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I Guess Cuban Really Wanted Smith
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BigRedDog
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6/27/2017  9:39 PM
He hired Frankie's coach just for a smokescreen I guess
https://sportsday.dallasnews.com/dallas-mavericks/mavericks/2017/06/23/mark-cuban-made-sure-mavs-pick-dennis-smith-jr-get-leaked-verticals-adrian-wojnarowski
Briggs-- Frank is 2 yrs away from being 2 years away
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BigRedDog
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6/27/2017  9:42 PM    LAST EDITED: 6/27/2017  9:43 PM
Rotoworld....
Anyway, the Mavs went for pure upside with their selection of Dennis Smith Jr. at No. 9. It looks like they know that these days having a good point guard can make the difference, and they know Yogi Ferrell isn’t quite the guy to lead them to the promised land. Last year, six of the top eight seeds had an All-Star point guard — it would’ve been seven in the last year if nine-time All-Star Chris Paul got a spot this year.

Sometimes teams don’t want to dump pressure on guys. The Magic were pumping the brakes a bit on their No. 6 guy, Jonathan Isaac. “We don’t intend to take our team and say [to Isaac], ‘Hey, take us to the promised land right now.’” coach Frank Vogel said. That’s not true for the Mavs, though. Check out how hard they are rolling out the hype train on DSJ:


Hype train full steam ahead!

OK, so what’s with the hype? While he is a shade undersized at 6’3”, DSJ has a 6’10” wingspan and he’s a straight up freak athletically as you can see by that 48-inch vert quote above. DSJ himself said he’s also gained eight inches to his vertical from his ACL tear during his senior year in high school. Here’s a GIF of him jamming on someone.


Looking at the stats, he obviously isn’t a finished product at 19 years old. He really struggled on two-point jumpers, making just 30.5 percent of those. He also made 35.8 percent of his treys, but he was unassisted on just 48.1 percent of those. His jumper is pretty smooth and quick, so he just needs to work. This was a really nice contested catch-and-shoot J:


Looking at the basic stats, it certainly whets the appetite. In 34.8 minutes per game, DSJ averaged 18.1 points, 4.6 boards, 6.2 assists, 1.9 steals, 0.4 blocks and 1.7 treys on 45.5 percent from the field and 71.5 percent from the line. He also turned in a 27.2 usage rate and a respectable 56.3 TS%.

With DSJ not being the best jump shooter, he’s likely going to have to count on getting buckets in the paint. While the 71.5 percent from the line isn’t great, he should get better at knocking down freebies as he gets older and also going to the line 6.3 times per game last year is solid. He was killer in the paint at NC State with 37.1 percent of his shots coming within three feet while making 64.9 percent of those. Solid.

As we’ve talked about a lot on our pods, we love DSJ. His opportunity is huge and the Mavs will be letting him loose. Yes, we’ve seen coach Rick Carlisle limit rookies, but this time is different as the Mavs look to rebuild.

He’s shaping up to be a top-three 2017 draft pick for fantasy and it wouldn’t be surprising at all to see him win Rookie of the Year.

Briggs-- Frank is 2 yrs away from being 2 years away
Knickoftime
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6/27/2017  9:55 PM
BigRedDog wrote:He hired Frankie's coach just for a smokescreen I guess
https://sportsday.dallasnews.com/dallas-mavericks/mavericks/2017/06/23/mark-cuban-made-sure-mavs-pick-dennis-smith-jr-get-leaked-verticals-adrian-wojnarowski

The premise that someone, anyone was looking to the Mavs to decide who to pick is headscratching.

Why would any team do that?

newyorknewyork
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6/27/2017  9:57 PM
Chicago should have took Smith at #7 over Markkennen. Should have kept their #16 instead of Dunn. Drafted Smith and Wilson or Leaf.
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CrushAlot
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6/27/2017  10:28 PM
One of the guys from The Ringer, Tjarks, said he was at the Mavs draft party and that the Mavs were thrilled to get Smith. He said it was clear Smith was the guy they wanted if he was there. I have heard a lt of speculation that Smith will win the ROY because he is in the perfect situation for him.
I'm tired,I'm tired, I'm so tired right now......Kristaps Porzingis 1/3/18
Knixkik
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6/27/2017  10:40 PM    LAST EDITED: 6/27/2017  10:40 PM
If Knicks took monk or Smith, you would be hearing the same about ntilikina, how Dallas got their guy. Dallas hired his coach. That's no smokescreen. But props to them for selling this. It helps Smith's confidence.
Knickoftime
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6/27/2017  10:42 PM
CrushAlot wrote:One of the guys from The Ringer, Tjarks, said he was at the Mavs draft party and that the Mavs were thrilled to get Smith. He said it was clear Smith was the guy they wanted if he was there. I have heard a lt of speculation that Smith will win the ROY because he is in the perfect situation for him.

Looks like most teams got their guy, relatively speaking.

CrushAlot
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6/27/2017  10:47 PM
Knixkik wrote:If Knicks took monk or Smith, you would be hearing the same about ntilikina, how Dallas got their guy. Dallas hired his coach. That's no smokescreen. But props to them for selling this. It helps Smith's confidence.
That was my take until I heard Tjarks on the High Upside Podcast. I don't think they thought Smith would be there. He reportedly had an incredible work out before the draft.
I'm tired,I'm tired, I'm so tired right now......Kristaps Porzingis 1/3/18
Welpee
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6/27/2017  11:12 PM
BigRedDog wrote:Hype train full steam ahead!

OK, so what’s with the hype? While he is a shade undersized at 6’3”, DSJ has a 6’10” wingspan and he’s a straight up freak athletically as you can see by that 48-inch vert quote above. DSJ himself said he’s also gained eight inches to his vertical from his ACL tear during his senior year in high school. Here’s a GIF of him jamming on someone.
6'10" wingspan? Everything I've seen says 6'3" to 6'5" wingspan.
GustavBahler
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6/27/2017  11:17 PM
Doesn't look like Cuban had much to worry about, doubt Phil was going to pick anyone else. Hope it was worth it. Time will tell.
nixluva
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6/27/2017  11:44 PM
GustavBahler wrote:Doesn't look like Cuban had much to worry about, doubt Phil was going to pick anyone else. Hope it was worth it. Time will tell.

From what I can gather Phil isn't really trying to build a team around a Marbury or Rose type of guard. He's trying to build a balanced Team that is loaded with guys that are multi skilled and excel playing in a team concept. Quietly he's added guys that can really shoot the ball and don't have to be ball dominant in order to be successful. I wanted Monk but I can understand what Phil did with Nitty rather than DSJ or Monk. Defense, Off Ball Skill and unselfish play was more of a priority.

joec32033
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6/27/2017  11:50 PM    LAST EDITED: 6/27/2017  11:51 PM
nixluva wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:Doesn't look like Cuban had much to worry about, doubt Phil was going to pick anyone else. Hope it was worth it. Time will tell.

From what I can gather Phil isn't really trying to build a team around a Marbury or Rose type of guard. He's trying to build a balanced Team that is loaded with guys that are multi skilled and excel playing in a team concept. Quietly he's added guys that can really shoot the ball and don't have to be ball dominant in order to be successful. I wanted Monk but I can understand what Phil did with Nitty rather than DSJ or Monk. Defense, Off Ball Skill and unselfish play was more of a priority.

He is trying to build Detroit from the Billups/Wallace/Hamilton/Wallace/Prince days. Sometimes I wonder why teams don't try and go that route more. instead of waiting for 1 homerun superstar get a few doubles and a triple and you can have a really good team. Honestly, that's what Golden State did, their guys just developed exponentially more.

~You can't run from who you are.~
GustavBahler
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6/27/2017  11:59 PM    LAST EDITED: 6/28/2017  12:07 AM
nixluva wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:Doesn't look like Cuban had much to worry about, doubt Phil was going to pick anyone else. Hope it was worth it. Time will tell.

From what I can gather Phil isn't really trying to build a team around a Marbury or Rose type of guard. He's trying to build a balanced Team that is loaded with guys that are multi skilled and excel playing in a team concept. Quietly he's added guys that can really shoot the ball and don't have to be ball dominant in order to be successful. I wanted Monk but I can understand what Phil did with Nitty rather than DSJ or Monk. Defense, Off Ball Skill and unselfish play was more of a priority.


I understand the reasoning Nix. I just believe that in the first round, top ten, you go for the biggest upside. The more Ive seen from Frank lately the more Ive liked. But like you, I would have preferred DSJ.

I believe KP and Smith might have made a hell of a one, two, punch. Frank is saying and doing all the right things, Im rooting for him.

GustavBahler
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6/28/2017  12:07 AM
joec32033 wrote:
nixluva wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:Doesn't look like Cuban had much to worry about, doubt Phil was going to pick anyone else. Hope it was worth it. Time will tell.

From what I can gather Phil isn't really trying to build a team around a Marbury or Rose type of guard. He's trying to build a balanced Team that is loaded with guys that are multi skilled and excel playing in a team concept. Quietly he's added guys that can really shoot the ball and don't have to be ball dominant in order to be successful. I wanted Monk but I can understand what Phil did with Nitty rather than DSJ or Monk. Defense, Off Ball Skill and unselfish play was more of a priority.

He is trying to build Detroit from the Billups/Wallace/Hamilton/Wallace/Prince days. Sometimes I wonder why teams don't try and go that route more. instead of waiting for 1 homerun superstar get a few doubles and a triple and you can have a really good team. Honestly, that's what Golden State did, their guys just developed exponentially more.

Joe Dumars made some great moves. I was living in fla, in Orlando when Ben Wallace was with the Magic, and he didn't look like the monster he became in Detroit. Billups was a journeyman before he got to the Pistons, and Dumars also drafted well. Prince was a great mid first round pick.

Phil is going to have to be more than just good at drafting. Trades, free agency, has to be good across the board to become a contender.

nixluva
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6/28/2017  1:01 AM
GustavBahler wrote:
joec32033 wrote:
nixluva wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:Doesn't look like Cuban had much to worry about, doubt Phil was going to pick anyone else. Hope it was worth it. Time will tell.

From what I can gather Phil isn't really trying to build a team around a Marbury or Rose type of guard. He's trying to build a balanced Team that is loaded with guys that are multi skilled and excel playing in a team concept. Quietly he's added guys that can really shoot the ball and don't have to be ball dominant in order to be successful. I wanted Monk but I can understand what Phil did with Nitty rather than DSJ or Monk. Defense, Off Ball Skill and unselfish play was more of a priority.

He is trying to build Detroit from the Billups/Wallace/Hamilton/Wallace/Prince days. Sometimes I wonder why teams don't try and go that route more. instead of waiting for 1 homerun superstar get a few doubles and a triple and you can have a really good team. Honestly, that's what Golden State did, their guys just developed exponentially more.

Joe Dumars made some great moves. I was living in fla, in Orlando when Ben Wallace was with the Magic, and he didn't look like the monster he became in Detroit. Billups was a journeyman before he got to the Pistons, and Dumars also drafted well. Prince was a great mid first round pick.

Phil is going to have to be more than just good at drafting. Trades, free agency, has to be good across the board to become a contender.

IMO it's WAY easier to make a key Trade or FA addition after you build a good team. Phil is forming a roster that fits his Philosophy and are around the same age. Once these kids develop a bit it'll be easier to figure out the missing pieces.

GustavBahler
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6/28/2017  1:32 AM
nixluva wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
joec32033 wrote:
nixluva wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:Doesn't look like Cuban had much to worry about, doubt Phil was going to pick anyone else. Hope it was worth it. Time will tell.

From what I can gather Phil isn't really trying to build a team around a Marbury or Rose type of guard. He's trying to build a balanced Team that is loaded with guys that are multi skilled and excel playing in a team concept. Quietly he's added guys that can really shoot the ball and don't have to be ball dominant in order to be successful. I wanted Monk but I can understand what Phil did with Nitty rather than DSJ or Monk. Defense, Off Ball Skill and unselfish play was more of a priority.

He is trying to build Detroit from the Billups/Wallace/Hamilton/Wallace/Prince days. Sometimes I wonder why teams don't try and go that route more. instead of waiting for 1 homerun superstar get a few doubles and a triple and you can have a really good team. Honestly, that's what Golden State did, their guys just developed exponentially more.

Joe Dumars made some great moves. I was living in fla, in Orlando when Ben Wallace was with the Magic, and he didn't look like the monster he became in Detroit. Billups was a journeyman before he got to the Pistons, and Dumars also drafted well. Prince was a great mid first round pick.

Phil is going to have to be more than just good at drafting. Trades, free agency, has to be good across the board to become a contender.

IMO it's WAY easier to make a key Trade or FA addition after you build a good team. Phil is forming a roster that fits his Philosophy and are around the same age. Once these kids develop a bit it'll be easier to figure out the missing pieces.


You make it sound a lot easier than it is. If that was true there would be more parity across the league.

yellowboy90
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6/28/2017  1:59 AM
The problem I have with Frank over Smith is that Frank is not a pg or a sg right now and he might never grow into a pg. The other problem is he comes into a system that more than likely will be put out to pasture in a year or two. He isn't coming into a stable culture and personally I don't want Ram is around Frank. Finally, I know prognosticators are not always right and they could be very wrong about Frank but for the most part everyone sees his upside as an average to slightly above average player. On ther other side when they project Smith Jr most view his down side as an average player and his upside as being a future stud. The guy has a real chance to be the best player in this draft.
yellowboy90
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6/28/2017  2:02 AM
Welpee wrote:
BigRedDog wrote:Hype train full steam ahead!

OK, so what’s with the hype? While he is a shade undersized at 6’3”, DSJ has a 6’10” wingspan and he’s a straight up freak athletically as you can see by that 48-inch vert quote above. DSJ himself said he’s also gained eight inches to his vertical from his ACL tear during his senior year in high school. Here’s a GIF of him jamming on someone.
6'10" wingspan? Everything I've seen says 6'3" to 6'5" wingspan.

I don't believe the wingspan reprt but if it's true that kind of really sucks. Even 6'5 would be a good wingspan measurement given his height w/o shoes

joec32033
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6/28/2017  4:13 AM
GustavBahler wrote:
nixluva wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
joec32033 wrote:
nixluva wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:Doesn't look like Cuban had much to worry about, doubt Phil was going to pick anyone else. Hope it was worth it. Time will tell.

From what I can gather Phil isn't really trying to build a team around a Marbury or Rose type of guard. He's trying to build a balanced Team that is loaded with guys that are multi skilled and excel playing in a team concept. Quietly he's added guys that can really shoot the ball and don't have to be ball dominant in order to be successful. I wanted Monk but I can understand what Phil did with Nitty rather than DSJ or Monk. Defense, Off Ball Skill and unselfish play was more of a priority.

He is trying to build Detroit from the Billups/Wallace/Hamilton/Wallace/Prince days. Sometimes I wonder why teams don't try and go that route more. instead of waiting for 1 homerun superstar get a few doubles and a triple and you can have a really good team. Honestly, that's what Golden State did, their guys just developed exponentially more.

Joe Dumars made some great moves. I was living in fla, in Orlando when Ben Wallace was with the Magic, and he didn't look like the monster he became in Detroit. Billups was a journeyman before he got to the Pistons, and Dumars also drafted well. Prince was a great mid first round pick.

Phil is going to have to be more than just good at drafting. Trades, free agency, has to be good across the board to become a contender.

IMO it's WAY easier to make a key Trade or FA addition after you build a good team. Phil is forming a roster that fits his Philosophy and are around the same age. Once these kids develop a bit it'll be easier to figure out the missing pieces.


You make it sound a lot easier than it is. If that was true there would be more parity across the league.

I think it more mirrors football. When an offensive team wins the Super Bowl, all of a sudden everyone wants offense and vice versa with defense.

Currently the quickest way to win is to sign players but if you want a classic case study in diametrically opposing strategies, Buying your way to a super team, gives you a window of 3-5 years (Miami, Cleveland). Teams that are built on sound drafting and successful strategy seem to have much longer runs of success (Boston, Golden State, San Antonio).

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yellowboy90
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6/28/2017  7:16 AM
If the Mavs really liked ntilikina would they trade Smith Jr for Frank right now?
I Guess Cuban Really Wanted Smith

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