djsunyc wrote:

holfresh wrote:Illegal immigrants not paying taxes???..They are paying more tax than Trump, who wants to deport them..But please, educate yourself, look at the numbers...Just looking a the courts, it would cost between 400 billion to 600 billion to deport 11 million illegal immigrants...And the hit to our economy???..Glad you asked...

"Overall, removing all undocumented immigrants would cause private sector output to decline by between $381.5 billion and $623.2 billion. This translates to a 2.9 percent to 4.7 percent reduction in total annual output from the private sector."

http://www.businessinsider.com/cost-deporting-undocumented-immigrants-study-2016-5

GET RID OF ALL OF THEM!!! YEAH!!! HIT THE BRICKS!!!

oh wait, you mean i have to replace those $5/hour people i pay with $10/hour people. yeah well i can't afford that. now what?

deportation is not the answer to this very very complex and difficult economic problem. it sounds cool but that's like answering "C" for every question on a multiple choice exam - you may get some right here or there but ultimately you fail.

you can deport some illegal immigrants but not all of them. that's just some straight unfiltered BULLSHIT.

What is your solution when all of these undocumented $5/hr workers, all have papers and demand fair wages or file for unemployment?

gr33d wrote:

holfresh wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

DrAlphaeus wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

Open up your ears and listen

Michael Moore has been crying from the rooftops to liberals trying to explain the Trump phenomenon and warning that he could certainly win. But he isn't endorsing Trump. He endorsed Clinton.

Maybe hsi words will resonate with people who btch about the status quo but also ACCEPT the status quo. I mean whats a world like without 20mm illegal immigrants sitting in our hospitals driving up health care costs and not paying taxes. Whats a world like with less drugs poring into the Southern border so our children can consume them. Yeah go vote for Hillary and well--dont btch about anything else cause I cant here ya and that goes for 1/2 the nation. Go fck with the upper middle class and elitists--theyre helping everyone else our right. :)

Illegal immigrants not paying taxes???..They are paying more tax than Trump, who wants to deport them..But please, educate yourself, look at the numbers...Just looking a the courts, it would cost between 400 billion to 600 billion to deport 11 million illegal immigrants...And the hit to our economy???..Glad you asked...

"Overall, removing all undocumented immigrants would cause private sector output to decline by between $381.5 billion and $623.2 billion. This translates to a 2.9 percent to 4.7 percent reduction in total annual output from the private sector."

http://www.businessinsider.com/cost-deporting-undocumented-immigrants-study-2016-5

This article is just focusing on dollars lost from the output of illegal workers...

What is the cost of illegal immigrants in terms of health care?

Illegal immigrants who have (free of charge) anchor babies in the US are also entitled to free formula, medication, foods stamps.

Then comes education- which is completely free, as well as lunch programs, after school care, etc.

Were any of these costs factored into the article? No chance.

Wait until these undocumented immigrants have papers and now want access to unemployment, federal/state tax refunds and social security that they were previously not entitled to...

Undocumented(illegal) workers don't have access to healthcare outside the emergency room...There are various studies out there that skew the numbers based on party politics...Conservatives say the cost to the US economy is 100 billion per year...But they say it's because of healthcare, which illegal immigrants don't have and they say it because they don't pay taxes, which 50% of them do indeed pay taxes..So the figures you get depends on the source...

Vmart wrote:I'll give you how Obamacare works out for private doctors. My children's doctor has been in business for over 25+ years. One day she says she is moving. I ask her where are you going. I have to join a group of doctors because of Obamacare. I asked her isn't it working she said it's not I can't afford to continue the practice anymore.

but that's the fault of the pharmaceutical companies. health care in this country is corrupt as f ck. which is another reason why pure capitalism is doing more harm than good these days. the "theory" behind obamacare was good but it was poorly executed. i don't think the solution is to completely remove it but to change it.

holfresh wrote:

gr33d wrote:

holfresh wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

DrAlphaeus wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

Open up your ears and listen

Michael Moore has been crying from the rooftops to liberals trying to explain the Trump phenomenon and warning that he could certainly win. But he isn't endorsing Trump. He endorsed Clinton.

Maybe hsi words will resonate with people who btch about the status quo but also ACCEPT the status quo. I mean whats a world like without 20mm illegal immigrants sitting in our hospitals driving up health care costs and not paying taxes. Whats a world like with less drugs poring into the Southern border so our children can consume them. Yeah go vote for Hillary and well--dont btch about anything else cause I cant here ya and that goes for 1/2 the nation. Go fck with the upper middle class and elitists--theyre helping everyone else our right. :)

Illegal immigrants not paying taxes???..They are paying more tax than Trump, who wants to deport them..But please, educate yourself, look at the numbers...Just looking a the courts, it would cost between 400 billion to 600 billion to deport 11 million illegal immigrants...And the hit to our economy???..Glad you asked...

"Overall, removing all undocumented immigrants would cause private sector output to decline by between $381.5 billion and $623.2 billion. This translates to a 2.9 percent to 4.7 percent reduction in total annual output from the private sector."

http://www.businessinsider.com/cost-deporting-undocumented-immigrants-study-2016-5

This article is just focusing on dollars lost from the output of illegal workers...

What is the cost of illegal immigrants in terms of health care?

Illegal immigrants who have (free of charge) anchor babies in the US are also entitled to free formula, medication, foods stamps.

Then comes education- which is completely free, as well as lunch programs, after school care, etc.

Were any of these costs factored into the article? No chance.

Wait until these undocumented immigrants have papers and now want access to unemployment, federal/state tax refunds and social security that they were previously not entitled to...

Undocumented(illegal) workers don't have access to healthcare outside the emergency room...There are various studies out there that skew the numbers based on party politics...Conservatives say the cost to the US economy is 100 billion per year...But they say it's because of healthcare, which illegal immigrants don't have and they say it because they don't pay taxes, which 50% of them do indeed pay taxes..So the figures you get depends on the source...

Let's be honest though...

How can anyone say illegal immigrants don't have healthcare, when they use hospitals as though they're primary care physicians?

The healthcare to provided to their children- is 100% free.

And let's say we all agreed that 50% pay taxes... How many of those 50% paying, are filing with correct amount of deductions because there is no consequence?

Furthermore- money used from Obamacare to help fund the healthcare of undocumented immigrants is a slap in the face.

holfresh wrote:

Vmart wrote:

Welpee wrote:

Knickoftime wrote:

Vmart wrote:

Knickoftime wrote:

Vmart wrote:

Knickoftime wrote:

Vmart wrote:

Knickoftime wrote:

Vmart wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:Hope you and your families stay healthy next year cuz Obamacare is going to double in premiums--you sckers want to pay more in taxes and healthcare while illegal immigrants pay zilch---real F smart.

I agree with you. I don't want to pay more Taxes and definitely Obamacare is horrid.

And this is why Trump supporters get made fun of. Not because we know what your IQ is or your level of education (we don't know or care).

But because of the stupid things you say publicly without realizing they're stupid.

This what Democrates do best jump on a pedestal thinking they know all. Who here likes to pay more taxes. Obamacare is an experience I'm living with so I know it to be horrid. It's the experience I had between my old insurance and this current one. I mentioned nothing about voting for anyone simple put it is a statement.

You replied affirmatively to a statement that clearly indicates a misunderstanding of what the Affordable Care Act is, how it works, and what was just announced.

But if you have firsthand experience with the ACA, why not share your experience? Why did you move from our old plan to 'Obamacare.' I'd be interested in your story.

And not for nothing but who here likes to pay more taxes is a pointless platitude.

What I want is to pay my fair share of taxes (which I actually do want to pay so I can drive over bridges and not swim across rivers and my parents can benefit from medicaid. I don't think I'd like a tax-free society. What also I want is for my taxes to be uses as efficiently as possible.

"Less" simply has no value other than shortsighted self-interest.

I understand it's suppose to be affordable but it's not working for me as my old insurance was as affordable and it cover most everything. The deductibles along are to costly. My insurance covers only 75% my old one covered 80% no deductible.

I assume switching was not your choice?

How come? What forced the switch?

I assume you don't qualify for the subsidies?

Not at all my choice. I was insured through my wife. The company she worked for got sold for $10 billion to another company. She worked in a lab the new company shut the lab down and sent it out to London. Basically putting a lot of people out of work. Our jobs going over seas yeah they are saw it first hand. This is on Long Island.

Needed insurance I'm self employed so Obamacare. She gets an offer in Dallas as a contract worker they don't give insurance to contract workers so Obamacare.

So I'm genuinely asking here. It sounds like before the affordable care act, the options in your situation would be to be uninsured or paying for private health care, and as a former freelancer years ago, I know that is extremely expensive.

I'm sympathetic your plan on the exchange isn't as good as your wife's formerly employer provided plan. But as a matter of policy are you suggesting the ACA should be repealed taking away that option or that it should be improved (or written better originally)?

Yeah, I don't get it either. The comparison shouldn't be between his wife's old insurance and Obamacare. It should be between what his options would've been before Obamacare vs. what's available to him now. I bet if that was examined he'd realize he's better off with Obamacare vs. being out there trying to get insurance on his own without it or just rolling the dice being uninsured.

I don't think you guys are understanding employers now don't have to provide insurance they simply get you to sign a waiver opting out of insurance. Then your basically sent to Obamacare. The comparison between the previous insurance and Obamacare illustrates that it was better when the employer provide the insurance. You got more coverage and no deductibles.

There is an employer mandate provision in Obamacare...Before Obamacare, small business didn' have to provide insurance...

The ObamaCare Employer Mandate / Employer Penalty, originally set to begin in 2014, was delayed until 2015 / 2016. ObamaCare’s “employer mandate” is a requirement that all businesses with 50 or more full-time equivalent employees (FTE) provide health insurance to at least 95% of their full-time employees and dependents up to age 26, or pay a fee by 2016. Below we clarify how each aspect of the mandate affects employees and employers.

I really don't see how Obama care (under any president) can work. I am living in Germany and they have a mostly-social medical system. It works here but the costs for trips to the doctors, treatments, drugs, etc. are probably half that of those in the States (I know doctors are much more expensive in the States and that the pharmaceutical industry sort of sells drugs for whatever price they choose - I'm exaggerating but relatively speaking, America is a different beast). To have everyone get the same healthcare with double plus the cost one finds in America, would bankrupt the system. I just don't see how it can work.

I love the idea of everyone having healthcare, but we have to fix the cost side of the equation first. Obamacare seems like a great idea of a Trojan Horse which will bankrupt the system.

Also, more affordable but natural medicines and care should be more of an option.

holfresh wrote:Illegal immigrants not paying taxes???..They are paying more tax than Trump, who wants to deport them..But please, educate yourself, look at the numbers...Just looking a the courts, it would cost between 400 billion to 600 billion to deport 11 million illegal immigrants...And the hit to our economy???..Glad you asked...

"Overall, removing all undocumented immigrants would cause private sector output to decline by between $381.5 billion and $623.2 billion. This translates to a 2.9 percent to 4.7 percent reduction in total annual output from the private sector."

http://www.businessinsider.com/cost-deporting-undocumented-immigrants-study-2016-5

In his recent Gettysburg address Trump said he would deport 2 million violent illegal immigrants. Not sure what he meant my "violent" or the like (e.g. convicted, etc.)
but 2 million vs. 11 million is a big difference.

gr33d wrote:

holfresh wrote:

gr33d wrote:

holfresh wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

DrAlphaeus wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

Open up your ears and listen

Michael Moore has been crying from the rooftops to liberals trying to explain the Trump phenomenon and warning that he could certainly win. But he isn't endorsing Trump. He endorsed Clinton.

Maybe hsi words will resonate with people who btch about the status quo but also ACCEPT the status quo. I mean whats a world like without 20mm illegal immigrants sitting in our hospitals driving up health care costs and not paying taxes. Whats a world like with less drugs poring into the Southern border so our children can consume them. Yeah go vote for Hillary and well--dont btch about anything else cause I cant here ya and that goes for 1/2 the nation. Go fck with the upper middle class and elitists--theyre helping everyone else our right. :)

Illegal immigrants not paying taxes???..They are paying more tax than Trump, who wants to deport them..But please, educate yourself, look at the numbers...Just looking a the courts, it would cost between 400 billion to 600 billion to deport 11 million illegal immigrants...And the hit to our economy???..Glad you asked...

"Overall, removing all undocumented immigrants would cause private sector output to decline by between $381.5 billion and $623.2 billion. This translates to a 2.9 percent to 4.7 percent reduction in total annual output from the private sector."

http://www.businessinsider.com/cost-deporting-undocumented-immigrants-study-2016-5

This article is just focusing on dollars lost from the output of illegal workers...

What is the cost of illegal immigrants in terms of health care?

Illegal immigrants who have (free of charge) anchor babies in the US are also entitled to free formula, medication, foods stamps.

Then comes education- which is completely free, as well as lunch programs, after school care, etc.

Were any of these costs factored into the article? No chance.

Wait until these undocumented immigrants have papers and now want access to unemployment, federal/state tax refunds and social security that they were previously not entitled to...

Undocumented(illegal) workers don't have access to healthcare outside the emergency room...There are various studies out there that skew the numbers based on party politics...Conservatives say the cost to the US economy is 100 billion per year...But they say it's because of healthcare, which illegal immigrants don't have and they say it because they don't pay taxes, which 50% of them do indeed pay taxes..So the figures you get depends on the source...

Let's be honest though...

How can anyone say illegal immigrants don't have healthcare, when they use hospitals as though they're primary care physicians?

The healthcare to provided to their children- is 100% free.

And let's say we all agreed that 50% pay taxes... How many of those 50% paying, are filing with correct amount of deductions because there is no consequence?

Furthermore- money used from Obamacare to help fund the healthcare of undocumented immigrants is a slap in the face.

Wait until these undocumented immigrants have papers and now want access to unemployment, federal/state tax refunds and social security that they were previously not entitled to...

The following list includes news media organizations that have donated to the foundation, as well as other media networks, companies, foundations or individuals that have donated. It is organized by the size of the contribution:
$1,000,000-$5,000,000
Carlos Slim
Chairman & CEO of Telmex, largest New York Times shareholder
James Murdoch
Chief Operating Officer of 21st Century Fox
Newsmax Media
Florida-based conservative media network
Thomson Reuters
Owner of the Reuters news service
$500,000-$1,000,000
Google
News Corporation Foundation
Philanthropic arm of former Fox News parent company
$250,000-$500,000
Houghton Mifflin Harcourt
Publisher
Richard Mellon Scaife
Owner of Pittsburgh Tribune-Review
$100,000-$250,000
Abigail Disney
Documentary filmmaker
Bloomberg Philanthropies
Howard Stringer
Former CBS, CBS News and Sony executive
Intermountain West Communications Company
Local television affiliate owner (formerly Sunbelt Communications)
$50,000-$100,000
Bloomberg L.P.
Discovery Communications Inc.
George Stephanopoulos
ABC News chief anchor and chief political correspondent
Mort Zuckerman
Owner of New York Daily News and U.S. News & World Report
Time Warner Inc.
Owner of CNN parent company Turner Broadcasting
$25,000-$50,000
AOL
HBO
Hollywood Foreign Press Association
Presenters of the Golden Globe Awards
Viacom
$10,000-$25,000
Knight Foundation
Non-profit foundation dedicated to supporting journalism
Public Radio International
Turner Broadcasting
Parent company of CNN
Twitter
$5,000-$10,000
Comcast
Parent copmany of NBCUniversal
NBC Universal
Parent company of NBC News, MSNBC and CNBC
Public Broadcasting Service
$1,000-$5,000
Robert Allbritton
Owner of POLITICO
$250-$1,000
AOL Huffington Post Media Group
Hearst Corporation
Judy Woodruff
PBS Newshour co-anchor and managing editor
The Washington Post Company

Read more: http://www.politico.com/blogs/media/2015/05/clinton-foundation-donors-include-dozens-of-media-organizations-individuals-207228#ixzz4ODpPZZ6X
Follow us: @politico on Twitter | Politico on Facebook

earthmansurfer wrote:

Welpee wrote:

earthmansurfer wrote:

holfresh wrote:

Vmart wrote:

Welpee wrote:

Knickoftime wrote:

Vmart wrote:

Knickoftime wrote:

Vmart wrote:

Knickoftime wrote:

Vmart wrote:

Knickoftime wrote:

Vmart wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:Hope you and your families stay healthy next year cuz Obamacare is going to double in premiums--you sckers want to pay more in taxes and healthcare while illegal immigrants pay zilch---real F smart.

I agree with you. I don't want to pay more Taxes and definitely Obamacare is horrid.

And this is why Trump supporters get made fun of. Not because we know what your IQ is or your level of education (we don't know or care).

But because of the stupid things you say publicly without realizing they're stupid.

This what Democrates do best jump on a pedestal thinking they know all. Who here likes to pay more taxes. Obamacare is an experience I'm living with so I know it to be horrid. It's the experience I had between my old insurance and this current one. I mentioned nothing about voting for anyone simple put it is a statement.

You replied affirmatively to a statement that clearly indicates a misunderstanding of what the Affordable Care Act is, how it works, and what was just announced.

But if you have firsthand experience with the ACA, why not share your experience? Why did you move from our old plan to 'Obamacare.' I'd be interested in your story.

And not for nothing but who here likes to pay more taxes is a pointless platitude.

What I want is to pay my fair share of taxes (which I actually do want to pay so I can drive over bridges and not swim across rivers and my parents can benefit from medicaid. I don't think I'd like a tax-free society. What also I want is for my taxes to be uses as efficiently as possible.

"Less" simply has no value other than shortsighted self-interest.

I understand it's suppose to be affordable but it's not working for me as my old insurance was as affordable and it cover most everything. The deductibles along are to costly. My insurance covers only 75% my old one covered 80% no deductible.

I assume switching was not your choice?

How come? What forced the switch?

I assume you don't qualify for the subsidies?

Not at all my choice. I was insured through my wife. The company she worked for got sold for $10 billion to another company. She worked in a lab the new company shut the lab down and sent it out to London. Basically putting a lot of people out of work. Our jobs going over seas yeah they are saw it first hand. This is on Long Island.

Needed insurance I'm self employed so Obamacare. She gets an offer in Dallas as a contract worker they don't give insurance to contract workers so Obamacare.

So I'm genuinely asking here. It sounds like before the affordable care act, the options in your situation would be to be uninsured or paying for private health care, and as a former freelancer years ago, I know that is extremely expensive.

I'm sympathetic your plan on the exchange isn't as good as your wife's formerly employer provided plan. But as a matter of policy are you suggesting the ACA should be repealed taking away that option or that it should be improved (or written better originally)?

Yeah, I don't get it either. The comparison shouldn't be between his wife's old insurance and Obamacare. It should be between what his options would've been before Obamacare vs. what's available to him now. I bet if that was examined he'd realize he's better off with Obamacare vs. being out there trying to get insurance on his own without it or just rolling the dice being uninsured.

I don't think you guys are understanding employers now don't have to provide insurance they simply get you to sign a waiver opting out of insurance. Then your basically sent to Obamacare. The comparison between the previous insurance and Obamacare illustrates that it was better when the employer provide the insurance. You got more coverage and no deductibles.

There is an employer mandate provision in Obamacare...Before Obamacare, small business didn' have to provide insurance...

The ObamaCare Employer Mandate / Employer Penalty, originally set to begin in 2014, was delayed until 2015 / 2016. ObamaCare’s “employer mandate” is a requirement that all businesses with 50 or more full-time equivalent employees (FTE) provide health insurance to at least 95% of their full-time employees and dependents up to age 26, or pay a fee by 2016. Below we clarify how each aspect of the mandate affects employees and employers.

I really don't see how Obama care (under any president) can work. I am living in Germany and they have a mostly-social medical system. It works here but the costs for trips to the doctors, treatments, drugs, etc. are probably half that of those in the States (I know doctors are much more expensive in the States and that the pharmaceutical industry sort of sells drugs for whatever price they choose - I'm exaggerating but relatively speaking, America is a different beast). To have everyone get the same healthcare with double plus the cost one finds in America, would bankrupt the system. I just don't see how it can work.

I love the idea of everyone having healthcare, but we have to fix the cost side of the equation first. Obamacare seems like a great idea of a Trojan Horse which will bankrupt the system.

Also, more affordable but natural medicines and care should be more of an option.

While we reel in the cost side (I have no idea how that gets done), what are the 20 million without healthcare suppose to do? Just keep waiting similar to trickle down economics?

I think we have more than those 2 options? What have they been doing? What were they doing before Obamacare? I mean, if you throw an absolute argument like you did out there, what is the point?
But the government generally foots the bill for those at the poverty level.

TBH - I don't understand how so many have no healthcare. Here in Germany, the average cost is probably around 300 Euro per month per person. When I was living in America, I could get basic healthcare for 1/2 that easy. Not sure where costs have gone though.

To have everyone get the same healthcare with double plus the cost one finds in America, would bankrupt the system. I just don't see how it can work.