BRIGGS wrote:

fishmike wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

Knickoftime wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

Knickoftime wrote:

martin wrote:

Knickoftime wrote:

martin wrote:

dacash wrote:why is this here and not kinda off topic

off-season. During season we'd definitely move this appropriately.

That said Martin, it's your choice to make, but my opinion to be expressed...

I loathe the participation trophy era of quote-unquote 'free speech.' We celebrate merely having an opinion, which pretty much anyone with a brainstem has, rather than productive expression of an opinion.

Having toxic, stupid **** on any discussion forum, particularly contributed by people who prove they can't even participate in a discussion, makes it worse, not better, and makes us worse, not better.

That doesn't help me. What to do?

The first step in persuasion is to get that misinformed and under-educated out there.

I suspect If I ever referred to black people on this forum, here specifically or anywhere generally, with the N-word, what would happen.

Briggs has directly referred to black people generally as being hateful, violent and scary. He lately has qualified that as "inner city AAs." At the same time he posts YouTube videos of violent outbursts that didn't occur in "inner city." He has rejected our nation's history as a factor in crime and violence, suggesting anyone in this country regardless of circumstance has equal opportunity. He may not have the courage to put those thoughts together, but the implication is clear.

We are now holding a discourse in a thread that has nothing to do with "inner city AAs", but his problems with black people of an entirely different demo.

Who he is is clear, by his own words.

As an American, I fully support his right to go about his life without fear of reprisal, imprisonment or taxation over his views from any government agency, which is the extent of his First Amendment rights. And independent of the views he holds, he doesn't even attempt to engage in discussion, so he would not be welcome in my home. If I were president of the club he would not be welcome as a member, if I an employer he would not be welcome as an employee.

As I say, I don't know how the sum total of his thoughts and words is any less offensive to the one thing that would get any of us removed from the premises.

Sorry Knickstime--Id say roughly 75% of non AA feel the same way--and the majority of police. And the other 25% well they can go hang out in their local inner city projects and see how they are treated if they spend a few hours there.

When you make up statistics out of thin air, you show yourself incapable of having an intelligent conversation.

But the excuse that black people are oppressed in 2017 is about a big of farce as you can get. You are free to go and do whatever you want in this country. Inner city AA need to have better parenting take responsibility and move away from their culture of violence and crime.

Okay, here is where you need to be brave. Explain why succinctly and honestly, since they have no excuse, "inner city AAs" are more violent and hateful than other people, aren't good parents, don't take responsibility, and don't move away from a culture of violence and crime?

The shouldn't be a difficult question answer, and there should be little to no hedging on your part.

answer what?

knicks time --- Colon K protests because of the perceived treatment of AA y police-- but answer why do you think police act the perceives way they do? It's ok to protest but exactly what is the solution? Why is the behavior of the police the way it is? And if you need to protest the police-- why choose a military anthem??? You won't answer my question-- Colin k protests because of perceived abuse against Aa by police-- why do the police act this way and how many cops are we talking about here-- also what's your solution to the problem -- I've given u my reasons but I'd bet a few bucks you'll be quiet now

Good stuff Briggs... first the poor treatment is "perceived" then you go back to your favorite rallying point that the unfair treatment is deserved in the first place. Time to post for more youtube videos of black people doing bad things.

Thats not an answer

The question is --if Colin K is protesting perceived police violence against AA--why do you think police act this way and than what is the solution to the issue. What is Colin's solution to the issue? Has he talked to the police? Has anyone talked with police?

Kap doesn't have to be the one to SOLVE a problem that's existed for longer than most of us have been alive. His job is bringing awareness and for those in POWER to take serious steps to solving the problem.

I don't want myself of my children to be the victims of some cops panic, fear or prejudice. Many times the biggest issue is a failure to conduct proper PROTOCOL by the Police. A failure to de-escalate by the Police. I say this as the son of a retired NYPD Officer! Even my Father had to deal with being profiled by fellow White officers.

Everyday Police deal with dangerous and violent WHITE people in a way that doesn't lead to that person's death. Not to mention all the interactions with White Citizens at mundane traffic stops that don't end up with a death. Stop acting like this is something that we shouldn't be protesting about.

meloshouldgo wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

NardDogNation wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

Uptown wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:The first question one may ask when disregarding the 'theme" of standing is "what have I personally done for my country". What did this country afford my family and I? Have I ever served the countries military? Have I put myself in harms way to protect others freedoms? Have I talked to members of the military who have done more than I and asked them what do they feel about the "National anthem". Do they feel it would be disrespectful to them if someone chose not to stand for it. The National Anthem is not a self-serving platform--go look at the origins of OUR military. Feel free to ask REAL servicemen how they feel about the SIMPLE appreciation and then come back here. It's really easy to disrespect the people who keep the nation safe everyday and who have for 250 years. Its not a platform for protest--its a pledge of respect. How does disrespecting hundreds of millions of servicemen create any good? I'm going to be selfish and use this platform of respect for people who have done nothing but safeguarded my well being?

Dude, you are clueless!!!! Are you reading the responses in this thread! The protest has nothing to do with the military! But since you are so gung-ho about your national anthem, do you care about the actual author of the national anthem? Do you care that the original national anthem had the following verse:

No refuge could save the hireling and slave
From the terror of flight or the gloom of the grave,
And the star-spangled banner in triumph doth wave
O’er the land of the free and the home of the brave.

The national anthem that you speak of talks about killing slaves....In this day and age, why do we still sing this song?!

Yes, and I object to calling only people who serve in the military "servicemen." If you are a doctor, a teacher, a sanitation worker, or just a kind person, you are serving the country.

Exactly! Especially teachers who are routinely scrutinized and poorly compensated despite being so crucial to furthering a strong and healthy democracy.

My brother teaches math and makes over 80 k a year with complete summers off ana a full workload of 190 days. How does that compare with people who don't even make 1/4 of that and put their lives on the line. Admirable vocation-- absolutely-- does it compare to servicemen-- you have to be kidding.

If you want to sit during the National Anthem-- go ahead but believe me 80-90% of the people will think you are disrespectful to our nation. You would not be here without the military -- you would not have exsisted

If anyone thinks any type of platform will be hear while disrespecting those you are trying to communicate with-- what kind of common sense does that make?

Who are these people defending us from? How many American lives were put on the line defending our country since the WWII - what the fukk are you talking about? We wouldn't exist if not for this imaginary defense against imaginary perpetrators because you said so?

Without education and science our military would be on par with Myanmar. Take away but the technology and no country on earth would give a **** about our military. We couldn't even handle Vietnamese guerillas. The only deterrent is the TECHNOLOGY in the hands of the military. That and not imaginary sacrifices by the military defending our country keeps us safe.

You totally clueless man.
I was on the other site and if no American army Russians will left no stone standing in US.
And Wehrmacht will gladly do the same.
And if no police, firefighter, and first responders you ass will be up for grub any day by anyone who so desire.
Leaving in comfort, security, and prosperity made so many Americans delusional while thinking they are very intellectually sound.
They just sound silly and so no one really taking them seriously. And this is a good thing.

BRIGGS wrote:

fishmike wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

Knickoftime wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

Knickoftime wrote:

martin wrote:

Knickoftime wrote:

martin wrote:

dacash wrote:why is this here and not kinda off topic

off-season. During season we'd definitely move this appropriately.

That said Martin, it's your choice to make, but my opinion to be expressed...

I loathe the participation trophy era of quote-unquote 'free speech.' We celebrate merely having an opinion, which pretty much anyone with a brainstem has, rather than productive expression of an opinion.

Having toxic, stupid **** on any discussion forum, particularly contributed by people who prove they can't even participate in a discussion, makes it worse, not better, and makes us worse, not better.

That doesn't help me. What to do?

The first step in persuasion is to get that misinformed and under-educated out there.

I suspect If I ever referred to black people on this forum, here specifically or anywhere generally, with the N-word, what would happen.

Briggs has directly referred to black people generally as being hateful, violent and scary. He lately has qualified that as "inner city AAs." At the same time he posts YouTube videos of violent outbursts that didn't occur in "inner city." He has rejected our nation's history as a factor in crime and violence, suggesting anyone in this country regardless of circumstance has equal opportunity. He may not have the courage to put those thoughts together, but the implication is clear.

We are now holding a discourse in a thread that has nothing to do with "inner city AAs", but his problems with black people of an entirely different demo.

Who he is is clear, by his own words.

As an American, I fully support his right to go about his life without fear of reprisal, imprisonment or taxation over his views from any government agency, which is the extent of his First Amendment rights. And independent of the views he holds, he doesn't even attempt to engage in discussion, so he would not be welcome in my home. If I were president of the club he would not be welcome as a member, if I an employer he would not be welcome as an employee.

As I say, I don't know how the sum total of his thoughts and words is any less offensive to the one thing that would get any of us removed from the premises.

Sorry Knickstime--Id say roughly 75% of non AA feel the same way--and the majority of police. And the other 25% well they can go hang out in their local inner city projects and see how they are treated if they spend a few hours there.

When you make up statistics out of thin air, you show yourself incapable of having an intelligent conversation.

But the excuse that black people are oppressed in 2017 is about a big of farce as you can get. You are free to go and do whatever you want in this country. Inner city AA need to have better parenting take responsibility and move away from their culture of violence and crime.

Okay, here is where you need to be brave. Explain why succinctly and honestly, since they have no excuse, "inner city AAs" are more violent and hateful than other people, aren't good parents, don't take responsibility, and don't move away from a culture of violence and crime?

The shouldn't be a difficult question answer, and there should be little to no hedging on your part.

answer what?

knicks time --- Colon K protests because of the perceived treatment of AA y police-- but answer why do you think police act the perceives way they do? It's ok to protest but exactly what is the solution? Why is the behavior of the police the way it is? And if you need to protest the police-- why choose a military anthem??? You won't answer my question-- Colin k protests because of perceived abuse against Aa by police-- why do the police act this way and how many cops are we talking about here-- also what's your solution to the problem -- I've given u my reasons but I'd bet a few bucks you'll be quiet now

Good stuff Briggs... first the poor treatment is "perceived" then you go back to your favorite rallying point that the unfair treatment is deserved in the first place. Time to post for more youtube videos of black people doing bad things.

Thats not an answer

The question is --if Colin K is protesting perceived police violence against AA--why do you think police act this way and than what is the solution to the issue. What is Colin's solution to the issue? Has he talked to the police? Has anyone talked with police?

This is what protocol has been established for. The protest are for the failure to follow protocol, leading toward things like excessive force, leading to the death of unarmed civilians. Then followed up with the lack of accountability for the breach in protocol.

The solution is for protocol to be followed. And for police to be held accountable when they breach protocol especially leading to the death of a human being.

Nix has offered tons and tons and tons of material on "causation" which you don't care for. But expect "causation" to be acknowledged when its convenient towards your argument.

Not to mention we have police officers themselves outing their departments over serious racism issues.

There is no way you realistically can look at the whole process of law enforcement to the judicial system and come away thinking that it has been fair to African Americans.

arkrud wrote:

meloshouldgo wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

NardDogNation wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

Uptown wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:The first question one may ask when disregarding the 'theme" of standing is "what have I personally done for my country". What did this country afford my family and I? Have I ever served the countries military? Have I put myself in harms way to protect others freedoms? Have I talked to members of the military who have done more than I and asked them what do they feel about the "National anthem". Do they feel it would be disrespectful to them if someone chose not to stand for it. The National Anthem is not a self-serving platform--go look at the origins of OUR military. Feel free to ask REAL servicemen how they feel about the SIMPLE appreciation and then come back here. It's really easy to disrespect the people who keep the nation safe everyday and who have for 250 years. Its not a platform for protest--its a pledge of respect. How does disrespecting hundreds of millions of servicemen create any good? I'm going to be selfish and use this platform of respect for people who have done nothing but safeguarded my well being?

Dude, you are clueless!!!! Are you reading the responses in this thread! The protest has nothing to do with the military! But since you are so gung-ho about your national anthem, do you care about the actual author of the national anthem? Do you care that the original national anthem had the following verse:

No refuge could save the hireling and slave
From the terror of flight or the gloom of the grave,
And the star-spangled banner in triumph doth wave
O’er the land of the free and the home of the brave.

The national anthem that you speak of talks about killing slaves....In this day and age, why do we still sing this song?!

Yes, and I object to calling only people who serve in the military "servicemen." If you are a doctor, a teacher, a sanitation worker, or just a kind person, you are serving the country.

Exactly! Especially teachers who are routinely scrutinized and poorly compensated despite being so crucial to furthering a strong and healthy democracy.

My brother teaches math and makes over 80 k a year with complete summers off ana a full workload of 190 days. How does that compare with people who don't even make 1/4 of that and put their lives on the line. Admirable vocation-- absolutely-- does it compare to servicemen-- you have to be kidding.

If you want to sit during the National Anthem-- go ahead but believe me 80-90% of the people will think you are disrespectful to our nation. You would not be here without the military -- you would not have exsisted

If anyone thinks any type of platform will be hear while disrespecting those you are trying to communicate with-- what kind of common sense does that make?

Who are these people defending us from? How many American lives were put on the line defending our country since the WWII - what the fukk are you talking about? We wouldn't exist if not for this imaginary defense against imaginary perpetrators because you said so?

Without education and science our military would be on par with Myanmar. Take away but the technology and no country on earth would give a **** about our military. We couldn't even handle Vietnamese guerillas. The only deterrent is the TECHNOLOGY in the hands of the military. That and not imaginary sacrifices by the military defending our country keeps us safe.

You totally clueless man.
I was on the other site and if no American army Russians will left no stone standing in US.
And Wehrmacht will gladly do the same.
And if no police, firefighter, and first responders you ass will be up for grub any day by anyone who so desire.
Leaving in comfort, security, and prosperity made so many Americans delusional while thinking they are very intellectually sound.
They just sound silly and so no one really taking them seriously. And this is a good thing.

Are you able to read? I didn't say anything about police or firefighters. I said no one gives a rats ass about our military personnel. Our military power is absolute because of our technology superiority and NOT because of the personnel.

BRIGGS wrote:

newyorknewyork wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

fishmike wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

Knickoftime wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

Knickoftime wrote:

martin wrote:

Knickoftime wrote:

martin wrote:

dacash wrote:why is this here and not kinda off topic

off-season. During season we'd definitely move this appropriately.

That said Martin, it's your choice to make, but my opinion to be expressed...

I loathe the participation trophy era of quote-unquote 'free speech.' We celebrate merely having an opinion, which pretty much anyone with a brainstem has, rather than productive expression of an opinion.

Having toxic, stupid **** on any discussion forum, particularly contributed by people who prove they can't even participate in a discussion, makes it worse, not better, and makes us worse, not better.

That doesn't help me. What to do?

The first step in persuasion is to get that misinformed and under-educated out there.

I suspect If I ever referred to black people on this forum, here specifically or anywhere generally, with the N-word, what would happen.

Briggs has directly referred to black people generally as being hateful, violent and scary. He lately has qualified that as "inner city AAs." At the same time he posts YouTube videos of violent outbursts that didn't occur in "inner city." He has rejected our nation's history as a factor in crime and violence, suggesting anyone in this country regardless of circumstance has equal opportunity. He may not have the courage to put those thoughts together, but the implication is clear.

We are now holding a discourse in a thread that has nothing to do with "inner city AAs", but his problems with black people of an entirely different demo.

Who he is is clear, by his own words.

As an American, I fully support his right to go about his life without fear of reprisal, imprisonment or taxation over his views from any government agency, which is the extent of his First Amendment rights. And independent of the views he holds, he doesn't even attempt to engage in discussion, so he would not be welcome in my home. If I were president of the club he would not be welcome as a member, if I an employer he would not be welcome as an employee.

As I say, I don't know how the sum total of his thoughts and words is any less offensive to the one thing that would get any of us removed from the premises.

Sorry Knickstime--Id say roughly 75% of non AA feel the same way--and the majority of police. And the other 25% well they can go hang out in their local inner city projects and see how they are treated if they spend a few hours there.

When you make up statistics out of thin air, you show yourself incapable of having an intelligent conversation.

But the excuse that black people are oppressed in 2017 is about a big of farce as you can get. You are free to go and do whatever you want in this country. Inner city AA need to have better parenting take responsibility and move away from their culture of violence and crime.

Okay, here is where you need to be brave. Explain why succinctly and honestly, since they have no excuse, "inner city AAs" are more violent and hateful than other people, aren't good parents, don't take responsibility, and don't move away from a culture of violence and crime?

The shouldn't be a difficult question answer, and there should be little to no hedging on your part.

answer what?

knicks time --- Colon K protests because of the perceived treatment of AA y police-- but answer why do you think police act the perceives way they do? It's ok to protest but exactly what is the solution? Why is the behavior of the police the way it is? And if you need to protest the police-- why choose a military anthem??? You won't answer my question-- Colin k protests because of perceived abuse against Aa by police-- why do the police act this way and how many cops are we talking about here-- also what's your solution to the problem -- I've given u my reasons but I'd bet a few bucks you'll be quiet now

Good stuff Briggs... first the poor treatment is "perceived" then you go back to your favorite rallying point that the unfair treatment is deserved in the first place. Time to post for more youtube videos of black people doing bad things.

Thats not an answer

The question is --if Colin K is protesting perceived police violence against AA--why do you think police act this way and than what is the solution to the issue. What is Colin's solution to the issue? Has he talked to the police? Has anyone talked with police?

This is what protocol has been established for. The protest are for the failure to follow protocol, leading toward things like excessive force, leading to the death of unarmed civilians. Then followed up with the lack of accountability for the breach in protocol.

The solution is for protocol to be followed. And for police to be held accountable when they breach protocol especially leading to the death of a human being.

Nix has offered tons and tons and tons of material on "causation" which you don't care for. But expect "causation" to be acknowledged when its convenient towards your argument.

Not to mention we have police officers themselves outing their departments over serious racism issues.

There is no way you realistically can look at the whole process of law enforcement to the judicial system and come away thinking that it has been fair to African Americans.

Does protocol factor in long term emotional distress? Does protocol factor in the fear of losing your life? Does protocol factor in spontaneous live action(possibly alone and outnumbered?)? Do you think most of these cops who have shot people of any race really wanted to do what they did--or maybe theyre were additional circumstance that go beyond protocol? Do you think cops leave their home and go to work thinking Im going to kill someone today? You're thinking from one side. AA on a % basis cause more crime and live in more dangerous areas--areas where police must have long term emotional distress on those beats. You're answering the question like a robot---protocol is part of a much more complex solution--but no where near a solution.

WTF! How about the emotional distress of a family that had their 12 yr old son gunned down by police?!!! How about the emotional distress of a 4 yr old who watched their dad get shot in the front seat of the car?! Do you think the 12 yr woke up thinking, I'm going to get killed by a police officer that's supposed to protect me?

You want to talk about long term emotional stress, try living in an environment where you can get killed at any moment because of perception. These cops can trade in their blue uniforms at anytime if the stress is too much to bear. Black men such as myself can't make such trade ins...

Uptown wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

newyorknewyork wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

fishmike wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

Knickoftime wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

Knickoftime wrote:

martin wrote:

Knickoftime wrote:

martin wrote:

dacash wrote:why is this here and not kinda off topic

off-season. During season we'd definitely move this appropriately.

That said Martin, it's your choice to make, but my opinion to be expressed...

I loathe the participation trophy era of quote-unquote 'free speech.' We celebrate merely having an opinion, which pretty much anyone with a brainstem has, rather than productive expression of an opinion.

Having toxic, stupid **** on any discussion forum, particularly contributed by people who prove they can't even participate in a discussion, makes it worse, not better, and makes us worse, not better.

That doesn't help me. What to do?

The first step in persuasion is to get that misinformed and under-educated out there.

I suspect If I ever referred to black people on this forum, here specifically or anywhere generally, with the N-word, what would happen.

Briggs has directly referred to black people generally as being hateful, violent and scary. He lately has qualified that as "inner city AAs." At the same time he posts YouTube videos of violent outbursts that didn't occur in "inner city." He has rejected our nation's history as a factor in crime and violence, suggesting anyone in this country regardless of circumstance has equal opportunity. He may not have the courage to put those thoughts together, but the implication is clear.

We are now holding a discourse in a thread that has nothing to do with "inner city AAs", but his problems with black people of an entirely different demo.

Who he is is clear, by his own words.

As an American, I fully support his right to go about his life without fear of reprisal, imprisonment or taxation over his views from any government agency, which is the extent of his First Amendment rights. And independent of the views he holds, he doesn't even attempt to engage in discussion, so he would not be welcome in my home. If I were president of the club he would not be welcome as a member, if I an employer he would not be welcome as an employee.

As I say, I don't know how the sum total of his thoughts and words is any less offensive to the one thing that would get any of us removed from the premises.

Sorry Knickstime--Id say roughly 75% of non AA feel the same way--and the majority of police. And the other 25% well they can go hang out in their local inner city projects and see how they are treated if they spend a few hours there.

When you make up statistics out of thin air, you show yourself incapable of having an intelligent conversation.

But the excuse that black people are oppressed in 2017 is about a big of farce as you can get. You are free to go and do whatever you want in this country. Inner city AA need to have better parenting take responsibility and move away from their culture of violence and crime.

Okay, here is where you need to be brave. Explain why succinctly and honestly, since they have no excuse, "inner city AAs" are more violent and hateful than other people, aren't good parents, don't take responsibility, and don't move away from a culture of violence and crime?

The shouldn't be a difficult question answer, and there should be little to no hedging on your part.

answer what?

knicks time --- Colon K protests because of the perceived treatment of AA y police-- but answer why do you think police act the perceives way they do? It's ok to protest but exactly what is the solution? Why is the behavior of the police the way it is? And if you need to protest the police-- why choose a military anthem??? You won't answer my question-- Colin k protests because of perceived abuse against Aa by police-- why do the police act this way and how many cops are we talking about here-- also what's your solution to the problem -- I've given u my reasons but I'd bet a few bucks you'll be quiet now

Good stuff Briggs... first the poor treatment is "perceived" then you go back to your favorite rallying point that the unfair treatment is deserved in the first place. Time to post for more youtube videos of black people doing bad things.

Thats not an answer

The question is --if Colin K is protesting perceived police violence against AA--why do you think police act this way and than what is the solution to the issue. What is Colin's solution to the issue? Has he talked to the police? Has anyone talked with police?

This is what protocol has been established for. The protest are for the failure to follow protocol, leading toward things like excessive force, leading to the death of unarmed civilians. Then followed up with the lack of accountability for the breach in protocol.

The solution is for protocol to be followed. And for police to be held accountable when they breach protocol especially leading to the death of a human being.

Nix has offered tons and tons and tons of material on "causation" which you don't care for. But expect "causation" to be acknowledged when its convenient towards your argument.

Not to mention we have police officers themselves outing their departments over serious racism issues.

There is no way you realistically can look at the whole process of law enforcement to the judicial system and come away thinking that it has been fair to African Americans.

Does protocol factor in long term emotional distress? Does protocol factor in the fear of losing your life? Does protocol factor in spontaneous live action(possibly alone and outnumbered?)? Do you think most of these cops who have shot people of any race really wanted to do what they did--or maybe theyre were additional circumstance that go beyond protocol? Do you think cops leave their home and go to work thinking Im going to kill someone today? You're thinking from one side. AA on a % basis cause more crime and live in more dangerous areas--areas where police must have long term emotional distress on those beats. You're answering the question like a robot---protocol is part of a much more complex solution--but no where near a solution.

WTF! How about the emotional of a family that had their 12 yr old son gunned down by police?!!! How about the emotional distress of a 4 yr old who watched their dad get shot in the front seat of the car?! Do you think the 12 yr woke up thinking, I'm going to get killed by a police officer thats supposed to protect me?

You want to talk about long term emotional stress, try living in an environment where you can get killed at any moment because of perception. These cops can trade in their blue uniforms at anytime if the stress is too much to bear. Black men such as myself can't make such trade ins...

uptown
How many black men were killed by police last year? How many black people were killed by other black people? How many white people killed by police. If you want fair discussion-- please answer the question.

Uptown wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

Uptown wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

newyorknewyork wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

fishmike wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

Knickoftime wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

Knickoftime wrote:

martin wrote:

Knickoftime wrote:

martin wrote:

dacash wrote:why is this here and not kinda off topic

off-season. During season we'd definitely move this appropriately.

That said Martin, it's your choice to make, but my opinion to be expressed...

I loathe the participation trophy era of quote-unquote 'free speech.' We celebrate merely having an opinion, which pretty much anyone with a brainstem has, rather than productive expression of an opinion.

Having toxic, stupid **** on any discussion forum, particularly contributed by people who prove they can't even participate in a discussion, makes it worse, not better, and makes us worse, not better.

That doesn't help me. What to do?

The first step in persuasion is to get that misinformed and under-educated out there.

I suspect If I ever referred to black people on this forum, here specifically or anywhere generally, with the N-word, what would happen.

Briggs has directly referred to black people generally as being hateful, violent and scary. He lately has qualified that as "inner city AAs." At the same time he posts YouTube videos of violent outbursts that didn't occur in "inner city." He has rejected our nation's history as a factor in crime and violence, suggesting anyone in this country regardless of circumstance has equal opportunity. He may not have the courage to put those thoughts together, but the implication is clear.

We are now holding a discourse in a thread that has nothing to do with "inner city AAs", but his problems with black people of an entirely different demo.

Who he is is clear, by his own words.

As an American, I fully support his right to go about his life without fear of reprisal, imprisonment or taxation over his views from any government agency, which is the extent of his First Amendment rights. And independent of the views he holds, he doesn't even attempt to engage in discussion, so he would not be welcome in my home. If I were president of the club he would not be welcome as a member, if I an employer he would not be welcome as an employee.

As I say, I don't know how the sum total of his thoughts and words is any less offensive to the one thing that would get any of us removed from the premises.

Sorry Knickstime--Id say roughly 75% of non AA feel the same way--and the majority of police. And the other 25% well they can go hang out in their local inner city projects and see how they are treated if they spend a few hours there.

When you make up statistics out of thin air, you show yourself incapable of having an intelligent conversation.

But the excuse that black people are oppressed in 2017 is about a big of farce as you can get. You are free to go and do whatever you want in this country. Inner city AA need to have better parenting take responsibility and move away from their culture of violence and crime.

Okay, here is where you need to be brave. Explain why succinctly and honestly, since they have no excuse, "inner city AAs" are more violent and hateful than other people, aren't good parents, don't take responsibility, and don't move away from a culture of violence and crime?

The shouldn't be a difficult question answer, and there should be little to no hedging on your part.

answer what?

knicks time --- Colon K protests because of the perceived treatment of AA y police-- but answer why do you think police act the perceives way they do? It's ok to protest but exactly what is the solution? Why is the behavior of the police the way it is? And if you need to protest the police-- why choose a military anthem??? You won't answer my question-- Colin k protests because of perceived abuse against Aa by police-- why do the police act this way and how many cops are we talking about here-- also what's your solution to the problem -- I've given u my reasons but I'd bet a few bucks you'll be quiet now

Good stuff Briggs... first the poor treatment is "perceived" then you go back to your favorite rallying point that the unfair treatment is deserved in the first place. Time to post for more youtube videos of black people doing bad things.

Thats not an answer

The question is --if Colin K is protesting perceived police violence against AA--why do you think police act this way and than what is the solution to the issue. What is Colin's solution to the issue? Has he talked to the police? Has anyone talked with police?

This is what protocol has been established for. The protest are for the failure to follow protocol, leading toward things like excessive force, leading to the death of unarmed civilians. Then followed up with the lack of accountability for the breach in protocol.

The solution is for protocol to be followed. And for police to be held accountable when they breach protocol especially leading to the death of a human being.

Nix has offered tons and tons and tons of material on "causation" which you don't care for. But expect "causation" to be acknowledged when its convenient towards your argument.

Not to mention we have police officers themselves outing their departments over serious racism issues.

There is no way you realistically can look at the whole process of law enforcement to the judicial system and come away thinking that it has been fair to African Americans.

Does protocol factor in long term emotional distress? Does protocol factor in the fear of losing your life? Does protocol factor in spontaneous live action(possibly alone and outnumbered?)? Do you think most of these cops who have shot people of any race really wanted to do what they did--or maybe theyre were additional circumstance that go beyond protocol? Do you think cops leave their home and go to work thinking Im going to kill someone today? You're thinking from one side. AA on a % basis cause more crime and live in more dangerous areas--areas where police must have long term emotional distress on those beats. You're answering the question like a robot---protocol is part of a much more complex solution--but no where near a solution.

WTF! How about the emotional of a family that had their 12 yr old son gunned down by police?!!! How about the emotional distress of a 4 yr old who watched their dad get shot in the front seat of the car?! Do you think the 12 yr woke up thinking, I'm going to get killed by a police officer thats supposed to protect me?

You want to talk about long term emotional stress, try living in an environment where you can get killed at any moment because of perception. These cops can trade in their blue uniforms at anytime if the stress is too much to bear. Black men such as myself can't make such trade ins...

uptown
How many black men were killed by police last year? How many black people were killed by other black people? How many white people killed by police. If you want fair discussion-- please answer the question.

First and foremost, there are a bunch of questions posters have directed toward you that you conveniently ignored...there were numerous answers to questions you posed, yet you chose not to respond. You are not interested in a fair discussion; instead you are on a crusade to prove a jaded and ignorant point of view you have of black people.

Ive answered every question--here are the answers

U.S. police killed 258 black people in 2015

US police killed 494 white people in 2015

There were over 6000 Black people killed by other blacks in the same year

US population 325mm

Number of police in the US 900,000

42 police officers killed in 2015

On a % basis 250 blacks killed doesnt look like an epidemic and its 1/25 less than black on black murder

White people who commit less crime on a % basis still had double the amount of people killed by police.

If AA make up 14% of the population than that over 23mm with 250 murders. Is that even close to a statistical epidemic? Does it read like black people are being hunted b y police?

My bet is police save 10000 times the lives theyve taken--think about it.

But even looking at these numbers which are statistical nothingness police are being made out to be a sieve on the black community--so much so that people dont believe thye need to stand for the national anthem and that wild protests are needed around the US to demonize them

258 murders--ask yourselves how many saved?

BRIGGS wrote:

Uptown wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

Uptown wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

newyorknewyork wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

fishmike wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

Knickoftime wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

Knickoftime wrote:

martin wrote:

Knickoftime wrote:

martin wrote:

dacash wrote:why is this here and not kinda off topic

off-season. During season we'd definitely move this appropriately.

That said Martin, it's your choice to make, but my opinion to be expressed...

I loathe the participation trophy era of quote-unquote 'free speech.' We celebrate merely having an opinion, which pretty much anyone with a brainstem has, rather than productive expression of an opinion.

Having toxic, stupid **** on any discussion forum, particularly contributed by people who prove they can't even participate in a discussion, makes it worse, not better, and makes us worse, not better.

That doesn't help me. What to do?

The first step in persuasion is to get that misinformed and under-educated out there.

I suspect If I ever referred to black people on this forum, here specifically or anywhere generally, with the N-word, what would happen.

Briggs has directly referred to black people generally as being hateful, violent and scary. He lately has qualified that as "inner city AAs." At the same time he posts YouTube videos of violent outbursts that didn't occur in "inner city." He has rejected our nation's history as a factor in crime and violence, suggesting anyone in this country regardless of circumstance has equal opportunity. He may not have the courage to put those thoughts together, but the implication is clear.

We are now holding a discourse in a thread that has nothing to do with "inner city AAs", but his problems with black people of an entirely different demo.

Who he is is clear, by his own words.

As an American, I fully support his right to go about his life without fear of reprisal, imprisonment or taxation over his views from any government agency, which is the extent of his First Amendment rights. And independent of the views he holds, he doesn't even attempt to engage in discussion, so he would not be welcome in my home. If I were president of the club he would not be welcome as a member, if I an employer he would not be welcome as an employee.

As I say, I don't know how the sum total of his thoughts and words is any less offensive to the one thing that would get any of us removed from the premises.

Sorry Knickstime--Id say roughly 75% of non AA feel the same way--and the majority of police. And the other 25% well they can go hang out in their local inner city projects and see how they are treated if they spend a few hours there.

When you make up statistics out of thin air, you show yourself incapable of having an intelligent conversation.

But the excuse that black people are oppressed in 2017 is about a big of farce as you can get. You are free to go and do whatever you want in this country. Inner city AA need to have better parenting take responsibility and move away from their culture of violence and crime.

Okay, here is where you need to be brave. Explain why succinctly and honestly, since they have no excuse, "inner city AAs" are more violent and hateful than other people, aren't good parents, don't take responsibility, and don't move away from a culture of violence and crime?

The shouldn't be a difficult question answer, and there should be little to no hedging on your part.

answer what?

knicks time --- Colon K protests because of the perceived treatment of AA y police-- but answer why do you think police act the perceives way they do? It's ok to protest but exactly what is the solution? Why is the behavior of the police the way it is? And if you need to protest the police-- why choose a military anthem??? You won't answer my question-- Colin k protests because of perceived abuse against Aa by police-- why do the police act this way and how many cops are we talking about here-- also what's your solution to the problem -- I've given u my reasons but I'd bet a few bucks you'll be quiet now

Good stuff Briggs... first the poor treatment is "perceived" then you go back to your favorite rallying point that the unfair treatment is deserved in the first place. Time to post for more youtube videos of black people doing bad things.

Thats not an answer

The question is --if Colin K is protesting perceived police violence against AA--why do you think police act this way and than what is the solution to the issue. What is Colin's solution to the issue? Has he talked to the police? Has anyone talked with police?

This is what protocol has been established for. The protest are for the failure to follow protocol, leading toward things like excessive force, leading to the death of unarmed civilians. Then followed up with the lack of accountability for the breach in protocol.

The solution is for protocol to be followed. And for police to be held accountable when they breach protocol especially leading to the death of a human being.

Nix has offered tons and tons and tons of material on "causation" which you don't care for. But expect "causation" to be acknowledged when its convenient towards your argument.

Not to mention we have police officers themselves outing their departments over serious racism issues.

There is no way you realistically can look at the whole process of law enforcement to the judicial system and come away thinking that it has been fair to African Americans.

Does protocol factor in long term emotional distress? Does protocol factor in the fear of losing your life? Does protocol factor in spontaneous live action(possibly alone and outnumbered?)? Do you think most of these cops who have shot people of any race really wanted to do what they did--or maybe theyre were additional circumstance that go beyond protocol? Do you think cops leave their home and go to work thinking Im going to kill someone today? You're thinking from one side. AA on a % basis cause more crime and live in more dangerous areas--areas where police must have long term emotional distress on those beats. You're answering the question like a robot---protocol is part of a much more complex solution--but no where near a solution.

WTF! How about the emotional of a family that had their 12 yr old son gunned down by police?!!! How about the emotional distress of a 4 yr old who watched their dad get shot in the front seat of the car?! Do you think the 12 yr woke up thinking, I'm going to get killed by a police officer thats supposed to protect me?

You want to talk about long term emotional stress, try living in an environment where you can get killed at any moment because of perception. These cops can trade in their blue uniforms at anytime if the stress is too much to bear. Black men such as myself can't make such trade ins...

uptown
How many black men were killed by police last year? How many black people were killed by other black people? How many white people killed by police. If you want fair discussion-- please answer the question.

First and foremost, there are a bunch of questions posters have directed toward you that you conveniently ignored...there were numerous answers to questions you posed, yet you chose not to respond. You are not interested in a fair discussion; instead you are on a crusade to prove a jaded and ignorant point of view you have of black people.

Ive answered every question--here are the answers

U.S. police killed 258 black people in 2015

US police killed 494 white people in 2015

There were over 6000 Black people killed by other blacks in the same year

....so you're using raw stats without accounting for population size? How astute of you.

Police can only issue warnings and tickets for minor traffic infractions that do not include suspected drink driving or reckless driving through mail( similar to non payment through a toll)

Police cannot stop or interact with any individual unless their body and car cameras are functional/ installed and running. Failure to have these cameras running will be met with written verbal warnings than termination.

There are no more mandatory minimum infraction rules

Here are some TRUE reasonable solutions-- not that hard to think about and implement

There were well over 1000 people killed by police only 25% were black. Those other 750 lives matter as well-- just as much as a black life?

It takes reasonable common sense approach to diminish police interaction to a minimum. I'm sure other reasonable steps can help further as well. But putting the entire police force of the nation on notice and protesting a national anthem that tens of millions find distesctful isn't yhe right avenue Common sense will always prevail