reub wrote:

Panos wrote:I'm feeling Ntikilina is our this year's Mudiay.
Foreign PG product with not enough firepower to justify the Knicks slot in the draft. I said pass on Mudiay, and I say pass now.

Mudiay couldn't shoot and was undisciplined.

Mudiay also isn't a foreign product. If anything, going to China probably stunted him. Nitty is playing in much more disciplined environment.

fitzfarm wrote:I think you have to take into consideration what frenchy frank at 18 is doing vs grown men opposed to the other kids. First off he is starting for the French team and the other day he scored 13 pts in 25 minutes vs again grown professional men. Like KP in Europe they dont play the young guys a lot of minutes... he is hands down the best defensive pg in the draft.. he's got a really nice looking jumper and uses his 7'1 wing span really well on both ends. Is he explosive like smith no, but he sure is a better defender and if we are making KP the main man we need players to compliment KP's game... Frenchy is our pick esp if Gaines tells Phil to take him ...the only player I take over frenchy is Isaac, And there is less then 10 percent chance he's there at 8 .

If we pick monk that means he, blew them away in the work out. Same with smith, although I see him going before us as well smith is not a good defender... do we need another bad defensive pg?

I'd be thrilled if we scored another first rd pick

Best draft would be

8th Frenchy

12th Mitchell

44th frank mason

58 th johan B

Rotation

Frenchy,baker,mason
Mitchell,holiday,baker
Melo,lance,kuz
Willy,johan,ndor
KP,plumlee,Willy

I think Phil signs that kid from Columbia that looks like Toni kucoc, as a undrafted FA

The hope is melo accepts a trade but I just don't see that happening.. I don't see rose coming back.

French and Mitchell are interchangeable at the 1 and 2 both defensive juggernots backed up by two other defensive studs in baker and holiday...

I like it but we don't have the 12th pick yet.

Knicks67 wrote:After a whole season moaning of the ball sticking, attitude issues and poor defense I can't believe how many people are so strongly opposed to Frank. The guy ticks every box for weaknesses we have right now, and may continue to have in the future. Surely Kp and Willy would benefit from the possibly elite D, which would mean having to play less help defense. Smith I'm sure will be a good player as well, but don't you think that style of player has rarely worked for the Knicks and probably won't start working now?

NBA is an Arms Race. Sure you want great D but you can't expect to win under today's Rules which favor Skilled Offensive Players if you don't have High End 3pt shooting/attacking guards! Steph, Klay, Lillard, McCollum, Wall, Beal, Westbrook, Kyrie, Isaiah etc.

I'm not convinced Ntilikina really matches up with that level. Only the Knicks scouts have seen him up close but they may not get to work him out before the draft. Seems kinda risky.

nixluva wrote:

meloshouldgo wrote:

EnySpree wrote:

meloshouldgo wrote:

nixluva wrote:

EnySpree wrote:You guys just described why I don't want this French Kid. His motor sucks.... I think guys only want him cuz draft express keeps saying the Knicks should draft him. I won't cry if we do draft him, but if I turn out to be right about him I'm going to roast him everyday.

I want a guy that puts the FEAR OF GOD in teams when he gets the ball. I don't get that vibe from Nitty. The lack of first step burst concerns me. Nitty's gonna be fine in a team concept. I don't see much bust potential just not a high ceiling.

So you want am iso heavy shoot first PG? What was wrong with Rose? I would rather have a team player that set up the offense like Rubio.

Did anybody say anything about an ISO point guard? Come on man just because this guy is supposedly at pass first point guard doesn't mean we have to draft him. F*** this guy he's slow he's big for nothing. He has the long arms and whatever else people like like about him. But he can't guard European players and he has no motor. He plays a European style basketball and Phil Jackson runs the triangle. I thought the triangle sucks? I thought people wanted offensive heavy point guard. THIS kid Frank Nitti sucks f****** dick and I'm tired of talking about him. I don't want to point guard in the number eight pick just because everyone says so. I rather get the best player available and then try to get another point guard either in the first round or later in the second round. THERE'S plenty point guards out there. You don't have to settle for this f****** french guy f*** this guy I'm tired of talking about it.

That's your opinion. I never wanted a scoring heavy point guard. We just had one in Rose. Apparently you have something against French people, not sure I want to know. If Phil drafts Frank, I will be ok with it or any other player except the likes of Dennis Smith that just another Rose in the making. You guys only care about "STAR" potential, and I don't. Different value systems.

Peace.

You keep misrepresenting what we're talking about. Steph is a Scoring PG! You saying you wouldn't want him?

I am saying we shouldn't draft ball dominant players. What you are looking for doesn't exist at 8 and so you are now getting to convince yourselves that Dennis Smith or Monk can be morphed into Steph Curry. I am definitely not aligned with that line of thinking

EnySpree wrote:

meloshouldgo wrote:

EnySpree wrote:

meloshouldgo wrote:

nixluva wrote:

EnySpree wrote:You guys just described why I don't want this French Kid. His motor sucks.... I think guys only want him cuz draft express keeps saying the Knicks should draft him. I won't cry if we do draft him, but if I turn out to be right about him I'm going to roast him everyday.

I want a guy that puts the FEAR OF GOD in teams when he gets the ball. I don't get that vibe from Nitty. The lack of first step burst concerns me. Nitty's gonna be fine in a team concept. I don't see much bust potential just not a high ceiling.

So you want am iso heavy shoot first PG? What was wrong with Rose? I would rather have a team player that set up the offense like Rubio.

Did anybody say anything about an ISO point guard? Come on man just because this guy is supposedly at pass first point guard doesn't mean we have to draft him. F*** this guy he's slow he's big for nothing. He has the long arms and whatever else people like like about him. But he can't guard European players and he has no motor. He plays a European style basketball and Phil Jackson runs the triangle. I thought the triangle sucks? I thought people wanted offensive heavy point guard. THIS kid Frank Nitti sucks f****** dick and I'm tired of talking about him. I don't want to point guard in the number eight pick just because everyone says so. I rather get the best player available and then try to get another point guard either in the first round or later in the second round. THERE'S plenty point guards out there. You don't have to settle for this f****** french guy f*** this guy I'm tired of talking about it.

That's your opinion. I never wanted a scoring heavy point guard. We just had one in Rose. Apparently you have something against French people, not sure I want to know. If Phil drafts Frank, I will be ok with it or any other player except the likes of Dennis Smith that just another Rose in the making. You guys only care about "STAR" potential, and I don't. Different value systems.

Peace.

Now I have something against French people? You don't know what a star player at #8? What value system are you talking about? I did state thay I would deal with Frenchy but I just don't like his game at all. Gtfoh with all that other bull****

That was sarcasm (about the French people), but never mind. The difference in value system is simple. And I am very much in the minority with my way of thinking, I get that.

Most people want to find star(scoring) potential and skills that are similar to Curry's (or some other star)and then project that given the right environment etc. that player can develop into something similar. I think it's more important to find kids with the right mindset (team first) and the right work ethic at the top of the draft (where dkills are assured). I doubt Curry could pass the way he does in College or when he was drafted, that was a "skill" he developed later by working on it. He was able to do that because of his work ethic, high basketball IQ and a mindset that allowed him to focus on the team. Something that was in display even in college.

Most people are betting that the work ethic can be developed when the skills are there, I guess I am more comfortable betting the opposite. I am not saying we should draft people with no talent or skills because that's how some of the trolls would read this. Curry was mostly an SG his first step want the quickest, and he had average assist numbers for one season. His defense was suspect etc. If you think finding a player like that means he will develop into Curry, well good luck to you. When Curry was drafted his main skill was shooting, what you are arguing is getting a good shooter with similar stats means it gives you a chance to see them develop into Curry. In my opinion while this is possible it is a very low probability approach.

Ira wrote:There are plusses and minuses about every player that will be there at 8. The minuses with Nkilitina have to do with his average athleticism and his turnovers. The plusses are a very good shot and excellent defense. He also is a very smart player - an underrated quality in basketball. I watched complete game videos of him in the European national series - I forget what it's actually called. In the games against Italy and Lithuania, he was like a man against boys. He was clearly the best player on the court for both teams in both games and the guy his teammates looked to for leadership.

Paris907 wrote:The league has and Willa ways be built around stars. Phil and Riley had them by the bucketful. You can have a great passing game but if you're not passing to A curry, a Lebron, KD, Kyrie what's the point. These teams average 115 ppl. So great you've got a scorer in Porzingis (who an increasing # of folks say will bolt to a winning franchise)yet if frank N ends up being Evan Turner or a "nice" two way guard, we lost a chance in a deep draft to secure a star compliment to KP. Monk and Smith have potential star power. Frank N...not so much.

Great concise example of what I think is exactly the wrong approach.

WaltLongmire wrote:From the Times article I've posted a number of times...

My take is that he will be better than Fox or Monk. Dennis Smith is more intriguing to me than earler...will go with the Knicks' staff evaluation on him, and Monk, for that matter.

As I've said before, Ntilikina can play both guard positions, though he might end up as a SG, and he will eventually be able to defend at 1/2/3.

Guys are missing the boat on him, like they did with KP, but there always seems to be a hesitancy about foreign players on UK.

Euros, for the most part, are schooled to play team ball and suppress some of their individualism as players. This was why Hezonja never got the minutes some say he should have gotten...he was more of an individualist.

Frank has more athleticism than some are saying he has...just a matter of time and him loosening up as a player.

Not sure what Phil ends up doing, but the Frenchie is a good pick at 8...probably the best one.

Romeo Travis, a 32-year-old power forward from Akron, Ohio, where he was a high school teammate of LeBron James, has been trying to summon the fire from Ntilikina, too. He raved about Ntilikina’s polish and praised his toughness. He said Ntilikina might be “overly coachable,” echoing the notion that Ntilikina could take more initiative and find moments to toss aside the game plan.

At the team’s practice Monday, after Ntilikina flubbed his layup, Travis walked over, put his hand on his young teammate’s shoulder and suggested — gently, but profanely — that he should be dunking on those plays.

“Frank doesn’t have a ceiling,” Travis said later. “He has everything: He has height, athleticism, ball-handing; he can shoot. So I’m just trying to give him that push, that confidence that he can be anything he wants to be.”

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/01/04/sports/basketball/frank-ntilikina-sig-strasbourg-france.html?smprod=nytcore-ipad&smid=nytcore-ipad-share&_r=0

This doesn't really have anything to do with Ntilikina other than being an example of a very young French point guard who joined the league NBA ready.