dk7th wrote:

HofstraBBall wrote:

dk7th wrote:

HofstraBBall wrote:

dk7th wrote:

HofstraBBall wrote:

mreinman wrote:

HofstraBBall wrote:

mreinman wrote:

HofstraBBall wrote:

mreinman wrote:

HofstraBBall wrote:

dk7th wrote:Some players are more team first and they understand hierarchy as being the best way. You can disagree and still comply. It's actually a great manifestation of Noah's tremendous character. Do you understand?

What are you talking about? Why would any coach have the right to put two really good players out of positions for a scrub??? Was Harden moved to the 4 and Howard to the bench so that the scrub could have the ball more?? When Lin had the chance and the league git to know his game, he was totally exposed and got benched behind two mediocre point guards. Your fantasy for him is pushing to all these non existent conclusions. Time to move on bro. Just take the poster down. Or become a Net fan. I'll buy you the Lin jersey.

because those good players were playing like boneheads and it did not have to be lin but any pg to take the ball out of those guys hands and set them up for much smarter shot attempts.

You hit me as the old guy at the Y who thinks he sets really good picks, boxes everyone out with a bit too much enthusiasm and thinks he is the best player on the floor because of it? Please tell me what a smart shot is? And remember it's 2016 not 1960. Grant it Melo may force a shot from time to time but what scorer in the league doesn't? Think you would be the guy in the stands booing the Warriors for all their so called bad shots. But let's stay on Lin. You claim to be a fan of fundamental basketball. Watch Lin play and tell me how many times the fundamental PG keeps his head down on drives with no awareness for open cutters. And explain why the guy that should have been put ahead of two All Stars went on to become a back up behind two mediocre point guards in Houston?

I do love setting damn good picks as well as fundamental basketball ... I see you as a guy who will just chuck it from anywhere thinking that all his shots are as good as any ones and your teammates probably hate playing with you, warm?

Not at all. Led my teams in assists most years actually. Think it's more the fact I respect the incredible level of natural talent needed to be one of the best all time scorers in the NBA. Your maybe a guy that clings to guys that play like you or how you think "Fundamental" basketball should be played. Refusing to give credit to guys that do things you maybe never could. But back to basketball.. a "Smart" shot? You did not elaborate. So Irving, Curry, LBJ, Thompson, Durant all take only smart shots? Curry takes 30 footers. Would you bring in Lin or any other smart PG to take ball out of his hands?

I am not sure what you want here ... what is your issue with my take? Don't even know what this is about and what post here you initially had a problem with.

Friendly banter on how we view prolific aggressive NBA scorers. But mostly my disagreement on how two parenial AllStars should have taken a back seat to a two week wonder? Dont know any organization that would have made such a ridiculous move. And the 54 win season that followed, proves that to be so.

what lin would be AT THAT TIME was an unknown, save for his brilliant play while the two prennial all-stars were out, both who led the knicks to a record 8 games below .500

20-20 hindsight is not an argument.

At that time he was a D league/bench player. He was given a team with no one that could score. He played well and became a hyped sensation. That is not enough to predicate a complete philosophy change and demotion of two parenial All Stars, once they returned, as you suggested. What he has been since then is a mediocre PG. Further proving that it would not have been prudent to do so.

"demotion" is a trigger word associated with emotions and fragile egos. it's revealing that you identify with melo and stoudemire in this way, rather than with the coach. when you are the coach you find a winning formula and you stick with it. moreover, it was not a "demotion" to ask melo to switch from the 3 to the 4. where do you get that? and stoudemire would have gotten a lot more touches and deepen the bench, making the team better.

As I said before, you can make up imaginary conclusions all day just to make yourself feel better. Reality is Lin left and proved his contract was ridiculous. We flourished without him and won 54 games and got to conference finals. He wound up as a third string back up in Houston. Then did nothing in LA. Was smart enough(Harvard IQ) to play well as back up to cash in during an off season in which backups are getting 20 mil, At least you get to watch him try to earn his 12+ Million with the Nets. Btw. What do you really think his stat line will be this year?

i feel fine, since i am dealing with facts, ethics, principles, leadership... as opposed to fantasies, obsession with particular players regardless of winning, and 20-20 hindsight. if i were dealing in the latter-- as you clearly are-- i'd probably repeat the same foolishness as well to make me feel better.

enjoy melo's twilight time. such a waste he didn't play the right way when he had the chance to back then with lin. thankfully he seems to have matured a bit last season. god bless

sadly, at that time for the knicks, it was dolan front and center. this was the same perverted scumbag dolan who was forced by stern to hire a real basketball person to replace the sick-headed malignant narcissist thomas. again, sadly, dolan still had not swallowed enough medicine, and since dolan was solely responsible for giving a hand job to melo, a power struggle resulted, wherefrom both walsh and d'antoni found the emergency exit by "resigning."
that's my interpretation of those events. you're entitled to your own interpretation. god bless

HofstraBBall wrote:

Kemet wrote:

arkrud wrote:

dk7th wrote:

wallstbear wrote:Haha, easy part of the schedule. This is getting hilarious.

38 points is 38 points. These are NBA teams.

I think people are running around too many topics here.

OK, does MDA suck? That's not the question.
Does a coach have authority decide which players to build the offense around in today's environment? That's not the question.
Does the casual fan and forum poster (albeit the ULTIMATE-knicks site) have the authority to decide then? That's not the question either.
Should the Knicks have gone with Lin or Melo or Amare, since people did not seem to agree on their roles? Not the question.
Was Melo having personal problem w/ Lin? Or BASKETBALL problem? Not important.
Is Lin a good player? Not important either.

Question is what happened during that offseason.

Was Lin's "GREED" the reason he did not stay? NO. He took the ONLY offer he got. Everyone would have done the same.
Did Lin go to Houston to SOLICIT a poison pill just to F*** NYK? No. He really wanted to stay in NY. It was Morey's idea, and Morey used it on multiple players.

I think if everybody could just set the record straight, i.e., Dolan decided to let Lin leave, I think we can all agree to end this thread.

PS: erasing Linsanity from garden history is a narrow-minded cowardly act. Linsanity (the phenomenon) is already in the history books of the sports world.

CrushAlot wrote:

dk7th wrote:

HofstraBBall wrote:

mreinman wrote:

HofstraBBall wrote:

mreinman wrote:

HofstraBBall wrote:

mreinman wrote:

HofstraBBall wrote:

dk7th wrote:Some players are more team first and they understand hierarchy as being the best way. You can disagree and still comply. It's actually a great manifestation of Noah's tremendous character. Do you understand?

What are you talking about? Why would any coach have the right to put two really good players out of positions for a scrub??? Was Harden moved to the 4 and Howard to the bench so that the scrub could have the ball more?? When Lin had the chance and the league git to know his game, he was totally exposed and got benched behind two mediocre point guards. Your fantasy for him is pushing to all these non existent conclusions. Time to move on bro. Just take the poster down. Or become a Net fan. I'll buy you the Lin jersey.

because those good players were playing like boneheads and it did not have to be lin but any pg to take the ball out of those guys hands and set them up for much smarter shot attempts.

You hit me as the old guy at the Y who thinks he sets really good picks, boxes everyone out with a bit too much enthusiasm and thinks he is the best player on the floor because of it? Please tell me what a smart shot is? And remember it's 2016 not 1960. Grant it Melo may force a shot from time to time but what scorer in the league doesn't? Think you would be the guy in the stands booing the Warriors for all their so called bad shots. But let's stay on Lin. You claim to be a fan of fundamental basketball. Watch Lin play and tell me how many times the fundamental PG keeps his head down on drives with no awareness for open cutters. And explain why the guy that should have been put ahead of two All Stars went on to become a back up behind two mediocre point guards in Houston?

I do love setting damn good picks as well as fundamental basketball ... I see you as a guy who will just chuck it from anywhere thinking that all his shots are as good as any ones and your teammates probably hate playing with you, warm?

Not at all. Led my teams in assists most years actually. Think it's more the fact I respect the incredible level of natural talent needed to be one of the best all time scorers in the NBA. Your maybe a guy that clings to guys that play like you or how you think "Fundamental" basketball should be played. Refusing to give credit to guys that do things you maybe never could. But back to basketball.. a "Smart" shot? You did not elaborate. So Irving, Curry, LBJ, Thompson, Durant all take only smart shots? Curry takes 30 footers. Would you bring in Lin or any other smart PG to take ball out of his hands?

I am not sure what you want here ... what is your issue with my take? Don't even know what this is about and what post here you initially had a problem with.

Friendly banter on how we view prolific aggressive NBA scorers. But mostly my disagreement on how two parenial AllStars should have taken a back seat to a two week wonder? Dont know any organization that would have made such a ridiculous move. And the 54 win season that followed, proves that to be so.

what lin would be AT THAT TIME was an unknown, save for his brilliant play while the two prennial all-stars were out, both who led the knicks to a record 8 games below .500

20-20 hindsight is not an argument.

That seven game stretch was the easiest on the Knicks schedule and was against most of the teams in the lottery that year. I think the Lakers were the only team that went to the playoffs but I could be wrong. The Knicks come out better than .500 for that stretch without Lin and probably go 5-2. It was exciting but there is also the quality of the opponent at the time.

although it's a given that dolan's filthy paws have been all over this franchise until very recently, sadly there are many posters whose lack of life skills refuse to recognize that the fish always rots from the head down.

to review: he hired thomas and stuck with him. he was forced to hire walsh by stern, who in turn hired d'antoni. he the went over walsh and d'antoni's heads to bring in melo, in the process trading away valuable assets for a "name" while also making melo more powerful than either the gm or the coach. fast forward to linsanity and you have dysfunction, a coach's resignation, a gm's "retirement," and a phenom not being given a contract.

do you see the connections here, wallstbear? please say yes.

Talking to people who only listening to themselves and only believe in history they like to remember is not productive.
The Lin story in NY is not ended but just started.
We will going to see how it will unfold in Brooklyn.

The history of the "LinSanity era" has been several confusing-conspiracy stories from the main media, Dolan-media, Melo-lovers, and Melo-haters ... to many conspiracy stories

The Knicks had two headcoaches that like to talk to the media as soon as a mike it put in their face Larry Brown and Dantoni .. Why is Dantoni making accusation now about the LinSanity situation?
LinSanity and Amare hit it off great their first 4 games playing together 2-2, Amare learn quick that Lin will only pass him the ball when he is 15 feet near the basket.
When Melo made a remarkable recovery from a strain groin injury (Hernia) after the Knicks went on a 10-3 "LinSanity" run (including a 7 game win streak) without Melo.
When Melo did return to the lineup, Melo had his ex-teammate JR.Smith joined the team, plu JR were put into the team rotation immediately to receive 30 minute of playingtime.
The Knicks were WINNING without Melo, Amare, JR, and B.Davis.

When Melo return to the rotation, Jefferies and Walker were taken out of the rotation, plus Guards Shumpert and Fields playingtime minute decrease drastically in half.
The so-call rumor of opponents learning LinSanity moves were all lies lies lies .. LinSanity run n gun SSOL moves were STOPPED! The sameway Allen Iverson run n gun moves were Stopped by Melo and JR never participating on a fastbreak basket. Melo and JR never ran back on defense nor did they run on a Knicks fast break basket with LinSanity.
On March 24th LinSanity and Amare had a run n gun game helping teammate Tyson Chandler have a 15 pt 17 rebound win blowing-out the Detroit Pistons 101-79. Both Lin and Amare walked off the court healthy as can be into the lockerroom after blowing-out the Pistons.
After the March 24th game vs Pistons, Lin n Amare did not play anymore regular season games.
On March 26th, Carmelo Anthony had his first 2011-12 Knicks win of the season vs Bucks, without Lin or Amare in the lineup.
LinSanity and Amare did not play in the Knicks 2012-13 season.

Lots of conspiracy talk from a guy that starts off complaining about crazy conspiracy theories? Love how you ended with Lin and Amare did not play in the 2012/2013 season. What was their record that year again? And how did Lin do in Houston and LA when expected to play a larger role? Or was that a conspiracy as well. Probably a result of his team mates on the Rockets and Lakers sabotaging his greatness? Come on man. Linsanity was just an unknown over achieving. Nothing more. Why cry and make it seem like he would have brought us a chip if not for a million reasons.

What part of a undraft Lin-Sanity getting his first shot in the NBA to receive consistent playing-time minute on a NBA team at age 23, as a rookie PG. That u hate the most.

The Video of the Knicks vs Miami Heat Game were the Knicks 4th game in 5 days .. Plus in the video the following teammates (Baron Davis, JR.Smith, Melo, and Amare)that were in the Knicks rotation vs the Heats BIG-3 were all new to playing with rookie PG Lin-Sanity. Plus JR/Melo/Amare/Davis were veterans calling-shots in the Miami game for 30 or more minute on the court. Plus none of the 4 players played in any of the Knicks 7 game win streak a week ago with Lin-Sanity before this Heats game.
As a Knicks fan who watch each game of the Lin-Sanity era .. I recall the immediate big change in the Knicks new lineup and rotation when the Knicks played the BIG-3 championship team .. The Video showed the return of ISO-Melo, along with two new players added to the Knicks team in JR.Smith and Baron Davis, it was their 3rd and 2nd game that season.

From 2011-12 season to 2015-16 season, Jeremy Lin teams made the playoff .. The mismanagement Lakers dont count, even Phil Jackson ran far far away from the Lakers foolish organization.