Knicks67 wrote:Willy needs to get that midrange shot going really well to ensure he can come in as a closer over Noah. You're right when you say his inability to shoot the rock means the other C can just peel away and D up someone else down the stretch.

im not sure I wholly agree. When the opponent peels why isn't that an alley op opportunity for Noah

I think that's what we would see from the opponent. I think we need just a little more time before we see and even anticipate and exploit these opportunities.

nixluva wrote:

StarksEwing1 wrote:

nixluva wrote:I saw some good things tonight even tho they still have a long way to go. They still have breakdowns on both ends that are killing them. It's mostly very fixable mistakes and poor execution.

my main concern is the defense. They have a lot of poor defenders so its tough to cover that up

True but they can still improve as a team and develop better defensive chemistry as the season Progresses. They still have a lot to learn but I can see progress already. It doesn't look like they have the roster to be a very good defensive team, so they've got to get a LOT better offensively.

The bad stretches of offense are not allowing them to take advantage of the times they've actually defended well!!! They had chances to extend a lead but didn't score.

Chandler wrote:

Knicks67 wrote:Willy needs to get that midrange shot going really well to ensure he can come in as a closer over Noah. You're right when you say his inability to shoot the rock means the other C can just peel away and D up someone else down the stretch.

im not sure I wholly agree. When the opponent peels why isn't that an alley op opportunity for Noah

I think that's what we would see from the opponent. I think we need just a little more time before we see and even anticipate and exploit these opportunities.

So far KOQ and Willy have been far more active and efficient scoring inside - but agree - it should be an easy bucket inside if KP gets doubled in the post. The entry pass should go right to the center instead of KP.

To me that's an easy area for improvement and can become a weapon. Getting double teamed in the NBA is a GOOD thing. Just have to move the ball to the open man to beat it.

holfresh wrote:Good to see they were competitive early in the season against the Raptors..Knicks will look differently in January when they figure a few things out..Rose doesn't have his legs yet, he isn't finishing..

I agree but think it may be sooner.

Chandler wrote:

holfresh wrote:Good to see they were competitive early in the season against the Raptors..Knicks will look differently in January when they figure a few things out..Rose doesn't have his legs yet, he isn't finishing..

I agree but think it may be sooner.

Bottom line - this team has BROUGHT it against Toronto and Chicago. If they come out with that effort more often, we'll win against a lot of other teams.

But the defense needs to be tightened, too. We started great against Utah and blew a lead.

You can see the room for improvement. Defense was pretty solid tonight. Though I think teams have figured out how to exploit KP on defense - Patterson raining threes because KP was helping off him, etc. KP picked up two fouls closing out on three point shooters tonight. Most of KP's fouls were kinda dumb. You just have to think he'll correct that at some point because he's so smart.

holfresh wrote:Dudes complaining about ISO..Quick lesson, Melo had a matchup advantage which the Knicks successfully went to..It's the same match up that KP had late in the 4th becuase they put Patterson on Melo..So KP had Powell on him, so the Knicks went to KP because of the matchup..Basketball 101..

Honestly don't you think the issue is timing. The issue isn't iso per se. It's when and how.

When the player tells his teammates fu I'll do this by myself it's not good

Even Shaq (most dominant low post guy in forever) learned to kick out and repost etc.

We need to exploit mismatches. No disagreement but in smart ways.

StarksEwing1 wrote:

nixluva wrote:

StarksEwing1 wrote:

nixluva wrote:I saw some good things tonight even tho they still have a long way to go. They still have breakdowns on both ends that are killing them. It's mostly very fixable mistakes and poor execution.

my main concern is the defense. They have a lot of poor defenders so its tough to cover that up

True but they can still improve as a team and develop better defensive chemistry as the season Progresses. They still have a lot to learn but I can see progress already. It doesn't look like they have the roster to be a very good defensive team, so they've got to get a LOT better offensively.

The bad stretches of offense are not allowing them to take advantage of the times they've actually defended well!!! They had chances to extend a lead but didn't score.

i think offensively they are very strong when they move the ball. However many times they go back to iso and it doesnt work

The real issue is it's not sustainable. Powell on Melo. Is Melo going to score all 100 points ?

Yes you need to exploit but within a system. When it gets iso focused Melo goes 1 on 2. Or 1 on 3.

Or tells his teammates fu I'll take these last 9 seconds to walk ball up and chuck a 3

crzymdups wrote:Pacers are 4-6 with some new players - sometimes new teams take a minute to come together.

Don't try to sugarcoat it. This team remains a mess on defense and it hardly looks like its improving. The offense is improving a little, but allowing 115+ a game will get us a ticket back to the lottery.

Knicksfan wrote:

crzymdups wrote:Pacers are 4-6 with some new players - sometimes new teams take a minute to come together.

Don't try to sugarcoat it. This team remains a mess on defense and it hardly looks like its improving. The offense is improving a little, but allowing 115+ a game will get us a ticket back to the lottery.

At least we have our pick this year!

I'm not sugar coating it. If I didn't see improvement, I wouldn't say so. I've seen improvement. The Raptors are the second best team in the East - the Knicks played them hard in their house and still have room for improvement. The defense is part of that. The coaching is part of that. The offense is part of that. Unfortunately the refs have been part of it.

Chandler wrote:

holfresh wrote:Dudes complaining about ISO..Quick lesson, Melo had a matchup advantage which the Knicks successfully went to..It's the same match up that KP had late in the 4th becuase they put Patterson on Melo..So KP had Powell on him, so the Knicks went to KP because of the matchup..Basketball 101..

Honestly don't you think the issue is timing. The issue isn't iso per se. It's when and how.

When the player tells his teammates fu I'll do this by myself it's not good

Even Shaq (most dominant low post guy in forever) learned to kick out and repost etc.

We need to exploit mismatches. No disagreement but in smart ways.

What was the score after the first half of ISO Melo?..What was the final score when we went away from ISO Melo?

Couple of things...Melo is keeping the Knicks in the game..If you notice the last few games when the team is losing they are talking a lot which could turn divisive soon..It important to win games and be competitive giving them a chance down they stretch...

It will get better i terms of ball movement..Knicks need to win some game to gain confidence..We only have one guy who is confident every night and that's Melo..Dude has won 50 games 7 consecutive season doing this..Don't tell me it doesn't work..

crzymdups wrote:

Chandler wrote:

StarksEwing1 wrote:

nixluva wrote:

StarksEwing1 wrote:

nixluva wrote:I saw some good things tonight even tho they still have a long way to go. They still have breakdowns on both ends that are killing them. It's mostly very fixable mistakes and poor execution.

my main concern is the defense. They have a lot of poor defenders so its tough to cover that up

True but they can still improve as a team and develop better defensive chemistry as the season Progresses. They still have a lot to learn but I can see progress already. It doesn't look like they have the roster to be a very good defensive team, so they've got to get a LOT better offensively.

The bad stretches of offense are not allowing them to take advantage of the times they've actually defended well!!! They had chances to extend a lead but didn't score.

i think offensively they are very strong when they move the ball. However many times they go back to iso and it doesnt work

The real issue is it's not sustainable. Powell on Melo. Is Melo going to score all 100 points ?

Yes you need to exploit but within a system. When it gets iso focused Melo goes 1 on 2. Or 1 on 3.

Or tells his teammates fu I'll take these last 9 seconds to walk ball up and chuck a 3

Agreed with this. Beginning to doubt it'll ever change.

He might if they win. The real issue is take the decision making out of his hands. Let rose Jennings even Noah make the decisions.

Melo is super talented. Ever see him in olympics etc. plays studly. That's because other smarter players give him the Ball exactly at good times.

We're on a good path. We'll be happy around thanksgiving and certainly by xmas (or other relevant holiday)