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It’s Not a Riddle at All: What Led the Knicks to Jeff Hornacek
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SupremeCommander
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5/19/2016  1:39 PM    LAST EDITED: 5/19/2016  1:39 PM
Great article and Hornacek *does* have a connection to the triangle

Assuming the contract details will be a formality and the mutual interest that Phil Jackson and Jeff Hornacek have expressed to each other leads to Hornacek’s becoming the next Knicks head coach, here is what fans will be getting, aside from their wish that it be anyone but the interim incumbent, Kurt Rambis:

Not an A list media star. Not an interview room entertainer. But someone who does fit Jackson’s stated preference for a candidate with whom he has some spiritual or philosophical familiarity.

“For as long as I’ve known Jeff, he’s been more on the quiet side, but a high character guy, a leader by example who will represent your franchise really well,” said Jerry Colangelo, who drafted Hornacek out of Iowa State in 1986 for the Phoenix Suns with the next-to-last pick in the second round.

It is the longstanding relationship between Colangelo and Hornacek that tangentially connects to Jackson, the Knicks’ team president, whose coaching search had become a Where’s Waldo mystery based on his clandestine wanderings while reaching out to a small sampling of candidates.

Hornacek, 53, grew up and played high school basketball in the suburbs of Chicago, which is Colangelo’s hometown. Colangelo knew Hornacek’s father, John, during his own playing days in Amateur Athletic League games around the city.

John Hornacek became a high school coach, and Colangelo, never straying far from his Chicago roots even after moving on to Phoenix, said he “kept an eye” on John Hornacek’s boy as he made his way through Iowa State.

Colangelo was by then associated with the N.B.A.’s predraft workout camp for college players in Chicago, and in 1986 made sure an invitation went out to Jeff Hornacek.

“I watched him closely at the camp and I noticed that he had kind of a funny shot, not a great rotation, a little flat,” Colangelo said in a telephone interview. “So I said to him, ‘Your dad’s a coach, didn’t he ever talk to you about your shot?’ ” Hornacek shrugged and said his father preferred to let his son’s coaches handle him. Then he took Colangelo’s advice, locked himself in a gym and, as Colangelo said, began the process of becoming “one of the better N.B.A. jump shooters” across a 14-year career that began with a six-season run for the Suns.

Phoenix is where we can trace Hornacek’s intersection with Jackson, as it relates to the triangle offense that Hornacek may or may not be interested in running in New York.

In 1988, Colangelo rehired Cotton Fitzsimmons to coach a Suns team that featured Tom Chambers, Kevin Johnson, Eddie Johnson and even included a rookie guard named Steve Kerr. Fitzsimmons had also coached the Suns in their third and fourth years of existence, replacing Colangelo on the bench for the 1970-71 season.

“And guess which offense we ran way back then?” Colangelo said. “We ran the triangle.”

Fitzsimmons, he explained, had been an assistant in the mid-to-late 1960s (and head coach successor) at Kansas State to Tex Winter, widely considered to be the triangle offense architect and later Jackson’s mentor when they both were assistants to Doug Collins with the Bulls in Chicago.

Using Fitzsimmons’s triangle, the Suns rose in the West with 48- and 49-win seasons.

“We had the right personnel for it, especially a good passing center in Neal Walk and a really smart, physical power forward in Paul Silas,” Colangelo said. “That’s the key, the right personnel. I mean, if you have a Michael Jordan and a Scottie Pippen, it’s a great offense.”

Colangelo is a widely respected executive and voice around the pro game, credited for resurrecting the United States national team program and most recently hired at age 76 by the Philadelphia 76ers to oversee the redirection of that downtrodden franchise.

Here was his take when asked about Jackson’s insistence, to this point, of running the triangle in New York and what Hornacek might be thinking about that.

“It’s pretty difficult to predetermine how you are going to play until you know what kind of talent you have, don’t you think?” he said. “What comes first, the chicken or the egg, the system or the talent?”

In a social media culture of spontaneous and often premature revelation, we already have Jeff Van Gundy reporting that Jackson will grant Hornacek the latitude to run his own offense — or what he didn’t allow Derek Fisher, who was fired in February, one week after Hornacek was let go in Phoenix.

We’ll see if Jackson can lighten up when it comes to his legacy.

In his 1988 return to coach some strong, up-tempo Suns teams, Fitzsimmons — a beloved figure in Phoenix, who died in 2004 — did retain principles of the triangle but did not make it the team’s identity.

Hornacek developed under Fitzsimmons, averaging a career-high 20.1 points and making the Western Conference All-Star team in 1991-92 before being a part of the trade that sent him to Philadelphia and Charles Barkley to Phoenix.

Years later, after he retired and was hired as an assistant in Utah by Jerry Sloan — for whom he played in two N.B.A. finals against Jackson’s Bulls — Hornacek cited his most impactful coaching influences as his father, Sloan and Fitzsimmons, disciple of Winter.

So there we can begin to understand why Jackson zeroed in on Hornacek, preferring him to Frank Vogel, David Blatt and, in perhaps a grudging concession to external pressures, Rambis as well.

Yes, Hornacek had a losing (101-112) record in his two-plus seasons in Phoenix after a 48-34 overachieving start in 2013-14. His team played a fast-pace offense that catered to its guard-oriented strength, talent before system.

He certainly was not the most credentialed available candidate on the spring market. But given their tumultuous front-office history and revolving door practice with coaches, the Knicks, for all their payroll largess and geographic prestige, are not a franchise with great curb appeal. Maybe Vogel, for instance, prefers another team.

If Hornacek is the presumptive hire for the Knicks, we can say the coaching search could have turned out worse, or mainly where it began, with Rambis. Next comes the heavier lifting for Jackson, building effectively around Kristaps Porzingis and solving the riddle of what remains of Carmelo Anthony’s Knicks career.

As for the status of the triangle, stay tuned. All we can tell you is that Hornacek is no stranger to the subject.

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/05/20/sports/basketball/jeff-hornacek-knicks-coach.html?_r=0

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Malcolm
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5/19/2016  1:49 PM
Also found this:

1989-90 Phoenix Suns Roster:

Coach: Cotton Fitzsimmons (54-28)

14 Jeff Hornacek SG
31 Kurt Rambis PF
<=======

gunsnewing
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5/19/2016  1:57 PM    LAST EDITED: 5/19/2016  4:02 PM
Good read. If Phil is on board then I'm on board. As long as he wasn't forced into doing something by over people that went against his wishes or just to spite the media. Ultimately paving the way for his exit
gunsnewing
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5/19/2016  2:02 PM
Malcolm wrote:Also found this:

1989-90 Phoenix Suns Roster:

Coach: Cotton Fitzsimmons (54-28)

14 Jeff Hornacek SG
31 Kurt Rambis PF
<=======

Interesting. Anyone know he history behind Fitzsimmons? Any ties?

nixluva
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5/19/2016  2:06 PM
gunsnewing wrote:
Malcolm wrote:Also found this:

1989-90 Phoenix Suns Roster:

Coach: Cotton Fitzsimmons (54-28)

14 Jeff Hornacek SG
31 Kurt Rambis PF
<=======

Interesting. Anyone know he history behind Fitzsimmons? Any ties?


No one reads my posts I guess. I have been posting this info in other threads. Cotton was an assistant coach under Tex Winter at Kansas State and he they took over after Tex Left. When Cotton ran the Suns he used the Triangle. Jeff as we now realize also played in the Triangle under Cotton for 4 years.
Malcolm
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5/19/2016  2:14 PM
nixluva wrote:No one reads my posts I guess. I have been posting this info in other threads.
Yeah.

Problem with this forum is there are too many non-Triangle people
cluttering up the posts . . .

mreinman
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5/19/2016  2:21 PM
Malcolm wrote:
nixluva wrote:No one reads my posts I guess. I have been posting this info in other threads.
Yeah.

Problem with this forum is there are too many non-Triangle people
cluttering up the posts . . .

someone asked you right when you started (nalod?) if you are a knick fan, a phil fan, or a triangle fan.

Can we assume triangle?

so here is what phil is thinking ....
crzymdups
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5/19/2016  2:27 PM
Malcolm wrote:Also found this:

1989-90 Phoenix Suns Roster:

Coach: Cotton Fitzsimmons (54-28)

14 Jeff Hornacek SG
31 Kurt Rambis PF
<=======

That's interesting - I think we all believe Rambis will be on board as an assistant. I wonder if Hornacek will bring in his assistants who were fired out from under him in Phoenix?

¿ △ ?
gunsnewing
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5/19/2016  2:27 PM
nixluva wrote:
gunsnewing wrote:
Malcolm wrote:Also found this:

1989-90 Phoenix Suns Roster:

Coach: Cotton Fitzsimmons (54-28)

14 Jeff Hornacek SG
31 Kurt Rambis PF
<=======

Interesting. Anyone know he history behind Fitzsimmons? Any ties?


No one reads my posts I guess. I have been posting this info in other threads. Cotton was an assistant coach under Tex Winter at Kansas State and he they took over after Tex Left. When Cotton ran the Suns he used the Triangle. Jeff as we now realize also played in the Triangle under Cotton for 4 years.

Sorry Nix I will start making the effort to read the gist of your posts again

Vmart
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5/19/2016  2:30 PM
Once again some reporters look very foolish. Phil did hire a triangle guy.
gunsnewing
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5/19/2016  2:33 PM    LAST EDITED: 5/19/2016  2:39 PM
Vmart wrote:Once again some reporters look very foolish. Phil did hire a triangle guy.

Yea caught me totally off guard. This wasn't as left field a move as I originally thought. On the surface it seemed Phil was hiring from a coaching tree that was his polar opposite with the Sloan Jazz. I knew Jeff started his playing career in Phoenix. Had absolutely no idea how deep his ties were to the triangle with Fitzsimmons and Rambis. This makes perfect sense now and really is the perfect hire. Of course the usual suspects in the media are gonna spin it in the opposite direction now.

Malcolm
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5/19/2016  2:39 PM
gunsnewing wrote:
Vmart wrote:Once again some reporters look very foolish. Phil did hire a triangle guy.

Yea caught me totally off guard. This wasn't as left field a move as I originally thought

Ditto here . . .
nixluva
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5/19/2016  2:40 PM
gunsnewing wrote:
Vmart wrote:Once again some reporters look very foolish. Phil did hire a triangle guy.

Yea caught me totally off guard. This wasn't as left field a move as I originally thought. On the surface it seemed Phil was hiring from a coaching tree that was his polar opposite with the Sloan Jazz. I knew Jeff started his playing career in Phoenix. Had absolutely no idea how deep his ties were to the triangle with Fitzsimmons and Rambis. This makes perfect sense now and really is the perfect hire. Of course the usual suspects in the media are gonna spin it in the opposite direction now.

The big benefit is that Jeff knows so much more than just the Triangle and he may be better equipped to blend some other stuff with the triangle and make it all work. Not in a half assed stilted way where it looks like we're running two different offenses!!!

mreinman
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5/19/2016  3:09 PM
nixluva wrote:
gunsnewing wrote:
Vmart wrote:Once again some reporters look very foolish. Phil did hire a triangle guy.

Yea caught me totally off guard. This wasn't as left field a move as I originally thought. On the surface it seemed Phil was hiring from a coaching tree that was his polar opposite with the Sloan Jazz. I knew Jeff started his playing career in Phoenix. Had absolutely no idea how deep his ties were to the triangle with Fitzsimmons and Rambis. This makes perfect sense now and really is the perfect hire. Of course the usual suspects in the media are gonna spin it in the opposite direction now.

The big benefit is that Jeff knows so much more than just the Triangle and he may be better equipped to blend some other stuff with the triangle and make it all work. Not in a half assed stilted way where it looks like we're running two different offenses!!!

right ... which is what Kerr and Walton would have brought. Was not sure that Phil was willing to bring that in and still need to see it actually be allowed to happen.

so here is what phil is thinking ....
GoNyGoNyGo
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5/19/2016  3:31 PM    LAST EDITED: 5/19/2016  3:32 PM
Phil always insisted on a system that emphasizes ball movement ala his Knick days as a player.

The triangle is just one of those and one that he has had GREAT success with. Phil has an open mind about everything, why not basketball systems then?

Of course he does as long as it a system that involves all the players.


The real question is will Melo like it? He didnt like MDA but did better in year 2 of Triangle. Time will tell.

Nalod
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5/19/2016  3:44 PM
I think we can assume off the ball movement will be important no matter what you label it.
nixluva
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5/19/2016  3:46 PM
GoNyGoNyGo wrote:Phil always insisted on a system that emphasizes ball movement ala his Knick days as a player.

The triangle is just one of those and one that he has had GREAT success with. Phil has an open mind about everything, why not basketball systems then?

Of course he does as long as it a system that involves all the players.


The real question is will Melo like it? He didnt like MDA but did better in year 2 of Triangle. Time will tell.

I think Melo was much more selfish when MDA was here. I think Melo is a different player now. He is much more ready to be a ball mover than he was.

newyorknewyork
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5/19/2016  3:50 PM
gunsnewing wrote:Good read. If Phil is on board then I'm on board. As long as he wasn't forced into doing something by over people that went against his wishes or just to spite the media. Ultimately paying the way for his exit

I can't see Phil allowing himself to be forced to do anything. I do agree with your sentiment though.

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knicks1248
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5/19/2016  4:13 PM
I don't think anyone had a problem with the triangle, I think some of us just realize your spinning your wheels trying to teach non talented players a system that requires high IQ players. we all Know what it takes, and the knicks don't have it yet
ES
Knixkik
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5/19/2016  4:35 PM
His connection to the triangle, combined with his modern thinking and high intelligence, seems to make this make a lot more sense. I had no idea his connection was this extensive. I take back what i said about this being a sign Phil might be easing his way out. This seems to make perfect sense going forward.
It’s Not a Riddle at All: What Led the Knicks to Jeff Hornacek

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