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Can Phil Just be the GM?
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buddapaw
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11/12/2016  10:24 PM
For the life of me, I just don't get why Phil is so involved in the coaching of the team. If he's a GM be a GM. Let Horny coach the damn team already, too much involvement from Phil in regards to the teams offensive identity(Triangle). They are thinking way too much on offense, defense is nonexistent why? They are preoccupied with an offense that most of the team is not buying. I wonder if Phil wants to win, or be right with the triangle? Either way we're not going to win anytime soon until he let the coach, coach. Rambis as defensive coach? Really didn't he suck as the iterim coach last year? Oh I get as long you are former Laker not named Fisher you're Ok. SMMH
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Knicks67
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11/13/2016  2:51 AM
True man, I think Hornaceck is really good and fits our players well, if he could run what he wants to without Gm coach Phil meddling.
nyknickzingis
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11/13/2016  7:50 AM    LAST EDITED: 11/13/2016  7:51 AM
How is Phil wanting the triangle as part of the Hornachek scheme hurting the team? If you look at this game we ran more Triangle than previous games and wound up being neck and neck with a top 2 eastern conference team.

The problem is defense. We simply give up too many points and don't get enough stops.

We're bottom 3-4 in defence in the league. We aren't just bad, we are really bad. Forget any offense you won't be a good team with this level of defense.
franco12
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11/13/2016  8:48 AM
nyknickzingis wrote:How is Phil wanting the triangle as part of the Hornachek scheme hurting the team? If you look at this game we ran more Triangle than previous games and wound up being neck and neck with a top 2 eastern conference team.

The problem is defense. We simply give up too many points and don't get enough stops.

We're bottom 3-4 in defence in the league. We aren't just bad, we are really bad. Forget any offense you won't be a good team with this level of defense.

I think the point is we're too consumed on the offensive end to give the necessary effort on the defensive end.
GustavBahler
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11/13/2016  9:07 AM
When Phil realized that Hornacek wasn't going to be able to get the defensive coordinator he wanted, he should have been looking for the next best candidate for the job. Maybe he looked, but I haven't heard of any effort to hire anyone. Seems like basic stuff you want to do to field if not a contender, a team that will go deep in the playoffs.

Knicks might figure things out on D, but why was that position left empty, and why is Rambis once again the best choice Phil could come up with? If this had been sorted before the season started we would have stood a better chance to get off to a good start. These games could be important around playoff time.
holfresh
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11/13/2016  9:43 AM    LAST EDITED: 11/13/2016  10:03 AM
In Phil's defense, the guy is a genius of a coach, still..Look at the Nets game after he complained about lack of triangle..He must have worked with them in practice..The Knicks ran new plays at the start of the game and the third quarter..The spacing was amazing and the easy looks at the basket was awesome...The Knicks missed a lot of those looks but they were very good looks at the basket..I see the delima he has...These coaches he hires aren't great coaches because he wants input...It sad to wee..But the Knicks will fail under this system..It's sad to watch...
buddapaw
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11/13/2016  10:01 AM
franco12 wrote:
nyknickzingis wrote:How is Phil wanting the triangle as part of the Hornachek scheme hurting the team? If you look at this game we ran more Triangle than previous games and wound up being neck and neck with a top 2 eastern conference team.

The problem is defense. We simply give up too many points and don't get enough stops.

We're bottom 3-4 in defence in the league. We aren't just bad, we are really bad. Forget any offense you won't be a good team with this level of defense.

I think the point is we're too consumed on the offensive end to give the necessary effort on the defensive end.



Bingo
"Low Percentage Shots r US, these are our Knicks" "NY KNICKS the cure for basketball fanatic"
GustavBahler
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11/13/2016  10:12 AM
buddapaw wrote:
franco12 wrote:
nyknickzingis wrote:How is Phil wanting the triangle as part of the Hornachek scheme hurting the team? If you look at this game we ran more Triangle than previous games and wound up being neck and neck with a top 2 eastern conference team.

The problem is defense. We simply give up too many points and don't get enough stops.

We're bottom 3-4 in defence in the league. We aren't just bad, we are really bad. Forget any offense you won't be a good team with this level of defense.

I think the point is we're too consumed on the offensive end to give the necessary effort on the defensive end.



Bingo

Seems odd for Phil to be this way given that defense was just as much of a factor in all his rings. Seems kind of desperate IMO.
knickscity
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11/13/2016  10:57 AM
GustavBahler wrote:
buddapaw wrote:
franco12 wrote:
nyknickzingis wrote:How is Phil wanting the triangle as part of the Hornachek scheme hurting the team? If you look at this game we ran more Triangle than previous games and wound up being neck and neck with a top 2 eastern conference team.

The problem is defense. We simply give up too many points and don't get enough stops.

We're bottom 3-4 in defence in the league. We aren't just bad, we are really bad. Forget any offense you won't be a good team with this level of defense.

I think the point is we're too consumed on the offensive end to give the necessary effort on the defensive end.



Bingo

Seems odd for Phil to be this way given that defense was just as much of a factor in all his rings. Seems kind of desperate IMO.


Actually few of his teams had great defensive schemes, they just featured better defensive players. Phil's teams have always been focused more on offense.
GustavBahler
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11/13/2016  11:00 AM
knickscity wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
buddapaw wrote:
franco12 wrote:
nyknickzingis wrote:How is Phil wanting the triangle as part of the Hornachek scheme hurting the team? If you look at this game we ran more Triangle than previous games and wound up being neck and neck with a top 2 eastern conference team.

The problem is defense. We simply give up too many points and don't get enough stops.

We're bottom 3-4 in defence in the league. We aren't just bad, we are really bad. Forget any offense you won't be a good team with this level of defense.

I think the point is we're too consumed on the offensive end to give the necessary effort on the defensive end.



Bingo

Seems odd for Phil to be this way given that defense was just as much of a factor in all his rings. Seems kind of desperate IMO.


Actually few of his teams had great defensive schemes, they just featured better defensive players. Phil's teams have always been focused more on offense.

Do we have better defensive players? If not, then they have to plan better. Thats where a defensive minded coach comes.
holfresh
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11/13/2016  11:04 AM
knickscity wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
buddapaw wrote:
franco12 wrote:
nyknickzingis wrote:How is Phil wanting the triangle as part of the Hornachek scheme hurting the team? If you look at this game we ran more Triangle than previous games and wound up being neck and neck with a top 2 eastern conference team.

The problem is defense. We simply give up too many points and don't get enough stops.

We're bottom 3-4 in defence in the league. We aren't just bad, we are really bad. Forget any offense you won't be a good team with this level of defense.

I think the point is we're too consumed on the offensive end to give the necessary effort on the defensive end.



Bingo

Seems odd for Phil to be this way given that defense was just as much of a factor in all his rings. Seems kind of desperate IMO.


Actually few of his teams had great defensive schemes, they just featured better defensive players. Phil's teams have always been focused more on offense.

How do you distinguish the two?, he had great defensive teams...
knickscity
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11/13/2016  6:48 PM
holfresh wrote:
knickscity wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
buddapaw wrote:
franco12 wrote:
nyknickzingis wrote:How is Phil wanting the triangle as part of the Hornachek scheme hurting the team? If you look at this game we ran more Triangle than previous games and wound up being neck and neck with a top 2 eastern conference team.

The problem is defense. We simply give up too many points and don't get enough stops.

We're bottom 3-4 in defence in the league. We aren't just bad, we are really bad. Forget any offense you won't be a good team with this level of defense.

I think the point is we're too consumed on the offensive end to give the necessary effort on the defensive end.



Bingo

Seems odd for Phil to be this way given that defense was just as much of a factor in all his rings. Seems kind of desperate IMO.


Actually few of his teams had great defensive schemes, they just featured better defensive players. Phil's teams have always been focused more on offense.

How do you distinguish the two?, he had great defensive teams...


The players distinguishes the two. The 01 Lakers weren't a good defensive team despite winning the title, the 03 lakers defense had a lot to do with why they didn't make it to the finals. The had a couple of good defensive clubs even when Del Harris coached them. Pretty sure the Bulls trotted out some good defensive squads when Doug Collins coached them before Phil.
arkrud
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11/14/2016  12:48 AM    LAST EDITED: 11/14/2016  12:49 AM
What defense?... who can play it on this squad?...
Broken down Noah? Disturbed Melo? Empty head Rose? Tiny Jennings?
A bunch of ruks... KP, HG, Kuz... they need time in NBA.
They need to play zone as this is the only way they can stop somebody.
"There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, Than are dreamt of in your philosophy." Hamlet
jrodmc
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11/14/2016  10:22 AM    LAST EDITED: 11/14/2016  10:23 AM
arkrud wrote:What defense?... who can play it on this squad?...
Broken down Noah? Disturbed Melo? Empty head Rose? Tiny Jennings?
A bunch of ruks... KP, HG, Kuz... they need time in NBA.
They need to play zone as this is the only way they can stop somebody.

Right, play zone. I would heartily agree with this stunning observation if the NBA didn't allow a stupid thing called a 3 point shot...

There's only two things required for playing defense, the desire and dedication to do it. These are NBA atheletes already, not sumo wrestlers. For some reason, this team doesn't seem to be all that interested in it. Wonder what type of defensive coach Ewing would be? Although might cause alot more issues for Horny than it would solve.

It also seems that players might be afraid of getting into foul trouble because their's no set rotation.
GustavBahler
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11/14/2016  10:47 AM    LAST EDITED: 11/14/2016  10:51 AM
Thibodeau went to Boston as an assistant and helped Rivers build a defense good enough to win a championship. Believe its a mistake to discount the importance of having quality assistants on a team. It was one of Phil's assistants who taught him the Triangle. Dont care what sport it is, championship teams usually have top notch assistants on their staff.

The same people who were saying that Rambis is just fine for head coach, are saying the same thing about him as as Hornacek's lead assistant. I doubt Jeff would put his possible replacement, Phil's best friend, one step closer to taking his place.

Some coaches can motivate players to D up better than others, some are better at game-planning defense than others. We can do better, Phil can do better, confident of that,
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