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The problem with the free agency and positive forward looking threads
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BRIGGS
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3/28/2016  10:37 PM
We stink--if this is the core team we stink. There are so many teams ahead of us its frustrating and its easy to see.

We lost to a d league team with a pro PG tonight.

RIP Crushalot😞
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crzymdups
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3/28/2016  10:49 PM

Why did Jerian Grant play only 9 minutes when he was the only player on the team who possibly could have a) created penetration or b) guard Jrue the Destroyah of Worlds.
¿ △ ?
nyknickzingis
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3/28/2016  11:02 PM
We stink because we don't have guards who are starting caliber. If the free agent happens to be a guard that can do what we need, it will change the end result of many games. It won't change the team from being a competitive team (what we are now) to a contender like Golden State or San Antonio or Cleveland. However we can move into the playoffs.

The one unknown in all of this is how truly good Porzingis can be. No one really can know. Is he going to be a good 2nd option? A 1st option? What he is now (A very good 3rd option)?. I don't know for sure. If Porzingis fills out his potential, the way the Knicks will play and what they can do transforms significantly just by that.

I do agree that the unknown and likelihood of KP needing a few years is what makes trading Melo the right move for the team. It'll change the core, give them some young players. Possibly give them a lottery pick in 2017. It'll set them up for a very good core in 2017 forward (assuming the Melo trade is one where we can get back 1 young starter and 1 draft pick at the very least).
nixluva
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3/28/2016  11:04 PM
BRIGGS wrote:We stink--if this is the core team we stink. There are so many teams ahead of us its frustrating and its easy to see.

We lost to a d league team with a pro PG tonight.

You can't overreact to these games. There is a clear direction this team needs to go and I don't think we're as far off as the losses make it seem. We have the worst backcourt players and so yes they lose games even to bad teams. It would be a different story if you had even an AVERAGE NBA backcourt. We don't need an entire team. Just better backcourt players.

Lets see what Phil can get done. No need to despair or jump off a cliff. More talent is coming this summer. Hopefully a LOT more talent.
arkrud
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3/28/2016  11:37 PM
Lopez and KP had a good game.
Melo was OK most of the time.
Even Calderon had OK game so we can see that he can be a valuable backup.
The rest of the crew stinks but we know that.
Galo and Grant are work in progress with unknown results...
The building of this team just started and it will take 3-4 years to get somewhere if not interrupted.
Molo will be gone by then or will became a valuable role player so no worries.
"There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, Than are dreamt of in your philosophy." Hamlet
nixluva
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3/28/2016  11:45 PM
arkrud wrote:Lopez and KP had a good game.
Melo was OK most of the time.
Even Calderon had OK game so we can see that he can be a valuable backup.
The rest of the crew stinks but we know that.
Galo and Grant are work in progress with unknown results...
The building of this team just started and it will take 3-4 years to get somewhere if not interrupted.
Molo will be gone by then or will became a valuable role player so no worries.

I don't believe it will take 3-4 years! Just 2 quality players in free agency could make a huge improvement next year. There's at least a chance of that happening. There will likely be continued internal development as well. Just seems to me that a lot changes if Phil can bring in better backcourt players.
BRIGGS
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3/29/2016  12:12 AM
nixluva wrote:
arkrud wrote:Lopez and KP had a good game.
Melo was OK most of the time.
Even Calderon had OK game so we can see that he can be a valuable backup.
The rest of the crew stinks but we know that.
Galo and Grant are work in progress with unknown results...
The building of this team just started and it will take 3-4 years to get somewhere if not interrupted.
Molo will be gone by then or will became a valuable role player so no worries.

I don't believe it will take 3-4 years! Just 2 quality players in free agency could make a huge improvement next year. There's at least a chance of that happening. There will likely be continued internal development as well. Just seems to me that a lot changes if Phil can bring in better backcourt players.

Your forgetting the 20 teams that are already better than us. They will all improve as well--or have as much potential to improve. We may get more out of KP--other than that internal improvement will be nothing material. I dont expect Grant to be a 15-5-5 player next year.

RIP Crushalot😞
callmened
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3/29/2016  12:53 AM
BRIGGS wrote:
nixluva wrote:
arkrud wrote:Lopez and KP had a good game.
Melo was OK most of the time.
Even Calderon had OK game so we can see that he can be a valuable backup.
The rest of the crew stinks but we know that.
Galo and Grant are work in progress with unknown results...
The building of this team just started and it will take 3-4 years to get somewhere if not interrupted.
Molo will be gone by then or will became a valuable role player so no worries.

I don't believe it will take 3-4 years! Just 2 quality players in free agency could make a huge improvement next year. There's at least a chance of that happening. There will likely be continued internal development as well. Just seems to me that a lot changes if Phil can bring in better backcourt players.

Your forgetting the 20 teams that are already better than us. They will all improve as well--or have as much potential to improve. We may get more out of KP--other than that internal improvement will be nothing material. I dont expect Grant to be a 15-5-5 player next year.

exactly. i mean we keep saying ...bring in derozen or batum...why would these GOOD players want to play for a rebuilding team. and yes i call the knicks a rebuilding team cuz theyre no where close to a playoff team. the best shot they have is to rebuild from within. sure get stop gap mediocre free agents like the immortal evan turner. but this team should be focused on getting younger, and rebuilding around kp. superstars and good players arent coming here soon. im not being negative just realistic

Knicks should be improved: win about 40 games and maybe sneak into the playoffs. Melo, Rose and even Noah will have some nice moments however this team should be about PORZINGUS. the sooner they make him the primary player, the better
nixluva
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3/29/2016  1:31 AM
callmened wrote:
BRIGGS wrote:
nixluva wrote:
arkrud wrote:Lopez and KP had a good game.
Melo was OK most of the time.
Even Calderon had OK game so we can see that he can be a valuable backup.
The rest of the crew stinks but we know that.
Galo and Grant are work in progress with unknown results...
The building of this team just started and it will take 3-4 years to get somewhere if not interrupted.
Molo will be gone by then or will became a valuable role player so no worries.

I don't believe it will take 3-4 years! Just 2 quality players in free agency could make a huge improvement next year. There's at least a chance of that happening. There will likely be continued internal development as well. Just seems to me that a lot changes if Phil can bring in better backcourt players.

Your forgetting the 20 teams that are already better than us. They will all improve as well--or have as much potential to improve. We may get more out of KP--other than that internal improvement will be nothing material. I dont expect Grant to be a 15-5-5 player next year.

exactly. i mean we keep saying ...bring in derozen or batum...why would these GOOD players want to play for a rebuilding team. and yes i call the knicks a rebuilding team cuz theyre no where close to a playoff team. the best shot they have is to rebuild from within. sure get stop gap mediocre free agents like the immortal evan turner. but this team should be focused on getting younger, and rebuilding around kp. superstars and good players arent coming here soon. im not being negative just realistic

I don't recall anyone suggesting superstars would be coming. I think there is a very realistic chance to make major upgrades simply because our backcourt talent is so far below par! You won't have to add a superstar in order to make significant improvement over this roster.

Moreover Phil is focused on making the team younger but that doesn't mean zero vets!!! You don't win with a completely young team. Just so we're clear NO ONE should be expecting an instant fix. That's not what this is about. There was limited progress this year and they need to make even more progress this summer.

Lets see what upgrades can be made and take it from there. I don't know why people worry about other teams. We can't control what other teams do. All the Knicks need worry about is building their team the right way. Just keep plugging holes with better talent and developing young talent they have.
callmened
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3/29/2016  2:10 AM
yes. theres no doubt that the knicks can upgrade their awful backcourt. that wont take much. lol. folks here were talking about batum and derozen and even steph curry!! i highly doubt that will happen. instead expectations should be realistically lowered to HOPE to acquire legendary talents like: bjennings, bazemore, turner,oj mayo etc. i have no problem with acquiring these mediocre talents. yes they improve the front court. as long as theyre on short term contracts and as long as the YOUTH continues to develop. i dont think the knicks will be in a good position to acquire LEGIT free agents until 2018 when the cap levels (assuming the knicks save their money)

PS = the reason why i worry about other teams is because most teams are better than us AND they have more money. thats where my whole perspective is coming from. knicks dont choose players, players choose teams - usually good teams with money.

Knicks should be improved: win about 40 games and maybe sneak into the playoffs. Melo, Rose and even Noah will have some nice moments however this team should be about PORZINGUS. the sooner they make him the primary player, the better
earthmansurfer
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3/29/2016  4:28 AM
The draft is on June 23 and FA period begins in early July.
So, if we are going to trade Melo it will happen before the FA period begins imo as Phil will want a pick now, so during the draft or there abouts.
Imagine, we could have had our own top pick and probably another via trading Melo - Nice start to a rebuild. Bargs, the gift that keeps on giving.
The intuitive mind is a sacred gift and the rational mind is a faithful servant. We have created a society that honors the servant and has forgotten the gift. Albert Einstein
arkrud
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3/29/2016  7:53 AM
earthmansurfer wrote:The draft is on June 23 and FA period begins in early July.
So, if we are going to trade Melo it will happen before the FA period begins imo as Phil will want a pick now, so during the draft or there abouts.
Imagine, we could have had our own top pick and probably another via trading Melo - Nice start to a rebuild. Bargs, the gift that keeps on giving.

It is not only Bargs trade. The organization was watering down the future for a momentary imaginary benefits for too long.
The time came to pay for the mistakes and mismanagement.
I remember when this happened with Rangers and Dolan razed white flag and depart from any team related decisions.
It took 5 years to build team back to elite status and it was done by combination of smart FA and diligent drafting and young players development.
Hopefully he will have patience to let Phil and whoever will come after him to do the job and inpatient NY fan base and media will be ignored.
There is no other way.

"There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, Than are dreamt of in your philosophy." Hamlet
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