't see KOQ coming back as I do feel Knicks want to play faster and having Kanter and KOQ prevents that.

I also have the feeling Knicks are looking to target a big at the draft. Or they may be looking to have KP take the starting PF mins and backup Center mins while keeping Kanter. So they want to clean up the backup center clutter while targeting more of a stretch 4.

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CrushAlot
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2/24/2018  11:57 AM
There was some that thought that the Knicks didn't trade KOQ at the deadline because they wanted to keep him. I have also heard it suggested that Noah be brought back if the Knicks replace Hornacek or maybe even if they keep him. I don't think the Knicks plan on buying out Noah or stretching him at this point. Next year is going to be another developmental year so nothing needs to be done out of desperation or to put the finishing touches on the roster. If the Knicks decide to move Noah and take on another bad deal they might get a center that way.
You playTrey Burke... Wally Szcerbiak
newyorknewyork
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2/24/2018  12:24 PM
CrushAlot wrote:There was some that thought that the Knicks didn't trade KOQ at the deadline because they wanted to keep him. I have also heard it suggested that Noah be brought back if the Knicks replace Hornacek or maybe even if they keep him. I don't think the Knicks plan on buying out Noah or stretching him at this point. Next year is going to be another developmental year so nothing needs to be done out of desperation or to put the finishing touches on the roster. If the Knicks decide to move Noah and take on another bad deal they might get a center that way.

I can't see them keeping Kanter, KOQ & Noah. Kanter if he opts in would be at 18mil, Noah is at about 17-18mil, KOQ can command anywhere from 8-14mil depending on the team. There is no benefit short or long term for that scenario. As those mins would be preferred to go to bigs with more versatile skill sets and position flexibility between C/PF and maybe even some SF. And their development.

Retaining KOQ only makes sense if Kanter opts out, and Noah is exiled until stretched or bought out. And we draft or sign an young big with upside to duke it out for KOQ for the starting spot until he eventually beats him out and KOQ becomes that high win share backup he is good at being. While the starter who beat him out offers the complimentary skill set to KP.

Or Kanter opts out, KOQ is allowed to walk. Then Noah could be brought back for the same scenario as the previous paragraph. But most likely Kanter opts in, and he is the one who we use as the stop gap unless he complete balls the hell out next yr in his contract yr.

TripleThreat
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2/24/2018  1:07 PM
newyorknewyork wrote:I can't see them keeping Kanter, KOQ & Noah.

The Knicks don't have a choice in the matter. Kanter and KOQ control their fates for next season. At least for one more year. Noah is possibly the worst contract in the entire league and his AAV/contract make him both untradeable and likely uncuttable.

Given this glut and total cap commitment, the Knicks don't have much of an option to pursue any other bigs unless they get one in the draft who was BPA.

It's not just a roster glut, it's a cap glut. You can't have this much cap infused into one position without horribly imbalacing your team. To be fair, Kanter was a salary match situation. He was not a Knick by virtue purely of total choice in the matter. He was simply less painful than Ryan Anderson's contract.

Since you came on this board you have been way off in regards to trade value. - Briggs 7/28/2015
TLover
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2/24/2018  1:30 PM
If the Knicks want to contend in todays NBA, KP is the person who should be our center of the future.
He will build more strength this offseason to withstand the rigors in the paint. Having a rugged forward to box out & rebound would help compliment him.

Embiid is the kind of center KP can become with a better 3pt shot but not as good a rebounder.

newyorknewyork
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2/24/2018  1:48 PM
TripleThreat wrote:
newyorknewyork wrote:I can't see them keeping Kanter, KOQ & Noah.

The Knicks don't have a choice in the matter. Kanter and KOQ control their fates for next season. At least for one more year. Noah is possibly the worst contract in the entire league and his AAV/contract make him both untradeable and likely uncuttable.

Given this glut and total cap commitment, the Knicks don't have much of an option to pursue any other bigs unless they get one in the draft who was BPA.

It's not just a roster glut, it's a cap glut. You can't have this much cap infused into one position without horribly imbalacing your team. To be fair, Kanter was a salary match situation. He was not a Knick by virtue purely of total choice in the matter. He was simply less painful than Ryan Anderson's contract.

Cap wise you are correct. If KOQ opts in I would take that happily. At 4.5mil he would be a bargain and would still be moveable. But he isn't opting in, his agent won't allow that.

Knicks aren't forced to play Noah. He has 2 yrs left. They can tell him to stay away from the team for one more season. Then look to buy him out or stretch him the season after that. That would leave the backup center position wide open if Kanter opts in. Would be the route I would take as Noah is a dead contract, he isn't going to get traded, and he is only going to eat mins from a player with more potential that we should be developing for the identity we want this team to have.

newyorknewyork
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2/24/2018  1:55 PM
TLover wrote:If the Knicks want to contend in todays NBA, KP is the person who should be our center of the future.
He will build more strength this offseason to withstand the rigors in the paint. Having a rugged forward to box out & rebound would help compliment him.

Embiid is the kind of center KP can become with a better 3pt shot but not as good a rebounder.

You want KP to be able to play PF or Center and take advantages of opponents weaknesses either way. Same for any front court player that you eventually pair him with. The hard part to get will be a player capable of guarding the stretch 4s, rebound & help defend. Or if KP never becomes strong enough to bang. He will have to maintain the agility to guard the stretch 4s while his compliment focuses anchoring defensively.

Jmpasq
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2/24/2018  7:24 PM
The player everyone describes that can Guard bulky centers, guard on the perimeter, give you 10 rebounds, can play in the post and stretch the floor would be an All NBA player that everyone wants
Check out My NFL Draft Prospect Videos at Youtube User Pages Jmpasq,JPdraftjedi,Jmpasqdraftjedi. www.Draftbreakdown.com
Paris907
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2/24/2018  7:26 PM
If building around KP is still an objective a year from now, then securing a big, preferably a 5 will be critical in my opinion. The last thing KP will Need is to come off that injury and play heavy minutes at the 5 after a major injury. I’ve wanted a 5 prior to the injury with a hope that Mo Bamba is available which he probably won’t be yet there are others in this draft and they’d help immeasurably. Kanter will be a 25 minite 5 who gets few minutes in the 4th as he’s justifiably a defensive liability. Perry will Draft a Big
newyorknewyork
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2/24/2018  8:22 PM
Jmpasq wrote:The player everyone describes that can Guard bulky centers, guard on the perimeter, give you 10 rebounds, can play in the post and stretch the floor would be an All NBA player that everyone wants

I agree, that's just naming everything possible. But it comes down to KP. If he can get strong enough to play center. Then you just need a player that can guard stretch 4s. If KP can't play center because he isn't strong enough then he need to mold himself I to guarding stretch 4s and the big man should be an anchor. Just need to figure out the roles.

EnySpree
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2/24/2018  8:42 PM
I just want y'all to put some respect on Kornet name lol
You know why I'm here....
EnySpree
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2/24/2018  8:57 PM
KP is not going to be the same player when he comes back.... maybe he comes back ready to be a full time center. He's already great at rim protection. He doesn't rebound well. He doesn't have to bang with bigger centers but bigger centers have to chase him out on the perimeter. You stick two aggressive 2 way guys next to him at the fwd spots and you have a good front court.

Look at Boston... Hortford is not that good a rebounder. He's just savy and has a high basketball iq... he's shooting 3s. KP can be the same player when he comes back. In the meantime we have Kanter for a year... maybe Kanter goes back to a bench role allowing KP to be the starter.

As far as the 2 way feds? Surprise! We're likely to get one in the draft Miles Bridges seems he's destined for that role. We're sure to find someone else. Maybe it's Trey Williams...

You know why I'm here....
TripleThreat
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2/24/2018  9:31 PM
Jmpasq wrote:The player everyone describes that can Guard bulky centers, guard on the perimeter, give you 10 rebounds, can play in the post and stretch the floor would be an All NBA player that everyone wants

Ideally you'd want a guy who can defend the rim, at least a league average rate, and space the floor with an effective three point shot, at least at a league average rate.

If you can't have that, at least have a player who do at least ONE OF THOSE THINGS at a league average rate.

The problem is a guy like Kanter can't do either of those things. And he's a massive cap hit. Noah cannot do either of those things. And he's an injury risk. And he's a problem in the locker room.

What the team needs is a guy who can do at least ONE OF THOSE THINGS at a somewhat cost controlled contract situation.

The problem is a massive AAV/Cap Hit for fading guys who can't do any of it. It's like marrying a chick who doesn't work, won't blow you, won't clean, but will only cook gourmet meals for herself.

No one is asking for a combination of Selena Gomez and Martha Stewart here. Just someone who can pick up a freaking vacuum cleaner once in a while. Or get on their knees and swallow some nut once a week. No one is asking for a miracle, just not having to play Twister with basically a homeless person.

Since you came on this board you have been way off in regards to trade value. - Briggs 7/28/2015
newyorknewyork
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2/24/2018  9:43 PM
EnySpree wrote:I just want y'all to put some respect on Kornet name lol

He the secret weapon.

Paris907
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2/24/2018  10:43 PM
EnySpree wrote:KP is not going to be the same player when he comes back.... maybe he comes back ready to be a full time center. He's already great at rim protection. He doesn't rebound well. He doesn't have to bang with bigger centers but bigger centers have to chase him out on the perimeter. You stick two aggressive 2 way guys next to him at the fwd spots and you have a good front court.

Look at Boston... Hortford is not that good a rebounder. He's just savy and has a high basketball iq... he's shooting 3s. KP can be the same player when he comes back. In the meantime we have Kanter for a year... maybe Kanter goes back to a bench role allowing KP to be the starter.

As far as the 2 way feds? Surprise! We're likely to get one in the draft Miles Bridges seems he's destined for that role. We're sure to find someone else. Maybe it's Trey Williams...

Paris907
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2/24/2018  10:44 PM
EnySpree wrote:KP is not going to be the same player when he comes back.... maybe he comes back ready to be a full time center. He's already great at rim protection. He doesn't rebound well. He doesn't have to bang with bigger centers but bigger centers have to chase him out on the perimeter. You stick two aggressive 2 way guys next to him at the fwd spots and you have a good front court.

Look at Boston... Hortford is not that good a rebounder. He's just savy and has a high basketball iq... he's shooting 3s. KP can be the same player when he comes back. In the meantime we have Kanter for a year... maybe Kanter goes back to a bench role allowing KP to be the starter.

As far as the 2 way feds? Surprise! We're likely to get one in the draft Miles Bridges seems he's destined for that role. We're sure to find someone else. Maybe it's Trey Williams...

Paris907
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2/24/2018  10:48 PM
EnySpree wrote:KP is not going to be the same player when he comes back.... maybe he comes back ready to be a full time center. He's already great at rim protection. He doesn't rebound well. He doesn't have to bang with bigger centers but bigger centers have to chase him out on the perimeter. You stick two aggressive 2 way guys next to him at the fwd spots and you have a good front court.

Look at Boston... Hortford is not that good a rebounder. He's just savy and has a high basketball iq... he's shooting 3s. KP can be the same player when he comes back. In the meantime we have Kanter for a year... maybe Kanter goes back to a bench role allowing KP to be the starter.

As far as the 2 way feds? Surprise! We're likely to get one in the draft Miles Bridges seems he's destined for that role. We're sure to find someone else. Maybe it's Trey Williams...

Like I said Perry will look for a big man as it will take KP a year to regain his form and having him play 32 hard minites at the 5 ain’t gonna happen. Kanter s weakness as a 5 would be glaring when KP
Comes back as Knicks won’t wamt KP playing 5 to cover for Kanters defensive woes

TripleThreat
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2/25/2018  12:16 AM
newyorknewyork wrote:Knicks aren't forced to play Noah. He has 2 yrs left. They can tell him to stay away from the team for one more season. Then look to buy him out or stretch him the season after that. ....


The Stretch Provision, like any provision in the CBA, has safeguards in it to prevent "Cash Rich" teams from exploiting them. Not all teams are cash rich teams like the Knicks and Lakers.

IF, and it's a huge IF, the Knicks stretched Noah, for five years, they'd be paying a little more than 7-8 million in cash for Noah to go away. The cap hit would be the same spread out.

But there is a cap on total amount of your projected cap that can be stretched at any given point. Noah makes about 17 percent of the total projected cap for next year.

Base point - The Stretch Provision was never designed for contracts like Noah's. I.E. High AAV deals with many years left in them. If the Knicks use the Stretch on Noah, they won't be able to use it on any other player for the five years that it would apply to Noah. That's very limiting for the Knicks for the entire five year future span.

Since you came on this board you have been way off in regards to trade value. - Briggs 7/28/2015
newyorknewyork
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2/25/2018  12:33 AM
TripleThreat wrote:
newyorknewyork wrote:Knicks aren't forced to play Noah. He has 2 yrs left. They can tell him to stay away from the team for one more season. Then look to buy him out or stretch him the season after that. ....


The Stretch Provision, like any provision in the CBA, has safeguards in it to prevent "Cash Rich" teams from exploiting them. Not all teams are cash rich teams like the Knicks and Lakers.

IF, and it's a huge IF, the Knicks stretched Noah, for five years, they'd be paying a little more than 7-8 million in cash for Noah to go away. The cap hit would be the same spread out.

But there is a cap on total amount of your projected cap that can be stretched at any given point. Noah makes about 17 percent of the total projected cap for next year.

Base point - The Stretch Provision was never designed for contracts like Noah's. I.E. High AAV deals with many years left in them. If the Knicks use the Stretch on Noah, they won't be able to use it on any other player for the five years that it would apply to Noah. That's very limiting for the Knicks for the entire five year future span.

I would only stretch Noah on the last yr of his deal at 18 mil. And only if necessary for immediate cap. Which is y I say tell him to stay away for one more season, then when he has 1 yr left. Either buy him out or stretch him.

Jmpasq
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2/25/2018  8:30 AM
newyorknewyork wrote:
TripleThreat wrote:
newyorknewyork wrote:Knicks aren't forced to play Noah. He has 2 yrs left. They can tell him to stay away from the team for one more season. Then look to buy him out or stretch him the season after that. ....


The Stretch Provision, like any provision in the CBA, has safeguards in it to prevent "Cash Rich" teams from exploiting them. Not all teams are cash rich teams like the Knicks and Lakers.

IF, and it's a huge IF, the Knicks stretched Noah, for five years, they'd be paying a little more than 7-8 million in cash for Noah to go away. The cap hit would be the same spread out.

But there is a cap on total amount of your projected cap that can be stretched at any given point. Noah makes about 17 percent of the total projected cap for next year.

Base point - The Stretch Provision was never designed for contracts like Noah's. I.E. High AAV deals with many years left in them. If the Knicks use the Stretch on Noah, they won't be able to use it on any other player for the five years that it would apply to Noah. That's very limiting for the Knicks for the entire five year future span.

I would only stretch Noah on the last yr of his deal at 18 mil. And only if necessary for immediate cap. Which is y I say tell him to stay away for one more season, then when he has 1 yr left. Either buy him out or stretch him.

yep, the stretching option should only be used if we are getting a true max player. I'm not stretching him to sign Kemba Walker or Eric Bledsoe

Check out My NFL Draft Prospect Videos at Youtube User Pages Jmpasq,JPdraftjedi,Jmpasqdraftjedi. www.Draftbreakdown.com
Our center situation

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