Knixkik wrote:

Kemet wrote:

nixluva wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:I'm not sure how this team will formulate-- but Willy keeps his game simple and is effective at it

Maybe it's KP who might need the Kevin Mchale type 6 th man role for a couple of years. We will need some change next year-- both of these guys are part of the future-- but chemistry needs work and everyone has to buy in on that

I think KP is the star of the two. But in regards to line ups KP might be better suited coming off the bench. The goal is team success. The line up needs balance. If Melo is back ( up to him) a frontline of KP, Willy and Melo will get crushed on defense. Also, KP's foul issues and rebounding issues might be less of an issue coming off the bench. It isn't an outrageous suggestion if you want team success.

KP should NOT come off the bench. Let the young man play and take his bumps and bruises. He's gotta learn how to manage his minutes as a starter.

I think you're projecting as if KP and Willy will continue to play as they do now and that's probably not going to be the case. They will get stronger and more knowledgeable about the game. There's likely to be no reason to bring KP off the bench. I almost laugh every time someone says this. PATIENCE...

Just look at how Wall and Beal play now compared to how they started. Or DeRozan. Players need time to mature and they need to play thru it.

If the Knicks wanna win next season then KP should come off the bench .. KP has not develop enough moves to be a starter or a 30 minute player in the NBA. Putting KP in the starter lineup in his rookie season were not the Knicks head-coach (Fisher) move, the move came from upstairs management office (Phil Jackson) to prove the 7.3 skinny kid from overseas were not another high draft pick BUST, after all the Boos KP receive on draft night in MSG when the Knicks selected him with the 4th pick.
Kyle O'Quinn prove consistently throughout the start of the 2015-16 season, Quinn should have been the PF alongside center Lopez in the Knicks starter frontcourt lineup.
It was obvious to see in the 2016-17 Knicks preseason games rookie Willie G had more skill-setting experience down-low in the paint than what KP showed throughout his rookie season.

Couldn't be more inaccurate. KP started as a rookie because he was our 2nd best player. Nothing political about that move whatsoever. No team in the nba would ever bring KP off the bench. It's not even plausible. He will be developed as a go-to player, like any team would do. And you need to have patience and let him figure it out, even though you're a knicks fan and I know that's difficult.

More than half the teams in the league would have brang KP off the bench the past two seasons .. what u mean is no LOTTERY team would have KP coming off the bench. KP rookie season were good highlight hype .. as for KP all-around performance and B.Ball IQ its very low if your team are playing to win games.
KP has a very low n poor performance in screening boxing-out pick n roll passing the ball, running back on defense, and throwing a lob-pass after grabbing a defensive-rebound

Kemet wrote:

Knixkik wrote:

Kemet wrote:

nixluva wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:I'm not sure how this team will formulate-- but Willy keeps his game simple and is effective at it

Maybe it's KP who might need the Kevin Mchale type 6 th man role for a couple of years. We will need some change next year-- both of these guys are part of the future-- but chemistry needs work and everyone has to buy in on that

I think KP is the star of the two. But in regards to line ups KP might be better suited coming off the bench. The goal is team success. The line up needs balance. If Melo is back ( up to him) a frontline of KP, Willy and Melo will get crushed on defense. Also, KP's foul issues and rebounding issues might be less of an issue coming off the bench. It isn't an outrageous suggestion if you want team success.

KP should NOT come off the bench. Let the young man play and take his bumps and bruises. He's gotta learn how to manage his minutes as a starter.

I think you're projecting as if KP and Willy will continue to play as they do now and that's probably not going to be the case. They will get stronger and more knowledgeable about the game. There's likely to be no reason to bring KP off the bench. I almost laugh every time someone says this. PATIENCE...

Just look at how Wall and Beal play now compared to how they started. Or DeRozan. Players need time to mature and they need to play thru it.

If the Knicks wanna win next season then KP should come off the bench .. KP has not develop enough moves to be a starter or a 30 minute player in the NBA. Putting KP in the starter lineup in his rookie season were not the Knicks head-coach (Fisher) move, the move came from upstairs management office (Phil Jackson) to prove the 7.3 skinny kid from overseas were not another high draft pick BUST, after all the Boos KP receive on draft night in MSG when the Knicks selected him with the 4th pick.
Kyle O'Quinn prove consistently throughout the start of the 2015-16 season, Quinn should have been the PF alongside center Lopez in the Knicks starter frontcourt lineup.
It was obvious to see in the 2016-17 Knicks preseason games rookie Willie G had more skill-setting experience down-low in the paint than what KP showed throughout his rookie season.

Couldn't be more inaccurate. KP started as a rookie because he was our 2nd best player. Nothing political about that move whatsoever. No team in the nba would ever bring KP off the bench. It's not even plausible. He will be developed as a go-to player, like any team would do. And you need to have patience and let him figure it out, even though you're a knicks fan and I know that's difficult.

More than half the teams in the league would have brang KP off the bench the past two seasons .. what u mean is no LOTTERY team would have KP coming off the bench. KP rookie season were good highlight hype .. as for KP all-around performance and B.Ball IQ its very low if your team are playing to win games.
KP has a very low n poor performance in screening boxing-out pick n roll passing the ball, running back on defense, and throwing a lob-pass after grabbing a defensive-rebound

He would be the starting center for both golden state and Cleveland. Those are the 2 best teams in the league. They would kill to have him in their starting lineups.

Knixkik wrote:

Kemet wrote:

Knixkik wrote:

Kemet wrote:

nixluva wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:I'm not sure how this team will formulate-- but Willy keeps his game simple and is effective at it

Maybe it's KP who might need the Kevin Mchale type 6 th man role for a couple of years. We will need some change next year-- both of these guys are part of the future-- but chemistry needs work and everyone has to buy in on that

I think KP is the star of the two. But in regards to line ups KP might be better suited coming off the bench. The goal is team success. The line up needs balance. If Melo is back ( up to him) a frontline of KP, Willy and Melo will get crushed on defense. Also, KP's foul issues and rebounding issues might be less of an issue coming off the bench. It isn't an outrageous suggestion if you want team success.

KP should NOT come off the bench. Let the young man play and take his bumps and bruises. He's gotta learn how to manage his minutes as a starter.

I think you're projecting as if KP and Willy will continue to play as they do now and that's probably not going to be the case. They will get stronger and more knowledgeable about the game. There's likely to be no reason to bring KP off the bench. I almost laugh every time someone says this. PATIENCE...

Just look at how Wall and Beal play now compared to how they started. Or DeRozan. Players need time to mature and they need to play thru it.

If the Knicks wanna win next season then KP should come off the bench .. KP has not develop enough moves to be a starter or a 30 minute player in the NBA. Putting KP in the starter lineup in his rookie season were not the Knicks head-coach (Fisher) move, the move came from upstairs management office (Phil Jackson) to prove the 7.3 skinny kid from overseas were not another high draft pick BUST, after all the Boos KP receive on draft night in MSG when the Knicks selected him with the 4th pick.
Kyle O'Quinn prove consistently throughout the start of the 2015-16 season, Quinn should have been the PF alongside center Lopez in the Knicks starter frontcourt lineup.
It was obvious to see in the 2016-17 Knicks preseason games rookie Willie G had more skill-setting experience down-low in the paint than what KP showed throughout his rookie season.

Couldn't be more inaccurate. KP started as a rookie because he was our 2nd best player. Nothing political about that move whatsoever. No team in the nba would ever bring KP off the bench. It's not even plausible. He will be developed as a go-to player, like any team would do. And you need to have patience and let him figure it out, even though you're a knicks fan and I know that's difficult.

More than half the teams in the league would have brang KP off the bench the past two seasons .. what u mean is no LOTTERY team would have KP coming off the bench. KP rookie season were good highlight hype .. as for KP all-around performance and B.Ball IQ its very low if your team are playing to win games.
KP has a very low n poor performance in screening boxing-out pick n roll passing the ball, running back on defense, and throwing a lob-pass after grabbing a defensive-rebound

He would be the starting center for both golden state and Cleveland. Those are the 2 best teams in the league. They would kill to have him in their starting lineups.

There's no way KP would have took Bogut or Green starter spot nor would KP had took Mozgov or Thompson starter spots .. When did KP learn how to play center LOL?
Or did u forget Lebron didn't let the NO-Defense Love and the No-Defense Kyrie Irving play in the Cavs playoff his first season back to the Cavs. KP is to raw with a very low b.ball IQ !!!

BRIGGS wrote:I'm not sure how this team will formulate-- but Willy keeps his game simple and is effective at it

Maybe it's KP who might need the Kevin Mchale type 6 th man role for a couple of years. We will need some change next year-- both of these guys are part of the future-- but chemistry needs work and everyone has to buy in on that

LOL this guy.

Tweet was deleted or there was problem with the URL:

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LivingLegend wrote:It's probably not going to happen but Knicks should be getting a feel for Willy's trade value right now.

Assuming KP is a future center -- Outside of our potential draft pick we have virtually nothing at the 1-4.

We could use a great young guard and a young wing SF.

My post assumes Melo is gone this summer.

MEH! I've got two names for you... Bynum and Gasol!!! KP and Willy have good chemistry but they still need so much more physical and skills development. The Triangle is an offense that can accommodate two bigs with ease. They just need to keep developing these young men. The offseason program for them needs to be stepped up. This is just the beginning stages of their development.

nixluva wrote:

LivingLegend wrote:It's probably not going to happen but Knicks should be getting a feel for Willy's trade value right now.

Assuming KP is a future center -- Outside of our potential draft pick we have virtually nothing at the 1-4.

We could use a great young guard and a young wing SF.

My post assumes Melo is gone this summer.

MEH! I've got two names for you... Bynum and Gasol!!! KP and Willy have good chemistry but they still need so much more physical and skills development. The Triangle is an offense that can accommodate two bigs with ease. They just need to keep developing these young men. The offseason program for them needs to be stepped up. This is just the beginning stages of their development.

However the biggest thing is even if Bynum did play an important role, from the few times I saw him play he was a fantastic low post defensive presence, blocking shots at will. Willy is a great rebounder but his defense will never be about stopping guys in the lane. I think what has to happen is KP become a real 4. which is to be able to go out and defend players on the perimeter and be better at rotating to shooters.

I think KP has the talent to be a real 4, on D. I think it's about focus. He needs to change habits and work on it. I doubt he has worked on his defense in the summer. I think he is very focused on his offense. If he works on his defense, there is no reason KP can not become a defensive 4. Why? Look at his ability to move and athleticism and long arms. He has shown the flashes. He went straight with Kawahi Leonard on a drive from the perimeter and swatted his attempt at the lane. He has the physical tools to be a good defender at 4.

The other thing is if we look at Memphis for reference, because they did well on defense with Gasol and Randolph, they had great defenders at 3, 2 and 1. Tony Allen. Courtney Lee for a while. Conley. These guys defend. They didn't start poor defenders at the perimeter. Melo is easily blown by at 3. Rose is always beaten on defense at 1. Courtney is no longer in his prime. We need better defenders at the perimeter such that Willy/KP are not always out of position to help.

foosballnick wrote:Now is forever is the state of mind for many Knicks fans.

Willy makes less than 2 M a year. KP makes a few M less than the MLE. These guys are not paid to, nor should be asked to be carrying the team to the playoffs or be in their peak or in their prime. Only on a Knicks board do I see fans do this. I visit other boards and most fans have a great appreciation for young players like that. Instead of looking at how bad Noah, Rose and even Melo have been for a combined 18+21+25M (64M combined) they focus on these young players at 21/22 not playing enough defense, smart offense etc. I mean why hold these players to a star level? How about hold the players who are paid like stars, who are supposed to be the the defensive cog in the middle (Noah) the superstar Jordan/Kobe/Lebron (Melo) or the star point (Rose) to their standards? I see the main problems with this team being that our coaching staff was confused as to how to play this year and that our top 3 "star" or money players underperformed in their roles. Willy and KP are huge assets to this team as both talent and trade assets. We would be crazy to be upset we have them or hold them to ridiculous standards this early in their careers.

Lets see where KP is at 23, two years from now. How Willy is at 24, both having 3-4 years of the NBA experience under their belt. That's usually when young players become more consistent, show better defense and begin to show star impact, if they have it in them.

Willy is the lesser talent, but more consistent at what he's good at. Willy's also got a defensive ceiling limitation. I love Willy and think he'll be a longterm player for the Knicks just like KP. However KP's ceiling on defense is much higher but he has to be active, smart and the team has to be energetic on D.

I look forward to these two players the next few years. Melo and Rose should have led the team with the extra pass mentality all season. I can't believe how true Jeff's words were. He said before the Clipper game that good teams don't settle for good or decent shots, they move the ball an extra time or two and get a great shot. This Knicks team didn't do that. Whenever they did, they looked a top 4 team in the Easy, defensive struggles and all.

Back to KP/Willy. I think these two can start together. However KP will need to play defense like he did tonight on a consistent basis. Active, using his long arms to deflect passes and to challenge shots. Moving his feet quickly. If KP really loves Willy as much as it seems they do (They are best buds off the court) KP needs to focus on footwork on defense all summer. Watch tape of his mistakes on defense. Willy needs to learn how to take charges more often against drivers.

nyknickzingis wrote:

nixluva wrote:

LivingLegend wrote:It's probably not going to happen but Knicks should be getting a feel for Willy's trade value right now.

Assuming KP is a future center -- Outside of our potential draft pick we have virtually nothing at the 1-4.

We could use a great young guard and a young wing SF.

My post assumes Melo is gone this summer.

MEH! I've got two names for you... Bynum and Gasol!!! KP and Willy have good chemistry but they still need so much more physical and skills development. The Triangle is an offense that can accommodate two bigs with ease. They just need to keep developing these young men. The offseason program for them needs to be stepped up. This is just the beginning stages of their development.

Bynum wasn't an important part of that team. It was Lamar Odom. I think their big 3 was Kobe, Gasol and Odom.
Looking at basketball reference, Bynum didn't play much in the playoff runs.

However the biggest thing is even if Bynum did play an important role, from the few times I saw him play he was a fantastic low post defensive presence, blocking shots at will. Willy is a great rebounder but his defense will never be about stopping guys in the lane. I think what has to happen is KP become a real 4. which is to be able to go out and defend players on the perimeter and be better at rotating to shooters.

I think KP has the talent to be a real 4, on D. I think it's about focus. He needs to change habits and work on it. I doubt he has worked on his defense in the summer. I think he is very focused on his offense. If he works on his defense, there is no reason KP can not become a defensive 4. Why? Look at his ability to move and athleticism and long arms. He has shown the flashes. He went straight with Kawahi Leonard on a drive from the perimeter and swatted his attempt at the lane. He has the physical tools to be a good defender at 4.

The other thing is if we look at Memphis for reference, because they did well on defense with Gasol and Randolph, they had great defenders at 3, 2 and 1. Tony Allen. Courtney Lee for a while. Conley. These guys defend. They didn't start poor defenders at the perimeter. Melo is easily blown by at 3. Rose is always beaten on defense at 1. Courtney is no longer in his prime. We need better defenders at the perimeter such that Willy/KP are not always out of position to help.