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Ogden’s Purge: how we get to draft 6 picks
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Paris907
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2/6/2018  7:20 AM    LAST EDITED: 2/6/2018  7:39 AM
Losing Beas doesn’t make me happy and the result wouldn’t get our win total beyond where it will end up this year. We said rebuild right? Here’s youth and two firsts and 3 second round picks. I was reading 'New York Knicks: Trades that would facilitate the rebuild' on NY Basketball for iOS and I thought you might be interested in reading it too. Make that 5 picks.
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Paris907
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2/6/2018  7:36 AM
https://dailyknicks.com/2018/02/06/new-york-knicks-trades-facilitate-rebuild/
Paris907
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2/6/2018  7:38 AM
Paris907 wrote:Losing Beas doesn’t make me happy and the result wouldn’t get our win total beyond where it will end up this year. We said rebuild right? Here’s youth and two firsts and 3 seconds. I was reading 'New York Knicks: Trades that would facilitate the rebuild' on NY Basketball for iOS and I thought you might be interested in reading it too. Make that 5 picks.
Paris907
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2/6/2018  7:42 AM
Anyone think we can flip KP and two firsts for AD?
Jmpasq
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2/6/2018  8:03 AM
Paris907 wrote:Anyone think we can flip KP and two firsts for AD?

We missed our chance last year to deal KP, Boston was the trade partner because of the slew of assets they had. Yes there is an alternative universe where Jason Tatum and Donavan Mitchell are Knicks, with the Knicks holding 2 more top 10 picks this year.

The alternate universe Knicks in 2018-2019

C Deandre Ayton - Because the Knicks don't have Porzingis the Knicks are the worst team in the league and win lottery
PF Aaron Gordon FA Orlando Knicks sign him this offseason to round out the young core
SF Jayson Tatum - With the pick from the Celtics the Knicks take Tatum to replace Melo
SG Donovan Mitchell Knicks don't sign Hardaway as this is a hard tank, Mills tanking Frank over Mitchell is overruled.
pg Colin Sexton With the Cavs pick from the Celtics the Knicks take

Check out My NFL Draft Prospect Videos at Youtube User Pages Jmpasq,JPdraftjedi,Jmpasqdraftjedi. www.Draftbreakdown.com
Vmart
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2/6/2018  9:01 AM
Would anyone consider a trade where KP is sent to the Suns for Josh Jackson and the number one pick. If I’m the Knicks I might be open to this trade. But no idea if the Suns would even consider it.
Knixkik
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2/6/2018  9:01 AM
The Cavs deal definitely! Not the other one though. Too much talent traded for a 2nd round pick.
Knixkik
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2/6/2018  9:02 AM
Paris907 wrote:Anyone think we can flip KP and two firsts for AD?

AD is a classic example of a player this board would turn on very quickly.

Vmart
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2/6/2018  9:08 AM
Knixkik wrote:
Paris907 wrote:Anyone think we can flip KP and two firsts for AD?

AD is a classic example of a player this board would turn on very quickly.

With Cousins uncertainty I doubt NO would even think about moving AD.

Paris907
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2/6/2018  9:18 AM
Vmart wrote:
Knixkik wrote:
Paris907 wrote:Anyone think we can flip KP and two firsts for AD?

AD is a classic example of a player this board would turn on very quickly.

With Cousins uncertainty I doubt NO would even think about moving AD.

We won’t be saying that if the Celtics grab him

EnySpree
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2/6/2018  11:24 AM
Jmpasq wrote:
Paris907 wrote:Anyone think we can flip KP and two firsts for AD?

We missed our chance last year to deal KP, Boston was the trade partner because of the slew of assets they had. Yes there is an alternative universe where Jason Tatum and Donavan Mitchell are Knicks, with the Knicks holding 2 more top 10 picks this year.

The alternate universe Knicks in 2018-2019

C Deandre Ayton - Because the Knicks don't have Porzingis the Knicks are the worst team in the league and win lottery
PF Aaron Gordon FA Orlando Knicks sign him this offseason to round out the young core
SF Jayson Tatum - With the pick from the Celtics the Knicks take Tatum to replace Melo
SG Donovan Mitchell Knicks don't sign Hardaway as this is a hard tank, Mills tanking Frank over Mitchell is overruled.
pg Colin Sexton With the Cavs pick from the Celtics the Knicks take

That is crazy... Phil might have been on to something. There was rumors we were going to go after Lauri Markkenan... with the way that kid is playing, that would have been a good trade off. Lauri and Donovan? Man oh man.... Tatum too. We would have been more than fine a d we would have expedited the rebuild.

We didn't do that now we can't back track and trade our guys for picks. KP is here already. Next year we expect KP to launch himself into superstardom. We can't have a guy like that ave surround him with a bunch of 1st rounders with no experience. We'd have to hit home runs in the draft for the win column to improve. We really need to manage the cap and maneuver a way to get KP some proven help.

KP is going to the all star game. Guys are going to be in the locker room chopping it up. KP will be making n friends... possibly forming alliances. Guys are going to see KP up close and say... I want to play with thus kid. Our time is now not in 2-3 years waiting for other draft picks to develop. I feel I can't stress that enough. It's not about signing an old jalen rose, a goofy Marbury, a broken down Amare, a premadonna like Melo, classic lazy talent like eddy curry.... we have a shot to get hard working guys that want to win. They see what we have here. We have to show teams we mean business. We want to get in the playoffs and beyond

You know why I'm here....
Nalod
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2/6/2018  11:24 AM
Didn't Davis miss a lot of games his first 3 years?
Didn't Pels suck in that time?
Grass greener?
Knicks1248: 1. Dolan should be more involved! 2. Why would any knick fan want pick 8, when that spot has a history of producing marginal NBA taken. (He prefers pick 9th instead)
NardDogNation
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2/6/2018  11:25 AM
Paris907 wrote:Anyone think we can flip KP and two firsts for AD?

Why? So that we be out two first rounders, see AD only play 50 games every season and continue to miss the playoffs? No doubt AD is better than KP (way better) but no one player is coming to NY and save us by himself. This is why I've been an advocate of leveraging cap space to acquire draft picks. It will require a team effort to right the ship and building through the draft offers low-risk/high reward opportunities to do exactly that without crippling the team's finances. But that involves effort and patience, neither of which the Knicks have demonstrated to have.

Skudra
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2/6/2018  11:26 AM
Jmpasq wrote:
Paris907 wrote:Anyone think we can flip KP and two firsts for AD?

We missed our chance last year to deal KP, Boston was the trade partner because of the slew of assets they had. Yes there is an alternative universe where Jason Tatum and Donavan Mitchell are Knicks, with the Knicks holding 2 more top 10 picks this year.

The alternate universe Knicks in 2018-2019

C Deandre Ayton - Because the Knicks don't have Porzingis the Knicks are the worst team in the league and win lottery
PF Aaron Gordon FA Orlando Knicks sign him this offseason to round out the young core
SF Jayson Tatum - With the pick from the Celtics the Knicks take Tatum to replace Melo
SG Donovan Mitchell Knicks don't sign Hardaway as this is a hard tank, Mills tanking Frank over Mitchell is overruled.
pg Colin Sexton With the Cavs pick from the Celtics the Knicks take

When Boston was open for trade, they still had No.1 pick, so NY would get Fultz. Luckily dodged that.
Also, Tatum would be in Phoenix, Jackson was "secure" number 3 pick.

So NYK would be way worse than you imagine.

Knixkik
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2/6/2018  11:31 AM
Vmart wrote:
Knixkik wrote:
Paris907 wrote:Anyone think we can flip KP and two firsts for AD?

AD is a classic example of a player this board would turn on very quickly.

With Cousins uncertainty I doubt NO would even think about moving AD.

They won't. And i wouldn't do that trade anyways. Davis doesn't play enough games and has too many defensive lapses to be considered a huge upgrade over KP, especially long-term.

EnySpree
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2/6/2018  11:36 AM
Knixkik wrote:
Vmart wrote:
Knixkik wrote:
Paris907 wrote:Anyone think we can flip KP and two firsts for AD?

AD is a classic example of a player this board would turn on very quickly.

With Cousins uncertainty I doubt NO would even think about moving AD.

They won't. And i wouldn't do that trade anyways. Davis doesn't play enough games and has too many defensive lapses to be considered a huge upgrade over KP, especially long-term.

KP is on their level now. It's not worth trading KP for either.

You know why I'm here....
NardDogNation
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2/6/2018  11:52 AM
Jmpasq wrote:
Paris907 wrote:Anyone think we can flip KP and two firsts for AD?

We missed our chance last year to deal KP, Boston was the trade partner because of the slew of assets they had. Yes there is an alternative universe where Jason Tatum and Donavan Mitchell are Knicks, with the Knicks holding 2 more top 10 picks this year.

The alternate universe Knicks in 2018-2019

C Deandre Ayton - Because the Knicks don't have Porzingis the Knicks are the worst team in the league and win lottery
PF Aaron Gordon FA Orlando Knicks sign him this offseason to round out the young core
SF Jayson Tatum - With the pick from the Celtics the Knicks take Tatum to replace Melo
SG Donovan Mitchell Knicks don't sign Hardaway as this is a hard tank, Mills tanking Frank over Mitchell is overruled.
pg Colin Sexton With the Cavs pick from the Celtics the Knicks take

I agree with the logic of moving KP to Boston but the deal I would have pursued is KP for Jaylen Brown, the 3rd pick (Jayson Tatum) and LALs 2018 first round pick/SACs 2019 first round pick. BOS still obviously has the room to sign Gordon Hayward and play him at his natural position at the 3 spot, with Marcus Smart at the 2. Makes perfect sense for them, especially when you consider how well Horford would fit with KP.

I also wouldn't have been a moron and (re)signed Tim Hardaway Jr and Ron Baker, to instead use that cap space as leverage for draft pick(s). I suspect the Blazers could've been a target because they were/are desperately looking to unload salary while remaining competitive and had the no.10 pick in the draft. If we would've taken on Evan Turner and Allen Crabbe with the no.10 for Willy Hernangomez, salary ballast and our cap space, do you really think they say no? Willy provides better cost-control and similar potential to the guy they did take at 10: Zach Collins- so there would not be much loss in value from moving the pick. And while it cripples our cap situation, we Turner and Crabbe filled needs for us and that 10th pick could've gotten us Donovan Mitchell, while allowing us to still take Ntililina at 8. Ladies and Gentleman, introducing our future backcourt of: Frank Ntilikina and Donovan Mitchell!

I also don't understand how we didn't pick up the phone to call Masai and structure another deal to save a luxury-tax team money. It was obvious as day, they wanted to offload DeMarre Carroll and Corey Joseph and were willing to include draft picks to do it. Courtney Lee and a $10 million trade exception/cap savings for Demarre Carroll, Corey Joseph and the 23rd pick in the draft would probably have worked. And with the 23rd pick in the 2017 draft, the Knicks select OG Anunoby as the Raptors actually did. Can you imagine him off the bench, as our 6th man backing up either Jaylen Brown or Jayson Tatum?!?!?!

And as you suggested, we'd end up losing a bunch of games this season as we develop the aforementioned talent, which would improve our own pick in the lottery and still have the opportunity to have a 2nd lottery pick via the Lakers. My targets would be Mohammed Bamba and Collin Sexton. Now picture rolling into the 2018-2019 season with this as your rotation.

STARTERS
G: Frank Ntilikina
G: Donovan Mitchell
F: Jayson Tatum
F: Jaylen Brown
C: Kyle O'Quinn

ROTATION
G: Collin Sexton
G/F: Evan Turner
F: OG Anounby
F: DeMarre Carroll
C: Mohammed Bamba


That has the makings of being one of the best dynamic defensive teams, ever! AND, it seems we'd have some prolific scorers in Mitchell and Tatum.

NardDogNation
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2/6/2018  11:55 AM
Vmart wrote:Would anyone consider a trade where KP is sent to the Suns for Josh Jackson and the number one pick. If I’m the Knicks I might be open to this trade. But no idea if the Suns would even consider it.

I'd only consider it if we offloaded serious salary for cap space and/or their expirers (e.g. Tyson Chandler). And even then, I'd have to really wonder if I'm making a huge mistake. But I'm so high on the big men of this draft that it'd really make me think.

NardDogNation
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2/6/2018  11:59 AM
Skudra wrote:
Jmpasq wrote:
Paris907 wrote:Anyone think we can flip KP and two firsts for AD?

We missed our chance last year to deal KP, Boston was the trade partner because of the slew of assets they had. Yes there is an alternative universe where Jason Tatum and Donavan Mitchell are Knicks, with the Knicks holding 2 more top 10 picks this year.

The alternate universe Knicks in 2018-2019

C Deandre Ayton - Because the Knicks don't have Porzingis the Knicks are the worst team in the league and win lottery
PF Aaron Gordon FA Orlando Knicks sign him this offseason to round out the young core
SF Jayson Tatum - With the pick from the Celtics the Knicks take Tatum to replace Melo
SG Donovan Mitchell Knicks don't sign Hardaway as this is a hard tank, Mills tanking Frank over Mitchell is overruled.
pg Colin Sexton With the Cavs pick from the Celtics the Knicks take

When Boston was open for trade, they still had No.1 pick, so NY would get Fultz. Luckily dodged that.
Also, Tatum would be in Phoenix, Jackson was "secure" number 3 pick.

So NYK would be way worse than you imagine.

Not if they were in competent hands. I thought Ainge made a coup when he essentially acquired two lottery picks to move down two spots despite the contrarians. Just because we got the first overall pick, I doubt it would have dissuaded the Sixers from engaging us with the same or better offer. And again, I would have taken it.

NardDogNation
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2/6/2018  12:05 PM
Jmpasq wrote:
Paris907 wrote:Anyone think we can flip KP and two firsts for AD?

We missed our chance last year to deal KP, Boston was the trade partner because of the slew of assets they had. Yes there is an alternative universe where Jason Tatum and Donavan Mitchell are Knicks, with the Knicks holding 2 more top 10 picks this year.

The alternate universe Knicks in 2018-2019

C Deandre Ayton - Because the Knicks don't have Porzingis the Knicks are the worst team in the league and win lottery
PF Aaron Gordon FA Orlando Knicks sign him this offseason to round out the young core
SF Jayson Tatum - With the pick from the Celtics the Knicks take Tatum to replace Melo
SG Donovan Mitchell Knicks don't sign Hardaway as this is a hard tank, Mills tanking Frank over Mitchell is overruled.
pg Colin Sexton With the Cavs pick from the Celtics the Knicks take

...what's stopping the Celtics from still trading for Kristaps? Everything that was true about him then, is more true of him today. He'd clearly be an upgrade of Aaron Baynes and now that we know that guys like Jaylen Brown and Jayson Tatum are players in this league, it alleviates the risk on our end. With the proper draft pick compensation, I think something like this could still have legs.

Ogden’s Purge: how we get to draft 6 picks

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