And when you actually look at the team, it's a bunch of unremarkable talent (save for Giannis) that somehow has them on the verge of paying the luxury tax. Considering that those salaries create a floor that will have them above the cap for the next two seasons, they are almost compelled to commit even more money to players like Eric Bledsoe and Jabari Parker since improvements via free agency won't be an option. But as history has shown, these guys are not good enough to make them any better a team. And even more damning is the fact that Giannis' contract will be set to be coming off the books before they get any kind of cap flexibility.

They are screwed and might have made the situation even worse if Giannis is as close to Kidd, as Kidd might lead us to believe. After all, Giannis isn't the cute-cuddly kid anymore when he first entered the league and his frustration with his circumstances seem to be slowly coming to light. Earlier in the season, he got into a bump/shouting match with an assistant coach, which seemed entirely out of character and a sign that he is gradually becoming disgruntled.

We need to make sure that we have enough assets outside of Kristaps Porzingis (and possibly Frank Ntilikina) to field a competitive offer for him in the next 2-3 seasons if and when he demands a trade. I have no doubt that he'll search for bigger and flashier lights and what better franchise to offer them than the one with the brightest stage of them all? Can you imagine how devastating he and KP could be together as foundational pieces for this franchise?

What can we do to begin preparing ourselves for Giannis' deperature from Milwaukee? Can we do anything at all? If so, what type of package would we need to get him if he demanded a trade? Is Frank essential to any KP-Giannis pairing? What would you need around Giannis and KP to be a true title contender?

NardDogNation wrote:They are screwed and might have made the situation even worse if Giannis is as close to Kidd, as Kidd might lead us to believe.

Media spin.

If Greek Freak wanted Kidd to be the coach, he'd still be the head coach.

If Greek Freak walked into the locker room, told everyone to shut up and do what Kidd says, that's what the team would do.

That's not what happened, so the answer is right there.

Greek Freak will not be a Knick. Edens won't trade him. Even if the Bucks know he'll walk eventually, they won't trade him.

NardDogNation wrote:It seems that the Bucks are a mess of an organization. Their ownership seems to be in flux, which has created a toxic culture that is having a ripple effect on the franchise. Each of the owners are rumored to have competing visions for the team and couldn't even agree on a frontrunner for their GM position this past summer once John Hammond left. The guy they do have running their basketball operations is supposedly someone that none of them wanted but got the job because he was Hammond's deputy assistant, making him the heir apparent for the job. Now picture how choatic their search for an actual head coach will be!

And when you actually look at the team, it's a bunch of unremarkable talent (save for Giannis) that somehow has them on the verge of paying the luxury tax. Considering that those salaries create a floor that will have them above the cap for the next two seasons, they are almost compelled to commit even more money to players like Eric Bledsoe and Jabari Parker since improvements via free agency won't be an option. But as history has shown, these guys are not good enough to make them any better a team. And even more damning is the fact that Giannis' contract will be set to be coming off the books before they get any kind of cap flexibility.

They are screwed and might have made the situation even worse if Giannis is as close to Kidd, as Kidd might lead us to believe. After all, Giannis isn't the cute-cuddly kid anymore when he first entered the league and his frustration with his circumstances seem to be slowly coming to light. Earlier in the season, he got into a bump/shouting match with an assistant coach, which seemed entirely out of character and a sign that he is gradually becoming disgruntled.

We need to make sure that we have enough assets outside of Kristaps Porzingis (and possibly Frank Ntilikina) to field a competitive offer for him in the next 2-3 seasons if and when he demands a trade. I have no doubt that he'll search for bigger and flashier lights and what better franchise to offer them than the one with the brightest stage of them all? Can you imagine how devastating he and KP could be together as foundational pieces for this franchise?

What can we do to begin preparing ourselves for Giannis' deperature from Milwaukee? Can we do anything at all? If so, what type of package would we need to get him if he demanded a trade? Is Frank essential to any KP-Giannis pairing? What would you need around Giannis and KP to be a true title contender?

I have been saying for awhile that this upcoming draft is critical to this team's success long-term. We have 3 draft picks, and need to come away in the first round with a future starting caliber player and at least 1 future high level role player from the 2nd round. We need to build up our assets by having a bunch of players on long-term, rookie scale contracts. We need to get significantly better without spending a lot of money. If we can do that, and build a playoff team around Porzingis successfully comprised of players on reasonable contracts (other than the big Hardaway contract) than we will be attractive to a big name free agent and have the flexibility to make a move. This draft is the key to it all.

VCoug wrote:There's no trade for Giannis that doesn't include KP unless we tank hard the rest of the year and are able to get a high pick in this year's draft. Theoretically, a trade package of this year's high 1st (like top 3), Ntilikina, WHG, two future 1st, and Kanter to match salaries would at least be a jumping off point to begin negotiations. But I don't think that could really get it done and I don't think it's a better package than other teams, like Boston, Philly, or Phoenix, could put together.

Fortunately, we wouldn't need the best offer available to get Giannis into a Knick uniform at that point. His willingness to re-sign with a franchise will ultimately dictate which offer the Bucks are forced to take and is why I think teams like the Suns are automatically disqualified (bad team, poorly run franchise and not a big stage).

But you're right about the Celtics and Sixers being serious competition; the Celtics more than anything else. I don't believe the Sixers have any game-changing assets left, outside of the players on the roster that would radically swing a deal in their favor like the Celtics do (e.g. the LAL 2018 1st round pick, the 2019 LAC and MEM 1st round picks, etc.). All they'd have is Ben Simmons, Dario Saric and some redundant young talent on the rest of the roster that would effectively leave the team bare ala Melo to NYK. Would the city of Philadelphia andan injury-prone Embiid be enough to peak Giannis' interest and make the experience there worthwhile?

The Celtics, on the other hand, really do scare me in a situation like this. They can form so many compelling offers involving lottery picks that are good enough to avoid having to surrender core pieces in a deal. And a trade that merely adds Giannis to their roster, with a coach like Brad Stephens, instantly makes them Warriors-esque. Our only hope is if Anthony Davis becomes available and the Celtics use those assets on him instead. I believe Davis' contract situation necessitates a decision be made on him before Giannis' situation becomes a situation, which could help our cause.

As I suggested before, it seems like we'll have about 2-3 seasons to work with before the Giannis sweepstakes begin. I think that is more than enough time to get our roster/assets into a situation where we can at least outbid the Sixers and still have enough left to field a competitive team. The "How do we get to that point?" is what intrigues me.

But what I do know is that we need to stop clogging our payroll with expensive role players and develop a better pipeline between us and the G-League. I still don't understand how a team like the Heat can turn an entire roster of second round picks and undrafted players into a playoof team/assets, yet a team as resource-rich as us, can't. Stuff like that will be the deciding factor for a Giannis trade, moving forward.

VCoug wrote:

NardDogNation wrote:

VCoug wrote:There's no trade for Giannis that doesn't include KP unless we tank hard the rest of the year and are able to get a high pick in this year's draft. Theoretically, a trade package of this year's high 1st (like top 3), Ntilikina, WHG, two future 1st, and Kanter to match salaries would at least be a jumping off point to begin negotiations. But I don't think that could really get it done and I don't think it's a better package than other teams, like Boston, Philly, or Phoenix, could put together.

Fortunately, we wouldn't need the best offer available to get Giannis into a Knick uniform at that point. His willingness to re-sign with a franchise will ultimately dictate which offer the Bucks are forced to take and is why I think teams like the Suns are automatically disqualified (bad team, poorly run franchise and not a big stage).

But you're right about the Celtics and Sixers being serious competition; the Celtics more than anything else. I don't believe the Sixers have any game-changing assets left, outside of the players on the roster that would radically swing a deal in their favor like the Celtics do (e.g. the LAL 2018 1st round pick, the 2019 LAC and MEM 1st round picks, etc.). All they'd have is Ben Simmons, Dario Saric and some redundant young talent on the rest of the roster that would effectively leave the team bare ala Melo to NYK. Would the city of Philadelphia andan injury-prone Embiid be enough to peak Giannis' interest and make the experience there worthwhile?

The Celtics, on the other hand, really do scare me in a situation like this. They can form so many compelling offers involving lottery picks that are good enough to avoid having to surrender core pieces in a deal. And a trade that merely adds Giannis to their roster, with a coach like Brad Stephens, instantly makes them Warriors-esque. Our only hope is if Anthony Davis becomes available and the Celtics use those assets on him instead. I believe Davis' contract situation necessitates a decision be made on him before Giannis' situation becomes a situation, which could help our cause.

As I suggested before, it seems like we'll have about 2-3 seasons to work with before the Giannis sweepstakes begin. I think that is more than enough time to get our roster/assets into a situation where we can at least outbid the Sixers and still have enough left to field a competitive team. The "How do we get to that point?" is what intrigues me.

But what I do know is that we need to stop clogging our payroll with expensive role players and develop a better pipeline between us and the G-League. I still don't understand how a team like the Heat can turn an entire roster of second round picks and undrafted players into a playoof team/assets, yet a team as resource-rich as us, can't. Stuff like that will be the deciding factor for a Giannis trade, moving forward.

Philly actually put some protections on the LAL pick traded to Boston; I believe Philly keeps it if it's 1 or below 6. They also have a Sacramento pick coming to them. They could also make Ben Simmons available since him and Giannis kind of duplicate each other.

Boston really is the big risk though. They could put together a really great offer for Giannis if he ever became available.

It's hard to imagine we'll ever stop wasting cap space on mediocre win-now players that won't actually make a difference for us. Not only has that been ownership's imperative for 15 years our own fanbase is always calling for the team to do that.

Good thing fans voice hardly matters. While I can't say the Phil experiment worked out, at least the only bad contract we got stuck with was Noah.
Most teams have one or two deals they live to regret. We tend to overstate as if its a franchise killer!
Rose was a low risk.

But we can argue this all day. Lets be real, Giannis did not sign a contract with Jason Kidd, he signed with the Bucks. He just extended and while he can ask for a trade, he can be refused. What is his real value? Two top 5 lottery picks and.....??? Or Ben simmons and a top 5 lotto pick? Boston, Tatum and a top 5 lotto pick. You don't even make a deal unless you know the picks verbatim.
Long way to go before he asks out. Any team he goes to might be depleted a bit going forward. This kid at this time in his career is a worth a boatload.
What is not known is does he have a good relationship with the owners? Rumor was Kidd had his eye on the PHX job once his relationship with ownership dimmed.
Only other player with this kind of value would be Anthony Davis.