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Article: Knicks Fact Or Fiction
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nixluva
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9/29/2017  4:00 PM
This is a pretty good job by John Schmeelk

Schmeelk: Knicks Fact Or Fiction
Addressing Some Of The Narratives Emerging From First Week Of Camp

September 29, 2017 12:45 PM


By John Schmeelk
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The Knicks’ first week of training camp has been relatively peaceful, but a few narratives have come up that should be addressed. What better way than to play a little “Fact or Fiction”?

The Knicks are still going to run the triangle.

Fiction x 1,000. I cannot stress this enough. This is not going to happen. The Knicks are not going to run Phil Jackson’s triangle in 2017. Might some of the plays they run have some common elements of the triangle? Of course. Nearly every team in the league has “aspects of the triangle” in their offense, including the Spurs and Warriors.


This is similar to the foolish argument people made in the past when defending the triangle. They said “see the Warriors and Spurs are running it!” They weren’t. They just had some plays (usually run through the post) that had triangle style spacing and cuts. They were not running the offense that it appeared Jackson wanted the Knicks to run. They are completely different animals.


The Knicks are not going to slow it down, rely on midrange shots and shy away from the 3. If what coach Jeff Hornacek is saying is true, they will be doing the opposite of those things. This, potentially, could be a very fun Knicks team to watch this year, at least on offense.

Frank Ntilikina will remind people of Kyrie Irving.

Fiction x 10,000. Ramon Sessions, a veteran point guard in the league who has been playing against Ntilikina in camp, made this point, so I understand why people would take it seriously. The evidence, however, is not in Sessions’ favor here. If you watched Ntilikina overseas, his skill set is nearly the opposite of Irving’s.

While Irving struggles mightily on defense, it is Ntilikina’s strength. Where Irving might be the best isolation scorer in the league with a wicked handle, those are the areas that Ntilikina still needs to work on. Where Irving looks to score first, Ntilikina looks to pass first. Knicks fans should not have Irving in mind when they start anticipating what Ntilikina will be on the floor this year.

Kristaps Porzingis’ knee is a big problem and terrible sign of things to come.

Fiction, for now. Obviously, you never want to see a team’s young franchise player deal with a knee injury, but by all accounts, it is minor. He dealt with a knee bruise in Europe over the summer. One common complaint about Porzingis over the past half-year or so is that he is injury prone.

Porzingis missed 10 games in his rookie season and 16 games in his second season. You would obviously want him to play in every game, but missing 26 games over the course of two seasons is hardly being injury prone. It also remains to be seen that if the Knicks had been better and fighting for a playoff spot whether he would have fought through some of the stuff toward the end of the past two years. He missed the final seven games of his rookie season and the final five of his second year. The Knicks were wisely conservative with their young star.

One legitimate risk of drafting a 7-foot-3 player is injury risk. Players that height often deal with lower body injuries, specifically with their feet (see Yao Ming, Bill Walton). In his two years in the NBA, Porzingis hasn’t had a major injury that required surgery. He has had some strains, bruises and other minor aches and pains, but nothing that would be considered a big deal.

That’s not to say those minor injuries don’t add or up or can’t be debilitating. His sore Achilles tendon clearly affected his play in the middle of last season. But as a player who is constantly working out to get stronger, all the while getting used to the rigors of an NBA schedule, things like that can be expected.

Anthony Davis missed 33 games in his first two seasons. Irving missed 54. Dwyane Wade missed 26. Kevin Love missed 23. Porzingis is not unique. As he ages and gets his body to where he wants it, he might grow out of these nagging injuries. He might not. That’s why we have to wait and see.

http://newyork.cbslocal.com/2017/09/29/schmeelk-knicks-fact-or-fiction/
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fishmike
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9/29/2017  4:07 PM
there isnt much new here... however I do like the bold as well. Puts into context some of the comments around here how silly the thought is to trade him or "we picked the wrong guy" like papabear said. yawn
"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
nixluva
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9/29/2017  4:44 PM
fishmike wrote:there isnt much new here... however I do like the bold as well. Puts into context some of the comments around here how silly the thought is to trade him or "we picked the wrong guy" like papabear said. yawn

I too particularly liked the info on other young players missing time. The KP Injury narrative gets overplayed.

HofstraBBall
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9/29/2017  6:44 PM
Thanks for posting.

Favorite part..."This is similar to the foolish argument people made in the past when defending the triangle. They said “see the Warriors and Spurs are running it!”

Agree about Frank vs Irving. So different.

Agree KP issue is overblown. Typical to be sore after ramping things up just weeks after shutting it down when Euro chips ended. Body thinks it's in recovery mode and then you try to go full gear. Body quickly reminds you that you have ease back into things.

'Knicks focus should be on players that have grown up playing soccer or cricket' - Triplethreat 8/28/2020
newyorknewyork
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9/29/2017  7:34 PM
Malcolm Brogdon won ROY last season. Though older and more physically mature listed at 225. He was said coming in to have similar weaknesses as Frank. Poor handling, average athleticism, lack of a first step, poor isolation player.

While 10pts, 2.8rebs, 4.ast, 45.7fg%, 403pt% isn't ground breaking rookie numbers. For a rookie year Malcolm Brodgon's rookie yr could be a good measurement for Frank to look to reach.

https://vote.nba.com/en Vote for your Knicks.
nixluva
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9/29/2017  8:09 PM
HofstraBBall wrote:Thanks for posting.

Favorite part..."This is similar to the foolish argument people made in the past when defending the triangle. They said “see the Warriors and Spurs are running it!”

Agree about Frank vs Irving. So different.

Agree KP issue is overblown. Typical to be sore after ramping things up just weeks after shutting it down when Euro chips ended. Body thinks it's in recovery mode and then you try to go full gear. Body quickly reminds you that you have ease back into things.

Most Everyone that talked about other teams running some Triangle made it clear that those teams weren't running the FULL TRIANGLE SYSTEM. It's pretty obvious that the point was Triangle concepts are common.

I think the Kyrie comp was being hyped up to be more than Sessions actually said. He said Kyrie tendencies. Nitty is a much different player overall. Much more of a ball mover. Running the offense rather than breaking it.

HofstraBBall
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9/29/2017  9:12 PM
nixluva wrote:
HofstraBBall wrote:Thanks for posting.

Favorite part..."This is similar to the foolish argument people made in the past when defending the triangle. They said “see the Warriors and Spurs are running it!”

Agree about Frank vs Irving. So different.

Agree KP issue is overblown. Typical to be sore after ramping things up just weeks after shutting it down when Euro chips ended. Body thinks it's in recovery mode and then you try to go full gear. Body quickly reminds you that you have ease back into things.

Most Everyone that talked about other teams running some Triangle made it clear that those teams weren't running the FULL TRIANGLE SYSTEM. It's pretty obvious that the point was Triangle concepts are common.

I think the Kyrie comp was being hyped up to be more than Sessions actually said. He said Kyrie tendencies. Nitty is a much different player overall. Much more of a ball mover. Running the offense rather than breaking it.

The point of the comment was not to critisize the level (Or type of excuse) used to defend the Triangle but rather that anyone would defend it at all. Some of us on here saw the lack of logic in building the future of a franchise based on a system from the past and no longer utilized in today's NBA. (To the extent Phil wanted) Not to mention that the guy pushing the antiquated system was probably out in a couple of years.

But who cares. Thats in the past. I'm happy Phil's missteps brought this to fruition, sooner rather than later. Looking forward to a system that is not lethargic and predictable.

'Knicks focus should be on players that have grown up playing soccer or cricket' - Triplethreat 8/28/2020
nixluva
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9/29/2017  9:26 PM
HofstraBBall wrote:
nixluva wrote:
HofstraBBall wrote:Thanks for posting.

Favorite part..."This is similar to the foolish argument people made in the past when defending the triangle. They said “see the Warriors and Spurs are running it!”

Agree about Frank vs Irving. So different.

Agree KP issue is overblown. Typical to be sore after ramping things up just weeks after shutting it down when Euro chips ended. Body thinks it's in recovery mode and then you try to go full gear. Body quickly reminds you that you have ease back into things.

Most Everyone that talked about other teams running some Triangle made it clear that those teams weren't running the FULL TRIANGLE SYSTEM. It's pretty obvious that the point was Triangle concepts are common.

I think the Kyrie comp was being hyped up to be more than Sessions actually said. He said Kyrie tendencies. Nitty is a much different player overall. Much more of a ball mover. Running the offense rather than breaking it.

The point of the comment was not to critisize the level (Or type of excuse) used to defend the Triangle but rather that anyone would defend it at all. Some of us on here saw the lack of logic in building the future of a franchise based on a system from the past and no longer utilized in today's NBA. (To the extent Phil wanted) Not to mention that the guy pushing the antiquated system was probably out in a couple of years.

But who cares. Thats in the past. I'm happy Phil's missteps brought this to fruition, sooner rather than later. Looking forward to a system that is not lethargic and predictable.

Last year the Knicks NEVER ran even 50% Triangle. Jeff wanted to play faster but DRose and Melo refused to run the floor. Now Jeff is 100% free to run what he wants but it wouldn't have made a difference without getting rid of players that refused to get up and down. Plus the fact that they added younger players that are willing to run and give effort.

Article: Knicks Fact Or Fiction

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