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Jamal update
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fishmike
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7/27/2004  7:51 PM
no, the kind that say our future expiring contracts are worthless and only bring more cast offs and malcontents, unless *Isiah* uses them to get Crawford in which case he has wasted our "valuable assets."

Look, you need to get over it. Isiah is the GM. If you would rather have Layden that nice, start a petition.
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Bonn1997
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7/27/2004  8:56 PM
Posted by fishmike:

no, the kind that say our future expiring contracts are worthless and only bring more cast offs and malcontents, unless *Isiah* uses them to get Crawford in which case he has wasted our "valuable assets."
Exactly; they're valuable once we no longer have them (because they could have gotten us a star player) but they're useless when we still do have them (because they'd never get us a star player)
martin
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7/27/2004  10:06 PM
well then, 2 threads of back and forth over some unfinished business on other forums. I like it.
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Knicksfan
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7/27/2004  10:15 PM
Posted by purple012870:

Did I read "flashes of brilliance" re: Frank Williams. This guy is one of the worst PG prospects I have ever seen. I cannot believe people are thinking he's anymore than a below average backup.

Did you follow the Knicks last season, specially when Frank Williams stepped into the starting rotation? Did you see him in the playoffs? I agree he hasn't had a complete successful season because of injuries and other issues, but he did showed some great things last season that prompted many people with basketball knowledge to say good things about him and his future. Who knows if he will ever become something consistently good, hopefulle he can, but he did show some very good things.
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martin
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7/27/2004  10:22 PM
Posted by Knicksfan:
Posted by purple012870:

Did I read "flashes of brilliance" re: Frank Williams. This guy is one of the worst PG prospects I have ever seen. I cannot believe people are thinking he's anymore than a below average backup.

Did you follow the Knicks last season, specially when Frank Williams stepped into the starting rotation? Did you see him in the playoffs? I agree he hasn't had a complete successful season because of injuries and other issues, but he did showed some great things last season that prompted many people with basketball knowledge to say good things about him and his future. Who knows if he will ever become something consistently good, hopefulle he can, but he did show some very good things.

Ditto the above. In fact, I think Frank is a diamond in the proverbial rough. Strong, pass first, deceptively quick, good first step, a set shot that is getting better, good defender, entertaining.
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Knicksfan
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7/27/2004  10:27 PM
Posted by martin:
Posted by Knicksfan:
Posted by purple012870:

Did I read "flashes of brilliance" re: Frank Williams. This guy is one of the worst PG prospects I have ever seen. I cannot believe people are thinking he's anymore than a below average backup.

Did you follow the Knicks last season, specially when Frank Williams stepped into the starting rotation? Did you see him in the playoffs? I agree he hasn't had a complete successful season because of injuries and other issues, but he did showed some great things last season that prompted many people with basketball knowledge to say good things about him and his future. Who knows if he will ever become something consistently good, hopefulle he can, but he did show some very good things.

Ditto the above. In fact, I think Frank is a diamond in the proverbial rough. Strong, pass first, deceptively quick, good first step, a set shot that is getting better, good defender, entertaining.

And tough.
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Allanfan20
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7/27/2004  10:32 PM
I just saw a Frank Williams jersey on sale, for 19.95, at the Finishline. If it were at regular price, I wouldn't have got it, in fears that he would be traded, but this is a good gamble. Frank Williams is going to be a very good backup one of these days, and possibly even a solid starter. I hope he stays on the Knicks though.
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MaTT4281
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7/27/2004  10:50 PM
Posted by Allanfan20:

I just saw a Frank Williams jersey on sale, for 19.95, at the Finishline. If it were at regular price, I wouldn't have got it, in fears that he would be traded, but this is a good gamble. Frank Williams is going to be a very good backup one of these days, and possibly even a solid starter. I hope he stays on the Knicks though.

I hope he stays with us too...but unfortunately him staying in NY will most likely keep him from living up to his potential, unless he can be worked into a 3 guard rotation, it would probably be better for him to be traded.

[Edited by - MaTT4281 on 07/27/2004 22:51:29]
Knicksfan
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7/27/2004  11:02 PM
Posted by MaTT4281:
Posted by Allanfan20:

I just saw a Frank Williams jersey on sale, for 19.95, at the Finishline. If it were at regular price, I wouldn't have got it, in fears that he would be traded, but this is a good gamble. Frank Williams is going to be a very good backup one of these days, and possibly even a solid starter. I hope he stays on the Knicks though.

I hope he stays with us too...but unfortunately him staying in NY will most likely keep him from living up to his potential, unless he can be worked into a 3 guard rotation, it would probably be better for him to be traded.

[Edited by - MaTT4281 on 07/27/2004 22:51:29]

True...
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Nalod
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7/27/2004  11:11 PM
Things are getting a little testy here.

Picky picky.

Chill guys, not much to talk about.

OOh, lets do the Marbury trade thing again!

Ok, Here I'll start:

Isiah paid too much for Marbury, I mean Lampe will be the next (you fill in here) and Vujanic, the puss, if he ever has the gonadel ability to come here, is gonna be like the next Nash! Oh, phx signed nash? SEE! Told you PHX would have the next nash! ANd, Lampe like the next Bird! Uh huh! Or the next KVH, what ever.

Or we got Nazr and TT for HOrn! And thats kinda good right, yeah go Isiah! Isiah not gay, right?

Or , yeah, Uh, TT is like so Gazy.

Or, uh, yeah, Damp is so cool right!

Go Knix. Nets suck anyway. Duh. Marbs rules. Dudes going to Greece. Heh Heh, so its back to "greece" OOOOOH, more back door greek jokes! Heh heh.

Yawn, do a trade Isiah, save us from ourselves!
Knicksfan
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7/27/2004  11:26 PM
Posted by Nalod:

Things are getting a little testy here.

Picky picky.

Chill guys, not much to talk about.

OOh, lets do the Marbury trade thing again!

Ok, Here I'll start:

Isiah paid too much for Marbury, I mean Lampe will be the next (you fill in here) and Vujanic, the puss, if he ever has the gonadel ability to come here, is gonna be like the next Nash! Oh, phx signed nash? SEE! Told you PHX would have the next nash! ANd, Lampe like the next Bird! Uh huh! Or the next KVH, what ever.

Or we got Nazr and TT for HOrn! And thats kinda good right, yeah go Isiah! Isiah not gay, right?

Or , yeah, Uh, TT is like so Gazy.

Or, uh, yeah, Damp is so cool right!

Go Knix. Nets suck anyway. Duh. Marbs rules. Dudes going to Greece. Heh Heh, so its back to "greece" OOOOOH, more back door greek jokes! Heh heh.

Yawn, do a trade Isiah, save us from ourselves!

Ohh Nalod... Nice recap of this board in the last weeks... LOL
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technomaster
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7/28/2004  2:59 AM
Heh. I was just saying that it sure seemed like we had our future set up before the season began last year. Just add water and couple of years of seasoning.

I'm kind of curious though, where's the young core of our team now? Marbury is good--- but please don't include TT, cuz he's never put up good numbers with any consistency. And let's not jump on the Sweetney bandwagon yet. I've got my bags and I'm ready to climb on board, but let's see him put up Elton Brand/Zach Randolph-type numbers together. The potential is there.

Besides, we don't have Crawford yet and Ariza has yet to play an NBA game yet. Do 2 players (Marbury/Sweetney) make up a good young core?
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Allanfan20
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7/28/2004  3:22 AM
Thanks for posting that Nalod. It's always nice to get a good laugh.

I agree that Sweetney is not all that, yet. In fact, I am not looking for him to put up Brand type numbers, b/c I think those are unfair expectations, even if he is thrown into the starting lineup. If you remember that one game against Denver, he was doing well in the previous games, but then he looked like a deer caught in headlights, with his foul problems (In the Denver game). Not that I am bashing the guy, b/c I love Sweetney, and have very high hopes for him. I just don't think he's ready to be close to Elton Brand, quite yet. And believe me, if he is, I am throwing a block party and you are all invited.

On a side note, I would greatly appreciate it if we can go back to the more important topic at hand. I really enjoy my Frank Williams replica jersey, which I got at half price. Finishline baby!
“Whenever I’m about to do something, I think ‘Would an idiot do that?’ and if they would, I do NOT do that thing.”- Dwight Schrute
Rich
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7/28/2004  6:10 AM
There is a huge difference between Brand numbers and not being all that.

Sweetney can average a double/double and become a dominant rebounder. That's hard to find. Elton Brand probably had a deer in the headlights look at times during his rookie year too.
Rich
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7/28/2004  6:24 AM
The NY Post reports that the Knicks failed to get Crawford:

http://www.nypost.com/sports/knicks/28260.htm

The Star-Ledger reports that they may still get him:

http://www.nj.com/sports/ledger/index.ssf?/base/sports-0/1091005120292450.xml
raven
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7/28/2004  7:12 AM
out of thomas and paxson, nobody knows what's going on. Journalists are like us and try to speculate.
BRIGGS
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7/28/2004  8:41 AM
i think it was pretty simple--give them deke over moochie-if they wanted the player bad enough they wouldve the bulls dont want anything else obviously-so i guess its time to move on to plan B and find another SG that can start if needed. again i would possibly go the wagner route and see if i get bring in rodney white on the cheap--i really dont want andersen playing any more minutes anyway
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joec32033
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7/28/2004  8:54 AM
Now we have to try to hammer out a 3 team trade for Jamal? After all that negotiating, Chicago renegging on a deal (just like GS), now we keep trying and all Chicago does is sit there...Christ...sign Crawford to an MLE contract with an opt out every year to be a unrestricted FA if he doesn't hit playing time goals (30-33 mins per game maybe on average), also put it scoring incentives to up the contract a little. IMHO, it's time to get nasty with Paxson, he already did with us. As for Dampier, I say he should just go to ATL or Thomas needs to decide who is more important, Dampier or Craw. Dampier may be easier to get (he's unrestricted), and he's also a piece we actually need. We have a dearth of quality big men.
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Bonn1997
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7/28/2004  9:20 AM
The Bulls will match an MLE deal if we give Crawford one. (In fact, they already offered him a 6 yr 38 mil contract),

If the Bulls want Dikembe instead of Moochie, we should gift wrap Dikembe and thank them for allowing us to rob them
CTKnicksfan
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7/28/2004  9:34 AM
Isiah needs to be careful here. It seems he's focused on keeping enough trade assets out of the Crawford deal to make another trade. Ideally he would like to add 2 impact players this offseason. He's trying to not paint himself into a corner where he gives up all the expiring contracts in the crawford deal, if another player becomes avialble, then he has nothing else to offer. But if he waits too long, he may be stuck doing nothing.

Any deal for Walker,Dampier,Carter etc, will require at least Deke's expiring deal along with KT and/or Nazr. If Isiah honestly belives he can make a deal for one of those, then he is right to try to hold onto Deke.

If Dampier signs for the MLE (seems unlikely) Isaih should relent and include Deke in the deal. If not, Isiah should keep trying to deal for Walker or Carter, and if he strikes out there, use the MLE on Baker/White and hold the expiring deals until the deadline.
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