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Mark Jackson maybe the coach for KP
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knicks1248
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2/3/2018  4:32 PM    LAST EDITED: 2/3/2018  4:35 PM
Kp's game is not expanding under this coaching regime, go look at his stats since he came in the league.

I think mark jackson is better at developing players..

32 wins will probably get jh fired, and were pacing towards that..That's not progress


SEASON TEAM GP GS MIN FGM-A FG% 3PM-A 3P% FTM-A FT% OR DR REB AST BLK STL PF TO PTS
'15-'16
NY
72 72 28.4 5.2-12.3 .421 1.1-3.4 .333 2.8-3.3 .838 1.8 5.5 7.3 1.3 1.9 0.7 2.8 1.7 14.3
'16-'17
NY
66 65 32.8 6.7-14.9 .450 1.7-4.8 .357 3.0-3.8 .786 1.7 5.5 7.2 1.5 2.0 0.7 3.7 1.8 18.1
'17-'18
NY
46 46 32.8 8.2-18.8 .436 1.9-4.8 .395 4.7-5.8 .808 1.3 5.4 6.7 1.2 2.3 0.7 3.0 2.0 23.0


aside from 3pt% and points (more touches) it's pretty much a flat line..

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TLover
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2/3/2018  5:30 PM
Loved Mark Jackson as a player for us (should never of traded him in Charles Smith deal) but I don’t think he should be our next coach.

The person who I would like is Ettore Messina, assistant coach for the spurs. He would relate well with the many European players we have. He’s established a great reputation in Europe and is Pop’s top assistant with the spurs which says a lot.

His demeanor is such that players will respect. I’m sick of Hornachek getting disrespected by his own players.

franco12
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2/3/2018  8:46 PM
I don't know where the blame lies, but what exactly is the front office doing at this point? There are a lot of numbers that don't point to growth.

Yes, he is young still, but I want the coach putting him in more places where he can succeed. This seems to be too much sink or swim.

martin
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2/3/2018  8:51 PM
franco12 wrote:I don't know where the blame lies, but what exactly is the front office doing at this point? There are a lot of numbers that don't point to growth.

Yes, he is young still, but I want the coach putting him in more places where he can succeed. This seems to be too much sink or swim.

There are also a lot of numbers that point to KP's growth.

What are your expectations for a 3rd year guy who just became the focal point of the team?

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franco12
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2/4/2018  6:15 AM
martin wrote:
franco12 wrote:I don't know where the blame lies, but what exactly is the front office doing at this point? There are a lot of numbers that don't point to growth.

Yes, he is young still, but I want the coach putting him in more places where he can succeed. This seems to be too much sink or swim.

There are also a lot of numbers that point to KP's growth.

What are your expectations for a 3rd year guy who just became the focal point of the team?

he has too many games where he has shot poorly. He is rushing shots. Can't pass out of a double team. Too many bad shots.

Look - there was the article about how Porzingis' problem was he can shoot over people.

He is being left out there too long. He was tired earlier in the season - his words, not mine! And he probably still is tired.

He should be shooting at a higher percentage all across the board. He is simply too good a shooter- or, maybe he isn't?

I get that we're leaning on him more- but we also are supposed to have a team system.

Jeff has to put him in better situations and do something to develop his ability/willingness to pass out of the double teams he is now seeing. There is no excuse for KP not to be a better passer- he is 7'3" and should see over everyone.

Let me ask you- what was November? He looked unstoppable. What's happened since? Yea, teams adjusted. Where is our adjustment? And why haven't we seen that player again- even for an in game pf 10 minutes? Maybe I've missed that.

Vmart
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2/4/2018  11:08 AM
The most telling static is KP shooting 42%. There is no way a 7’3 player should be shooting a measly 42%. I have been saying that JH isn’t putting KP in a position to succeed. After that fast start KP’s shooting doesn’t even reflect the 42%, it’s much worse than that.

I don’t like the coaching carousel as much as the next guy but JH isn’t the answer going forward. I’m open to the idea of Mark Jackson but I really hope the Lakers can Walton that is my first choice.

franco12
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2/4/2018  11:42 AM
Vmart wrote:The most telling static is KP shooting 42%. There is no way a 7’3 player should be shooting a measly 42%. I have been saying that JH isn’t putting KP in a position to succeed. After that fast start KP’s shooting doesn’t even reflect the 42%, it’s much worse than that.

I don’t like the coaching carousel as much as the next guy but JH isn’t the answer going forward. I’m open to the idea of Mark Jackson but I really hope the Lakers can Walton that is my first choice.

I love Walton and the Lakers would be stupid to get rid of him. I think he has done well with getting them to perform.

BigDaddyG
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2/4/2018  11:53 AM
Judging from Mark's time with Curry, he's probably one of the last guys to take KP to another level offensively. His offenses we're bland and predictable. He relied mainly on heavy iso scheme featuring Curry, and teams were able to read it easily. I'm afraid Mark will come in and reinforce KP's bad habits.
Always... always remember: Less is less. More is more. More is better and twice as much is good too. Not enough is bad, and too much is never enough except when it's just about right. - The Tick
Vmart
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2/4/2018  12:11 PM
BigDaddyG wrote:Judging from Mark's time with Curry, he's probably one of the last guys to take KP to another level offensively. His offenses we're bland and predictable. He relied mainly on heavy iso scheme featuring Curry, and teams were able to read it easily. I'm afraid Mark will come in and reinforce KP's bad habits.

There is a lot of truth in what you are saying. Mark Jackson always came from a post up offense and isolation offense. I would also consider Mike Brown.

martin
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2/4/2018  12:25 PM
franco12 wrote:
martin wrote:
franco12 wrote:I don't know where the blame lies, but what exactly is the front office doing at this point? There are a lot of numbers that don't point to growth.

Yes, he is young still, but I want the coach putting him in more places where he can succeed. This seems to be too much sink or swim.

There are also a lot of numbers that point to KP's growth.

What are your expectations for a 3rd year guy who just became the focal point of the team?

he has too many games where he has shot poorly. He is rushing shots. Can't pass out of a double team. Too many bad shots.

Look - there was the article about how Porzingis' problem was he can shoot over people.

He is being left out there too long. He was tired earlier in the season - his words, not mine! And he probably still is tired.

He should be shooting at a higher percentage all across the board. He is simply too good a shooter- or, maybe he isn't?

I get that we're leaning on him more- but we also are supposed to have a team system.

Jeff has to put him in better situations and do something to develop his ability/willingness to pass out of the double teams he is now seeing. There is no excuse for KP not to be a better passer- he is 7'3" and should see over everyone.

Let me ask you- what was November? He looked unstoppable. What's happened since? Yea, teams adjusted. Where is our adjustment? And why haven't we seen that player again- even for an in game pf 10 minutes? Maybe I've missed that.

BTW, just read an article last week where Kerr said the whole GSW team was tired. It happens.

In regards to your November question, KP was unstoppable, and for me that is KP's future. Teams have adjusted and KP and the Knicks as a whole have not, plan and simple. Teams know they can key off of and double KP.... and no one else on the Knicks can burn defenses when it is happening. Whether that is a team thing, a KP bad passing thing, a talent thing, a coaching thing, it's happening.

For me, that's part of the growth factor. Last year KP could not post guards, this year he eats them up and draws fouls (still far from perfect). This year he is seeing double teams and has lots and lots of trouble; next year it will get better. You have to see them first, adjust and practice adjusting to it as a player, a team and a coaching staff.

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nixluva
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2/4/2018  3:55 PM
I’m not really that excited by Mark Jackson anymore. Knicks need a Budenholzer Type IMO. HECK I saw more creative use of KP from his Latvia coach.
Welpee
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2/4/2018  8:04 PM
We need a Tom Thibodeau clone. Where we find one I have no idea. But I don't think Mark Jackson is that guy...UNLESS... there's a Tom Thibodeau-like assistant out there and we can duplicate the Doc Rivers/Tom Thibodeau dynamic.
Nalod
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2/5/2018  10:27 AM
Welpee wrote:We need a Tom Thibodeau clone. Where we find one I have no idea. But I don't think Mark Jackson is that guy...UNLESS... there's a Tom Thibodeau-like assistant out there and we can duplicate the Doc Rivers/Tom Thibodeau dynamic.

Thibs fries his teams come playoff time.
Look closely to his teams in Chicago and look what happened. In Minny his players avg more min than other starters in the league.
WE have to deal with a reality that "Change" is not "Improvement" and a new coach might not be the answer. The desire for change is a natural one but lets not fool ourselves. Knicks are famous for making changes but in retrospect its a roster thing.
At least this time one of our problems is young players inexperience and inability to close out games. Does a new coach change that?
Doc Rivers best teams were those with established veterans. some coaches do well with vets, some do well with youth.
Mark Jax? His record was good but look closer and some things are mixed. He had personality clashes with coaches and management. Not sure it would be more than a starphuch hire thinking his Warrior run can be replicated. The magic of Steph Curry is not easily duplicated.

Knicks1248: 1. Dolan should be more involved! 2. Why would any knick fan want pick 8, when that spot has a history of producing marginal NBA taken. (He prefers pick 9th instead)
Welpee
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2/5/2018  11:03 AM
Nalod wrote:
Welpee wrote:We need a Tom Thibodeau clone. Where we find one I have no idea. But I don't think Mark Jackson is that guy...UNLESS... there's a Tom Thibodeau-like assistant out there and we can duplicate the Doc Rivers/Tom Thibodeau dynamic.

Thibs fries his teams come playoff time.
Look closely to his teams in Chicago and look what happened. In Minny his players avg more min than other starters in the league.
WE have to deal with a reality that "Change" is not "Improvement" and a new coach might not be the answer. The desire for change is a natural one but lets not fool ourselves. Knicks are famous for making changes but in retrospect its a roster thing.
At least this time one of our problems is young players inexperience and inability to close out games. Does a new coach change that?
Doc Rivers best teams were those with established veterans. some coaches do well with vets, some do well with youth.
Mark Jax? His record was good but look closer and some things are mixed. He had personality clashes with coaches and management. Not sure it would be more than a starphuch hire thinking his Warrior run can be replicated. The magic of Steph Curry is not easily duplicated.

Tom also wins and has proven he can maximize talent. You can pick apart any coach other than a handful who are currently unavailable. You haven't offered an alternative option.
martin
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2/5/2018  11:46 AM
Welpee wrote:
Nalod wrote:
Welpee wrote:We need a Tom Thibodeau clone. Where we find one I have no idea. But I don't think Mark Jackson is that guy...UNLESS... there's a Tom Thibodeau-like assistant out there and we can duplicate the Doc Rivers/Tom Thibodeau dynamic.

Thibs fries his teams come playoff time.
Look closely to his teams in Chicago and look what happened. In Minny his players avg more min than other starters in the league.
WE have to deal with a reality that "Change" is not "Improvement" and a new coach might not be the answer. The desire for change is a natural one but lets not fool ourselves. Knicks are famous for making changes but in retrospect its a roster thing.
At least this time one of our problems is young players inexperience and inability to close out games. Does a new coach change that?
Doc Rivers best teams were those with established veterans. some coaches do well with vets, some do well with youth.
Mark Jax? His record was good but look closer and some things are mixed. He had personality clashes with coaches and management. Not sure it would be more than a starphuch hire thinking his Warrior run can be replicated. The magic of Steph Curry is not easily duplicated.

Tom also wins and has proven he can maximize talent. You can pick apart any coach other than a handful who are currently unavailable. You haven't offered an alternative option.

The alternate is to keep continuity and let the experience and growth come over time.

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Welpee
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2/5/2018  12:01 PM
martin wrote:
Welpee wrote:
Nalod wrote:
Welpee wrote:We need a Tom Thibodeau clone. Where we find one I have no idea. But I don't think Mark Jackson is that guy...UNLESS... there's a Tom Thibodeau-like assistant out there and we can duplicate the Doc Rivers/Tom Thibodeau dynamic.

Thibs fries his teams come playoff time.
Look closely to his teams in Chicago and look what happened. In Minny his players avg more min than other starters in the league.
WE have to deal with a reality that "Change" is not "Improvement" and a new coach might not be the answer. The desire for change is a natural one but lets not fool ourselves. Knicks are famous for making changes but in retrospect its a roster thing.
At least this time one of our problems is young players inexperience and inability to close out games. Does a new coach change that?
Doc Rivers best teams were those with established veterans. some coaches do well with vets, some do well with youth.
Mark Jax? His record was good but look closer and some things are mixed. He had personality clashes with coaches and management. Not sure it would be more than a starphuch hire thinking his Warrior run can be replicated. The magic of Steph Curry is not easily duplicated.

Tom also wins and has proven he can maximize talent. You can pick apart any coach other than a handful who are currently unavailable. You haven't offered an alternative option.

The alternate is to keep continuity and let the experience and growth come over time.

So keep Hornacek? How many years you want to give him to make this thing right?
Nalod
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2/5/2018  1:43 PM
Welpee wrote:
Nalod wrote:
Welpee wrote:We need a Tom Thibodeau clone. Where we find one I have no idea. But I don't think Mark Jackson is that guy...UNLESS... there's a Tom Thibodeau-like assistant out there and we can duplicate the Doc Rivers/Tom Thibodeau dynamic.

Thibs fries his teams come playoff time.
Look closely to his teams in Chicago and look what happened. In Minny his players avg more min than other starters in the league.
WE have to deal with a reality that "Change" is not "Improvement" and a new coach might not be the answer. The desire for change is a natural one but lets not fool ourselves. Knicks are famous for making changes but in retrospect its a roster thing.
At least this time one of our problems is young players inexperience and inability to close out games. Does a new coach change that?
Doc Rivers best teams were those with established veterans. some coaches do well with vets, some do well with youth.
Mark Jax? His record was good but look closer and some things are mixed. He had personality clashes with coaches and management. Not sure it would be more than a starphuch hire thinking his Warrior run can be replicated. The magic of Steph Curry is not easily duplicated.

Tom also wins and has proven he can maximize talent. You can pick apart any coach other than a handful who are currently unavailable. You haven't offered an alternative option.

That how it works? Pick a guy, give him a year and a half then be a "good fan" and come up with an alternative?
1st 30 games coach was like "Top 5 COY", now we fire him. Jeff was a good hire as he got a raw deal in PHX.
He is not Thibs. Thibs is a good coach. Not with this team. I want "The next Pop" just like everyone else.
Fans want a proven coach. Like Jax, but look at Jax and why he was let go.
We want Thibs, We just superimpose his past success and it will happen here?
Jarred Jack is our starter and a 19 year old his back up.
Hardaway did great, then he missed 20 games. Not really a viable back up.
We don't have a very good team. Didn't before season started either.
The Logjam at center: we have two guys that want to play. That's a good thing BTW. Gotta find a good deal. If not, do nothing.
WE just assume KOQ is worth a boatload but teams have waiver wire picks for free. Its a tough market out there. Picks are back in vogue again.
Its good we didn't sign Monroe. but we do have Noah.

Knicks1248: 1. Dolan should be more involved! 2. Why would any knick fan want pick 8, when that spot has a history of producing marginal NBA taken. (He prefers pick 9th instead)
matt
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2/5/2018  2:09 PM
I don't get the Mark Jackson romance. Isn't it concerning that the Warriors EXPLODED after they let him go? Without really even changing the roster that much....


No more retreads. We need a Brad Stevens/Brett Brown/Kenny Atkinson; not a Thibs/Hornacek/Mark Jackson

fishmike
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2/5/2018  2:15 PM
Welpee wrote:
Nalod wrote:
Welpee wrote:We need a Tom Thibodeau clone. Where we find one I have no idea. But I don't think Mark Jackson is that guy...UNLESS... there's a Tom Thibodeau-like assistant out there and we can duplicate the Doc Rivers/Tom Thibodeau dynamic.

Thibs fries his teams come playoff time.
Look closely to his teams in Chicago and look what happened. In Minny his players avg more min than other starters in the league.
WE have to deal with a reality that "Change" is not "Improvement" and a new coach might not be the answer. The desire for change is a natural one but lets not fool ourselves. Knicks are famous for making changes but in retrospect its a roster thing.
At least this time one of our problems is young players inexperience and inability to close out games. Does a new coach change that?
Doc Rivers best teams were those with established veterans. some coaches do well with vets, some do well with youth.
Mark Jax? His record was good but look closer and some things are mixed. He had personality clashes with coaches and management. Not sure it would be more than a starphuch hire thinking his Warrior run can be replicated. The magic of Steph Curry is not easily duplicated.

Tom also wins and has proven he can maximize talent. You can pick apart any coach other than a handful who are currently unavailable. You haven't offered an alternative option.
Kris Dunn might say differently
Welpee
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2/5/2018  8:35 PM
fishmike wrote:
Welpee wrote:
Nalod wrote:
Welpee wrote:We need a Tom Thibodeau clone. Where we find one I have no idea. But I don't think Mark Jackson is that guy...UNLESS... there's a Tom Thibodeau-like assistant out there and we can duplicate the Doc Rivers/Tom Thibodeau dynamic.

Thibs fries his teams come playoff time.
Look closely to his teams in Chicago and look what happened. In Minny his players avg more min than other starters in the league.
WE have to deal with a reality that "Change" is not "Improvement" and a new coach might not be the answer. The desire for change is a natural one but lets not fool ourselves. Knicks are famous for making changes but in retrospect its a roster thing.
At least this time one of our problems is young players inexperience and inability to close out games. Does a new coach change that?
Doc Rivers best teams were those with established veterans. some coaches do well with vets, some do well with youth.
Mark Jax? His record was good but look closer and some things are mixed. He had personality clashes with coaches and management. Not sure it would be more than a starphuch hire thinking his Warrior run can be replicated. The magic of Steph Curry is not easily duplicated.

Tom also wins and has proven he can maximize talent. You can pick apart any coach other than a handful who are currently unavailable. You haven't offered an alternative option.
Kris Dunn might say differently
Won/loss record and Jimmy Butler might refute Dunn's thoughts.
Mark Jackson maybe the coach for KP

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