im not against this one. vc doesnt have much time left on his contract and his talent level blows away anything else we can get. i kind of thought it was funky wed facilitate a trade of vc to dallas when we could just get the player ourselves.

i think we have a real shot here. because he wants out and we will take back alvin williams. this creates hype and sells seats. its hard to tell if this makes us a better team because we dont know what wed give up, but it's a worthy gamble here. When VC is healthy and not taking bad long shots, he really is imposible to guard.

When you have a chance to add a star like Vince Carter to your team, you take that chance. When Vince is healthy he is a top-10 player in the NBA and adding him to the team would be huge. I decided to take a crack at landing Vince using the realgm trade checker (I'll admit it)....


New York trades: PG Frank Williams (3.9 ppg, 1.0 rpg, 2.2 apg in 12.8 minutes)
C Dikembe Mutombo (5.6 ppg, 6.7 rpg, 0.4 apg in 23.0 minutes)
C Kurt Thomas (11.1 ppg, 8.3 rpg, 1.9 apg in 31.9 minutes)
SF Tim Thomas (14.7 ppg, 4.8 rpg, 1.9 apg in 31.6 minutes)
New York receives: SF Lamond Murray (6.0 ppg, 2.7 rpg, 0.9 apg in 15.7 minutes)
PG Alvin Williams (8.8 ppg, 2.7 rpg, 4.0 apg in 30.9 minutes)
SF Vince Carter (22.5 ppg, 4.8 rpg, 4.8 apg in 38.1 minutes)
Change in team outlook: +2.0 ppg, -10.6 rpg, and +3.3 apg.

Toronto trades: SF Lamond Murray (6.0 ppg, 2.7 rpg, 0.9 apg in 15.7 minutes)
PG Alvin Williams (8.8 ppg, 2.7 rpg, 4.0 apg in 30.9 minutes)
SF Vince Carter (22.5 ppg, 4.8 rpg, 4.8 apg in 38.1 minutes)
Toronto receives: PG Frank Williams (3.9 ppg, 1.0 rpg, 2.2 apg in 56 games)
C Dikembe Mutombo (5.6 ppg, 6.7 rpg, 0.4 apg in 65 games)
C Kurt Thomas (11.1 ppg, 8.3 rpg, 1.9 apg in 80 games)
SF Tim Thomas (14.7 ppg, 4.8 rpg, 1.9 apg in 66 games)
Change in team outlook: -2.0 ppg, +10.6 rpg, and -3.3 apg.

TRADE ACCEPTED

Due to New York and Toronto being over the cap, the 15% trade rule is invoked. New York and Toronto had to be no more than 115% plus $100,000 of the salary given out for the trade to be accepted, which did happen here. This trade satisfies the provisions of the Collective Bargaining Agreement.


I would've tried to include Houston in there, but I doubt they would take him back. So if they do this deal and the Dampier deal (for Mohammed and Harrington) then we would have a starting lineup of...


Dampier
Sweetney
Carter
Houston
Marbury

BREAKING NEWS
POSTED AT 12:04 AM EDT Saturday, Jul 17, 2004

Carter 'wants out and needs to go'


By MICHAEL GRANGE
From Saturday's Globe and Mail

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Vince Carter wants to be traded to an Eastern Conference team in the National Basketball Association, ideally the New York Knicks, a league source says.

The four-time NBA all-star will return for his seventh season with the Toronto Raptors only as a last resort, the source said. The source added that it has been made plain to the club that a deal should be worked out sooner rather than later.

"He wants out and he needs to go," said the source, who asked not to be identified. "He is very, very firm on that. He needs to go. They're supposed to be working on something right now. It might have to involve a third team, or they may have to acquire someone and pass him through."

Lending weight to reports that have linked the Raptors and Knicks in a possible Carter deal, the source said New York would be Carter's preferred destination, and the interest is mutual.

Knicks president Isiah Thomas "has lots of interest," the source said. "He'd give up anyone on his roster outside Stephon [Marbury]."

As previously reported, Carter's desire for a new address is based on his view that he hasn't been properly consulted as the club has gone about revamping its front office and coaching staff. Carter's management team at IMG shares the view.

"[The Carter camp] are terribly upset about communication, trust and the way things are handled," the source said. "[The Raptors] haven't followed through on their promises."

Raptors general manager Rob Babcock has said that he's not planning to trade the club's top career scorer and franchise player, while at the same time acknowledging he's talked to eight or nine clubs about Carter. Sources say the new GM is simply trying to deflect the impression that he's under pressure to make a deal.

"Babcock is spinning this thing," the source said. "He can say whatever he wants, but it's been made abundantly clear to him that [Carter] wants out."

Babcock said Friday he had no comment on reports about Carter's future with the Raptors. "My only comment on the whole Vince Carter situation is that I'm not going to comment on any third-hand information based on agents, friends, superfans or anything else. I will deal directly with Vince, and I'm not going to comment on any trade discussions."

Carter's agent, Mark Steinberg, said Friday: "I have no comment. I can't say anything right now." Steinberg is at the British Open in Scotland with another of his clients, Tiger Woods.

Richard Peddie, the president and chief executive officer of Maple Leaf Sports and Entertainment, which owns the Raptors, played down suggestions the club is under pressure to deal Carter or is obliged to make a move. He also dismissed rumours that have linked Carter to various deals.

"We want to keep Vince Carter," Peddie said. "We think he's very good for our team. I can call up rumours in every market. Rumours are part of the NBA."

While sources close to Carter cite a recent addition to his Toronto nightclub and inquiries about employment being made on behalf of his wife, a chiropractor, as evidence that Carter hasn't yet severed all ties with the city, others say that he's frustrated with the direction the team has taken and the way he's been treated.

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20040717.wxcarter0717/BNStory/Sports/

Posted by raven:

no way they do that. they would get absolutly robbed on this one.

they have either to get a true star back to fill seats, or get some nice things for the future.

They are not going to get a true star back. Plus, we would be taking 2 bad contracts in Lamond Murray and Alvin Williams. We could include a pick in that deal, but Deke is an expiring contract and he can mentor Araujo, Frankie is young and cheap, Kurt can play PF/C, and Tim would be Vince's replacement. I don't see why you think the deal is so bad. The Raptors are not going to get equal value for Vince if they trade him.

No way should we give up Sweets-he can be dominant rebounder for the next 10 years and will be a defensive force. FWill is a nice player with good upside but we're covered with Steph. Everyone is tradable.

I wouldn't trade Sweetney too. Vince is an all-star, a great scorer and a player that brings in huge crowds and that also brings excitement to the fans. Okey. But I wouldn't really trade a player that could be a great low post player, something we have lacked in a loooong time, and a fierce rebounder. It would be good if we can bring Vince to NY but its not really like we need him a lot. We can live without him. But without a low post prescence, without good young movement on the team, we would be taking a step back, again.

Bring Vince to NY if you can, but don't include Sweetney, please.

Don't trade Sweetney, that's not a smart move. You don't trade big for small, even if the small is an All-Star SF. Why do we need Carter to sell tickets, the Knicks sold out every game after they got Marbury, or were close to it.

My feeling is they will try to get Dampier for the Mohammed/Harrington package, which isn't a bad deal (as long as there's a team option in there somewhere, maybe after year 5), and then use whatever else they can to get either Crawford or Carter.

For Crawford, they're probably giving up Anderson, Mutumbo, Trybanski, Frank Williams, and $3 million cas.

For Carter, I'd imagine they'd have to give up Tim Thomas (expires in 07 vs Carters 08), Frank Williams, and Kurt Thomas, and they'll have to take on Alvin Williams. I'm giving Toronto the first round picks and anything else they want with that package, but I think that's a pretty good one. They have practically nobody signed past '07, they get a nice PG to contest Alston for playing time, and they get a veteran in KT who can play in the frontcourt with their two younger guys, Bosh and Araujo. It looks like a longshot, but if Vince is demanding a deal to NY, there's not much they can do.

lol, any feedback on my proposed trade?

Posted by raven:

here is your feedback : they need a big name to fill the seats. your trade is good basketball wise, for both of us, but they need a name.

Lol, anyone else other than raven? No but seriously, they will not get a big name in return if they trade Carter, and I'm not the only one that thinks so, here is a question from David Aldridge's chat yesterday...

"jessica (vancouver): what would be "fair value" for a vince carter, and is there any way he stays and leads the raps into the playoffs?

David Aldridge: A star player who sells tickets. But I don't think Toronto will get that, and I think he'll be traded once the Raptors get two or three good young players in exchange."



I agree with you raven, Toronto should try to get a player that fills seats in return, but I just don't think they will be able to. I think we have a shot at Carter if he keeps demanding to be traded.



[Edited by - s3231 on 07/17/2004 13:45:49]

Then no deal. Sweetney is young, healthy, and cheap. Carter is too much of a health risk to give up Sweetney for.

I am not trading sweetney either, if toronto wants a lot for vince then good for them, but I guarantee you that teams are, not offering a lot considering vince health problems.. someone mentioned a good 3 way trade with the warriors which makes sense, the warriors like Pietrus more than Richardson(for some odd reason) and they would be willing to trade talent for expiring deals, NY has that..... If we have to give up sweetney, then I say no deal...