Assuming we get Vin Baker and not Dampier with the trades we have made, some chemistry, guys coming back healthy most in the media I have heard put us #4 in the East behind Pacers, Det and Heat. Who knows what the season yields... this squad might struggle together for awile, its might play very well out of the gate. Time will tell, but I think that the talent is there for a very good season (at least advancing in the playoffs).

One thing I dont get is why oh why are the Heat a gimme to be in the top 3? DWade is a great... he's erratic but an awesome talent. Shaq is Shaq but he misses 15 games a year, and is coming off his worst season.

Has anyone seen the rest of their roster? They have Eddie Jones (who Shaq called a choker) and a bunch of guys that couldnt crack the Bobcats roster. Rasual Butler? Malik Allen? Udonis Haslem? The Heat dont have any forwards. Horry isnt signing there, Malone is retired... The used used their MLE on Doleac and Damon Jones.

Seriously.. they have no forwards. This can be an important position. This team is going to sputter to 45 wins, and any team with any depth will kills them. What happens when Shaq takes his usual 2 week vacations during the regular season? Can they win ANY games?!?!

Eddie Jones is a nice player, but he probably is no better than Penny Hardaway at this point. Now, it's a given that Penny is a nice role player, as is Eddie, but the Heat need more. Their problem is that they have no big men who will run the court. I can see a team like Cleveland beating the Heat. Detroit can easily destroy the Heat, as can the Pacers. The Knicks? I don't know. Maybe. If Houston is healthy, certainly. If Sweetney comes around, AND if Houston is healthy, and if Marbury doesn't get tired from the Olympics (Oh wait, the Heat have Wade who is also gonna get tired from the Olympics) then the Knicks can most certainly beat the Heat.

With this being said, the Heat are not to be underestimated. Shaq is still Shaq, Wade is still Wade, and Jones can always go back to his younger self, at times.

Yea I completely agree with everything fishmike said. The Heat just don't have enough depth to win a title, let alone get to the NBA Finals. Shaq and Dwayne are both very good players but outside of them and Eddie Jones they have no one. Detroit showed teams how to beat a team that has Shaq, you just let Shaq get his points and concentrate on stopping the other players. Thats the reason why the Lakers couldn't even push the series to 6 games, Shaq and Kobe would both play well at times but they weren't getting any outside help because Detroit would stop Payton, Malone, and the rest. The Heat won't win as many games as people think they will, but they will get a top 3 seed just because their division is the weakest division in the NBA. Obviously it isn't smart to underestimate a team that has Shaq, but the Heat definitely have some major holes. Thats why if we do get Dampier, a number 2 seed is very much realistic if our team gets some good chemistry going. Even if we don't get Dampier, our team is still good enough to get to the second round of the playoffs if we play well together. Lets see if Isiah has any tricks up his sleeve.

[Edited by - s3231 on 08/09/2004 14:59:47]

Posted by Allanfan20:

BTW, is Malone going to play for them? Or is he definitely retired?

I think Karl will play for a team this season. Will it be the Spurs? The Heat? I'm not sure, but the last time I heard about him I think the Heat was his number 1 destination.

Shaq isnt dangerous, he's unstoppable. Wade is manageable and they dont have one great shooter around Shaq. you set Shaq get his and focus and shutting down the other guys.

why? Shaq misses at least 15 games a year, and he replaces their entire frontcourt, all of whom were 40 minute a night type players.

So tell me again where those minutes are coming from. The Lakers always had good role players and guy that could make big shots. Payton, Malone, Fox, Fisher, Horry, Rush, George... sorry but Rasual Butler, Wang Zhi Zhi, Doleac, Haslem... these guys arent even close. Doleac will get so abused at PF its not even funny. He will have 2 fouls in 30 seconds trying to guard 4's in the East. Shaq doesnt want to come out on defense either, so if your bigs can hit a midrange jumper the Heat are toast.

Shaq is the most dominating player in hoops, probably ever... but your asking him to elevate the level of play of guys some of which shouldnt even be in the freakin league... but the Heat need them because they are warm bodies.

We will see...

Hmm. I think the Heat will be as good as the Lakers last year. I think they won't have the problem of admitting that Shaq is the man that Gary and Kobe had. Wade is not quite the player Kobe is, but his unselfishness makes him almost as dangerous. I would say Eddie Jones is a notch ahead of Penny, he's better defensively and still pretty young. I agree that the Heat have horrid depth issues, but really, so did the Lakers. Malone wasn't available during most of the season and was slowed in the playoffs. Fisher is a joke (nice work Mullin!). Gary was pouting. Kobe had his share of problems.

I think the Heat aren't quite as deep as the Lakers of last year, but they will have FAR better chemistry. I don't think Shaq will miss 15 games on purpose, I think there is something to the fact that he will be very excited to prove Kobe is a little bitch.

It should be interesting. I think Detroit will hands down win the top seed. I think the Knicks and Miami will be in the running for the two and three seeds (due to the division titles rule) and the Pacers will be the four seed. The main issue for Miami will be how tired Dwayne Wade is after playing in like 100 NBA games counting the Olympics after never playing more than 35 high level games in a season. Will Wade break down? Is he as injury prone as it seemed last year?

The issues for the Knicks are obviously:
1) is Damps coming?
2) is Allan healthy?
3) How will Jamal work off the bench/spot starting? (I happen to think he'll average around 15ppg but he'll play fantasically and people will acknowledge that he is in fact a young star).
4) How will Sweets develop? (this is a mystery to me, I don't think he's a lock to be much better, but I have faith in Zeke and Mark).
5) How will Timmy come back from his injury, and embarassment?
6) If Damps doesn't come, how do Kurt and Nazr respond?
7) Is Baker or Keon coming?

So, we have a ton of questions, but I think the raw talent is there to just beat out the Nets, Celts and Sixers. I do think the Atlantic will be better than advertised.

Posted by islesfan:

Do you think anybody fears the Knicks???

I think a lot more teams fear the Heat than they fear the Knicks.

Do you think any team 12 months ago feared the Grizzlies? I know you were responding to Fish's post, but I personally don't care if opponents fear a team in *August*. The regular season and especially the playoffs are when you strike fear in your opponents.

A) Kurt can actually guard Shaq one on one better than most

B) if the Knicks win the NEW Atlantic, they are assured a top three seed. If they aren't a top three seed, they'll probably end up behind Indiana and thus the five seed. Which is very possible, as I think New Jersey will be better than people think.

how can you say the Heat are even close to the Lakers last year? DWade cant sniff Kobe's jock. You cant say the Lakers didnt have chemistry, because they beat some bigtime teams to get to the finals. They may not like each other but it didnt affect their play the last 4 years.

Posted by fishmike:

how can you say the Heat are even close to the Lakers last year? DWade cant sniff Kobe's jock. You cant say the Lakers didnt have chemistry, because they beat some bigtime teams to get to the finals. They may not like each other but it didnt affect their play the last 4 years.

We've disagreed on this before, Fish, but I think at times last year and especially in the finals Kobe HURT Shaq's performance by not letting the offense run through him or trying to create plays for him. Wade is NOT nearly as good as Kobe, but I think if Wade goes out there with his number one priority always being to try to create good shots for Shaq, he and Shaq can be a more effective two man combo than Kobe and Shaq were last year.