DrAlphaeus wrote:What if Noah was a Quaker or Jehovah's Witness? Would he get the jrod 7 seals of approval then?

Knicks can't suit up quick enough, sweet bouncing baby Jesus.

I doubt a Quaker or a JW would be showing up at NBA games, Dr A. Them dancers be pretty much against anything a good Quaker or Charles Taze Russell would be preaching about.

Then we could all be posting about Noah's inability to overcome his prudish, outmoded views on sex.

jrodmc wrote:

Knickoftime wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

DrAlphaeus wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:Let me write this basic answer

If it wasn't for millions of American soldiers who died. As in gave their live in the cause of providing a country full of freedoms, there would be no J Noah's available yo be direspectful . But hey fck them they're dead and were here. So all of these young kids who give their lives to train and maybe their own life to protect Noah and his kids. Yeah let's get rid of the military and the flag. Let's listen to quiet riot in schools and fck we don't need the police either. We can self police ourselves

That applies to some of our country's wars. Much of the time now our military is a Department of Offense (as Jill Stein put it), not Defense.

Call it whatever you want Bonn if it wasn't here you wouldn't be here

Same thing with doctors, police, etc. As a nation, we're all interdependent. Do I have to go to dinners for everyone?

If you are a public figure who makes incredible earnings you should be first in line to do the minimum to support the countries military. I'm not sure Noah would be as happy in a concentration camp somewhere

This is out of order BRIGGS. People supporting their military were responsible for concentration camps in the first place. What a ****ty dramatic escalation of where grown men decide to eat dinner.

Wow are you guys naive. Without the military you would not have the life you do. Case closed

Indeed true.

We also probably would not have the life we do if we didn't annex one of the world's largest, most abundantly rich, most naturally defendable land masses by committing genocide against the civilizations that already inhabited it.

We probably would not have the life with do if we didn't build our pre-industrial economy on the backs of slave labor.

We might not have life we all do if we were not the only civilization in the history of humankind to use a nuclear weapon on another... twice.

Your 'point' has no meaning. The idea that a person can't object to specific applications of our standing military is intellectually barren.

Your 'counterpoints' also are meaningless.

The civilizations that already inhabited it were slightly busy committing atrocious acts against each other, as well as anyone else that happened along, while fighting alongside the French or English. Missed those days in history class, did you? Ever see a Franciscan monk without any weapons being skinned alive?

All countries had slaves (including the ones we imported slaves from) maybe the whole world should just disband it's governments and militaries. Also, I forget why the North won the Civil War. Was it so we could all benefit from slave labor?

Had lots of family dying in the Pacific theatre during WWII, did you? Ever read anything about what the Japanese were planning towards the end of that war? Had a great alternative plan that would have ended it all sooner?

No one's saying Noah can't object until his man bun falls off. He could have objected any one of a million other ways. More power to his free speech.

Being disrespectful or choosing an inappropriate way to object is the point. Not his rights as an American citizen.

Is your point that we annexed North America under the doctrine of Manifest Destiny because native American cultures deserved it? It was to make the world better? They forced the U.S.'s hand?

Yes, most country's histories are stained by slavery. I'm not accustomed, however, to the argument that the U.S. is just another nation in the world community?

None of your rebuttals justifying these things is the point, however.

The point always was the argument that a person of conscious should put their brain on hold in some broad deference to ideals they don't believe in is both moronic and unamerican.

Being disrespectful and inappropriate is a completely subjective matter and will naturally be defined differently by those with different views. The important thing is what's the intentions of people like Noah or Kaepernick. Deciding for someone else they intend to disrespect others or institutions is ridiculous.

Third time he went with Bulls as first sports team to visit Obama.

When the Knicks win the championship and Noah has to decide whether to go to the White House or not, we'll see what happens. Because I will admit it would be much more powerful and philosophically consistent to decline a visit to the President than a West Point invitation, since the White House represents the command that sends these poor kids to war in the first place.

jrodmc wrote:

DrAlphaeus wrote:

jrodmc wrote:

DrAlphaeus wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

DrAlphaeus wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:Let me write this basic answer

If it wasn't for millions of American soldiers who died. As in gave their live in the cause of providing a country full of freedoms, there would be no J Noah's available yo be direspectful . But hey fck them they're dead and were here. So all of these young kids who give their lives to train and maybe their own life to protect Noah and his kids. Yeah let's get rid of the military and the flag. Let's listen to quiet riot in schools and fck we don't need the police either. We can self police ourselves

That applies to some of our country's wars. Much of the time now our military is a Department of Offense (as Jill Stein put it), not Defense.

Call it whatever you want Bonn if it wasn't here you wouldn't be here

Same thing with doctors, police, etc. As a nation, we're all interdependent. Do I have to go to dinners for everyone?

If you are a public figure who makes incredible earnings you should be first in line to do the minimum to support the countries military. I'm not sure Noah would be as happy in a concentration camp somewhere

This is out of order BRIGGS. People supporting their military were responsible for concentration camps in the first place. What a ****ty dramatic escalation of where grown men decide to eat dinner.

Wow are you guys naive. Without the military you would not have the life you do. Case closed

But you brought up concentration camps: something invented and executed by militaries. I'll cop to being naive if you admit to having no sense of perspective.

Godwin's Law by page 2 because someone turned down a dinner invitation. Congrats BRIGGS.

Maybe we need to read a little bit about what drove the Final Solution before deciding it's the evil military that invented something as insidious as concentration camps.
The Holocaust was driven by what? The need to win wars? No, it was driven by Nietzschean and Darwinian worldviews that Nazi leadership decided was the way to drive humanity forward.

This is akin to saying the "militaries" are responsible for the invention of ISIS and Al Queda.

+666

Boo!

Knickoftime wrote:

jrodmc wrote:

Knickoftime wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

DrAlphaeus wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:Let me write this basic answer

If it wasn't for millions of American soldiers who died. As in gave their live in the cause of providing a country full of freedoms, there would be no J Noah's available yo be direspectful . But hey fck them they're dead and were here. So all of these young kids who give their lives to train and maybe their own life to protect Noah and his kids. Yeah let's get rid of the military and the flag. Let's listen to quiet riot in schools and fck we don't need the police either. We can self police ourselves

That applies to some of our country's wars. Much of the time now our military is a Department of Offense (as Jill Stein put it), not Defense.

Call it whatever you want Bonn if it wasn't here you wouldn't be here

Same thing with doctors, police, etc. As a nation, we're all interdependent. Do I have to go to dinners for everyone?

If you are a public figure who makes incredible earnings you should be first in line to do the minimum to support the countries military. I'm not sure Noah would be as happy in a concentration camp somewhere

This is out of order BRIGGS. People supporting their military were responsible for concentration camps in the first place. What a ****ty dramatic escalation of where grown men decide to eat dinner.

Wow are you guys naive. Without the military you would not have the life you do. Case closed

Indeed true.

We also probably would not have the life we do if we didn't annex one of the world's largest, most abundantly rich, most naturally defendable land masses by committing genocide against the civilizations that already inhabited it.

We probably would not have the life with do if we didn't build our pre-industrial economy on the backs of slave labor.

We might not have life we all do if we were not the only civilization in the history of humankind to use a nuclear weapon on another... twice.

Your 'point' has no meaning. The idea that a person can't object to specific applications of our standing military is intellectually barren.

Your 'counterpoints' also are meaningless.

The civilizations that already inhabited it were slightly busy committing atrocious acts against each other, as well as anyone else that happened along, while fighting alongside the French or English. Missed those days in history class, did you? Ever see a Franciscan monk without any weapons being skinned alive?

All countries had slaves (including the ones we imported slaves from) maybe the whole world should just disband it's governments and militaries. Also, I forget why the North won the Civil War. Was it so we could all benefit from slave labor?

Had lots of family dying in the Pacific theatre during WWII, did you? Ever read anything about what the Japanese were planning towards the end of that war? Had a great alternative plan that would have ended it all sooner?

No one's saying Noah can't object until his man bun falls off. He could have objected any one of a million other ways. More power to his free speech.

Being disrespectful or choosing an inappropriate way to object is the point. Not his rights as an American citizen.

Is your point that we annexed North America under the doctrine of Manifest Destiny because native American cultures deserved it? It was to make the world better? They forced the U.S.'s hand?

Yes, most country's histories are stained by slavery. I'm not accustomed, however, to the argument that the U.S. is just another nation in the world community?

None of your rebuttals justifying these things is the point, however.

The point always was the argument that a person of conscious should put their brain on hold in some broad deference to ideals they don't believe in is both moronic and unamerican.

Being disrespectful and inappropriate is a completely subjective matter and will naturally be defined differently by those with different views. The important thing is what's the intentions of people like Noah or Kaepernick. Deciding for someone else they intend to disrespect others or institutions is ridiculous.

Yea they are role models who are saying "Hey its ok to be disrespectful" Im sure those kids at the Academy now think Noah is a BIG dck. And he might be the coolest guy around--a nice human being--but his actions are disrespectful to those who put their lives on the line to protect HIM and HIS family.

martin wrote:

WP76 wrote:As rarely as I agree with Frank Isola, I think he nailed this when he said that Noah's gesture was "rude." If you have a host who's extending you a dinner invitation, you accept or politely decline (see above). To handle it as Noah did is, at best, poor decision making or, at worst, classless.

How did Noah handle this? Insofar as I can tell, he declined to attend.

He should've just said, "given the fact that I'm a new father, I'd like to decline the dinner invitation to spend time with my newborn." Again, non-issue at that point.

Instead he gives some brain dead rationalization of "I don't like the idea of kids killing kids" which comes off as short-sighted, ill-informed, and rude. There's a big difference between the two approaches because one shows intelligence and class; the other not so much.

I found WP76's post compelling, thanks man. Didn't know that about Ali's visit. I agree, if it was just about him just having other things to do, the ambiguous rhetoric could have not been necessary.

But I don't think it's necessary to trash the guy. I wonder what he'd have to say to WP76's perspective.

I hope we can pick this thread up when Noah doesn't go to the White House when we get our chip! (No jinx)

Welpee wrote:

WP76 wrote:

martin wrote:

WP76 wrote:As rarely as I agree with Frank Isola, I think he nailed this when he said that Noah's gesture was "rude." If you have a host who's extending you a dinner invitation, you accept or politely decline (see above). To handle it as Noah did is, at best, poor decision making or, at worst, classless.

How did Noah handle this? Insofar as I can tell, he declined to attend.

He should've just said, "given the fact that I'm a new father, I'd like to decline the dinner invitation to spend time with my newborn." Again, non-issue at that point.

Instead he gives some brain dead rationalization of "I don't like the idea of kids killing kids" which comes off as short-sighted, ill-informed, and rude. There's a big difference between the two approaches because one shows intelligence and class; the other not so much.

Well, the same way Noah has a right to his opinion that you say comes across as "ill-informed and rude" you are entitled to your opinion which could be viewed as self-righteous and pompous. Once again, we ask our athletes to be authentic and genuine until they do or say what we don't like. Then they're suppose to either lie about their feelings, tow the company line or just stay quite.

What a country.

I do agree Welpee that some people are too quick with the "shut up richie rich" my country take it or leave over-sensitive attitude to this. That's why His Airness used to never say **** and just endorse checks but there has to be a middle ground.

I think Noah gave an answer that came from a sincere place, it may have just been bad etiquitte and a wishy washy explanation. But he's a ball player and new dad... feeling emotional about kids and future. Not cool with the concentration camp talk, have some compassion BRIGGS.

WP76 wrote:

martin wrote:

WP76 wrote:As rarely as I agree with Frank Isola, I think he nailed this when he said that Noah's gesture was "rude." If you have a host who's extending you a dinner invitation, you accept or politely decline (see above). To handle it as Noah did is, at best, poor decision making or, at worst, classless.

How did Noah handle this? Insofar as I can tell, he declined to attend.

He should've just said, "given the fact that I'm a new father, I'd like to decline the dinner invitation to spend time with my newborn." Again, non-issue at that point.

Instead he gives some brain dead rationalization of "I don't like the idea of kids killing kids" which comes off as short-sighted, ill-informed, and rude. There's a big difference between the two approaches because one shows intelligence and class; the other not so much.

You are saying that he should lie. That's the classy way of handling things? Lie?

Not for me. I thought he did the honest thing. He did not make a deal about it, went on his way and honestly answered a reporters question (Noah did not go find reporter to make it a statement thing).